Details of POTC Update/Refurb

[disneymaniac24]

Personally, I could not be any more upset at the fact that Disney is going to permanently ruin both of the Pirates of the Caibbean attractions in the U.S. The rumors have been out there for a couple of years, but it is truly a shame that they would actually go through with plans to "update" such a classic ride, just to promote a movie. It's not just corporate greed, it's a sell-out, and nothing more. I thought hearing about a Bambi sequel recently was bad enough.

As one who has boycotted all Disney movies since 2001, I freely admit that I haven't seen the "Pirates" movie, and yes, plenty of people have told me how great they think it is. Please folks, don't think for a minute that these rides have inspired movies. It's the greed and the lack of originality that created these films, and it's sad. I'm sure Walt Disney would not approve of this being done to the final ride that he supervised. I don't approve either, and unless I get to Disneyland before march, I will probably never ride POTC again.

Maybe next year we'll see and audio animatronics Eddie Murphy in The Haunted Mansion. Or maybe we'll even get a Country Bears attraction at Disneyland some day.





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Ok the whole Eddie Murphy thing I totally agree on. This is extremely upsetting (really I was crying when I read this). It's also stupid that they're changing a classic ride that everyone loves (sure it may be past it's prime but that's why we call it a classic people!) into something stupid from a movie that was only so so. It really bugs me!!! I won't even get there to see it one last time before they completely butcher it!
I'm not posite Walt would like this either!

 

[Another Voice]

Okay – let’s set the way back machine again.

The original plan for the Magic Kingdom was to offer something different. Up to this point, Disney’s experience had come from Disneyland. The people out here were wowed with ‘Pirates of the Caribbean’, both the show and the “exotic” New Orleans location. Disney knew they had a hit attraction on their hands and wanted to duplicate its success out east.

When it came time to plan the “big show” for the Magic Kingdom, Disney wanted to make sure it would wow the Florida crowd on both levels too. It was assumed that a New Orleans/Caribbean location would seem too commonplace and unexotic to the visitors to the new park. Since WDW was expected to draw only people living east of the Mississippi, Disney decided that an Old West location would as interesting to you easterners as the bayou is to us westerners.

The show they came up with was ‘The Wild West River Expedition’. It was a show just as big, just as long, and with more animated characters than ‘Pirates of the Caribbean’. Designed by the same Imagineers who created ‘Pirates’, “WWRE’ would had featured scenes like a buffalo stampede, a train holdup and other sites from the west. The design of the attraction was essentially finished (some of the concept art can be found on the Ineternet) and things were ready to go.

Then the Magic Kingdom opened its gates. Thousands and thousands of guest flooded through the gates – and most of them asked “where’s the pirate ride?” POTC had become so widely know that people wanted to see it. The notion that pirates were not “exotic” enough to be interesting to Florida vacationers turned out to be flat wrong. Responding to the public, plans for ‘Wild West’ were scrapped and ‘Pirates’ was rushed into construction (the rush and limited budget hurting the attraction).

As for the “updating” of the POTC to include the movie characters…I’m inclined to see how it turns out. However, after seeing how Disney “updated” ‘Tiki Room/Under New Management’, ‘Alien Encounter/Stitch Great Escape’ and ‘Journey into Imagination/We Killed Figment’ I’m not cutting Disney any slack until they prove this is a good thing.

 

[yensiD naF]

Honestly, and I don't mean this with an malice what-so-ever, if you can't take criticism don't post opinions.

By the way, how many Alice comedies were there? How many Mickey shorts were produced by Walt? These sequesl are harmless, perhaps not good, but harmless

How about this. If you can't take the answers, don't post replies. It would seem like the author did a fair job of answering your questions. Didn't he/she? But it appears that you did not like those answers.

I wouldn't call Mickey Mouse shorts or Alice comedies sequels. They were parts of series'. Like Flowers and Trees, True Life Adventures, The Mickey Mouse Club, etc. To me, a sequel is something that is created as a follow-up to a success. And hopefully the sequel will be equally as successful, like "The Godfather part 2", or "The Empire Strikes Back."

In Disney's case, I would say that a "Pirate's" sequel is justified, even though I, too never saw the original and never would. But the original was a success, and therefore a sequel would make sense. But any direct to home video sequel is just a grab for more money. Disney does it because they have created a market for it. "The Emperor's New Groove" was a total flop! Did it really need a sequel? The original should have never been made.

