Do you ever remove the standard tips and add them later?

[DynamicDisneyDuo]

The cruise industry does this, not just DCL. I believe DCL is unusual in that they let you remove or decrease tips.

We just got off Royal Caribbean and I removed the automatic gratuities and did it manually. The only annoying part was that they included "support personnel" or some such nonsense in their calculations of the total figure, which having only cruised DCL we had never heard of. We always assumed that these people, since they are not in a tipped position, got paid a better wage to begin with. They said this was the people who cleaned the public areas and other such positions.

 

[squirk]

We just got off Royal Caribbean and I removed the automatic gratuities and did it manually. The only annoying part was that they included "support personnel" or some such nonsense in their calculations of the total figure, which having only cruised DCL we had never heard of. We always assumed that these people, since they are not in a tipped position, got paid a better wage to begin with. They said this was the people who cleaned the public areas and other such positions.

Did you push back on that? I would have made the same assumption.

 

[JW9DVC]

That's my point, it shouldn't be called or considered a tip. How the heck does anyone justify paying zero for service just because it didn't meet their completely arbitrary expectations? I blame Disney (and the entire food service industry) for calling it a tip and leaving people to decide if they should pay for someone serving them. They should call it a service charge but then they would have to notify you upfront in the cruise cost. So they play this game where servers work 80+ hours per week and they are at the mercy of people not paying them because they didn't meet some completely arbitrary standard. All this so the cruise line can avoid telling you the true cost of the cruise upfront. It should never be considered a tip because these people do not get paid if you do not "tip" them. If you feel the hard working service team shouldn't get paid after waiting on you for 3,4,7etc nights on a cruise, then that is more of a reflection on your character than their serving skills.

That's like telling people to pay a service fee for everything in life. The clerk at the grocery store bagged my items. I was given my steaks from the butcher. I was pulled over today and the police officer gave you a ticket. Someone at Target opened the dressing room door for me so I could try on clothes. They checked my receipt at Costco on the way out the door. The car salesman took me on a test drive, I didn't purchase the car though.


Not everyone in life will send a tip and/or receive a service fee for doing a job. Like it has been discussed. That's your opinion on if you feel someone is cheap. If I didn't receive the service, I would most definitely remove the service fee.

Heck at restaurants that charge for larger parties, it better be amazing service. If it's not. It will be changed, no ifs ands or buts about it.

JW

 

[bbel]

Just like any tipped position, yes tips must be reported.

And there is paperwork for gifts given that must be filled out - usually involving your signature so that it is clear where the gift came from.

Not completely true, at least not on DCL. CM can receive gifts. If they are of value ($70+ I think), then they have to take them to their manager/supervisor, and they'll follow up and record that they had it/if they can have it.
As for a guest, I've never heard of them having to fill out a form (I could be completely wrong tho, as I've never been a guest so haven't had that opportunity)

Once, as YA, I got a tip of $50, I'm wasn't in a tipped position, so it goes to my managers where it goes into a big pot and goes towards treats for the whole team (ice cream at meetings, food at team builders, activities, gifts...). My manager took the guests room number and followed up with them, but more of a thank you than anything else.

 

[apathetic]

That's like telling people to pay a service fee for everything in life. The clerk at the grocery store bagged my items. I was given my steaks from the butcher. I was pulled over today and the police officer gave you a ticket. Someone at Target opened the dressing room door for me so I could try on clothes. They checked my receipt at Costco on the way out the door. The car salesman took me on a test drive, I didn't purchase the car though.


Not everyone in life will send a tip and/or receive a service fee for doing a job. Like it has been discussed. That's your opinion on if you feel someone is cheap. If I didn't receive the service, I would most definitely remove the service fee.

Heck at restaurants that charge for larger parties, it better be amazing service. If it's not. It will be changed, no ifs ands or buts about it.

JW

Yeah, except most of those people are paid a salary. Forget the service charge, what if they just priced the cruise with that stuff in the base fare? You know, charge what it costs so they could pay their employees instead of a system where they could work 80 hours and have 25% of the people they serve decide not to pay them. It's not about being cheap (most cases, anyway) it's about this notion that if a server doesn't meet some arbitrary expectation they don't get paid. 80 hours in a week and a bunch of people don't pay you because the drinks didn't get there fast enough or the food wasn't on the plate correctly. Imagine working all week only to find out you don't get paid because your boss just wasn't happy with something and they didn't bother to tell you. They just didn't pay you. This is largely on the cruise company exploiting the word tip to lower the cruise fare and have their servers pay the price. If they charged it in the base fare or as a service fee, they would have to refund the money when people complained their food was 2 minutes late from the kitchen. In this system, Disney just passes on that loss to the servers.

