Fast Pass Plus Changes ....

[PlutoMars]

I have nothing to clarify. Disney is not going to make business adjustments to mollify local FL residents who choose not to buy APs and therefore cannot obtain FP+ in advance. You can slice and dice those words any way you see fit. Have at it. I have noticed, however, that rather than challenge that premise, you choose instead to engage in hyperbolic linguistics. I do too much of that at work. Won't do it here.

It is interesting for you to say I am engaging in hypberolic linguistics given your "does not care one bit" statement. I find that amusing.

Local FL residents are also future potential AP holders as well so from a business standpoint it would not be in the economic best interests to totally disregard a fertile market consisting of potential AP holders.

 

[OtherScott]

Excuse me? Where do I state anything close to your assertion? My point was as follows: 1. There is not enough evidence yet to say with a certainty whether or not FP+s are being held back or not 2. I do not agree with the assertion that Disney does not care "one bit" about Florida locals that do not have APs. In part, because they are potential AP holders in the future and it does not match the very business principles that JimmyV is trying to prop up his position with.

What would hold back look like?

When you hold back, who do you hold back from?

When you hold back, who do you hold back for?

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

But couldn't you also say that a local showing up and not being able to get the FP+s they want day of might be more inclined to make sure it doesn't happen again. They have a higher chance of learning their lesson and doing their day over. Like going to see your favorite local band, it would only take once maybe twice to realize that if you show up 5 minutes before the show starts that you aren't going to get front row seats. You still love the band. You just learn you need to change the time you arrive to the theater and you are able to do it because you are local. Just as non-locals are learning they need to get their tickets early to pre-book FP+s so will the locals. It might even push them into getting that AP because then they could pre-book every Saturday for the next 30 days just in case they want to come to Disney. What would be the reason Disney would want to keep a FP+ from a family that is pre-planning their trip to Disney, no matter where they live, to reward the family that does not. How does it benefit Disney to do this in the long term? Will you turn off a some that can't get want they want day of and they never return? Maybe so but you also could have just as many that learn their lesson and make sure it doesn't happen again which would give Disney what they want. They would also pass a warning on to all their friends to pre-book your FP+s to get what you want. Disney has stated that one of the main goals of FP+s was to lock guest into their parks days before they plan to be in the parks. How does holding back FP+s fit in with this plan?

I must at this time say that I have no idea weather they are or are not holding back FP+s. I have no insider knowledge. I have talked to no CMs or bus driver. I have never worked for Disney or know anyone that works for Disney. This all just thinking in my head and using the common sense God gave me which could be not much at times.

 

[JimmyV]

But couldn't you also say that a local showing up and not being able to get the FP+s they want day of might be more inclined to make sure it doesn't happen again. They have a higher chance of learning their lesson and doing their day over. Like going to see your favorite local band, it would only take once maybe twice to realize that if you show up 5 minutes before the show starts that you aren't going to get front row seats. You still love the band. You just learn you need to change the time you arrive to the theater and you are able to do it because you are local. Just as non-locals are learning they need to get their tickets early to pre-book FP+s so will the locals. It might even push them into getting that AP because then they could pre-book every Saturday for the next 30 days just in case they want to come to Disney. What would be the reason Disney would want to keep a FP+ from a family that is pre-planning their trip to Disney, no matter where they live, to reward the family that does not. How does it benefit Disney to do this in the long term? Will you turn off a some that can't get want they want day of and they never return? Maybe so but you also could have just as many that learn their lesson and make sure it doesn't happen again which would give Disney what they want. They would also pass a warning on to all their friends to pre-book your FP+s to get what you want. Disney has stated that one of the main goals of FP+s was to lock guest into their parks days before they plan to be in the parks. How does holding back FP+s fit in with this plan?
I must at this time say that I have no idea weather they are or are not holding back FP+s. I have no insider knowledge. I have talked to no CMs or bus driver. I have never worked for Disney or know anyone that works for Disney. This all just thinking in my head and using the common sense God gave me which could be not much at times.

To quote the Talking Heads....Stop Making Sense!

 

[JimmyV]

Local FL residents are also future potential AP holders as well so from a business standpoint it would not be in the economic best interests to totally disregard a fertile market consisting of potential AP holders.

Disney is not disregarding local FL residents without APs. It is re-shaping their purchasing habits. It is called marketing. Or, to put it more simply...If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Disney has made a small sliver of touring style, (day visitors), second class citizens. But at the same time, it is offering these people life lines that will elevate them back up to first class status. Many will grab the life line and in so doing, Disney makes money. Draconian business practice? Perhaps. But Disney is as much Scrooge McDuck as it is Fairy Godmother.

 

[Suellen]

I believe that those that think Disney doesn't care about the Florida residents "locally" that are not Florida pass holders are not seeing the big picture.

If they care so little - why offer deals like the Discover Disney passes? They know that locals frequent DTD and restaurants and resort restaurants, we book birthday parties at their venues, you all are thinking only of theme park admission money and not the big ticket items. We have been to birthday parties at TRex, Goofy's candy company and Wilderness lodge and are having my daughters at Beach Club. We host our moms night out at resort bars, restaurants and even Epcot. Locals spend money at Disney - even without entering parks or riding the rides or using the precious, coveted FP+.