"Fantasia 2000" was a great follow-up to the original. And it was don't the right way, not only being released in theaters, but in the IMAX format as well. But did Disney really need to do the same thing with "Beauty and the Beast" and "The Lion King". I'm just glad they stopped that trend with those two films.

There are people at Disney who would be the first to admit that the quality of these animated sequels is not the same standard as the originals. The originals have stood the test of time for generations. These third-rate follow-ups will never be seen again. It's nothing more that a trick to keep getting your money and it works because you continue to willingly, if not eagerly hand it over.

Welcome to Michael Eisner's legacy.

 

[rogerram]

as for sequels, some are good, but most aren't close to the original. It is a marketing tool to generate more revenue. Once in a while you will find a gem in a sequel. Hopefully POTC will be one. As for Bambi 2, I have seen it and it is very good. I was waiting for a total disaster, but it was enjoyable. It is no cinderella II or lady and the tramp II. those were a mistake. This one might be worth a look. I hope the POTC will be equally as enjoyable.

 

[MJMcBride]

Why is disagreeing with someone's very strongly worded opinion considered a "slamming" or an attack. SPeaking for myself, I respectfully disagreed with the author and stated my reasons for it and questioned his reasons for his. I didn't call him names and I didn't tell him what to think. If you are going to start a discussion with an opinion like this one, you MUST expect some disagreement. Honestly, and I don't mean this with an malice what-so-ever, if you can't take criticism don't post opinions.

As afr as your quote, you are correct. By the way, how many Alice comedies were there? How many Mickey shorts were produced by Walt? These sequesl are harmless, perhaps not good, but harmless

I agree here. Some people are too unwillingly to change or even update, or even tweak. The POTC changes sound likely a minor tweak to add characters from a very popular movie. Get over it. Its no big no big deal. They're not tearing it down for a Jack Sparrow roller coaster.

As for sequels, I thought the Lion King and Alladin ones were decent. If people love these characters, they are going to want to see them, whether it be in sequels or in rides.

 

[perdidobay]

I"m sorry, but POTC was already "Ruined" (or at least seriously damaged) when they did the PC sanitizing alterations. At least these alterations look like they have the possibility to be fun and interesting, and add some life and excitement to the attraction!

I totally agree!
And to the OP, you need to end you boycott and see this movie, it was beyond great..... adding Jack Sparrrow is a plus INHO.

 

[dbm20th]

How about this. If you can't take the answers, don't post replies. It would seem like the author did a fair job of answering your questions. Didn't he/she? But it appears that you did not like those answers.

Yes he did answer them and I accepted that and did not accuse him of "slamming" me for disagreeing. That is my point. We disagree, big deal! It's Disney World. I think we can disagree on something as fun as Disney World without taking it personally don't you?

My argument comes down to this, I will not assume they are ruining POTC simply by adding some characters, one of which, Jack Sparrow, is incredibly popular with many people. The author claims to have never seen it, so my disagreement stems from him vehomently arguing an opinion that appears to be based on something he hasn't seen, either the refurbished ride or the characters they are adding.

You're point about the Alice comedies is true, but my point is that no one can say for sure what Walt would or would not do. He never had much of a chance to tinker with his parks, only to really add to them. Alice simply shows Walt would play with a good idea, go back to it, and not leave it to stand on it's own.

I know that people often long for the Disney "good old days", or at least what their memroy tells them is the Disney good old days. But the fact is that things have to change. My memories of POTC is the ride, but for many younger kids it is the movie. And it is a terrific and fun movie, and Jack Sparrow is one of the great characters is the history of Disney's films. Going to the ride and NOT seeing Jack Sparrow is a let down for those kids. It seems to me that Disney is trying to tie to the two together and use the ride to please those kids, who will then go see every other POTC film made in the future and buy all the stuff, while keeping the ride's nostalgia. Why do we assume this is going to be bad?

I think another thing worth pointing out is the difference between this and other "re-do"s that have come to WDW, Figment being the most popular example sited in these type of discussions. In that ride, the whole thing was close, completely gutted, and turned into something totally different...and it didn't work. From what I am reading, that is totally different then what we are getting here.

