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[YesDear]

Todd:

Really good shots even with a Canon!!! How many times did you go through the rides and how many total shots would you say you took of each ride to get the ones you have here?

 

[handicap18]

If your looking to do just your basic family picture candids and gatherings I would get the SB-600 over the 400. Much more flexability with the 600. I've had mine for close to 3 years and love it. Also consider getting a diffuser for it. I bought a basic $24 one at a local shop and while I liked the light coming out of it, it was kind of cumbersome and not very flexable. I then went out and got a Gary Fong and it almost never comes of my SB-600.

If you plan on doing a lot of flash work and think you might want to get into more portrait stuff and get real creative, then you might want to seak out the SB-900 or a used 800.

I do some basic portrait stuff using my SB-600 with the diffuser and add some basic 60 or 75 watt light bulbs for some extra light from the sides and get very good results.

The SB-600 was definately worth the money spent.

 

[Todd_H]

Thanks for the info. I was using my crumpler bag to tote around the parks, and it worked surprisingly well, but I'm not sure it'll cut it if I have all the gear that I'm planning on having . Good idea about stashing the tripod though! Do you have the 70-200 2.8 or the 4? I like the extra stop, but I do the majority of my shooting during the daytime hours outside, so I figured I would go with the 4 to save some size/weight.

By the way, I forgot about the size of the lens hood on the 24-70. That thing is huge

Which Crumpler bag do you have? I was looking at the 6MDH, but that might be too big. What I currently use most of the time is this cheap Canon backpack that works really, really well for me. The only real downside is that fact that it screams "camera bag." I don't own the 70-200 yet. I was planning on renting a 70-200 f/2.8 when we go down in September (I would buy it, but I'm *ahem* a little over my camera budget for the year ).

Yep. The reason that lens hood is so big is because it stays in one place while the zoom extends. What's also interesting about the 24-70 is that it "reverse zooms." In other words, it's at its widest (24mm) when it's fully extended. It's a bit strange and takes a little getting used to, but it's a fantastic lens and is so much more useful with a full frame camera.

 

[Angrypenguin]

I currently have the 5MDH, which has been great. However, the 50D with the 24-105 takes up a lot of the room, and I only can squeeze the 50mm underneath it plus the associated cleaning cloths, extra CF cards, etc. I've been thinking about eventually getting the 6MDH.

As for the 70-200, treat it like social security. Just borrow from next year's camera budget.

 

[Todd_H]

Todd:

Really good shots even with a Canon!!! How many times did you go through the rides and how many total shots would you say you took of each ride to get the ones you have here?

LOL... now you're going to expose me for the aspiring amateur I really am !

Actually, looking back through my shots, it appears that I rode the HM 10 times in 3 days, taking a grand total of about 500 shots just inside the HM alone. Of those, I'd say maybe 15-20% came out pretty good. The rest are either too underexposed or out of focus to be usable.

I haven't tallied the others, but I know I only rode PPF 3 times and took maybe 60-70 shots total in there. As far as PotC, I rode it 5 times and took maybe 150 shots in there.

As far as complete throwaways, I would say that PPF had the worst ratio of usable shots to total shots taken. I rank it as the toughest dark ride to shoot because you have too many things working against you as a photographer.

 

[Todd_H]

I currently have the 5MDH, which has been great. However, the 50D with the 24-105 takes up a lot of the room, and I only can squeeze the 50mm underneath it plus the associated cleaning cloths, extra CF cards, etc. I've been thinking about eventually getting the 6MDH.

As for the 70-200, treat it like social security. Just borrow from next year's camera budget.

You know, if Obama lets us get to our 401K, I might just borrow from retirement to get the 70-200 !

 

[YesDear]

Todd: Thanks for the honest answer. I actually think that your keeper ratio was really pretty good. The reason I asked was for the answer you gave. Some of the newer photographers on this and other boards see our keepers and think they can get that result in the 10-20 shots we may post.

Many pros will tell you a 10% keeper ratio would be great. Of course the better you are the more you will have.