It is crazy to think they don't care about their customers who could potentially spend be customers 365 days a year.

 

[JimmyV]

I believe that those that think Disney doesn't care about the Florida residents "locally" that are not Florida pass holders are not seeing the big picture.

If they care so little - why offer deals like the Discover Disney passes? They know that locals frequent DTD and restaurants and resort restaurants, we book birthday parties at their venues, you all are thinking only of theme park admission money and not the big ticket items. We have been to birthday parties at TRex, Goofy's candy company and Wilderness lodge and are having my daughters at Beach Club. We host our moms night out at resort bars, restaurants and even Epcot. Locals spend money at Disney - even without entering parks or riding the rides or using the precious, coveted FP+.

It is crazy to think they don't care about their customers who could potentially spend be customers 365 days a year.

Of course they like that income. But none of the things you mentioned entail a FP. Disney isn't going to hold back FPs for people who host birthday parties at the bowling alley. Once you choose to enter one of the parks, you fight for ride space just like everybody else. All that other stuff is more akin to what people spend at retail stores. It buys you no good will in the parks. Your spending at DTD is no different than my spending at the New York ESPN Club. Disney wants that spending. But it doesn't earn me park cred.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

I believe that those that think Disney doesn't care about the Florida residents "locally" that are not Florida pass holders are not seeing the big picture.

If they care so little - why offer deals like the Discover Disney passes? They know that locals frequent DTD and restaurants and resort restaurants, we book birthday parties at their venues, you all are thinking only of theme park admission money and not the big ticket items. We have been to birthday parties at TRex, Goofy's candy company and Wilderness lodge and are having my daughters at Beach Club. We host our moms night out at resort bars, restaurants and even Epcot. Locals spend money at Disney - even without entering parks or riding the rides or using the precious, coveted FP+.

It is crazy to think they don't care about their customers who could potentially spend be customers 365 days a year.

I guess the point I was making wasn't so much that locals like you are talking about isn't needed or wanted but more that locals like those would know and understand that you would need to pre-book your FP+s, even if it is only a day or 2 beforehand. And if those guest sign in the night before looking for FP+, I think you deserve to have those instead of Disney holding them until the next day forcing you to have to check once you enter the park and want to go about your touring.

 

[OtherScott]

The bottom line is Disney won't hold back because Disney doesn't need to. Capacity is there already and Disney will make the most of it by more efficiently distributing it. It can actually be 'increased' with intelligent and strategic overbooking.

 

[Suellen]

I guess the point I was making wasn't so much that locals like you are talking about isn't needed or wanted but more that locals like those would know and understand that you would need to pre-book your FP+s, even if it is only a day or 2 beforehand. And if those guest sign in the night before looking for FP+, I think you deserve to have those instead of Disney holding them until the next day forcing you to have to check once you enter the park and want to go about your touring.

I just find it humorous that the argument is always - locals don't spend money! When I reality we maintain our passes primarily so we CAN go spend money! Lunch at Tony's with the husband while the kids are at school is a favorite of ours because it is right at the front of the park.

If we can't also use those tickets to occasionally her some FP's for our kids then at some point we let them go and keep Universal which gives us FOTL after 4:00 everyday. Disney doesn't want that happening.

As locals with annual passes we don't always even know the day before. Sometimes I do t know until the kids get home and have no homework or their evening activity was canceled because the field was wet. Thee difference is that I think works in our favor and WDW is: we don't care what the ride is we get a FP for and often don't care what the park is. I check to see what we can get for an hour from now and that is the park we head to.

It isn't that they "don't care" or "don't value" they just know we tour differently.

Locals that but the special four day 1/2 price tickets (I have family that fall in to this category) and go buy them day of - if they can't get any FP's for the day of become frustrated and frustrated customers are negative mouthpieces of information that Disney can't have. Those locals will:

A. Not become annual pass holders and begin spending their vacation dollars on staycation activities.

B. Not encourage their visiting friends and family to visit the parks.

Realistically I'm sure WDW knows the number or people who purchase a ticket on the day get are entering the park and can easily hold some FP's to accommodate those.

Who knows - maybe as a local AP holder I get different availability for FP+ than a person with the same party size holding a tourist ticket. Maybe a same day ticket purchase is flagged to offer FP's that a pre purchased ticket doesn't. I'm sure the technology exists.

 

[Laketravis]

Hey Shaden, hope you're having fun!

I'm inclined to believe that there would be a sufficient amount of churn over the course of so many days involving so many people changing plans for so many FP's that availability would be a statistically satisfying recurring event and holding some back simply wouldn't be necessary.

 

[PlutoMars]

Disney is not disregarding local FL residents without APs. It is re-shaping their purchasing habits. It is called marketing. Or, to put it more simply...If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Disney has made a small sliver of touring style, (day visitors), second class citizens. But at the same time, it is offering these people life lines that will elevate them back up to first class status. Many will grab the life line and in so doing, Disney makes money. Draconian business practice? Perhaps. But Disney is as much Scrooge McDuck as it is Fairy Godmother.

