Does anyone honest to goodness tithe?

[cybrkitn]

I disagree! God ALWAYS provides for those who love Him. It may not be exactly the way WE want.

John 14

1"Do not let your hearts be troubled. Trust in God; trust also in me.

15"If you love me, you will obey what I command. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him."

I know in our case, we struggled for years with our finances even though we gave countless hours of time & effort to the Lord's ministry through our local church. We gave from the leftovers instead of the firstfruits as the Bible instructs, i.e. not much. Now that we tithe (in addition to giving time & effort), God has blessed us financially. We've gone from living paycheck to paycheck to having more than enough to live on. We're not getting rich, thankfully, because then we might start relying on ourselves instead of God. That's not to say our life is a bed of roses. We have ups & downs like everyone. But God is faithful through it all & I know He will continue to be.

JimmieJ, thank you. We are also struggling and living paycheck to paycheck. But we are still tithing 10% and God has been blessing us and providing for us for following His will. Let me give an example.

Back in October (about 2 weeks before our Disney trip), DH's car went (on a Monday). He finally got it out of the driveway and drove it to work. When he left, the car wouldn't go into reverse at all (this was a used SUV that he had paid off back in March). Tuesday, he has this strong feeling to look for a new car and at a specific dealership. He goes, finds a Toyota Matrix and test drives it. Wednesday, DH goes back to the dealership fills out the application for a loan. Thursday, he finds out that he has been approved and on Friday, he has his new 2006 Toyota Matrix (with all wheel drive, the last of its kind on Long Island).

We took a giant leap of Faith that God would provide what was needed. God knew we needed another car and He was right there to provide when it was needed. DH's credit has never been good and he managed to get this car without a co-signer. The only way this could have happened is through God. By ourselves, we can not afford a new car. But we know that since this was God's will for DH that the money needed to pay for it will be there. It's not for us to know the how or why; just to know that it is there. And DH doesn't see that Matrix as his. He sees it belonging to God who provided it for him.

After reading the scripture you quoted, another one came to mind that was the reading at church last Sunday. It is Matthew 6:25-34 (GWT):

25"So I tell you to stop worrying about what you will eat, drink, or wear. Isn't life more than food and the body more than clothes? 26Look at the birds. They don't plant, harvest, or gather the harvest into barns. Yet, your heavenly Father feeds them. Aren't you worth more than they? 27Can any of you add a single hour to your life by worrying? 28And why worry about clothes? Notice how the flowers grow in the field. They never work or spin yarn for clothes. 29But I say that not even Solomon in all his majesty was dressed like one of these flowers. 30That's the way God clothes the grass in the field. Today it's alive, and tomorrow it's thrown into an incinerator. So how much more will he clothe you people who have so little faith? 31Don't ever worry and say, 'What are we going to eat?' or 'What are we going to drink?' or 'What are we going to wear?' 32Everyone is concerned about these things, and your heavenly Father certainly knows you need all of them. But first, be concerned about his kingdom and what has his approval. Then all these things will be provided for you. 34So don't ever worry about tomorrow. After all, tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."

Tithing fits right in there, too. As Jesus said above, "But first, be concerned about his kingdom and what has his appropval. Then all these things will be provided for you."

What you had said above about it just not being our way is correct. God provides through different means and he knows how it will be done. How we want it may not be the best for us and could hurt us down the road. Tithing helps God provide for those who need it.

 

[FL-Belle]

If people leave a church because of the leaders, but do tithe in the next church, how is that wrong? IMO churches struggle because people figure their money is best spent at another church, or even giving to God outside the church.

It's not wrong at all. My example was about small mismanagement (paying too much for something).
IMO you should tithe at the church you are going to. If you leave one church and join another (for whatever reason) your tithe belongs to the church you are attending.

 

[aquinas]

It's not wrong at all. My example was about small mismanagement (paying too much for something).
IMO you should tithe at the church you are going to. If you leave one church and join another (for whatever reason) your tithe belongs to the church you are attending.

I agree but I think too many leave churches for the wrong reasons and are too quick to do so.

BUT if you belong to a church then it is your responsibility to tithe to that church. If you feel led to give to a charity or organization outside of the church then it should be above and beyond your tithe to the local church.

 

[FL-Belle]

I agree but I think too many leave churches for the wrong reasons and are too quick to do so.

BUT if you belong to a church then it is your responsibility to tithe to that church. If you feel led to give to a charity or organization outside of the church then it should be above and beyond your tithe to the local church.

Yes, I agree that giving to charity or to another outside organization should be above and beyond your tithe. I give to another ministry, as well as my church. However, I do not deduct the amount I give elsewhere from my tithe to my church. The other giving is just that giving above and beyond.