 

[MJMcBride]

Yes he did answer them and I accepted that and did not accuse him of "slamming" me for disagreeing. That is my point. We disagree, big deal! It's Disney World. I think we can disagree on something as fun as Disney World without taking it personally don't you?

My argument comes down to this, I will not assume they are ruining POTC simply by adding some characters, one of which, Jack Sparrow, is incredibly popular with many people. The author claims to have never seen it, so my disagreement stems from him vehomently arguing an opinion that appears to be based on something he hasn't seen, either the refurbished ride or the characters they are adding.

You're point about the Alice comedies is true, but my point is that no one can say for sure what Walt would or would not do. He never had much of a chance to tinker with his parks, only to really add to them. Alice simply shows Walt would play with a good idea, go back to it, and not leave it to stand on it's own.

I know that people often long for the Disney "good old days", or at least what their memroy tells them is the Disney good old days. But the fact is that things have to change. My memories of POTC is the ride, but for many younger kids it is the movie. And it is a terrific and fun movie, and Jack Sparrow is one of the great characters is the history of Disney's films. Going to the ride and NOT seeing Jack Sparrow is a let down for those kids. It seems to me that Disney is trying to tie to the two together and use the ride to please those kids, who will then go see every other POTC film made in the future and buy all the stuff, while keeping the ride's nostalgia. Why do we assume this is going to be bad?

I think another thing worth pointing out is the difference between this and other "re-do"s that have come to WDW, Figment being the most popular example sited in these type of discussions. In that ride, the whole thing was close, completely gutted, and turned into something totally different...and it didn't work. From what I am reading, that is totally different then what we are getting here.

I couldn't agree more. You need to "tinker" with things sometimes. Adding a couple of characters and some special effects is no big deal. To be against something before you even see it or try it is silly.

 

[doombuggy]

As for the “updating” of the POTC to include the movie characters…I’m inclined to see how it turns out. However, after seeing how Disney “updated” ‘Tiki Room/Under New Management’, ‘Alien Encounter/Stitch Great Escape’ and ‘Journey into Imagination/We Killed Figment’ I’m not cutting Disney any slack until they prove this is a good thing.

I am with you there and loved your comment about Journey...

I hope the additions will be good. While I don't like the changes they made perviously (having the women chase the men instead of the other way around), they are funnier .....

As far as sequels go, our society does this all over the place. Disney is not the only film company "guilty" of this. Remember Rocky, Lethal Weapon, Beverly Hills Cop? How about my alltime favorite: Star Wars?

Glad to hear Bambi II geta a thumbs up from someone. Is that Patrick Stewart as Dad?

 

[rogerram]

Doombuggy,
in Bambi II, Patrick Stewart is the dad. I thought it was very good.

 

[MJMcBride]

I am with you there and loved your comment about Journey...

I hope the additions will be good. While I don't like the changes they made perviously (having the women chase the men instead of the other way around), they are funnier .....

As far as sequels go, our society does this all over the place. Disney is not the only film company "guilty" of this. Remember Rocky, Lethal Weapon, Beverly Hills Cop? How about my alltime favorite: Star Wars?

Glad to hear Bambi II geta a thumbs up from someone. Is that Patrick Stewart as Dad?

Sometimes sequels are as good or even better. Godfather II, Lethal Weapon 2, etc.

 

[dbm20th]

Also, what we were talking about is a direct-to-video sequel, which we all must admit is very different from the typical Hollywood sequel. And don't forget some other great sequels...

Aliens
Spider Man 2
Many James Bond Films
Many Star Trek Films
Rocky 2
Toy STory 2
X-2
Two Towers and Return of the King
Bride of Frankenstein (and I mean the 1935 version)
Goldmember
The MAtrix Reloaded

 

[MJMcBride]

Also, what we were talking about is a direct-to-video sequel, which we all must admit is very different from the typical Hollywood sequel. And don't forget some other great sequels...

Aliens
Spider Man 2
Many James Bond Films
Many Star Trek Films
Rocky 2
Toy STory 2
X-2
Two Towers and Return of the King
Bride of Frankenstein (and I mean the 1935 version)
Goldmember
The MAtrix Reloaded

I was with you until "Matrix Reloaded". That movie was lame.

