Dear Disney re: AP Rates, Or Lack Thereof

[hdmichael]

Ok, I have to say that I am amazed at some of the anger directed toward people who are waiting for AP rates. Therefore, I do want to add my two cents, for what it is worth.

First, I did buy an AP this year. (I already have DC, AAA, and several "frequent visitor" cards for various national hotel chains.) Second, we have two trips planned to Disney this fall. One we will not cancel because we are going with friends, one I might cancel without the AP rates. Why?

Second, it is not an issue of whether I can afford rack rate or not. (We have a comfortable income and can afford it.) For me, it is a matter of (1) the best value for my dollar and (2) which businesses or resorts treat me as though they value my business. For example, if you are an AP holder for Universal, you get discounts up to 30% off rooms in their on site hotels. Also, when I visit hotels in Las Vegas, San Francisco, Hilton Head, and other cities, I get postcards, special emails, and special mailings offering me a discount on room rates because I am a repeat customer. (These discounts typically beat what I can find on expedia, hotels, or travelocity.) The same applies to hotels for which I have a "frequent visitor" card or who are partnered with airlines for which I have "frequent flyer" cards. All of these businesses are saying to me, "We value your business, and we won't take your repeat business for granted. You are part of the customer base which we need to prosper as a business. Please come visit again."

Disney, in providing discounts to everyone but, arguably, their most loyal repeat customers, is basically saying, "We don't need your business. If you want to come back fine, if not, we don't care because we have all the customer base we need." Thus because AP holders are singled out for not being able to receive a discount on their rooms (remember FTP and winter packages do get discounts on their rooms), I am left with a bad tase in my mouth.

Therefore, although I have a great time at WDW, my family also can have an equally great time at literally hundreds of places around the world where our business is welcomed and where we can get a great value for our dollar. Additionally, if we go to Disney for our second fall trip, we may check out the Swan/ Dolphin hotels who appear to be saying, "Hey, we value your business, and here's what we can do for you." Given the state of our economy, that is what most resorts and hotels seem to be saying these days.

 

[DVCPAT]

Swan & Dolphin resorts are a good alternative. Dont get upset once the resort occupancy levels rise and they raise nightly rates. It's not personal, It's business.

 

[faithinkarma]

For me, it is a matter of (1) the best value for my dollar and (2) which businesses or resorts treat me as though they value my business.





That is exactly the way I feel !!!

I have always paid rack rates except for my last trip. I was fully prepared to pay them this time.

But there was something about the way the discounts were offered in a package seemingly designed to herd people that I found I could not accept.

I am happy for those who still feel enough of the magic that they are willing to pay the price for it. I wish I could.

 

[skiwee1]

Originally posted by DebbieB
Wouldn't it make sense for Disney instead of cutting out the discounts completely to lower the discounts? Instead of 50% off, maybe 20%-25% off. Then people would still think they are getting a deal and would be happy. I think the room rates are inflated to start with. I'm going Oct 1 to 6 and really wanted to stay at BWI. But I think $285 plus tax for a standard view there is outrageous. And that's value season! It's not a matter of what I can afford, it's the principle. I paid $169 for the same room last December. I paid about $285 for an OKW 1 bedroom for 2 nights in May, which is about 3 times the size of a BWI room. So I'm staying at CBR with a 20% AAA discount. $118 per night I think is reasonable for that room (waterview).

If bookings are good then why would they want to lower the discount or offer any at all? Maybe they have no rooms to offer a discount for because everyone has overbooked waiting for AP rates. Businesses don't lower prices on merchandise they don't have to offer. As far as other discounts go, I too used AAA. I only saved 10% off my room but that little amount certainly more then paid for my AAA card.

 

[polkadotminnie]

hdmicheal and dianev- I totally agree with what you have stated. We have frequent flier miles and dozens of hotel points from many national chains (enough to stay a week free in Hawaii next summer). They value my repeat business. I am not an AP holder, but I think Disney's rack rate is outrageous for what you get especially the deluxes. I will stay at the Universal hotels with FOTL access with as nice of a room as any deluxe at Disney, but pay half the rate (they offer lots of different types of discounts). Disney will lose money from me. This is our 3rd trip this year, but the first time we won't go to Disney. Companies should reward repeat customers.