 

[Buckalew11]

And the most important thing to remember is not how much you give, but the spirit with which you give it. If you resent giving the money, then don't. God doesn't want you to give in that way. JMHO. Always need to examine your heart in all things--figuring out why we are doing what we are doing. If you think you should give to make God love you more, you're wrong--He won't. If you think you should give so that others will see and know you are tithing and be impressed with you, don't. It won't impress anyone and esp. won't mean anything to God either. If you think you'll give a 10% or more and God will make you rich, you're wrong. God's riches are obviously not the same as earthly measure of wealth--otherwise Jesus would have been the great and rich King He was expected to be. No, in God, often the opposite is true!

I'll be honest and say I haven't always been a cheerful giver. There were plenty of times I thought I needed that $$ more than God did and resented letting it go. There was a long period of time I gave nothing...not even a quarter or a dollar. That is all something that I have had to work out as I grew with my relationship to God.

I would not be comfortable in a church with pledges and all that jazz. But, I am often someone who looks at life way too simply so it may not be wrong to do money that way within the church but for me, it is distasteful.

 

[3DisneyKids]

Back in October (about 2 weeks before our Disney trip), DH's car went (on a Monday). He finally got it out of the driveway and drove it to work. When he left, the car wouldn't go into reverse at all (this was a used SUV that he had paid off back in March). Tuesday, he has this strong feeling to look for a new car and at a specific dealership. He goes, finds a Toyota Matrix and test drives it. Wednesday, DH goes back to the dealership fills out the application for a loan. Thursday, he finds out that he has been approved and on Friday, he has his new 2006 Toyota Matrix (with all wheel drive, the last of its kind on Long Island).

We took a giant leap of Faith that God would provide what was needed. God knew we needed another car and He was right there to provide when it was needed. DH's credit has never been good and he managed to get this car without a co-signer. The only way this could have happened is through God. By ourselves, we can not afford a new car. But we know that since this was God's will for DH that the money needed to pay for it will be there. It's not for us to know the how or why; just to know that it is there. And DH doesn't see that Matrix as his. He sees it belonging to God who provided it for him.

I am so sorry, and I do not intend to be rude at all, since you seem like a very nice and sincere person. But this post terrifies me. God did not provide you with a new car. The fact that your DH secured an auto loan (for a brand new car, no less) is because the U.S. banking and credit industry preys upon people this way. There have been hundreds of stories of families losing their homes/cars/etc. to foreclosure because they were granted loans/mortgages that they could never afford. Credit agencies want your MONEY. Period. You pay huge amounts in finance charges....this is what they are after. If God had provided you with a car, it would not be by means of a new car financed to the hilt. Sorry, jmo...

Best wishes.

 

[cardaway]

I am so sorry, and I do not intend to be rude at all, since you seem like a very nice and sincere person. But this post terrifies me. God did not provide you with a new car. The fact that your DH secured an auto loan (for a brand new car, no less) is because the U.S. banking and credit industry preys upon people this way. There have been hundreds of stories of families losing their homes/cars/etc. to foreclosure because they were granted loans/mortgages that they could never afford. Credit agencies want your MONEY. Period. You pay huge amounts in finance charges....this is what they are after. If God had provided you with a car, it would not be by means of a new car financed to the hilt. Sorry, jmo...

ITA! It's not only scary how many people don't realize the bad istuaitons they put themselves in. And this bothers me because bunkruptcy hurts everybody, not just the people who go bankrupt.

I also find it sad how many people don't give creidt to themselves or others that help them.

 

[cardaway]

Since I actually am somebody who takes knwoing about what I psot seriously, here is something interesting I found on wikipedia when reading up of tithing.

There has also been much controversy with the introduction of "membership covenants" in many evangelical churches in North America, spearheaded by many mega-churches. These covenants, such as those introduced at the Willow Creek and Saddleback mega-churches, require giving 10% to that church as a condition of membership. Prospective members must sign off on a contract and are interviewed regarding their lifestyle, including tithing. Proponents say this is accountability. Opponents say this teaching is extortion.

This really hits home because of a situation close to me. Some friends and family left a church because of this kind of stuff. I can't imagine going to a church that keeps track of how much people give and hounds them when they don't give as much as they want them to.

I've also heard similar stories about the local mega church. The one that owns more land than the large billion dollar company I work at here in the land of Microsoft.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overlake_Christian_Church

 

[Buckalew11]

I agree with Cardaway and 3DisneyKids...about the car and the church keeping track of your money for membership. Something about that seems so wrong to me.