But you are right, why should people expect to get paid for doing a job? I should be able to pick and choose when I pay for service. I don't like how you fixed my car, I'm not paying. Dry cleaning came back 5 minutes later than I wanted, so no payment there. Of course, it is even better that service people can't choose who they serve. It is against the law to refuse service but not illegal to withhold a payment labeled a tip.

 

[squirk]

Once, as YA, I got a tip of $50, I'm wasn't in a tipped position, so it goes to my managers where it goes into a big pot and goes towards treats for the whole team (ice cream at meetings, food at team builders, activities, gifts...). My manager took the guests room number and followed up with them, but more of a thank you than anything else.

If you had received that $50 tip as cash, handed directly to you, I assume there was a clear, bright-line rule that you were supposed to fork the $$$ over to your manager?

 

[JW9DVC]

Yeah, except most of those people are paid a salary. Forget the service charge, what if they just priced the cruise with that stuff in the base fare? You know, charge what it costs so they could pay their employees instead of a system where they could work 80 hours and have 25% of the people they serve decide not to pay them. It's not about being cheap (most cases, anyway) it's about this notion that if a server doesn't meet some arbitrary expectation they don't get paid. 80 hours in a week and a bunch of people don't pay you because the drinks didn't get there fast enough or the food wasn't on the plate correctly. Imagine working all week only to find out you don't get paid because your boss just wasn't happy with something and they didn't bother to tell you. They just didn't pay you. This is largely on the cruise company exploiting the word tip to lower the cruise fare and have their servers pay the price. If they charged it in the base fare or as a service fee, they would have to refund the money when people complained their food was 2 minutes late from the kitchen. In this system, Disney just passes on that loss to the servers.

But you are right, why should people expect to get paid for doing a job? I should be able to pick and choose when I pay for service. I don't like how you fixed my car, I'm not paying. Dry cleaning came back 5 minutes later than I wanted, so no payment there. Of course, it is even better that service people can't choose who they serve. It is against the law to refuse service but not illegal to withhold a payment labeled a tip.

You act as though they are only paid through the tip or service fee. It's not the only payment. I'm in law enforcement and I don't receive a salary. Most of the people I listed in professions are not salary. They do a job that they get paid for. Some in the service industry get paid less to receive a tip. Many that end up receiving well above what I even make a year!

 

[over50visits]

DCL has tips in a lot of places. For example, the spa has a mandatory tip, you have no choice in that. Whenever you get a paid drink (at a bar), there is a mandatory tip. Even if you buy a candy bar or popcorn outside the theater they add a 15% tip! These are not negotiable, so spend time worrying about things you can control.

Unfortunately, the tip for the servers is something you can control, and I've seen too many rationalizations for not paying them the income they well, well deserve. It's a part of your cruise cost, period.

 

[Dug720]

Not completely true, at least not on DCL. CM can receive gifts. If they are of value ($70+ I think), then they have to take them to their manager/supervisor, and they'll follow up and record that they had it/if they can have it.
As for a guest, I've never heard of them having to fill out a form (I could be completely wrong tho, as I've never been a guest so haven't had that opportunity)

Once, as YA, I got a tip of $50, I'm wasn't in a tipped position, so it goes to my managers where it goes into a big pot and goes towards treats for the whole team (ice cream at meetings, food at team builders, activities, gifts...). My manager took the guests room number and followed up with them, but more of a thank you than anything else.

Interesting. I'd think they would want to cover everyone's butt. I know RCCL requires the guest to sign a form - I gave my cabin attendant a box of Starbucks Via and had to sign a form that I'd given it to her.

 

[bbel]

Interesting. I'd think they would want to cover everyone's butt. I know RCCL requires the guest to sign a form - I gave my cabin attendant a box of Starbucks Via and had to sign a form that I'd given it to her.

It could very well be different for stateroom hosts on DCL too, purely because they're usually alone around guests personal items.
Personally though I haven't heard of this on DCL.

 

[bbel]

If you had received that $50 tip as cash, handed directly to you, I assume there was a clear, bright-line rule that you were supposed to fork the $$$ over to your manager?

