Fastpass return or replacement?

[andyman8]

Unfortunately I don't think speaking in absolutes is reliable. Unless you are one of the people at the table it's pretty impossible to know and the people at the table don't speak at all. Everything else is rumour.

Just sharing what I’ve heard. Everything is of course a rumor until it is confirmed. Everything is subject to change. You can take away from it whatever you’d like. You can choose to believe it or not.

Also that “table” is a bit bigger than you think, and as is the case with many major corporations, these sorts of decisions have to run by a lot of people before we see changes on the ground.

 

[Cabius]

if the model shifts that way, to where there is a $10 fee per day per person, or something along that lines, it would make me question if disney is shifting its focus from families, to couples.

that would get really expensive really quick for a family of 4 that vacations at disney for a week.

My working assumption is that, unless it comes back more or less in its old shape, it will be included at least for on-site guests, possibly tiered with Deluxe getting more than Value, and maybe even not offered to off-site guests for free at all. And of course, people will be able to buy more.

 

[Mac30188]

(Edit: sorry, just saw RamieGee made this point and said it better.)

While $30 more for a ticket may not sound horrible, it's still quite an increase for a feature that used to be free. You also need to multiply that amount per family member and how many days you'll be in the park. If you're one person going for the day, it's more doable than a family of 4 there for a week.

Good point, and I think you are correct. When you multiply it out and and since I am sure they are not discounting the tickets that don't have Fastpass it turns into a 30% price hike on tickets. It is not trivial, but I still would end up paying it because I view the value more than other items I am spending on my vacation. It wouldn't turn into just a giant budget explosion. It would probably bump my budget slightly and I would get the rest of the cost by taking it out of maybe one less table meal or worst case, one less day at the parks in general.

Still at the end of the day, I have to judge it as cost versus value (not cost now versus cost before). Is it worth adding $30 to my ticket for 3 fastpasses? Yep. Especially when compared to the insane amount of money I am spending on other items. I mean in a world of $15 sandwiches $200 table meals, and $20 cheap plastic souvenirs, $30 sounds reasonable compared to how much it would improve my trip versus how much it costs.

 

[Mac30188]

Which is why I doubt that pricing structure will fly at WDW. People go to Disneyland for a day trip. Maybe two. Of course you have people that go for a week but that is not even a large portion of people. Charging DL guests $30 -$50 per person per day will not be a deal breaker for most. Do that at WDW where people stay from 7-14 days then you are talking about killing people's ability to go to WDW. They cannot do that to people financially though I am sure they would love to. I can see them tacking on a cost onto the tickets like a hidden fee or something and still giving us the FP's for "free". However, my best guess is that we will see a hybrid of free and paid but the paid cannot be $30 per person per day.

What will help is if you start mitigating this cost by staying at a WDW Hotel / Resort / DVC etc. will get you add a number of free ones then it offsets the cost.

For example, if you get 3 free Fastpasses at a Deluxe, 2 free Fastpasses at a moderate, and 1 free Fastpasses at Value then it starts to reduce some of the cost increase. The DVC/Deluxe guest gets the same 3 Fastpasses they have always had. The Value only gets one, but could buy a couple more to offset. The Moderates only would have to spend $10 to get back to 3 free fastpasses (a much more reasonable cost increase). Offsite users get no free Fastpasses, but can purchase them at $10 a pop. AP probably also gets a free FP every visit. The real loser turns into the power user. If you are used to getting 8-10 Fastpasses a day, that will cost more than a little to get back.

 

[Wandering Oaken]

What will help is if you start mitigating this cost by staying at a WDW Hotel / Resort / DVC etc. will get you add a number of free ones then it offsets the cost.