You did a great job but I had a feeling it took more than one ride to get what you got!

 

[annnewjerz]

Actually, looking back through my shots, it appears that I rode the HM 10 times in 3 days

Ugh, there go my hopes of getting anything that's half-way decent in December. I will probably only get to ride it twice, maybe three times. BOOO!!

What do you think was the most challenging ride to get the low-light shots in out of all the ones you attempted?

 

[boBQuincy]

Many pros will tell you a 10% keeper ratio would be great. Of course the better you are the more you will have.

Ansel Adams once said that he considered 12 really good photographs in a year to be a good year. That's out of the hundreds he took, so we should not feel too badly about a 10% keeper ratio.

My recent visit to the O. Winston Link museum left me with a much greater appreciation of what he did since many of his best photographs involved elaborate setups and he often only got one chance at them. His keeper ratio must have been very good!

As for me, my keeper ratio gets better the more I photograph, so get out there and take pictures!

 

[Todd_H]

Todd: Thanks for the honest answer. I actually think that your keeper ratio was really pretty good. The reason I asked was for the answer you gave. Some of the newer photographers on this and other boards see our keepers and think they can get that result in the 10-20 shots we may post.

Many pros will tell you a 10% keeper ratio would be great. Of course the better you are the more you will have.

You did a great job but I had a feeling it took more than one ride to get what you got!

Thanks very much, YesDear!

 

[Todd_H]

Ugh, there go my hopes of getting anything that's half-way decent in December. I will probably only get to ride it twice, maybe three times. BOOO!!

What do you think was the most challenging ride to get the low-light shots in out of all the ones you attempted?

IMO, there are two that I rank together as being the most difficult, but for different reasons. The HM is difficult simply because it is so dark. I think your D90's sensor capability can go to ISO 6400 (and maybe 12800 in expanded mode? Not sure), but even at 6400, you'll be able to get some really good shots in the HM, especially of Leota's floating head, the ballroom, the bride (which you'll need to quickly lower your ISO before you shoot her), and maybe a few in the graveyard. Now, PPF is difficult because it moves so fast and your boat is suspended so it wobbles a bit from side to side and you generally don't have much time to frame a scene before your boat zooms on through to the next scene. The lighting is a little brighter in PPF, but you will need to compose a little quicker.

I'm not sure how well Nikons AF in low light, or if there is enough light on any of these rides to use the AF with any success, so you may want to just go the manual focus route. IIRC, you just bought a 30mm f/1.4 which is the perfect lens to use on these rides. You will hear a lot of people recommending using aperture priority, but I find that shutter priority works better. These rides are so dark, there's about a 8/10 chance the camera is going to select the widest aperture anyway. I set my shutter speed anywhere from 1/50 sec. down to 1/30 sec. and jack the ISO up to either 6400 or 12800. Then the only thing you need to do is manually focus and snap. You won't have much time to compose the shot and that's where studying shots before you go down will help you kind of visualize what to expect.

A good one to practice on is PotC. There's usually not a long line for it and it moves pretty slow (even the motion of the boat is no big deal). This will help you relax a bit and help you get used to the shooting conditions. Since PPF will most likely have the longest wait times, I would practice on the others before trying that one.

And since you're shooting digital, fire away! Take a bunch of memory cards or a card reader so you can empty your cards every night. I hope this helps.

 

[Angrypenguin]

IMO, there are two that I rank together as being the most difficult, but for different reasons. The HM is difficult simply because it is so dark. I think your D90's sensor capability can go to ISO 6400 (and maybe 12800 in expanded mode? Not sure), but even at 6400, you'll be able to get some really good shots in the HM, especially of Leota's floating head, the ballroom, the bride (which you'll need to quickly lower your ISO before you shoot her), and maybe a few in the graveyard. Now, PPF is difficult because it moves so fast and your boat is suspended so it wobbles a bit from side to side and you generally don't have much time to frame a scene before your boat zooms on through to the next scene. The lighting is a little brighter in PPF, but you will need to compose a little quicker.

