Don't like new fastpass plus!

[DougEMG]

What I'd like to see is the ability to book 5 or 6 FP+ at once. What I'm finding is that the lines are so long for everything that I end up leaving lots of times after doing the first 3. I suppose at some point the cost of admission vrs the number of rides we can do is going to become an important consideration in continuing to go to WDW.

 

[Dis703]

They didn't know that to access a ride or pull a FP you had to be in the park? It didn't occur to them that the world's busiest theme park might have long lines?

The first several times I went to Disney we didn't use FP at all. We saw some signs for it, but we thought you had to pay extra so we didn't use it. I can't imagine I was the only one who didn't know any better.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

What I'd like to see is the ability to book 5 or 6 FP+ at once. What I'm finding is that the lines are so long for everything that I end up leaving lots of times after doing the first 3. I suppose at some point the cost of admission vrs the number of rides we can do is going to become an important consideration in continuing to go to WDW.

You can get additional FPs at the kiosks after you have used your 3. Of course you can only do that the same day and not all attractions may be available. But at MK, which has lots of attractions, you can knock off plenty of them that way without waiting.

 

[Mambo Junkie]

Just got back from WDW and in my opinion, the new fastpass plus has done nothing but deterred me from going back any time soon. We reserved and used our 3 fastpasses a day. They developed my disney experience and have a phone app but you can't use it to get new fast passes so you have to go to a kiosk and get your 4th fastpass. The problem is, by the time you've used your last fastpass, all of the fastpasses for the top rides are already gone. When we were there 2 years ago, we were able to go on Soarin 4 times in one day, 3 with fastpasses and once we stood in the stand by line early. This trip, we could only go on Soarin once over the course of 2 days. We didn't spend as much time in the parks either because we ran out of fastpass options and weren't about to stand in super long lines. I have been there 3 times in the last 6 years and for the first time, we were bored and went back to the resort early. Fastpass plus is a big disappointment.

Are you sorry you mentioned it yet?

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Sort of. That's true if two companies are selling the same thing to the same people. But when it's a monopoly situation like what Disney has where the loyal guests seek out the services of the company, it's entirely different. Disney knows the amount of loyal guests that will stop going because of a change in the queuing system is close to 0. Think about it. You're still going. So they're not losing loyal guests to get new guests. They're processing the loyal guests more efficiently to make space for more new guests.

To be fair, the only reason we are still going on this trip because it has been planned for a while and is all for our daughter (she picked the hotel, restaurants, etc.). Our trip in July, we decided to skip the parks entirely and just did some resort dining, a water park, activities at Fort Wilderness, and explored other resorts. Instead of WDW next year, we are planning on Disneyland. And we have no plans to return in 2016. For people who have been taking multiple trips a year recently, and spending 10 days in the parks on each of those trips, that's a pretty big change for us.

 

[ncdj2013]

See, when people who knew the old fastpass system inside and out road Soarin 4 times a day, that meant that someone else didn't get to ride it at all. Disney wants those people to ride the rides, be satisfied with their visit, and come back. In this respect I completely see the point of FP+. I just wish allocation was more fair (30/60 days).

What's not fair?

 

[niffer5150]

So Disney came out w this magical FP- system wherein instead of standing there for an hour, you just took a ticket and came back in an hour. But then surprise surprise, some ppl figure out how to work the system, and they figure out ways to get on everything fast all the time. Now finally Disney fixes it with an electronic system that provides no such benefit to ppl who would otherwise be able to beat the FP- system and so those ppl feel like their system has been taken away from them. When really, it's what FP- was supposed to do, but failed to.

can you, or anyone really, explain to me how people were gaming the system? i've tried and tried to wrap my brain around how people were misusing it(because i keep seeing people saying others were abusing it) but i just can't. did they have extra park tickets somehow? how do you beat a system that only doles out one FP per ticket in a set time frame?