The car bothers me because it is so easy to get a loan and then those monthly payments can really kill you and I think they who loan the $$ want it to kill you! I might be wrong and wasn't going to say anything about that car post but it really bothered me deeply when I read it. Something tells me God would not want someone to go into deep debt for a car when they are struggling each month anyway. JMHO.

 

[cardaway]

The car bothers me because it is so easy to get a loan and then those monthly payments can really kill you and I think they who loan the $$ want it to kill you! I might be wrong and wasn't going to say anything about that car post but it really bothered me deeply when I read it. Something tells me God would not want someone to go into deep debt for a car when they are struggling each month anyway. JMHO.

I'm glad somebody here agrees because IMO this is a huge problem. All one has to do is listen to the radio to know how many places there are that prey on people with bad credit. It's amazing how many commercials I hear starting with something like "do you have bad credit" or "been turned down elsewhere"...

 

[mickeyfan2]

I am so sorry, and I do not intend to be rude at all, since you seem like a very nice and sincere person. But this post terrifies me. God did not provide you with a new car. The fact that your DH secured an auto loan (for a brand new car, no less) is because the U.S. banking and credit industry preys upon people this way. There have been hundreds of stories of families losing their homes/cars/etc. to foreclosure because they were granted loans/mortgages that they could never afford. Credit agencies want your MONEY. Period. You pay huge amounts in finance charges....this is what they are after. If God had provided you with a car, it would not be by means of a new car financed to the hilt. Sorry, jmo...

Best wishes.

The other day on TV they said that 1/3 of all mortgages will be in trouble in the next 5 years due to the way they got the financing. They could not afford the house when they bought it, but got creative with the financing. When the creative part ends they will still not be able to afford the home. I really find this so extremely sad and worry some for the economy as well.

 

[cybrkitn]

I am so sorry, and I do not intend to be rude at all, since you seem like a very nice and sincere person. But this post terrifies me. God did not provide you with a new car. The fact that your DH secured an auto loan (for a brand new car, no less) is because the U.S. banking and credit industry preys upon people this way. There have been hundreds of stories of families losing their homes/cars/etc. to foreclosure because they were granted loans/mortgages that they could never afford. Credit agencies want your MONEY. Period. You pay huge amounts in finance charges....this is what they are after. If God had provided you with a car, it would not be by means of a new car financed to the hilt. Sorry, jmo...

Best wishes.

You're not being rude. When you have an intimate relationship with God, you "know" when he is working in your life. And yes, God did provide DH with a car right when it was needed (even though we really can't afford it, but He has already provided the means to do so). Of that, I have no doubt what-so-ever . That is Faith. There are other blessings that God has provided for us as well.

One was for DH when he was on a business trip in Las Vegas for a conference. We didn't have enough money for him to really go on this trip. The state reimburses after the money is spent by the employee first. Well, we ran out of money in our account for him to get food. Whatever he had in his pocket was it and it was less than $10. The scripture passage that I had quoted was given to me by God during that time as well and I emailed it to my DH. He had Faith in God that he would not go hungry and be able to eat. One day it was just popcorn. Another time, he had gotten something small from McDonalds and it was during their Monopoly game. Well, he had won a few food deals that kept him afloat until payday. That was not coincidence. That was God working and providing.

You would be amazed at what God provides when you have Faith in him and let go of wanting to control everything, including finances. I'm starting to realize it even more and this thread has helped me tremendously.

 

[aquinas]

You're not being rude. When you have an intimate relationship with God, you "know" when he is working in your life. And yes, God did provide DH with a car right when it was needed (even though we really can't afford it, but He has already provided the means to do so). Of that, I have no doubt what-so-ever . That is Faith. There are other blessings that God has provided for us as well.

One was for DH when he was on a business trip in Las Vegas for a conference. We didn't have enough money for him to really go on this trip. The state reimburses after the money is spent by the employee first. Well, we ran out of money in our account for him to get food. Whatever he had in his pocket was it and it was less than $10. The scripture passage that I had quoted was given to me by God during that time as well and I emailed it to my DH. He had Faith in God that he would not go hungry and be able to eat. One day it was just popcorn. Another time, he had gotten something small from McDonalds and it was during their Monopoly game. Well, he had won a few food deals that kept him afloat until payday. That was not coincidence. That was God working and providing.

You would be amazed at what God provides when you have Faith in him and let go of wanting to control everything, including finances. I'm starting to realize it even more and this thread has helped me tremendously.

We serve a sovereign Lord. He is sovereign in ALL things. Big and small.

 

[Cool-Beans]

You're not being rude. When you have an intimate relationship with God, you "know" when he is working in your life. And yes, God did provide DH with a car right when it was needed (even though we really can't afford it, but He has already provided the means to do so). Of that, I have no doubt what-so-ever . That is Faith. There are other blessings that God has provided for us as well.