I'm not sure how well Nikons AF in low light, or if there is enough light on any of these rides to use the AF with any success, so you may want to just go the manual focus route. IIRC, you just bought a 30mm f/1.4 which is the perfect lens to use on these rides. You will hear a lot of people recommending using aperture priority, but I find that shutter priority works better. These rides are so dark, there's about a 8/10 chance the camera is going to select the widest aperture anyway. I set my shutter speed anywhere from 1/50 sec. down to 1/30 sec. and jack the ISO up to either 6400 or 12800. Then the only thing you need to do is manually focus and snap. You won't have much time to compose the shot and that's where studying shots before you go down will help you kind of visualize what to expect.

A good one to practice on is PotC. There's usually not a long line for it and it moves pretty slow (even the motion of the boat is no big deal). This will help you relax a bit and help you get used to the shooting conditions. Since PPF will most likely have the longest wait times, I would practice on the others before trying that one.

And since you're shooting digital, fire away! Take a bunch of memory cards or a card reader so you can empty your cards every night. I hope this helps.

Thanks for the tips, Todd! Great advice. Now I just need to go back sometime and try it....

 

[mygirlkristi]

These are very cool!

 

[Todd_H]

These are very cool!

Thanks, Kristi!

 

[thefirebuilds]

these pictures are creepy as hell!

 

[annnewjerz]

IMO, there are two that I rank together as being the most difficult, but for different reasons. The HM is difficult simply because it is so dark. I think your D90's sensor capability can go to ISO 6400

Yes, unfortunately my lowly D90 only goes to ISO 6400 in expended mode. No ISO 12800 shots for me!!

Even at 6400, you'll be able to get some really good shots in the HM, especially of Leota's floating head, the ballroom, the bride (which you'll need to quickly lower your ISO before you shoot her), and maybe a few in the graveyard.

Glad to hear it. I'm not looking for anything of the quality that you just posted or images I have seen from Jeff, etc. but I would like to have maybe one or two reasonably good shots to use for a photobook when I get home. Anything extra will be gravy and anything less will be disappointing, but I'll get over it and try again next time I go back.

Now, PPF is difficult because it moves so fast and your boat is suspended so it wobbles a bit from side to side and you generally don't have much time to frame a scene before your boat zooms on through to the next scene. The lighting is a little brighter in PPF, but you will need to compose a little quicker.

Honestly don't even know if I'll end up on PPF. On our last trip the wait for that was 45 minutes in September. The only thing I'd wait 45 minutes for are Splash Mountain, Haunted Mansion and Tower of Terror since they're my faves.

I find that shutter priority works better. These rides are so dark, there's about a 8/10 chance the camera is going to select the widest aperture anyway. I set my shutter speed anywhere from 1/50 sec. down to 1/30 sec. and jack the ISO up to either 6400 or 12800. Then the only thing you need to do is manually focus and snap. You won't have much time to compose the shot and that's where studying shots before you go down will help you kind of visualize what to expect.

That would be my thought too. Since it's so dark, worry more about getting the fastest shutter speed you can to avoid blur. 1/50 shutter speed will probably automatically get your lowers f/#, but your lowest f/# may not get you a 1/50 shutter speed, it might be something slower that you can't handhold as easily---right??

I hope this helps.

It did. Bringing the camera to WDW is definitely going to be a good learning experience, but I can tell that over the next 7 months I'm going to have a lot of studying to do. Unless you live in a historic home in Gettysburg, I would guess that trying to shoot ghosts in the dark is not an easy thing practice at home.

 

[Todd_H]

Yes, unfortunately my lowly D90 only goes to ISO 6400 in expended mode. No ISO 12800 shots for me!!

Your D90 is an awesome camera and will perform extremely well. ISO 6400 is sensitive enough to get very decent exposures (you've seen Jeff's pictures with his D300 in the HM... those are MUCH better than anything I have posted in this thread and he didn't have the benefit of ISO 12800 or the bigger viewfinder).