 

[ncdj2013]

Personally, I'm tired of the assumption that anyone who does not like FP+ was a legacy super user. We used maybe 2-3 FP's per day maximum and we were never big repeat users. However, I do not like FP+. It has created longer SB lines where none existed before: HM, POC, Spaceship Earth. I also don't like making ride reservations. I know people will now retort, "But you don't have to." However if I want to ride popular attractions with minimal waits, I do have to participate in the FP+ system.

I guess the confusing part to me is that I don't understand how scheduling a FP is worse than grabbing a FP ticket for a designated return time that is completely out of your control? I can recall more than once trying to pull a FP for a ride but the return time they were giving conflicted with dinner or a show or for some that were already giving return times of several hours later and we weren't even going to be in the park by that point.

I totally agree. More than once we have given away FP- because we had to leave before the return time.

 

[MrInfinity]

can you, or anyone really, explain to me how people were gaming the system? i've tried and tried to wrap my brain around how people were misusing it(because i keep seeing people saying others were abusing it) but i just can't. did they have extra park tickets somehow? how do you beat a system that only doles out one FP per ticket in a set time frame?

People take it so negatively when you speak about how they were getting more out of the system. Ok so you (and I) were not misusing or abusing it. Yet the system, due to its inherent flaws, presented itself to be heavily used by those who chose to, but not used at all by most guests. It failed as a system. A few people used it... but got tons of use out of it, giving them a huge edge over the rest of guests.

Meanwhile it did not improve the experience for the majority of guests or get most guests less time in line. It got a few guests a lot less time in line and longer waits for most guests. That was a fail as a system. The new system is so much better because it provides some benefit to everyone, and not a disproportionate benefit to anyone. There is no way for you to get more use out of it than someone else.

 

[JoeyAnyc]

Sorry to hear that the FP+ system isn't compatible with your style of doing the parks. It will be interesting to see where things go with FP+, and what differences there will be a year from now.

I'm very excited to go in two weeks. For me, I'm thrilled to know that I have a FP+ reservations for all of the rides I love doing. I got to use the Magic Band system last December last year and it all worked out well. I hope to have the same experience. Luckily MK is opened until 2AM on my Saturday. SCORE! Hopefully I WILL get that 7DMT ride in on this trip

It's very interesting to read how FP+ is a game changer on both ends of the spectrum.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

can you, or anyone really, explain to me how people were gaming the system? i've tried and tried to wrap my brain around how people were misusing it(because i keep seeing people saying others were abusing it) but i just can't. did they have extra park tickets somehow? how do you beat a system that only doles out one FP per ticket in a set time frame?

I don't really see how anyone gamed the system, either. And I do understand how some people like one over the other. It's like how some people prefer capitalism and others socialism. Neither is necessarily wrong, but people's experiences and preferences will make them partial to one or the other. With fast pass, everyone had the exact same opportunity to grab them. If you toured with a large group and didn't split up, if you didn't get to the parks until noon, or if you had small children, you likely didn't take as advantage of fast pass as other people did. And that's fine. You did what worked best for you with the situation you were given. With FP+, everyone will have the same number of fast passes. It won't matter when you arrive, how many are in your party, or the ages of those touring. You have your three just like the other Joe sitting right next to you. In neither system is anyone cheating or being cheated. Everyone has equal opportunities. It's just that same have preferences that are better fitted to FP and others to FP+.

Personally, I'm tired of the assumption that anyone who does not like FP+ was a legacy super user. We used maybe 2-3 FP's per day maximum and we were never big repeat users. However, I do not like FP+. It has created longer SB lines where none existed before: HM, POC, Spaceship Earth. I also don't like making ride reservations. I know people will now retort, "But you don't have to." However if I want to ride popular attractions with minimal waits, I do have to participate in the FP+ system.

I totally agree. More than once we have given away FP- because we had to leave before the return time.

I think a lot of it has to do when when you are deciding to pull the FP. With FP+, you are choosing 60 days out. You are having to make assumptions on how tired you will be, what the weather will be like, and how crowds will be 60 days out. That's rather hard. However, if you are doing things day-of, you have a better idea of whether or not you are going to be able to make it to Space Mountain in 4 hours to cash in a fast pass or not. You know how you are feeling. You know if you are tired and if you are getting irritated with family, friends, and strangers around you. You know whether or not the forecast says that the 3:00 rain shower will be longer than usual that day. You are also able to monitor return times throughout the day so you know that even if you don't want to ride Space Mountain at 4:00, if you wait another 30 minutes, the return time will be 5:30 and that will work out great with your current projected touring strategy. Basically, you have a lot more information to help you decide what to fast pass with legacy than with FP+.

