Disney Skyliner (Gondola Transportation System) Read Post 1 Now Open!

[jknezek]

Your also assuming that 100 % of hotel guests go to one of the four parks every single day - and that clearly isn't true either, but yeah I was figuring 20% of occupancy would be at Epcot at any one time.

So there's like 2000 rooms at Pop (average 3 per room), another 1000 at AOA (suites - average 5 per room), 1500 rooms at CBR (average 3) and 600 rooms at Riviera (average 5). Gives us 18,500 patrons at these resorts.

Say 20% go to Epcot on a given day, and 50% stay for the fireworks (75% is WAY too high), that's 1850 people.

Hourly capacity of 3,000 means 37 minutes to get them all back to the resort. Not that the line would be that long as all those people have to exit the park, but you could see 20 minute backups if true.

But in the end we have to do a reality check - let's go back to the bus transportation: This calculation says that 1850 people are leaving Epcot for these four resorts at the end of the night. At 60 people per bus, that would mean 31 busloads of people are going back to these 4 resorts. dropping Riviera which doesn't exist yet, that 26 bus loads of people going back to CBR, Pop, and AoA, or roughly 8 buses each resort.

Is there ONE person on the board that believes there are EIGHT busloads of people heading back to CBR at the end of each night? Of course not - it's maybe 3 or 4. Same for the other resorts. So the ACTUAL numbers will likely be half that number so now we are talking 1000 people leaving Epcot for the gondola. That's 20 minutes of full load.

I've done similar calculations elsewhere on this thread - the crowds here won't be as bad as everyone thinks. The worst will be at the end of the fireworks, but wait will still be way shorter than the buses. (Have you ever left a park for the buses and had to wait 2 even 3 buses? I've waited 45 minutes for a bus at the end of the night - you'll never have this happen here.)

They are more than ready for these crowds.

How can I like this more than once? One of my favorite posts here in quite a long time.

 

[joelkfla]

So there's like 2000 rooms at Pop (average 3 per room), another 1000 at AOA (suites - average 5 per room), 1500 rooms at CBR (average 3) and 600 rooms at Riviera (average 5). Gives us 18,500 patrons at these resorts.

It's 2900 at Pop, 2000 apiece at CBR & AoA, but only 300 at Riviera (again, according to touringplans.com)

 

[skier_pete]

How can I like this more than once? One of my favorite posts here in quite a long time.

Well, I keep returning the same argument - a gondola with 3000 person capacity in each direction is carrying 50 full buses per hour in EACH direction. To only 4 resorts. Which get 3 buses an hour usually. There should be no question about whether it can handle the crowds if the buses can currently handle the crowds.

 

[skier_pete]

It's 2900 at Pop, 2000 apiece at CBR & AoA, but only 300 at Riviera (again, according to touringplans.com)

You are right on Pop Century, but CBR used to have 2,200 rooms, but they ripped out 600 to build Riviera, so now it's only 1,600. I got the 1000 at AoA off google, but assumed those were 1000 suites, thus 5 people per room. Riviera won't be only 300 rooms. I've seen between 400 and 600 so I shot for the high end. Bay Lake Tower has 428 rooms, Boardwalk has 530 rooms. It will probably be between 400 and 500.

 

[middlechild]

A point to consider is the line will be continually moving in the Skyliner system. People can wait for large crowds as the line is active.When you stand and wait, time drags on. That simple idea made Disneyland waits bearable before fast pass. Now waits for attractions involve standing in place, not good. So keep in mind the wait outside the IG after Illuminations will be active. Ski resorts with gondolas are my point of reference. Waiting in those lines are active, which makes the wait bearable.

 

[Nakkira]

I love this idea

 

[joelkfla]

You are right on Pop Century, but CBR used to have 2,200 rooms, but they ripped out 600 to build Riviera, so now it's only 1,600. I got the 1000 at AoA off google, but assumed those were 1000 suites, thus 5 people per room. Riviera won't be only 300 rooms. I've seen between 400 and 600 so I shot for the high end. Bay Lake Tower has 428 rooms, Boardwalk has 530 rooms. It will probably be between 400 and 500.

Only 1 quibble: AoA is exactly the same size as Pop, and 2 or 3 of the 10 buildings are Pop-style rooms. (2 were built for Pop; I don't know whether the 3rd Little Mermaid was built with rooms or suites.) So assuming a building of suites has half as many units as a building of individual rooms, and considering the number of rooms at Pop, I think the 2000 count is more credible than 1000.