Honestly don't even know if I'll end up on PPF. On our last trip the wait for that was 45 minutes in September. The only thing I'd wait 45 minutes for are Splash Mountain, Haunted Mansion and Tower of Terror since they're my faves.

As for PPF, if you want to shoot it, just pick up a fastpass first thing when you get to the MK. Hopefully the window of time won't be too far in the future so you can pick up another FP for a different ride before too long. What I did was pick up a FP first thing the a.m. and then went ahead and got in the standby line (it was only around 10 minutes last week soon after rope drop). I've found that the lines don't usually creep up until around 10am, but then they stay in the 30-50min wait times the rest of the day. Also, since Space Mtn was closed, I wasn't getting FP for any other rides... didn't do Splash because I promised my DD(7) that I would wait and ride it with her in Sept when we go back.

That would be my thought too. Since it's so dark, worry more about getting the fastest shutter speed you can to avoid blur. 1/50 shutter speed will probably automatically get your lowers f/#, but your lowest f/# may not get you a 1/50 shutter speed, it might be something slower that you can't handhold as easily---right??

Bingo. And DOF isn't as big of an issue as you would think

It did. Bringing the camera to WDW is definitely going to be a good learning experience, but I can tell that over the next 7 months I'm going to have a lot of studying to do. Unless you live in a historic home in Gettysburg, I would guess that trying to shoot ghosts in the dark is not an easy thing practice at home.

If you want to practice in similar light at home (and I say this in all seriousness), I would wait until nighttime, set up a few objects in a room that are lit by candlelight and practice walking through the room and manually focusing on the object and shooting it while you're moving. This will at a minimum allow you to practice trying to manually focus through the viewfinder in low light with the 30mm and/or the 50mm (there will be a noticeable difference in what you're able to see with the 50 vs the 30). O.K., now I sound like a dork

Anyway, good luck and have fun with it!

 

[annnewjerz]

If you want to practice in similar light at home (and I say this in all seriousness), I would wait until nighttime, set up a few objects in a room that are lit by candlelight and practice walking through the room and manually focusing on the object and shooting it while you're moving. This will at a minimum allow you to practice trying to manually focus through the viewfinder in low light with the 30mm and/or the 50mm (there will be a noticeable difference in what you're able to see with the 50 vs the 30). O.K., now I sound like a dork

Doing that around the house actually makes a lot of sense, just didn't know if it would accurately mimic the amount of light that you get on most dark rides. Now that you suggest it, I guess I have done it in the past, just not pictures of rum chugging pirates.

For example, I took the picture below using my D60, ISO 1600, 1/25 shutter speed handheld and manually focused the D60. The room was only lit by a few candles because it was demonstrating life colonial times.

It's all sloooooowly coming together. I just need to re-read "Understanding Shutter Speed"---got it for Christmas, blew through it and up until a monent ago couldn't remember if 1/50 was faster or slower than 1/25.

Thanks again for all the info---it makes me feel at least slightly more confident!

 

[Angrypenguin]

Doing that around the house actually makes a lot of sense, just didn't know if it would accurately mimic the amount of light that you get on most dark rides. Now that you suggest it, I guess I have done it in the past, just not pictures of rum chugging pirates.

For example, I took the picture below using my D60, ISO 1600, 1/25 shutter speed handheld and manually focused the D60. The room was only lit by a few candles because it was demonstrating life colonial times.

It's all sloooooowly coming together. I just need to re-read "Understanding Shutter Speed"---got it for Christmas, blew through it and up until a monent ago couldn't remember if 1/50 was faster or slower than 1/25.

Thanks again for all the info---it makes me feel at least slightly more confident!

That's a great shot, annne! I'm thinking I'll need to do some practicing as well. I also need to make sure I don't drink too much coffee and get the shakes

 

[annnewjerz]

That's a great shot, annne! I'm thinking I'll need to do some practicing as well. I also need to make sure I don't drink too much coffee and get the shakes

Meh, the shot was okay---not very interesting content, but I feel like it demonstrated what Todd was saying well. There are real everyday scenarios that can give us newbs practice before we make the trip down to WDW---I guess I just never thought about it before.