 

[bsears]

Maybe they have no rooms to offer a discount for because everyone has overbooked waiting for AP rates.



This is a good point. But in a way Disney brought it on themselves by allowing people to make a reservation, and later apply a discount to it. I always thought this was generous of them.

 

[Sammie]

I think what has happened is that when AP discounts were first offered they were a reward for the repeat customer. They were a reward for the family that bought every member in the family an AP, and came many times in a single year, spending alot of money on lodging, dining, and misc.

However that changed. Soon you saw many people booking rooms that they knew they would not keep unless they got a very good discount. This totally confused the Disney system of tracking how occupancy rates were going for certain times of the year and certain resorts.

Also instead of the previous situation I mentioned you saw guests buying one AP and most times a child's AP just to get the discount. This was never Disney's intent for the use of the AP program or the discounts offered.

Many people that bought the one AP had no intention of going back that year, they just wanted the discount for that one trip.

Believe me Disney did not become as successful as they are by being stupid in marketing. They are the Kings of marketing and they will do what is best for the company whether it pleases everyone or not.

 

[Tonyspad]

Finally someone that is speaking some sense about this matter. Maybe Disney should change it's AP discount policy, if they ever come out with a discount again, to require ALL members of an AP's discounted room have an AP. This would stop the people from doing exactly what you just mentioned. It is a crime to see how many post there are about how to get around the system. There is not any way Disney ever intended to allow a childs AP to be used at check-in for an AP discounted room.

 

[disneyjunkie]

Originally posted by Tonyspad
Finally someone that is speaking some sense about this matter. Maybe Disney should change it's AP discount policy, if they ever come out with a discount again, to require ALL members of an AP's discounted room have an AP. This would stop the people from doing exactly what you just mentioned. It is a crime to see how many post there are about how to get around the system. There is not any way Disney ever intended to allow a childs AP to be used at check-in for an AP discounted room.

Of course if they were to do this, people will scream foul. How dare Disney make me buy APs for everyone in my party. Don't they know not all families can afford to spend so much $$$ for park passes????

 

[Lisa3]

I am a first time AP holder and we did this with the intention that we would get two trips out of our passes (yes we did buy them for the entire family). We received a nice discount at the Polynesian last year and have a Come Back rate for this Nov. so while I would love a rate like last year, I feel fortunate for what I have. While I don't agree that everyone in your party should have an AP, I do feel that the adults in the party should have one. I really don't think it was ever Disney's intention to give a discount based on buying a child's AP. This was a loophole that many found and used.

I like the idea of having a straight forward discount to all adult AP holders of 25% to 30%. No more waiting for discounts to be released or being angry for something you expected Disney to deliver. I believe Universal does something like this.

On another note why do so many of you seem to have to justify that you can afford to pay rack rates? I for one cannot afford $400 to $500 per night for a room and I'm not afraid to say so. We save and save for our vacations so that we can stay where we would like and take a break from the everyday creative financing our family does. For our family of 5 the deluxe resorts are the best value both in price and space. I really think if Disney made their rates more in line with the rest of the industry there wouldn't be such an outcry for discounts and their rooms would be filled regardless of what offer happens to be out. I sometimes feel very uncomfortable on this board when I am being told to "book what you can afford", taking that to mean that people like myself have no business at a deluxe resort.

Anyway, I really just wanted to see my countdown again!

 

[disneyjunkie]

If a family wants to book one of Disney's packages, everyone has to be included. Mom and Dad can't book the package and then buy PHPs for the kids. It's all or nothing. Why should the AP rates be any different?

 

[sue1013]

I really think if Disney made their rates more in line with the rest of the industry there wouldn't be such an outcry for discounts and their rooms would be filled regardless of what offer happens to be out. I sometimes feel very uncomfortable on this board when I am being told to "book what you can afford", taking that to mean that people like myself have no business at a deluxe resort.