For example, if you get 3 free Fastpasses at a Deluxe, 2 free Fastpasses at a moderate, and 1 free Fastpasses at Value then it starts to reduce some of the cost increase. The DVC/Deluxe guest gets the same 3 Fastpasses they have always had. The Value only gets one, but could buy a couple more to offset. The Moderates only would have to spend $10 to get back to 3 free fastpasses (a much more reasonable cost increase). Offsite users get no free Fastpasses, but can purchase them at $10 a pop. AP probably also gets a free FP every visit. The real loser turns into the power user. If you are used to getting 8-10 Fastpasses a day, that will cost more then a little to get back.

Not us. We were happy with our three free per person per day. I knew it was possible to get more fast passes by refreshing over and over and over again but I just never bothered.

 

[Disneylover99]

What will help is if you start mitigating this cost by staying at a WDW Hotel / Resort / DVC etc. will get you add a number of free ones then it offsets the cost.

For example, if you get 3 free Fastpasses at a Deluxe, 2 free Fastpasses at a moderate, and 1 free Fastpasses at Value then it starts to reduce some of the cost increase. The DVC/Deluxe guest gets the same 3 Fastpasses they have always had. The Value only gets one, but could buy a couple more to offset. The Moderates only would have to spend $10 to get back to 3 free fastpasses (a much more reasonable cost increase). Offsite users get no free Fastpasses, but can purchase them at $10 a pop. AP probably also gets a free FP every visit. The real loser turns into the power user. If you are used to getting 8-10 Fastpasses a day, that will cost more than a little to get back.

I’d be okay with all of this.

 

[Grasshopper2016]

Character meet and greets are perhaps the single biggest thing they could bring back that would help ride lines, even without FP being brought back.

Curious about that. I would think that meet and greets are probably just about the lowest capacity attractions in the parks. Even if they have 3 Elsas going at once in separate rooms, they still can't get through very many people in an hour, can they? Though, I guess the major meet and greets tend to draw big lines, and everyone standing in a character line would otherwise be standing in a ride line.

Still, it seems to me that re-opening massive crowd-eating shows like the Indiana Jones stunt show would be even more helpful.

But, either way, I certainly agree that they should be opening everything that is still closed as fast as possible (so long as they can do it safely). Every little bit helps. And boy do they need help!

 

[persnickity2020]

What will help is if you start mitigating this cost by staying at a WDW Hotel / Resort / DVC etc. will get you add a number of free ones then it offsets the cost.

For example, if you get 3 free Fastpasses at a Deluxe, 2 free Fastpasses at a moderate, and 1 free Fastpasses at Value then it starts to reduce some of the cost increase. The DVC/Deluxe guest gets the same 3 Fastpasses they have always had. The Value only gets one, but could buy a couple more to offset. The Moderates only would have to spend $10 to get back to 3 free fastpasses (a much more reasonable cost increase). Offsite users get no free Fastpasses, but can purchase them at $10 a pop. AP probably also gets a free FP every visit. The real loser turns into the power user. If you are used to getting 8-10 Fastpasses a day, that will cost more than a little to get back.

Our family needs two rooms at Pop - if we're only getting 1 "free" Fastpass a day for the $460/night that's costing us, we'll just stay off site and pay out of pocket. I don't see how that helps Disney's bottom line.

 

[Cabius]

Our family needs two rooms at Pop - if we're only getting 1 "free" Fastpass a day for the $460/night that's costing us, we'll just stay off site and pay out of pocket. I don't see how that helps Disney's bottom line.

I imagine Disney will run projections on how many guests who currently stay off-site might switch to Pop Century for that FastPass, or how many people are Pop Century would pay for a second one, and decide based on that bigger picture.

I don't mean to be glib or dismissive; that would suck for your family, and if they go that route I will feel sorry for you.

But I'm sure those are the kinds of factors they're weighing here.