Anyhow, it's all guesswork. I agree that the Skyliner should be able get everyone home in a reasonable time. The question is whether the number of Guests exiting IG and those queuing for the Skyliner will swamp the available space at IG. I think Disney will find a way to make it work, but it might be uncomfortable the first few big nights until they figure it out.

 

[Doberge]

People may be leaving Dolphin and Swan out of calculations, making it essentially five resorts within walking distance that already use the gate.

Other parks you exit from a narrow area into a wide open space and people peel off to buses boats etc. Space wise there's not a lot of room for people to walk near IG (compared to other park exits), it's pretty narrow between World Traveler shop and the canal. Now imagine fireworks crowds from 7 Disney resorts and Dolphin and Swan all walking through there. Some to walk, some to boats, some to gondolas. When you're walking down the bridge (from UK area and bridge to France) toward the exit and there's just a mass of bodies, then you get around the corner and you're on the wrong side so people are crossing each other while others are slowly moving forward.

I'll trust Disney has thought it all through. I think this can be fixed with ropes that create lines. Go to this line to boats, this line to gondolas, this line to walk out.

 

[DanBoris]

Well, I keep returning the same argument - a gondola with 3000 person capacity in each direction is carrying 50 full buses per hour in EACH direction. To only 4 resorts. Which get 3 buses an hour usually. There should be no question about whether it can handle the crowds if the buses can currently handle the crowds.

... and from what we have been hearing, 3000 per hour is conservative.

 

[BabybetterDisney]

My discussion is simply on how the gondolas seem to be being touted as a perfect solution to Disney's transportation mess. Plenty of all positive assumptions. Just giving my no so positive assumptions as counterbalance. THat's sorta what a discussion is.

I hadn't heard that no A/C was confirmed. If so, that makes these an even worse idea. Better be perfect operations. In humid situations, airflow does little to cool you off. But even 5 minutes stopped in August sun, in a small cabin with 7 others, will be horrible. The Texas State Fair has one that is quite short, but only operates in October for the most part. I'm not aware of many that are in really hot areas. I know the one I rode in Tokyo at Yomiuri Land in the summer had no, or a broken A/C, and was miserable.

I just personally see these as possibly going down as an epically bad decision for Disney.

-J

No A/C is very confirmed, simply because there's no way to power A/C on a gondola, (or even a fan), not because they don't want to. It is my greatest question. The gondola will be the only Disney Transportation without A/C. How will people be able to stand it in hot Florida? However, I do believe that during evenings and cool days without sun, the gondola will be a cool ride. I will handle the "gondola replacing the buses" concept with something called the Minnievan, while enjoying the gondola when the temperature allows it and there is not a big crowd. I come from Hong Kong. I rode the gondola there once when I was a kid, during winter but the sun was shining. It was like being in a car with the windows up, the sun shining, and no A/C. It was the most suffocating feeling ever.

My other question is, if Pop and Aof A are connected to the system, doesn't that mean CBR is going to get full gondolas when they try to go anywhere? But perhaps they can have their own supply of empty gondolas that join the line.

I am extremely interested to see how the gondola will work out for Disney. I think it will be done in 2019, same as Star Wars Land? Next year will be super exciting.

 

[disney-inspired]

I'm super interested in how this turns out. I think it's a really cool idea and at the estimated capacity, it will definitely have no problems.
I also agree with the concern about FL weather - not just heat but the storms. Imagine being stuck in the air for hours because it had to be shut down.

 

[Tigger's ally]

Your also assuming that 100 % of hotel guests go to one of the four parks every single day - and that clearly isn't true either, but yeah I was figuring 20% of occupancy would be at Epcot at any one time.

So there's like 2000 rooms at Pop (average 3 per room), another 1000 at AOA (suites - average 5 per room), 1500 rooms at CBR (average 3) and 600 rooms at Riviera (average 5). Gives us 18,500 patrons at these resorts.

Say 20% go to Epcot on a given day, and 50% stay for the fireworks (75% is WAY too high), that's 1850 people.

Hourly capacity of 3,000 means 37 minutes to get them all back to the resort. Not that the line would be that long as all those people have to exit the park, but you could see 20 minute backups if true.

But in the end we have to do a reality check - let's go back to the bus transportation: This calculation says that 1850 people are leaving Epcot for these four resorts at the end of the night. At 60 people per bus, that would mean 31 busloads of people are going back to these 4 resorts. dropping Riviera which doesn't exist yet, that 26 bus loads of people going back to CBR, Pop, and AoA, or roughly 8 buses each resort.

