delivery Fee Question

[BWV Dreamin]

Quick update: after writing a third email with all the references to the Florida law as per Drusba's post, I received a reply saying the issue was being escalated and that I should have received a reply early this week. Still nothing though.

Wow great job!!! Please keep us posted, and thank you!

 

[zavandor]

I have received a call yesterday about the grocery delivery fee. On the call there was Yvonne (who we already know, from Compliance), then E. who works in Condo finance and L. who works in Member Experiences. Sorry, titles were said quickly so I didn't catch them exactly.

They mostly reiterated what was already told to me: grocery delivery is not one of the services that is included in MF, it is an extra service and as an extra it has to be paid.

I made a few questions:
- The grocery delivery fee is paid only if the package is delivered in room, the effort to receive and store the item is included. Instead the package handling fee is due just for receiving the package, even if it's retrieved at the desk.
They replied that for the package delivery the problem is the extra space that is required to handle all those packages

- At a resort like SSR, with no cash resort attached, I suppose all Bell Services salary is paid entierly by due, so will we end paying BS twice? With dues and with the fee?
They told me only a percentage of the salay is paid by MF.
They also told me that the financial statement (I think it's the term they've used) is audited and certified. So I've asked if I could see it and they've said I can and they'll send it to me. However it's not detailed enough to get to see how salary is split between resort and MF. Anyway I've asked for it anyway

- since they told me grocery delivery is not within the list of services included in the MF, I've asked if they have a formal document where they list what is included and what not: for example for housekeeping in the official document they spell exactly when we get "free" housekeeping and that extras are pay to play. But I have found no mention of grocery delivery being an extra.
They replied they cannot spell exactly a list of everything is not included, that would be impossible. I felt this was a way to not answer to the real question. I'd be interested to get the official documents where everything is offered to members is listed, list from which they desume the grocery delivery is not included and luggage delivery is. The exact wording can be important and I feel they would like not to disclose this. I'll try to get this in followup emails.

- In my email I've sent the articles quoted by Drusba and asked for a comment. They didn't have my email in front of them, so I re-read them during the call. This was near the end fo the call so they were a bit rushed at this point. I've tried to catch the exact terms they were using (as it's an important legal interpretation) but I'm not sure I wrote them down exactly: they told me that the grocery delivery is not a common expense or an incidental benefit, so those articles do not apply to it. I have asked to receive a formal answer in writing via email with their interpretation of the law.

 

[Bestdayever89]

I thought it is okay to use a cart if you want at a DVC resort.

Last time we went to akl they had carts on lock down. Only for cm

 

[BWV Dreamin]

I have received a call yesterday about the grocery delivery fee. On the call there was Yvonne (who we already know, from Compliance), then E. who works in Condo finance and L. who works in Member Experiences. Sorry, titles were said quickly so I didn't catch them exactly.

They mostly reiterated what was already told to me: grocery delivery is not one of the services that is included in MF, it is an extra service and as an extra it has to be paid.

I made a few questions:
- The grocery delivery fee is paid only if the package is delivered in room, the effort to receive and store the item is included. Instead the package handling fee is due just for receiving the package, even if it's retrieved at the desk.
They replied that for the package delivery the problem is the extra space that is required to handle all those packages

- At a resort like SSR, with no cash resort attached, I suppose all Bell Services salary is paid entierly by due, so will we end paying BS twice? With dues and with the fee?
They told me only a percentage of the salay is paid by MF.
They also told me that the financial statement (I think it's the term they've used) is audited and certified. So I've asked if I could see it and they've said I can and they'll send it to me. However it's not detailed enough to get to see how salary is split between resort and MF. Anyway I've asked for it anyway

- since they told me grocery delivery is not within the list of services included in the MF, I've asked if they have a formal document where they list what is included and what not: for example for housekeeping in the official document they spell exactly when we get "free" housekeeping and that extras are pay to play. But I have found no mention of grocery delivery being an extra.
They replied they cannot spell exactly a list of everything is not included, that would be impossible. I felt this was a way to not answer to the real question. I'd be interested to get the official documents where everything is offered to members is listed, list from which they desume the grocery delivery is not included and luggage delivery is. The exact wording can be important and I feel they would like not to disclose this. I'll try to get this in followup emails.