One was for DH when he was on a business trip in Las Vegas for a conference. We didn't have enough money for him to really go on this trip. The state reimburses after the money is spent by the employee first. Well, we ran out of money in our account for him to get food. Whatever he had in his pocket was it and it was less than $10. The scripture passage that I had quoted was given to me by God during that time as well and I emailed it to my DH. He had Faith in God that he would not go hungry and be able to eat. One day it was just popcorn. Another time, he had gotten something small from McDonalds and it was during their Monopoly game. Well, he had won a few food deals that kept him afloat until payday. That was not coincidence. That was God working and providing.

You would be amazed at what God provides when you have Faith in him and let go of wanting to control everything, including finances. I'm starting to realize it even more and this thread has helped me tremendously.

OK, I'll bite.

Your husband received free french fries or whatever through divine intervention. But, God lets children starve to death, or suffer with horrible pain before they die.

Why does God like your husband so much more? Is he more deserving than these kids? Or is it that he has a better relationship with God, or is it because he gave more money?

 

[Zippa D Doodah]

I would not be comfortable in a church with pledges and all that jazz. But, I am often someone who looks at life way too simply so it may not be wrong to do money that way within the church but for me, it is distasteful.

Not to pick, because I agree with much of what you say, but what is the difference in making a pledge to the church vs. making a pledge to your mortgage lender or your auto finance company? Those entities expect us to make pledges, couldn't God expect us to make and keep promises of financial commitment? Now certainly there are right and wrong, tasteful and distasteful ways for churches to go about encouraging that commitment, but the principle may remain the same.

EC: changed a "should" to "could"

 

[cardaway]

OK, I'll bite.

Your husband received free french fries or whatever through divine intervention. But, God lets children starve to death, or suffer with horrible pain before they die.

Why does God like your husband so much more? Is he more deserving than these kids? Or is it that he has a better relationship with God, or is it because he gave more money?

I think I understand and agree with where you are going with that, but it's not going to mean anything to somebody who doesn't put any meat behind those statements. It's not like a person is going to actually turn around and blame God if they didn't win at McD's Monopoly. Likely just to find something else to give God credit for instead.

 

[Buckalew11]

I don't think you are picking and the problem might just be me. I just don't handle my relationship with God as I do a loan on my house. I pay the mortgage because I have to and although I like having a home, I am not real cheerful when I pay the loan $, LOL. I give to my church from my heart, not because I have a set amount I must give. I do not count what I give to the church on my taxes...maybe a mistake, but it just wouldn't seem right to me to do that. I give the 10% because I think it was given as a good guideline in an amount to give. I get 100% and give 10%---seems more than fair to me. Again, it might just be me and my feelings about money and giving but pledging money won't be happening for me. It would seem too "have to" to me and not from the heart.

 

[JoyG]

There has also been much controversy with the introduction of "membership covenants" in many evangelical churches in North America, spearheaded by many mega-churches. These covenants, such as those introduced at the Willow Creek and Saddleback mega-churches, require giving 10% to that church as a condition of membership. Prospective members must sign off on a contract and are interviewed regarding their lifestyle, including tithing. Proponents say this is accountability. Opponents say this teaching is extortion.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overlake_Christian_Church

WHAT?!?!

I am shocked and appalled. I can't believe Saddleback is doing that!?!

That is so wrong on so many levels. I think when we start restricting membership to only those that tithe we are being really legalistic and missing out on the opportunity to witness to new christians and help them grow in their faith. I have a hard time having members sign off on a contract about their lifestyles before they join also. Having people sign a contract before they can become members really crosses the line into legalism. Wow.

 

[Buckalew11]

Not to pick, because I agree with much of what you say, but what is the difference in making a pledge to the church vs. making a pledge to your mortgage lender or your auto finance company? Those entities expect us to make pledges, couldn't God expect us to make and keep promises of financial commitment? Now certainly there are right and wrong, tasteful and distasteful ways for churches to go about encouraging that commitment, but the principle may remain the same.

EC: changed a "should" to "could"

Me again...I don't want to owe anyone or any bank. I think I'd feel like I owed the church and when giving tithes and offerings, I don't "feel" like I owe the $$. Does that make any sense?

 

[cardaway]

WHAT?!?!

I am shocked and appalled. I can't believe Saddleback is doing that!?!

That is so wrong on so many levels. I think when we start restricting membership to only those that tithe we are being really legalistic and missing out on the opportunity to witness to new christians and help them grow in their faith. I have a hard time having members sign off on a contract about their lifestyles before they join also. Having people sign a contract before they can become members really crosses the line into legalism. Wow.

I'm think the local place I linked to does the same thing.