Do you think someone receiving assistance should continue to have children?

[shortbun]

Well, then the government can "stay out of it" with our money too.

Works for me

So you would privatize welfare? And just exactly who would YOU help? Not children? What are you going to do with those children who are not being fed, clothed or cared for regarding health issues?

 

[disneyjunkie]

Many people read on the Budget Board (how to feed your family on $10./day) about people receiving WIC for each of their children and they are pregnant again (we are talking 3+ children). In the meantime, readers have discovered the individuals receiving WIC:

a) Sit home and do not work; they will argue that being a SAHM is a job but if you require public assistance, you need to get out in the job market.

b) Have Disney trips planned (if you are receiving a hand-out on the taxpayers dime, the taxpayer is not going to be receptive to your plans of going to WDW during Free Dining nor do we want to suggest the best places for you to eat while we stay at home working and providing for our families)

c) Have $50. to blow on a diet drug

Yeah, I can see why people are heated about it.

Don't forget one family receiving WIC is heading down to WDW next March. (PEAK season) How can a family that isn't able to provide milk, formula, cheese...for their children able to afford a trip to WDW?

 

[hentob]

This thread has gone waaaaaaaay off topic. I apologize OP. Instead of bashing this woman for the choices she's made, I'm in there, week after week, teaching her parenting skills, and doing what I can to make sure these kids get what they need. Again, I see what you guys are saying. I wish you had attempted to see my side. Obviously that's not happening. And this changes nothing. I welcome any and all of you to get more involved, and make changes. Even if I don't agree with the changes you would like to make, we can all agree that what's happening now isn't working. And who knows, I'm not arrogant enough to say that I am right and you are wrong. It's an opinion. Nothing more, nothing less. You could very well be absolutely on the money. I don't happen to think you are. But if the changes you would like to see happen were put into place, and there were no more children going hungry or living in gang ridden apartments where they can't go outside to play, I would be the first person here eating crow.

Hey--I admire you for your work. I REALLY do. It is a thankless job. You are there for the children. You are paid crap (am I right?) for one of the most tedious jobs out there.

I have taught in very, very poor school districts.

In the past, I have fantasized about kidnapping three children in particular I wanted them to live with ME. Wow! What I could give these children. I know they are Ivy League material, and instead, I am 100% positive they will be pregnant by 13 I could vomit typing this. What a waste.

Yet, their parents keep bringing other children into the world

An obvious sore spot for me

 

[yeartolate]

Don't forget one family receiving WIC is heading down to WDW next March. (PEAK season) How can a family that isn't able to provide milk, formula, cheese...for their children able to afford a trip to WDW?

And don't forget claiming bankruptcy and still goingon your Disney Cruise....

 

[shortbun]

How exactly would anybody get help unless they somebody invades their privacy and inventories the situation?

I'm talking about legislating welfare based on how many children a person is allowed to have. Voluntarily giving information based on family size so that your children can be fed and medically cared for is one thing. Having the government set a limit on how many children one can have is very "Big Brother." Reminds me of the old ZPG theory and what the Chinese do/did to disuade people from having more than two children. There should be no stigma attached to having children. Lots of people on these boards have beautiful and loved daughters adopted from China. When we begin discussing these issues, I can not help but feel there is extreme prejudice driving the discussions.

 

[hentob]

So you would privatize welfare? And just exactly who would YOU help? Not children? What are you going to do with those children who are not being fed, clothed or cared for regarding health issues?

OMG. I would help the children FOR SURE! But I would also make a great effort to prevent future children.

 

[disneyjunkie]

And don't forget claiming bankruptcy and still goingon your Disney Cruise....

Wow, I missed that one.

 

[hentob]

And don't forget claiming bankruptcy and still goingon your Disney Cruise....

Oh Boy. You guys are giving me heart palpitations tonight. Please--This cannot turn into a bankrupt-but-we-still-take-luxury-vacations thread.

It's too late in the evening to get me wound up

 

[hentob]

There should be no stigma attached to having children.

Oh. I beg to differ. If you can't feed your current children, there should be some shame in TRYING to have more

 

[vickyBaby]

Wow, I missed that one.

Dang nab it, I missed it too!!

 

[yeartolate]

Oh. I beg to differ. If you can't feed your current children, there should be some shame in TRYING to have more

YUp.

 

[cardaway]

I'm talking about legislating welfare based on how many children a person is allowed to have.

What we are discussing is far from legislating how many children a person is allowed. We're simply cutting off the funding so the people popping them out to get more money will stop.

When we begin discussing these issues, I can not help but feel there is extreme prejudice driving the discussions.

There are people of every race receiving aid and abusing the system. I can't believe you are going to try and imply this is a race issue.

 

[goofygirl]

To answer the original question- that would be a big fat NO!

 

[tiggersmom2]

Don't forget one family receiving WIC is heading down to WDW next March. (PEAK season) How can a family that isn't able to provide milk, formula, cheese...for their children able to afford a trip to WDW?

Nice, real nice.... I swear, the local DFCS should read the Budget boards and try to figure out which "jewels" are cheating the system b/c lord knows, they give out enough information on themselves.