- In my email I've sent the articles quoted by Drusba and asked for a comment. They didn't have my email in front of them, so I re-read them during the call. This was near the end fo the call so they were a bit rushed at this point. I've tried to catch the exact terms they were using (as it's an important legal interpretation) but I'm not sure I wrote them down exactly: they told me that the grocery delivery is not a common expense or an incidental benefit, so those articles do not apply to it. I have asked to receive a formal answer in writing via email with their interpretation of the law.

Thank you for keeping us informed.

 

[hayesdvc]

I have no problem with the $6 fee if you want the package to be delivered to your room. Stayed at PVB last week and had a package sent to the resort. I planned on going to the front desk and pick it up once notified. I was never notified. The package was delivered to my room while we were out of the room. I was charged the $6.

 

[Madame]

I have no problem with the $6 fee if you want the package to be delivered to your room. Stayed at PVB last week and had a package sent to the resort. I planned on going to the front desk and pick it up once notified. I was never notified. The package was delivered to my room while we were out of the room. I was charged the $6.

You’re lucky you got it at all. DD & I were at BCV 2 wks ago & got someone else’s Amazon Prime package. It just showed up on our studio table. Looked like a lithium battery for a laptop. We took it to BS, but yeah....

 

[zavandor]

I've had another call (the last one, they won't talk to me again about this) with DVC executives about the delivery fee.
They said:
- the only thing that it is budgeted for is the delivery of luggage. Anything else is not budgeted for.
- in the future, they may decide to add a fee to delivery other things (strollers, umbrellas, golf clubs bags...) or remove the fee if the majority of members want to have groveries delivered
- there is nowhere a document where it is stated that BS can only deliver luggage for free
- if in the past, deliveries for owner lockers and groceries were not charged just because of "good customer services", but they've never been paid by members (there weren't many members doing it, so it went under the radar)
- when BS do a delivery, they code in their system what they have delivered, in this way they can have separate budgets and not make members pay for the time BS have spent delivering the groceries
- when both groceries and luggage are delivered, then we're not charged the fee, however luggage and groceries may be delivered by different people because they've arrived at different times and stored in different places, in this case we would be charged
- I have asked about a loophole: if I go to BS and I leave them a piece of luggage asking them to bring it to my room with the groceries, will I be charged? The answer has been; it's a lot of effort to avoid $6
- I have asked about the Florida law: they said there are on the Internet people who have a lot of "opinions". They have a lot of lawyers and external companies who audit their budgets so they are sure what they're doing is 100% right

 

[Madame]

I've had another call (the last one, they won't talk to me again about this) with DVC executives about the delivery fee.
They said:
- the only thing that it is budgeted for is the delivery of luggage. Anything else is not budgeted for.
- in the future, they may decide to add a fee to delivery other things (strollers, umbrellas, golf clubs bags...) or remove the fee if the majority of members want to have groveries delivered
- there is nowhere a document where it is stated that BS can only deliver luggage for free
- if in the past, deliveries for owner lockers and groceries were not charged just because of "good customer services", but they've never been paid by members (there weren't many members doing it, so it went under the radar)
- when BS do a delivery, they code in their system what they have delivered, in this way they can have separate budgets and not make members pay for the time BS have spent delivering the groceries
- when both groceries and luggage are delivered, then we're not charged the fee, however luggage and groceries may be delivered by different people because they've arrived at different times and stored in different places, in this case we would be charged
- I have asked about a loophole: if I go to BS and I leave them a piece of luggage asking them to bring it to my room with the groceries, will I be charged? The answer has been; it's a lot of effort to avoid $6
- I have asked about the Florida law: they said there are on the Internet people who have a lot of "opinions". They have a lot of lawyers and external companies who audit their budgets so they are sure what they're doing is 100% right

Just wow. Someone very recently ridiculed me for stating ME & BS were covered by MF. Some of us just aren’t stupid. I won’t ever use BS again for anything.