Lisa,
What you are saying about Disney rates is like telling Mercedes to lower their prices to be more in line with Kia. Before anyone starts I'm not saying anything against any resort. "Book what you can afford" is not meant that you have no business at a deluxe resort. But why make yourself nuts about not getting a discount. I for one am tired of all the whining about discounts. Sure they are great to get but it is not an entitlement. To me book what you can afford means stay where you will be comfortable. If your going to be upset that you don't have a discount at a deluxe so much that it will take away from the enjoyment you will have on vacation don't stay at a deluxe. Go to WDW and have fun!!! That's what its all about.

 

[Lisa3]

"What you are saying about Disney rates is like telling Mercedes to lower their prices to be more in line with Kia."

sue1013 - This is not what I'm saying at all. As with any purchase you have to compare apples to apples. Mercedes' prices still have to be in line with other luxury cars in its class. There is no way you can compare a Mercedes with a Kia. That is like saying the Grand Floridian is equivalent to a Days Inn (I am not knocking Days Inn). While I haven't done alot of traveling, I do have family members who have and all think Disney's rack rates are a little out of line to other "comparable" vacation destinations.

I just think a more straightforward AP discount policy (just like AAA and DC) and more reasonable rack rates would eliminate the "whining" over discounts. I, for one, want to see Disney thrive (some of my retirement is sitting in Disney stock). If you can fill your rooms there will be more people in the parks, restaurants, stores, etc. all willing to pay those extremely high prices on the rest of their Disney vacation.

Again, just my thoughts. Sometimes the best ideas come from those of us who do not have a degree in marketing but in psychology instead!

 

[DebbieB]

What you are saying about Disney rates is like telling Mercedes to lower their prices to be more in line with Kia.

But what if Mercedes lowered their prices for select groups? If you are a Florida Resident we will lower it by 40%, if you are one of the select people to receive a postcard we will lower it by 40%, if you buy their option package we will lower the price by 43% (FTP). But if you are a loyal current customer, you can pay full price. What should that customer do? Head to BMW !

 

[RescueRanger]

Lisa3, I think you may have hit the nail on the head. Alot of the people on these boards who tell us they "have no problem paying rack rates" actually dont want there to be discounts. Its a class warfare thing. They don't want someone who may not be of "their class" staying in "their resort". The high prices keep what they consider the "undesirables" out, even if it means paying extravagant rates for a so-so resort. I am not saying everyone is like this, but their are alot that are. I too feel that if Disney would keep it prices more in line with the rest of the industry, it would avoid alot of these problems. I for one will be spending more trips at Universal. You don't have to guess if there will be discounts at there resorts.

 

[Lisa3]

Rescue Ranger- You had the nerve to say what I was thinking. I was very hurt by some of the comments flying around on these boards when people were being moved from some of the moderate resorts up to the deluxes. The comments got even worse when the undertone was that the FTP was bringing the quality of conciege down. Maybe it's my own insecurity but I worry that we will feel "outclassed" on our Nov. trip (we are staying Concierge at the Polynesian).

I have to say that sometimes I sit here in wonder at the way some people think. To me there is good and bad at all levels and all of us can only work together to make things better for our children.

 

[RescueRanger]

Lisa go and have a good time, and don't worry what others think. The only people we have to satisfy are ourselves. The people who really are caught up in the "class system" don't deserve a second thought. I don't think Walt meant for Disney to be for only the affluent. By the way, when you go to the concierge lounge be sure to fill up extra plates of food to bring back to the room with you. LOL

 

[miko]

The people who really are caught up in the "class system" don't deserve a second thought.

IMHO there are basically 2 types of "class". Those who think it is bought by money and those that really have it!

 

[Tonyspad]

Let me just try and expand on Sues post. Mercedes makes DELUXE automobiles and Kia makes VALUE automobiles. Even though they are both automobiles it is safe to say that most may perfer the Mercedes but most can only afford the Kia. Does that mean that Mercedes or Disney for that matter should continue to discount their items for sale to accomodate everyones buget for their high line offerings? Disney and Mercedes both offer deluxe and value priced items and occasionally they offer discounts to certain regions of the country and not the others for whatever marketing reason. I just think that anyone making a reservation at WDW knows the price at the time of the reservation and they should book what they can afford at the time they reserve it.

 

[RescueRanger]

Well said Miko!