 

[MakiraMarlena]

Yes, it is a game changer. WDW is the first theme park to ever have a system like this. Others may follow suit eventually if it works out.

Those who don't like having their games changed are making their displeasure known here, and to Disney by refusing to return to WDW for vacations. But will WDW carry on and continue to profit without them? Still the big question.

I think a lot of it has to do when when you are deciding to pull the FP. With FP+, you are choosing 60 days out. You are having to make assumptions on how tired you will be, what the weather will be like, and how crowds will be 60 days out. That's rather hard.

This is what it would be like if you were completely unable to change the FP you made at 60 days. But it's possible to change them, even the day of. The issue is that what you want to change it to may not be available, but that could have been an issue with legacy passes also if you arrived at the FP distribution point and they didn't have a return time available that fit with your touring strategy.

I can understand though that it was probably somewhat easier to look and see what the time was on the FP distribution than it is to get the phone out or visit a kiosk to see what's available.

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

This is what it would be like if you were completely unable to change the FP you made at 60 days. But it's possible to change them, even the day of. The issue is that what you want to change it to may not be available, but that could have been an issue with legacy passes also if you arrived at the FP distribution point and they didn't have a return time available that fit with your touring strategy.

Fast Pass was considerably more flexible than FP+. It wasn't hard to monitor FP return times to know when to head to the ride to grab one. It wasn't hard to have multiples out at one time. And it certainly wasn't hard to use more than 3 in a day. As is, FP+ is difficult to change attractions day-of. It is difficult to use if you plan to park hop. And it is risky in that you don't know if you should select fast passes for earlier in the day, thereby risking not getting a fourth and standing in lines when they are the longest of the day, or if you should select them later in the afternoon almost guaranteeing you won't get a fourth, but you will at least be guaranteed those three rides which will have minimal wait.

 

[IWannaBuildASnowman]

I'm not exactly sure of what their motives are, but anyone who has ever taken a basic business class will tell you it is cheaper to keep a loyal customer than to create a new one. In fact, I remember it being 6 times cheaper to keep a loyal customer. So, I would think that they thought FP+ would benefit their loyal customers more than they thought it would help them get new ones. Now, whether or not the majority of loyal Disney guests are happy with FP+ or not is not something I know. But, I'm willing to bet it was much more about trying to keep loyal guests happy.

....Right. And the customers who have already purchased tickets and are in the parks, are customers. But because they didn't "know the system", they aren't returning. It's exactly as you're stating - they are trying to make *those* customers happy. I mean, among a myriad of other things, I'm sure.

With regards to gaming the system, that's happening now, with burner rooms etc. I don't think people were gaming the system before, but people were "maximizing" it with in-depth knowledge of the parks and systems that it takes a really long time to gain, thus making it harder for people who didn't have that knowledge to see or do the things they may have liked to do. This does level the playing field in that sense.

 

[Goofdad]

just some thoughts -

We are in the trip planning phase now and 60days out we have a complete calendar/agenda ready.

• We know what parks we will be at on what days.
• We know where/when we will eat.
• We know when we are scheduled to ride major attractions.
• We know what night time finale's we will see and when.

All the "big stuff" is covered. And with whatever snippets of time we have in between our scheduled dining and FP+, we enjoy all the "little things" that Disney offers.

So far, I really like FP+. I am certain that we will be busy all day but not much of it will be waiting in lines.
We last visited when FP+ first came out and "old" FP was still available - and we worked hard to use both... and it was a bit of a run-around. To us, the Disney experience is more than just riding amusement rides. I don't have to get on every single ride - we don't worry that we "can't do everything" because we know we can't (and trying reduces enjoyment).