People have reported being charged for simple luggage delivery. Maybe I should get a refund on MF then since I rarely use BS and it would seem others are getting massive amounts of crap delivered. They really need to stop marketing DVC as deluxe.

 

[twinklebug]

I've had another call (the last one, they won't talk to me again about this) with DVC executives about the delivery fee.
They said:
- the only thing that it is budgeted for is the delivery of luggage. Anything else is not budgeted for.
- in the future, they may decide to add a fee to delivery other things (strollers, umbrellas, golf clubs bags...) or remove the fee if the majority of members want to have groveries delivered
- there is nowhere a document where it is stated that BS can only deliver luggage for free
- if in the past, deliveries for owner lockers and groceries were not charged just because of "good customer services", but they've never been paid by members (there weren't many members doing it, so it went under the radar)
- when BS do a delivery, they code in their system what they have delivered, in this way they can have separate budgets and not make members pay for the time BS have spent delivering the groceries
- when both groceries and luggage are delivered, then we're not charged the fee, however luggage and groceries may be delivered by different people because they've arrived at different times and stored in different places, in this case we would be charged
- I have asked about a loophole: if I go to BS and I leave them a piece of luggage asking them to bring it to my room with the groceries, will I be charged? The answer has been; it's a lot of effort to avoid $6
- I have asked about the Florida law: they said there are on the Internet people who have a lot of "opinions". They have a lot of lawyers and external companies who audit their budgets so they are sure what they're doing is 100% right

An appropriate, yet sarcastic reply back to this person would have been:
"Restructuring the way BS works and reprogramming the system to add billable codes... it's a lot of effort to make $6"

Hearing that they acknowledge that they're knowingly dropping good customer service is heartbreaking. To me Disney always was the epitome of customer service, it's what made them special. Not a mouse, not themed resorts or rides, it's about the people and their willingness to make it home away from home for all guests.

The Disney I know and love is dissolving before my eyes much like a loved one suffering from dementia, and there's nothing I can do about it.

 

[Chuck S]

Hearing that they acknowledge that they're knowingly dropping good customer service is heartbreaking. To me Disney always was the epitome of customer service, it's what made them special.

I agree, but the reality is, good customer service like we are used to from DIsney takes some employee time, and employee time costs money . Money that most corporations of any size are no longer willing to absorb, sadly.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

If I am having luggage delivered via Magical Express, there is no charge. Correct?

 

[crvetter]

If I am having luggage delivered via Magical Express, there is no charge. Correct?

Correct no charge ever for luggage. Also magical express delivery you don’t even have to tip as it’s built into the service already.

 

[drusba]

I've had another call (the last one, they won't talk to me again about this) with DVC executives about the delivery fee.
They said:
- the only thing that it is budgeted for is the delivery of luggage. Anything else is not budgeted for.
- in the future, they may decide to add a fee to delivery other things (strollers, umbrellas, golf clubs bags...) or remove the fee if the majority of members want to have groveries delivered
- there is nowhere a document where it is stated that BS can only deliver luggage for free
- if in the past, deliveries for owner lockers and groceries were not charged just because of "good customer services", but they've never been paid by members (there weren't many members doing it, so it went under the radar)
- when BS do a delivery, they code in their system what they have delivered, in this way they can have separate budgets and not make members pay for the time BS have spent delivering the groceries
- when both groceries and luggage are delivered, then we're not charged the fee, however luggage and groceries may be delivered by different people because they've arrived at different times and stored in different places, in this case we would be charged
- I have asked about a loophole: if I go to BS and I leave them a piece of luggage asking them to bring it to my room with the groceries, will I be charged? The answer has been; it's a lot of effort to avoid $6
- I have asked about the Florida law: they said there are on the Internet people who have a lot of "opinions". They have a lot of lawyers and external companies who audit their budgets so they are sure what they're doing is 100% right