The day I can't afford to give my children a DOLLAR worth of carton milk, is the day the state should come and remove my kids from my custody.....

 

[darlak]

just some info. to clarify-

public assistance (as in cash/tanf) does have a lifetime limit for adults-when they hit the end of their 'clock' which keeps track of every time they are/have been on aide they no longer receive assistance. children are exempt from this. there has not been a financial incentive to have additional children while on aide for several years-with only a couple of exceptions (rape or the failure of certain types of medicaly monitored birth control) additional children do not result in an increased grant.

food stamps operate totaly differently-they are not based on familial relationships. strictly income/household size-and they no way come near to providing for an additonal 'mouth' what it costs to feed it (maybe the fs go up $50 per month, but not much more-and less if the household is larger). since rent and household expenses are used in the budgeting process, if a person receives subsidized or free housing their food stamps are greatly reduced.

'welfare to work' requires that an adult be in an approved and overseen work placement or VERY LIMITED job training program for a flat number of hours per week (used to be 30 but it was edging up when i retired). if the adult fails to do so then their needs are removed from the cash and food stamp grants (so both go down). the county i worked for if paying jobs were not available had recipeints working picking up trash or at the county recycling center.

Barkley, it is evident that you speak from experience. However, the information is these three paragraphs simply is not true in my state, or at least partly untrue.

Paragraph 1.) The mother's financial incentive to continue to have children is is in the very fact that children are exempt from this. While the mother herself may not draw a check, each of her children do. While it it is true that the overall all amount of each check is reduced, she does still benefit from an increase in the total month's amount.

Paragraph 2.) The family's food stamp allotment is not reduced here by the fact that they may receive subsidized or free housing. I have many families who are receiving in excess of $600 per month in food stamps.

Paragraph 3.) I believe that Welfare to Work could begin to address this problem, IF it were being implemented. In my state, it is not. Even our Family Court judges have tried to speak with the "powers that be" who administer this money. We have been told at the state level that the program is not currently being implemented due to their own staff limitations. Sadly, I know this to be true. These same staffing difficulties also affect our state's Child Protective Services ability to adequately protect children.

I do live in my state's largest city and it is my understanding that the problems we face in this area are not as severe in other, smaller counties. I don't even begin to know the answers to these overwhelming problems, but I know we must find a way to begin addressing them. It sounds like it is being addressed much more effectively in your area.

 

[Hannathy]

Don't forget one family receiving WIC is heading down to WDW next March. (PEAK season) How can a family that isn't able to provide milk, formula, cheese...for their children able to afford a trip to WDW?

Because they aren't providing milk, formula, cheese...for their children. And probably not their lunches or breakfast at school, nor their school fees and field trips, etc 'cause at our schools extras are free if you get the free lunches.

 

[Coolio]

Because they aren't providing milk, formula, cheese...for their children.

or maybe they have one WIC eligible child and are using the vouchers to help feed a family of about 6 on" less than $10/day".

 

[DisneyPhD]

I pretty much agree with everything Ready to go in OK and Darlak has said so far in this thread. It just isn't that easy and we can't allow innocent children to starve. As a social worker I know it isn't that simple of a fix.

That being said do I think it is responsible to try to have a child or more children if you can't afford to care for them? No. I personally am not so thrilled with people trying to get pregnant when they are not in a committed (ideally married) relationship either, but I realize everything is not black and white in this world. I do realize that many pregnancies aren't planned and you have to make the best of the situation.

I agree education is the key. Both in birth control, and to help families increase their ability to support themselves (or learn to start a family WHEN they can support themselves.)

I also agree that if a person can't afford the basics, they should not get luxury items like vacations, cigarettes, fancy clothes etc... yet we see it everyday. It is frustrating when you act responsibly and others don't, but that is just life.

Oh and this is just a pet peeve of mine, I don't think government assistance should be so quick to hand out free formula. Many people who pay for all their families food themselves, work hard to breast feed and one motivation is breastfeeding is free. Including myself when I 1st became a mother, later I learned other benefits of bf. I know many women who never considered BF for a second because WIC gave them formula for free, why bother with bf???? I don't know what the answer is because babies who need it should get it, but I hate to see mother's not even try to bf just because it is free to FF anyway. Heck, breast feeding helps the new mother for not getting pregnant again so soon after too.

 

[vickyBaby]

Some people do breastfeed, get the formula, then sell it on ebay.

NOTE:
I never saw anyone on the DIS say they were doing this.

 

[katerkat]

Oh and this is just a pet peeve of mine, I don't think government assistance should be so quick to hand out free formula. Many people who pay for all their families food themselves, work hard to breast feed and one motivation is breastfeeding is free. Including myself when I 1st became a mother, later I learned other benefits of bf. I know many women who never considered BF for a second because WIC gave them formula for free, why bother with bf???? I don't know what the answer is because babies who need it should get it, but I hate to see mother's not even try to bf just because it is free to FF anyway. Heck, breast feeding helps the new mother for not getting pregnant again so soon after too.

Yep, I have a friend who has almost quit breastfeeding because WIC gives formula for free. And she gets the WIC supplementary breastfeeding stuff as well.