Is there ONE person on the board that believes there are EIGHT busloads of people heading back to CBR at the end of each night? Of course not - it's maybe 3 or 4. Same for the other resorts. So the ACTUAL numbers will likely be half that number so now we are talking 1000 people leaving Epcot for the gondola. That's 20 minutes of full load.

I've done similar calculations elsewhere on this thread - the crowds here won't be as bad as everyone thinks. The worst will be at the end of the fireworks, but wait will still be way shorter than the buses. (Have you ever left a park for the buses and had to wait 2 even 3 buses? I've waited 45 minutes for a bus at the end of the night - you'll never have this happen here.)

They are more than ready for these crowds.

And one other point, everyone is assuming that everybody that is in Epcot wants to immediately go back to the hotel Some will be finishing drinks in Epcot. Some will be headed out the front gate to go towards MK and the restaurants/lounges over that way. Some will be headed to a park that has late night. Some (raising hand here) will be going to Jelly Rolls or the Crew's cup for a nightcap. And some will just slowly meander from the oppo side of the lake taking it all in before ever wanting to leave.

 

[WrongLeverrrr]

And one other point, everyone is assuming that everybody that is in Epcot wants to immediately go back to the hotel Some will be finishing drinks in Epcot. Some will be headed out the front gate to go towards MK and the restaurants/lounges over that way. Some will be headed to a park that has late night. Some (raising hand here) will be going to Jelly Rolls or the Crew's cup for a nightcap. And some will just slowly meander from the oppo side of the lake taking it all in before ever wanting to leave.

Since this discussion was originally framed around the conclusion of Illuminations, I also want to point out that people may also stick around for EMH if that is scheduled at Epcot for the night in question.

 

[sachilles]

Imagine being stuck in the air for hours because it had to be shut down.

You won't be stuck in it for hours. It has redundant drive systems.
If the main(electric) drive fails, after about 5 minutes or so, if the lift maintenance team feels it can not run under electric power, they will turn it over to the back up motor which will be gas or diesel. Generally the back up is much louder and annoying. The backup is used to "clear the line", getting all guests to the off load ramps, and they won't load new folks until the electric drive is fixed. If there is an alignment issue or something that prevent the haulrope from moving cars, then they'd evacuate. Even then it should not take hours.

 

[Turn the Page]

I'm super interested in how this turns out. I think it's a really cool idea and at the estimated capacity, it will definitely have no problems.
I also agree with the concern about FL weather - not just heat but the storms. Imagine being stuck in the air for hours because it had to be shut down.

You would never be stuck in the air for hours due to a shut down caused by weather. Obviously if the storm is so bad it can't operate (which would require something like 40 to 50 mph winds) they will not leave you in the gondola at the mercy of the elements for hours on end. They would get everyone off it before they shut it down. Even if there was some sort of catastrophic failure to the motor these systems are designed to be able to pull the cable in manually to ensure no one is still on the line anywhere.

 

[DanBoris]

No A/C is very confirmed, simply because there's no way to power A/C on a gondola, (or even a fan), not because they don't want to.

This actually isn't true, the London system has AC although it has been reported it doesn't work well. Cars could definitely have enough power for fans if they wanted to.

 

[dina444444]

My other question is, if Pop and Aof A are connected to the system, doesn't that mean CBR is going to get full gondolas when they try to go anywhere? But perhaps they can have their own supply of empty gondolas that join the line.

The expectation is that there will be 3 routes. AoA/Pop to CBR, CBR to DHS, and CBR to Epcot with a proposed pass through load at Riviera (will be like the gondola at mammoth mountain for reference if that station is built). Anyone coming in from AoA/PoP will deboard at CBR and re-board on the route for the park they are going to.

 

[DanBoris]

The expectation is that there will be 3 routes. AoA/Pop to CBR, CBR to DHS, and CBR to Epcot with a proposed pass through load at Riviera (will be like the gondola at mammoth mountain for reference if that station is built). Anyone coming in from AoA/PoP will deboard at CBR and re-board on the route for the park they are going to.

Riviera will have the problem the OP was speaking of. Sending empty cars periodically from the CBR station when needed would probably be how this is handled.

 

[dina444444]

Riviera will have the problem the OP was speaking of. Sending empty cars periodically from the CBR station when needed would probably be how this is handled.

Yeah, and riviera is expected to only have 300 equivalent rooms.

 

[OKW Lover]

Curious that many of the posts here deal with a fatal flaw in this installation. Be it bad weather, heat, capacity, physical access or otherwise. Apparently we all see issues that Disney didn't consider.