It does not appear that they are willing to answer a key question: how are our dues for Bell Services determined? It appears DVC is claiming it is actually determined based on some estimated $ amount applicable to each specific activity performed daily and throughout the year by an employee and not determined by DVC paying all or a percentage of the annual estimated wages and benefits of Bell Services employees. That would be the only way it could justify the charge, and, of course, doing the accounting that way sounds absurd, e.g., for luggage, does someone come up with a cost per luggage delivery based on the portion of an employees wages and benefits applicable to the average time it takes to deliver the luggage, and then multiply that by estimated number of times luggage will be delivered to rooms during the year? Does accounting even keep figures showing number of luggage deliveries for each day? And if luggage is the only thing budgeted for, is DVC claiming we are not paying for any other costs of Bell Services in our dues?

 

[zavandor]

It does not appear that they are willing to answer a key question: how are our dues for Bell Services determined?

They told me they enter in the system the type of delivery they do and that is used to determine the BS costs for members. But they didn't specify how this is used to calculate the final amount we pay. Your questions are all very pertinent.
However, I've been banned to make other questions related to this topic
It doesn't seem many people are concerned about this fee. It seems DVC can bleed us into poverty $6 at a time without much objections.

 

[TavieP]

They told me they enter in the system the type of delivery they do and that is used to determine the BS costs for members. But they didn't specify how this is used to calculate the final amount we pay. Your questions are all very pertinent.
However, I've been banned to make other questions related to this topic
It doesn't seem many people are concerned about this fee. It seems DVC can bleed us into poverty $6 at a time without much objections.

I'm concerned, and I wrote to DVC about it, just to register my complaint. I don't expect anything will come of it (and frankly, I don't want them to call me about this and told them not to.)

I appreciate your efforts!

 

[twinklebug]

They told me they enter in the system the type of delivery they do and that is used to determine the BS costs for members. But they didn't specify how this is used to calculate the final amount we pay. Your questions are all very pertinent.
However, I've been banned to make other questions related to this topic
It doesn't seem many people are concerned about this fee. It seems DVC can bleed us into poverty $6 at a time without much objections.

I don't see how they can ban you from asking questions related to the dues you pay as an owner. I doubt there's anything in the contract that limits our contact with them. Sounds like a tale fabricated by that person you spoke with to keep the headache off their schedule.

My advice to all of us: As Andy (Shawshank Redemption) would say after all his effort and receiving just a nod... “Well, from now on, I’m gonna write 2 letters per week instead of one”.

 

[zavandor]

I don't see how they can ban you from asking questions related to the dues you pay as an owner. I doubt there's anything in the contract that limits our contact with them. Sounds like a tale fabricated by that person you spoke with to keep the headache off their schedule.

My advice to all of us: As Andy (Shawshank Redemption) would say after all his effort and receiving just a nod... “Well, from now on, I’m gonna write 2 letters per week instead of one”.

I've had two 30 minutes calls with 3 executive level managers. They said they wouldn't schedule any such call anymore. I can ask, but basically I won't go over the standard customer service team (probably with premade courtesy answers)

 

[emilymad]

I've had two 30 minutes calls with 3 executive level managers. They said they wouldn't schedule any such call anymore. I can ask, but basically I won't go over the standard customer service team (probably with premade courtesy answers)

To me this is the concerning thing. It is not about $6 but about the general way DVC is treating its members. So they don't care about the members nor do they care about customer service. I work in a customer facing role for my job and we would never say we won't talk to you anymore. None of this is a surprise but still sad to see.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I've had two 30 minutes calls with 3 executive level managers. They said they wouldn't schedule any such call anymore. I can ask, but basically I won't go over the standard customer service team (probably with premade courtesy answers)

Maybe you should contact the Orlando Sentinel and see what they can find out.