So far... I'm a huge fan of the FP+ approach. We are going to WDW knowing that we have a couple of nice meals, 3 or 4 BIG rides, and a night-time finale EVERY day there! And we still have time to fill it all in with other rides, parades, snacks, pools, naps, or whatever we want.

 

[wishuponastarforever]

This thread has given me a new perspective. I am an experienced fp user. We never rode our favorites over and over but we did take occasional advantage of returning after the return time. This has been eliminated by fp+ and quite frankly I think fp+ is a more fair way of distribution. We will use fp+ for our first time next month. I initially bristled at the changes and started to go into resentment mode at the prospect of losing our spontaneity. This thread has helped me to view the other side. I will go about this with a more open mind and armed with some great information. We'll see how it goes

 

[Suvadoo]

Personally, I'm tired of the assumption that anyone who does not like FP+ was a legacy super user. We used maybe 2-3 FP's per day maximum and we were never big repeat users. However, I do not like FP+. It has created longer SB lines where none existed before: HM, POC, Spaceship Earth. I also don't like making ride reservations. I know people will now retort, "But you don't have to." However if I want to ride popular attractions with minimal waits, I do have to participate in the FP+ system.

I guess the confusing part to me is that I don't understand how scheduling a FP is worse than grabbing a FP ticket for a designated return time that is completely out of your control? I can recall more than once trying to pull a FP for a ride but the return time they were giving conflicted with dinner or a show or for some that were already giving return times of several hours later and we weren't even going to be in the park by that point.

Ok, I'll reverse your logic. I don't understand why anyone would want to make ride reservations.
I do not want to feel scheduled on vacation. With Legacy, if the FP return time didn't accommodate our schedule,we moved on. But I didn't have to make plans for the exact day and time I wanted to be at a particular park for a particular ride 60 days before my arrival. I also do not make ADR's for the same reason.

 

[Suvadoo]

I can understand why people who visited a WDW where there were never standby lines for attractions like POC and HM even in the middle of the afternoon, and FPs for attractions like Space Mountain, Soarin, and Test Track were freely available all day, would find the current WDW less enjoyable for them.

But, because we never found that WDW in any of our visits beginning in 1983, we can't miss it. I still have an Unofficial Guide to WDW from 2003 that suggests riding POC before noon or after 5 PM and HM before 11:30 AM or after 8 PM, so apparently there used to be standby lines at those attractions at least some of the time even way back then.

I've got those old Unofficial Guides also and what you fail to mention is the guide makes these recommendations for higher crowd days. Usually when the parks are at an 8-10 crowd level.

 

[mom2rtk]

Ok, I'll reverse your logic. I don't understand why anyone would want to make ride reservations.
I do not want to feel scheduled on vacation. With Legacy, if the FP return time didn't accommodate our schedule,we moved on. But I didn't have to make plans for the exact day and time I wanted to be at a particular park for a particular ride 60 days before my arrival. I also do not make ADR's for the same reason.

Not to mention that if I would show up at the park in December and the weather was cold, I would not pull a fastpass for Splash Mountain. If I showed up and it was 80, I would definitely pull one. No way to know which will be the case 60 days out.

 

[campbell95]

We were AP holders for 3 years in a row, and let them expire last year. We don't even like making dining reservations, because, well, who knows what we want to do 1, 3, 6, 12 months from now? I mean, really. Weather affects things. Our kids' sleep schedules affect things. Random ride closures affect things. I don't want to make these decisions 60 days in advance. And that is if (IF!!) you stay on site. Stay off-site and then you're really at a disadvantage. We do stay on site, so I guess we are "lucky" to have those extra days. Except. I don't want to be locked into rides and shows when I know nothing about how that day will play out.

We just took a gamble and booked 2 trips. I'm curious to see how it all plays out. We'll be there at a low time (jan/feb), and then at a peak time(Easter). I just don't know. We have a whole 3 dining reservations combined for our 2 trips. I don't look forward to making our FP+ reservations. I hope the rides are open. And the weather cooperates. And our kids, too. I like the old way. FP- let us play it by ear the day of.