Oh yes. Even though it was aimed at me personally for an incident that had happened earlier that day.
But another CM witnessed it and covered me so I could pass it on straight away, didn't even want to risk waiting till my break haha!

 

[squirk]

Oh yes. Even though it was aimed at me personally for an incident that had happened earlier that day.
But another CM witnessed it and covered me so I could pass it on straight away, didn't even want to risk waiting till my break haha!

See, it kind of bugs me that a guest decided to give you a tip for exemplary service that you provided, and DCL took it away from you. Doesn't that kind of discourage people from tipping if they know their intended recipient won't get the tip?

 

[Dug720]

See, it kind of bugs me that a guest decided to give you a tip for exemplary service that you provided, and DCL took it away from you. Doesn't that kind of discourage people from tipping if they know their intended recipient won't get the tip?

A tipped position the person DOES get the tip. Kids Club CMs are not a tipped position.

 

[bbel]

See, it kind of bugs me that a guest decided to give you a tip for exemplary service that you provided, and DCL took it away from you. Doesn't that kind of discourage people from tipping if they know their intended recipient won't get the tip?

It is a little annoying. At the end of the day I was doing my job, however, if it had happened to be a cm in a tipped position who get there first then it probably would have been another story...
My managers gave me what they call a four keys card, which we can put in a kind of raffle thing to win stuff...I didn't tho lol...
And I did get my name on the positive guest comments, which in my department is acknowledged by a single clap in the meeting haha.

That's the job tho. I explain to guests what's going to happen to their tip and no one has ever complained. The little ray of sunshine is that my whole team got to share it with me. But I went into it knowing I wouldn't be tipped.

 

[squirk]

It is a little annoying. At the end of the day I was doing my job, however, if it had happened to be a cm in a tipped position who get there first then it probably would have been another story...
My managers gave me what they call a four keys card, which we can put in a kind of raffle thing to win stuff...I didn't tho lol...
And I did get my name on the positive guest comments, which in my department is acknowledged by a single clap in the meeting haha.

That's the job tho. I explain to guests what's going to happen to their tip and no one has ever complained. The little ray of sunshine is that my whole team got to share it with me. But I went into it knowing I wouldn't be tipped.

Sorry. Is there any way a guest could give a YA counselor some form of gratuity without mgt taking it away? Or is kudos on a comment card really it?

 

[squirk]

A tipped position the person DOES get the tip. Kids Club CMs are not a tipped position.

I understand that, Dug. But regardless of how the position is defined, the guest gave @bbel a gratuity for something she did, and DCL took it away.

I'd still give the tip so that she would be recognized and her teammates could enjoy ice cream "on her", as it were. I recognize there might be very good policy reasons why direct tipping of a YA is not allowed, but still, as she said, a little annoying how DCL thwarts the guest's intention like that.

 

[PrincessShmoo]

Sorry. Is there any way a guest could give a YA counselor some form of gratuity without mgt taking it away? Or is kudos on a comment card really it?

No, the kids's club CMs are a NON-tippable position. It's my understanding that they are paid "better" than the room hosts/dining teams.

And, in all probability, you won't really know which YAC has best served your child. Hence, all tips/gifts are pooled to be enjoyed/used by all YAC CMs.

Comments on the comment card are the best way to bring exceptional CMs, regardless of what position they are in, to the attention of the "powers that be".

 

[bbel]

Sorry. Is there any way a guest could give a YA counselor some form of gratuity without mgt taking it away? Or is kudos on a comment card really it?

Honestly, from my experience, for our department the name on the comment card doesn't mean much (occasionally you'll get a manager who sets a challenge like who ever gets the most in a month wins a dining request or an internet package). Something free that does stand out is something more like a personal letter or email naming a person, that way you (usually) get a 4 keys card which gives the opportunity to win things like trips to Palo or a merchandise voucher. That can be done on the cruise or once home.

Other than that, I love my collection of key chains, wristbands, magnets etc that guests have left - but that takes effort and preparation.
Candy is always easy. We love candy or just food in general. One of my favourites was the guest that ordered 20 Mickey bars from room service just before midnight and delivered them just before we closed, I'm not usually a fan of Mickey bars but once they unexpectedly appear after a long sea day they're suddenly the best thing ever. We've even had a couple of pizzas and chicken tenders dropped off with a child, we keep it safe in the back and take it in turns to check on the pizza and chicken tenders... is it obvious that a way to a YA's heart is through guest food? Haha

The same would go for guest services, cruise staff, characters...just to name a few departments.