 

[malba2366]

What I'm almost certain of (and maybe just being naive or Disney colored glasses) is that we will NOT see the DLP model at WDW. That seems to be where everyone jumps to on this topic because of what they decided to do there. DLP is a completely different type of park than WDW (and only a single park). A pay $10 or more per ride will not be what we get at WDW. That would just be obscene. I could see it being more like adding Park Hopping to your tickets for the length of your stay, like a set cost per trip. I think from what I've read, when the concierge level was able to add more it was this kind of concept. Pay $xx per person per trip. An..th

If it is an add on to the ticket prices expect it to be very costly as they have to limit how many they sell. Look at pricing for express pass at Universal - over $200 a day during peak times. I believe Disney will only have paid FP for the most popular rides and some other system for the less popular rides. I don't see Disney offering it for free with deluxe rooms, much less moderate/value rooms, as they have no problem selling those rooms at the moment and because there is such a large number of rooms at WDW. I remember reading somewhere (pre covid) that Disney hotels have a 10% higher occupancy rate than the Orlando market. The improved transportation, early/late hours and the Disney experience are more than enough to sell the rooms.

To all those who are saying $30 per person is too much look at what people are paying at Universal to get an idea of what these passes are worth. It has to be priced at a sufficient price so that everyone is not trying to buy it otherwise it is pointless as the line will get to be hours long just like the standby line, or the fast passes will sell out immediately...they will need to price the passes at a price where the supply and demand vs price curves meet.

I find it very hard to believe that senior Disney management doesn't yet know what the plan is...midlevel managers may be in the dark because they want to keep things under wraps. They have had months to figure this out and they are probably working out the integrations into their back of house systems. I would assume they want something in place that is functioning well by Oct. 1

 

[persnickity2020]

I imagine Disney will run projections on how many guests who currently stay off-site might switch to Pop Century for that FastPass, or how many people are Pop Century would pay for a second one, and decide based on that bigger picture.

I don't mean to be glib or dismissive; that would suck for your family, and if they go that route I will feel sorry for you.

But I'm sure those are the kinds of factors they're weighing here.

Maybe they should just cut to the chase and let you earn a wish with every X dollars you spend.

 

[tinkerhon]

After what we've endured this trip, I would GLADLY pay for FP+. !!! Bring it on !!!!

 

[Grasshopper2016]

Maybe they should just cut to the chase and let you earn a wish with every X dollars you spend.

That’s actually not a bad idea! It would incentivize on-site stays, hotel upgrades, restaurant spending, shopping, etc. And it would lead guests to feel like they were getting extra for their money.

 

[malba2366]

Maybe they should just cut to the chase and let you earn a wish with every X dollars you spend.

I don't think they will do that...if they do this I think they will offer up wishes based on their internal parameters that way it is more of a pleasant surprise to the guest vs. I need to spend $x to get y. Also if their systems get really smart they can use these wishes to drive guests to different parts of the park to manage crowding. Ie. if the Star Wars area is crowded they could offer chosen guests that are in that area fast passes to rides in other areas of the park for free or at a low cost.

 

[annadreamsofdisneyworld]

Our trip isn't until August 2022, but we're already thinking of doing something else. We're still waiting to see what happens with fastpass. But my kids, husband, and I are excited about doing a cruise instead if the fast pass situation doesn't resolve in a way we can afford. We are willing to pay some extra money for FP or cut our trip down a little, but we will not pay thousands extra or be stuck waiting in long lines all day.

 

[Wandering Oaken]

If it is an add on to the ticket prices expect it to be very costly as they have to limit how many they sell. Look at pricing for express pass at Universal - over $200 a day during peak times. I believe Disney will only have paid FP for the most popular rides and some other system for the less popular rides. I don't see Disney offering it for free with deluxe rooms, much less moderate/value rooms, as they have no problem selling those rooms at the moment and because there is such a large number of rooms at WDW. I remember reading somewhere (pre covid) that Disney hotels have a 10% higher occupancy rate than the Orlando market. The improved transportation, early/late hours and the Disney experience are more than enough to sell the rooms.