 

[Agent Spectre]

I know that I am in the minority here, but I also believe that the Jack Sparrow addition to POTC is a cheap marketing ploy. I understand the "making an old attraction fresh again" and "reaching new markets" arguments, but they don't cut it for me in this case. What really gets me is the addition not only of Sparrow, but of two other characters from the movie. One Sparrow AA stuck into the ride somewhere might be seen as cute and would be a nod to the success of the movie. But the rumors and news articles point to a slight change in story line to accomodate these characters. Yes, the original DL was built on movie plots and creative marketing, but this seems like a blatant attempt to promote the new sequel as well as continuing to squeeze ever last dime they possible can out of the original. (And I did see the movie. I will not be seeing the sequel however.)
Here's an idea: Keep POTC the same. Add one Jack Sparrow AA if you want. Then hire some passable Johnny Depp lookalikes and have a Sparrow meet and greet outside of the attraction. The kids will be happy, the fans of POTC will be happy and Disney would accomplish their goal of promoting the movie.

Wind of this revamp has finally brought me to the boards...

I agree completely with what this person is saying. I'm VERY upset and heart broken that they're trying to change one of my favorite rides to fit with the movies. For the record, I'm a huge fan of the movie... It's one of the only decent things Disney has come out with recently, but this idea makes me nauseous. If they were sticking in just one Jack AA or maybe even a few other chracters (I'm more a fan of Barbossa) just in the background it would be fine, and a nice nod to the movies. The problem is, this isn't the case. Sure the original stuff will be there, but they're changing the whole story for the sake of the movie. It's dissapointing.
The meet and greet is an awesome idea. I wish they would just do that instead of tampering with the ride.

 

[dbm20th]

I was with you until "Matrix Reloaded". That movie was lame.

Yes it was, but it was also succesful and that is the point.

There are lots of lame Disney movies out there that have been successful. Can anyone say National Treasure??? Pirates of the Carribean is not one of them. If it were unsuccessful, the OP would have a point about assuming these changes to be a flop.

 

[2Xited4Disney]

hahah Wow I think I am the only one who like National Treasure....


Well if we are talking about sequels gotta mention National Treasure 2

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0465234/

 

[2Xited4Disney]

whoops here is another sequel that is bound to ruffle some feathers


http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0466053/


and another

http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0465940/

 

[MJMcBride]

Yes it was, but it was also succesful and that is the point.

Actually, I think the Martix sequels did not do as well as the first at all. They certainly weren't as good.

I find it out odd that a POTC thread turns somehow morphs into a debate on the merits of Martix Reloaded and National Treasure.

 

[exDS vet]

If it were unsuccessful, the OP would have a point about assuming these changes to be a flop.

In my original post I did not say that the changes to the ride would be a flop. I just stated that I did not like the idea of them adding characters from a movie, this movie to the ride. There was nothing wrong with the ride to begin with and since Pirates was an original Disney creation, I think any additions to the ride should be original as well.

For example, Disney has made several minor enhancements to the ride that simply added to the storyline. One of them at Disneyland was when they added the sword fight sillouette (sp) scene up on the building across the water from the pirate ship. This was subtle and it worked.

Of course we all know that making the chase scene "pc" by turning the women on the men and removing the woman in the barrel were big mistakes. Eventually I think the drunken pirates will also be taken away.

I just don't like the idea of something from the POTC movie being added to a ride that was an original Walt Disney concept. Nor do I like the timing which is to coincide/promote a new movie. I'm not sure if this has ever been done before on an existing Disney attraction.

Finally, I would have no problem if they put human characters in a meet and greet area near the ride. I also wouldn't mind if they had posters or standees near the attraction or if they re-merchandised the shop at the exit to offer movie merchandise. That is synergy and it would be acceptable. I still maintain that what they are going to do by adding Sparrow and Barbosa to the actual ride is wrong and not the Disney way.

 

[exDS vet]

whoops here is another sequel that is bound to ruffle some feathers

That is if I only had any feathers left. The idea of those sequels to me is simply pathetic. If people would just stop buying these pieces of crap, Disney might actually stop making them. Look, they can make all the Pixar sequels that they want to. I won't even complain too much about the LM, LK, B&B, etc. But when they start messing with Walt Disney's Classics, I will always have a problem.

Count me out on all of the above.