 

[squirk]

Honestly, from my experience, for our department the name on the comment card doesn't mean much (occasionally you'll get a manager who sets a challenge like who ever gets the most in a month wins a dining request or an internet package). Something free that does stand out is something more like a personal letter or email naming a person, that way you (usually) get a 4 keys card which gives the opportunity to win things like trips to Palo or a merchandise voucher. That can be done on the cruise or once home.

Other than that, I love my collection of key chains, wristbands, magnets etc that guests have left - but that takes effort and preparation.
Candy is always easy. We love candy or just food in general. One of my favourites was the guest that ordered 20 Mickey bars from room service just before midnight and delivered them just before we closed, I'm not usually a fan of Mickey bars but once they unexpectedly appear after a long sea day they're suddenly the best thing ever. We've even had a couple of pizzas and chicken tenders dropped off with a child, we keep it safe in the back and take it in turns to check on the pizza and chicken tenders... is it obvious that a way to a YA's heart is through guest food? Haha

The same would go for guest services, cruise staff, characters...just to name a few departments.

Food and emails to Guest Services/Communications are the way to go. Gotcha.

But hypothetically, suppose I just happened to bump into you on the ship when you were off-duty and not in the clubs, and I handed you $50 in cash to thank you for how well you worked with my autistic son while in the club.

Setting aside the obvious question of "how would DCL ever know?", would you still be required under the rules to fork that money over? I mean, since you're off-duty, it's just two people engaging in a private transaction, right?

I'm honestly curious as to how long DCL's "reach" is regarding stuff like this.

 

[Club Disney Chandler]

See, it kind of bugs me that a guest decided to give you a tip for exemplary service that you provided, and DCL took it away from you. Doesn't that kind of discourage people from tipping if they know their intended recipient won't get the tip?

Thanks for mentioning me in your post yesterday, I've spent the last day reading and getting caught on the entire thread and have a few thoughts.

As far as your original post, I totally get your logic behind it and even somewhat agree, why fork over a gratuity for service you haven't received yet? If it's a true gratuity, it should come after you can evaluate the service. I look at these as service charges and just pay ahead of time whenever possible, I really wish they would just put it as part of my cruise fare and getaway from the gratuity all together. I generally give cash to our servers and/or room attendants at the end of the cruise, but not always.

For example, on our 2nd cruise our Head Server noticed our kids not eating the dinner rolls, we told him they just weren't into "fancier" rolls, they like plain white dinner rolls. Every night after that, there was a basket of plain white dinner rolls on the table. Not only did we tip him extra but also made sure to mention this on the survey and a follow up email when we returned home. That is the kind of above and beyond service that I will pay extra more. That's the kind of above and beyond service I want my employees to do for my guests.

We've had servers on DCL that we give nothing extra to because they did nothing to warrant it. When we were on the Wonder, Noreen, our room attendant was amazing, was so kind and thoughtful and took great care of us, she definitely got extra.

When I worked for Disney, none of us were allowed to accept tips, with the exception of the birthday party hosts. Disney didn't allow them to keep them for themselves though, they pooled them all together and then we did something all together with that money. I hated this with a passion! I think it doesn't give the full incentive to do your best, it screams of redistribution of wealth to me. As you can probably tell, I totally agree with your comment I quoted.

Overall, I'm not a fan of the gratuity on cruise ships, just charge me what you're going to charge me and be done with it. Let employees/CM's accept cash tips, regardless of position and move on. If it's "not fair" that behind the scene CM's don't receive tips, then they can work harder to get to a position that receives tips if they're good enough. And not everyone is good enough to get those positions, and that's ok.

And for what it's worth, none of the workers in my restaurant are tipped employees, they all make above minimum wage. However, if they receive a tip for something they keep it, no redistribution of wealth. Some dishwashers like not making extra and staying in the dish room and some want to be more in the spot light so they can receive tips. There are some nights, I really wish I could spend 4-6 hours in the dish room, never speaking to a guest. We pay higher rates so we can hire and keep better employees. If somebody doesn't meet our minimum standards, they don't last long.

I think, as someone suggested earlier, compose an email, don't remove then add later. That would be a waste of your time and would have less impact on the decision makers.

Nice topic and ensuing discussion.