To all those who are saying $30 per person is too much look at what people are paying at Universal to get an idea of what these passes are worth. It has to be priced at a sufficient price so that everyone is not trying to buy it otherwise it is pointless as the line will get to be hours long just like the standby line, or the fast passes will sell out immediately...they will need to price the passes at a price where the supply and demand vs price curves meet.

I find it very hard to believe that senior Disney management doesn't yet know what the plan is...midlevel managers may be in the dark because they want to keep things under wraps. They have had months to figure this out and they are probably working out the integrations into their back of house systems. I would assume they want something in place that is functioning well by Oct. 1

I don't think they care one bit about things selling out fast. If they cared about things going away really fast like that then they would do something about the boarding group for Rise of the Resistance. Disney keeps proving every single day that they don't care how comfortable their guests are or how well they treat their guests anymore. The days of Walt are gone. We now live in the days of the almighty dollar.

 

[malba2366]

I don't think they care one bit about things selling out fast. If they cared about things going away really fast like that then they would do something about the boarding group for Rise of the Resistance. Disney keeps proving every single day that they don't care how comfortable their guests are or how well they treat their guests anymore. The days of Walt are gone. We now live in the days of the almighty dollar.

If it sells out too fast then they left a lot of $$ on the table, also to maintain satisfaction the paid fast passes have to remain generally available - ie. cant sell out within 5 minutes of the park opening. Also I think they care to some extent about the experience because they need the guests to return. Rise of the Resistance is a tough one because the demand for the ride way outstrips capacity...I think they should offer an earlier booking window for on property guests but I am sure a lot of people would disagree. Not sure what they can do with that one until the demand normalizes to the same as some of the other popular rides.

 

[whiporee]

I think almost everyone agrees that FP+ as we know it is gone, if they were simply reverting to that there is no reason for not having it in place now that crowds are essentially back to normal. Once they decide on what they are doing they can reconfigure the queues for the rides so that there is more space dedicated to the standby lines. As others have said, the lack of shows/character attractions/parades and many guests maintaining more distance between themselves and others than pre COVID are also contributing to these long lines.

I think most people here think it’s gone, but this board has a tendency to think the worst of Disney whenever possible.

I don’t think it’s gone — if it changes, my guess is they have a scenario where more that 3 are available. Maybe a larger form of virtual queues or something of the sort.

the reason for a delay is probably because FPs are hard to line up with the reservation system, and until the specter of COVID limitations are gone, they don’t want to abandon the reservation system. But once the reservation system goes, my guess is FP comes back exactly as it was.

 

[Wandering Oaken]

I think most people here think it’s gone, but this board has a tendency to think the worst of Disney whenever possible.

I don’t think it’s gone — if it changes, my guess is they have a scenario where more that 3 are available. Maybe a larger form of virtual queues or something of the sort.

the reason for a delay is probably because FPs are hard to line up with the reservation system, and until the specter of COVID limitations are gone, they don’t want to abandon the reservation system. But once the reservation system goes, my guess is FP comes back exactly as it was.

Except Chapek specifically said the Park Pass system is here to stay.

 

[Mac30188]

If it sells out too fast then they left a lot of $$ on the table, also to maintain satisfaction the paid fast passes have to remain generally available - ie. cant sell out within 5 minutes of the park opening. Also I think they care to some extent about the experience because they need the guests to return. Rise of the Resistance is a tough one because the demand for the ride way outstrips capacity...I think they should offer an earlier booking window for on property guests but I am sure a lot of people would disagree. Not sure what they can do with that one until the demand normalizes to the same as some of the other popular rides.

To keep them generally available I suspect you will be get up to 3 up front and then buy as you go (just a guess). I doubt you will be able to buy 12 fast passes to schedule your entire day before you set foot un the park. I think they want them to be available, and that is the best way to make sure they both sell out and are available during the day.

I also believe that public perception is something that often prevents Disney from maximizing the profit of an individual item. There are many things they could raise the price on but don't because they don't want to damage the brand. They have been just pushing the envelope more lately, but immediate lack of demand is not their problem.