Why would Disney offer "life lines" to a group of people who you say they do not "care one bit" about?

Your basic premise is inherently flawed. Disney does care about local FL residents that do not have APs.

 

[PlutoMars]

But couldn't you also say that a local showing up and not being able to get the FP+s they want day of might be more inclined to make sure it doesn't happen again. They have a higher chance of learning their lesson and doing their day over. Like going to see your favorite local band, it would only take once maybe twice to realize that if you show up 5 minutes before the show starts that you aren't going to get front row seats. You still love the band. You just learn you need to change the time you arrive to the theater and you are able to do it because you are local. Just as non-locals are learning they need to get their tickets early to pre-book FP+s so will the locals. It might even push them into getting that AP because then they could pre-book every Saturday for the next 30 days just in case they want to come to Disney. What would be the reason Disney would want to keep a FP+ from a family that is pre-planning their trip to Disney, no matter where they live, to reward the family that does not. How does it benefit Disney to do this in the long term? Will you turn off a some that can't get want they want day of and they never return? Maybe so but you also could have just as many that learn their lesson and make sure it doesn't happen again which would give Disney what they want. They would also pass a warning on to all their friends to pre-book your FP+s to get what you want. Disney has stated that one of the main goals of FP+s was to lock guest into their parks days before they plan to be in the parks. How does holding back FP+s fit in with this plan?

I must at this time say that I have no idea weather they are or are not holding back FP+s. I have no insider knowledge. I have talked to no CMs or bus driver. I have never worked for Disney or know anyone that works for Disney. This all just thinking in my head and using the common sense God gave me which could be not much at times.

This is all assuming that FP+s are important or crucial to a local family's touring style. FP+s arent the be all and end all to everyone, neither are they a driving factor in defining an enjoyable and successful day in the parks. And even if bears out to be true that Disney isnt holding back any FP+s, local residents can take advantage of the parks during the slower times so getting FP+s on the same day may not even be an issue.

I am not arguing one way or another whether they are or are not holding back FP+s, but again merely stating that it is too early to tell and challenging a premise where a business would not "care one bit" about a percentage of their guests.

 

[OtherScott]

Hey Shaden, hope you're having fun!

I'm inclined to believe that there would be a sufficient amount of churn over the course of so many days involving so many people changing plans for so many FP's that availability would be a statistically satisfying recurring event and holding some back simply wouldn't be necessary.

Bingo.

http://www.disboards.com/showpost.php?p=51440513&postcount=46

 

[OtherScott]

but again merely stating that it is too early to tell

Based on what standard?

 

[PlutoMars]

Based on what standard?

Based on the standard of relying on initial reports by a few CMs and GR people who have proven to be an unreliable source of info in the past.

But it may be that Disney will never release this information in full and could be telling its employees an official line and doing something else.

There are compelling arguments for each side as why or why not Disney would hold back FP+s.

 

[OtherScott]

Based on the standard of relying on initial reports by a few CMs and GR people who have proven to be an unreliable source of info in the past.

But that isn't what is happening here. Seems people are applying a variety of methods to best guess what is happening - personal observations, anecdotal evidence, common sense, individual experience, sourced and unsourced reports in media, collective experience...

Contrary to your original point that PPs tend to believe CMs that affirm what they already believe, the PPs you've singled out in this thread believe CMs that are contradicting what they believed.

But it may be that Disney will never release this information in full and could be telling its employees an official line and doing something else.

And if they don't?

This isn't a "too early to tell" problem.

There are compelling arguments for each side as why or why not Disney would hold back FP+s.

Certainly, but one side seems to be compelling the other side.

 

[MightyGitis]

So this doesn't really bear into the WHY argument but here's an official response from Disney when I emailed the official help link and asked:

"Thank you for contacting the Walt Disney World® Resort.

At this point in time we are releasing all available FastPass+ reservations(slots) in advance, and are not holding anything for any day inside of the Theme Parks. Since we are releasing all of our available FastPass+ reservations in advance it if very possible for an attraction to be completely booked in advance, on any given day.

If you have questions or need further assistance, feel free to contact
us."

 

[MaryKatesMom]

They don't have enough data to know that my anything goes budget left.

 

[The Hub]

Yes if the Hub could come in on this ... would be great.

I also wonder how much control each park's operations has over how to allot their FPs. So maybe DHS has made the decision not to hold any back, but at MK (where The Hub works) they do hold back some?

The up to 40% allotment of FastPasses being held for day guests was before offsite guests had the ability to prebook. If there were any changes (I'm sure there were with the additions of offsite, full Passholder rollout and the rotating FP+,) my leaders either haven't shared this at any of our track talk meetings or weren't informed. If I hear anything, I'll let you know.

I casually asked one of my leaders if this had changed and the answer is yes, it did. It changed the day offsite guests without Annual Passes had the ability to prebook. The reasoning is due to the heavy number of users who now have the ability to make reservations before arriving. Hopefully, knowing this, you will be able to make sure you schedule the FastPasses you want.