Dear Disney re: AP Rates, Or Lack Thereof

[DianeV]

I guess I dont feel that way and I dont even have an AP! I think that if something is mentioned as a "benefit",especially an attractive benefit there is a certain expectation that it will happen. I am not saying they promised anyone anything but I also think that when you list something like that as even "may" be offered and historically it has been to just start taking it away like that or make it such a last minute thing if even possible, it tends to upset some people and I do understand that.

As I have said before I have never seen any hotel company that makes it so hard to get any kind of discount on their rooms. No other company I have dealt with makes you jump through hoops or makes it a big secret you have to have the magic "code" for to get a discount. Their rooms are very expensive and yes they are nice, but there are nicer..

Yet we see Florida resident rates offered pretty much all the time..why wouldnt they want to entice other states and people to come to their parks?

 

[DVCPAT]

Originally posted by PatriciaH
I got an AP discount just this past March at AKL concierge. That is considered "peak" season according to Disney. For as long as I have been booking they have also offered discounts at peak times as well as regular and value season.

AKL offers the deepest discounts because occupancy levels are the lowest of any deluxe resort. We stayed at AKL last year for $119.00 per night. If I never get that rate again, I wont be upset, I'll consider myself lucky.

 

[Penny12]

Oh I understand people are upset too, of course I do. You know, I get upset when I see other people win the lottery and I don't...but that doesn't mean that it's reasonable or justified for me to do so though

Bottom line here is - we've all got comfy with the frequency of discounts flying around that we've taken them for granted when we shouldn't of - people started talking about <i>when</i> the discounts come rather than <b><i>if.</i></b>

JMHO

 

[C.Ann]

Okay... I've read all five pages of this thread and this is the conclusion I have come to......

I'm going to add this AP room-only-discount fiasco to my list of reasons why I prefer to stay off-site... If trying to get a room anywhere caused me this much anger and anxiety I would run in the other direction as fast as I could!!

Please - just book a room somewhere that you think is reasonable and be done with it!!!

 

[WebmasterPete]

Let me share with you a conversation I had in October 2001 with a manager at Disney. It was in the aftermath of Sept 11th, and I was asking why Disney was not lowering their rates (as every hotel in Orlando had done by that point), in order to entice more people to travel. The answer he gave me was "rate integrity". Disney felt that if they lowered the rates at the resorts, people would subsequently expect them, and find them too expensive to visit when the rates returned to normal. I told him he was crazy, but I think I'm beginning to see his point. Disney's history is to eliminate discounts that cause them too much trouble. Case in point...Discount codes. Thanks to the proliferation of these codes all over the internet, and the abuse that ensued, Disney has all but stopped issuing them. The only instances where they are sent out now is with a pin number to ensure that only the person who received the code could take advantage of it.

Disney is a business. Yes, they provide magical memories, and wonderful resorts, and great food, etc. But, at the end of the day, they are a business, and a business must remain profitable, or it will soon go bankrupt. That is the law of capitalism. The AP rates are historically issued around this time of the year for fall travel, because Oct/Nov/Dec tend to be slower periods for Disney. This year, the Fairy Tale Packages that were released in April were for travel, you guessed, during the fall months. Response to that package was unprecedented. I have it on good authority that Disney revised there sales goals more than 5 times during that promotion because they were selling far more of the packages then they ever anticipated. Put simply, they don't need to fill the resorts with AP rates. Simply because they have done it in the past does not guarantee they will do it in the future, nor does Disney owe us, or anyone else, a discount. To expect it, and actually go so far to quote promissory estoppel is really pushing the line of reality. Disney does not promise the discount, nor is anyone entitled to it. If enough people make enough noise about it, Disney is more likely to stop the AP discounts all together, and find another way to fill those rooms (like more Fairy Tale packages, which will end up making them far more money than they would make on AP rates).

So folks, I'm all for calling Disney out when they mess up, but the fact is, people are upset because they feel entitled to something that was never promised to them. The burden lies on our expectations, not Disney's actions.

Pete

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by WebmasterPete
Let me share with you a conversation I had in October 2001 with a manager at Disney. It was in the aftermath of Sept 11th, and I was asking why Disney was not lowering their rates (as every hotel in Orlando had done by that point), in order to entice more people to travel. The answer he gave me was "rate integrity". Disney felt that if they lowered the rates at the resorts, people would subsequently expect them, and find them too expensive to visit when the rates returned to normal. I told him he was crazy, but I think I'm beginning to see his point. Disney's history is to eliminate discounts that cause them too much trouble. Case in point...Discount codes. Thanks to the proliferation of these codes all over the internet, and the abuse that ensued, Disney has all but stopped issuing them. The only instances where they are sent out now is with a pin number to ensure that only the person who received the code could take advantage of it.

Disney is a business. Yes, they provide magical memories, and wonderful resorts, and great food, etc. But, at the end of the day, they are a business, and a business must remain profitable, or it will soon go bankrupt. That is the law of capitalism. The AP rates are historically issued around this time of the year for fall travel, because Oct/Nov/Dec tend to be slower periods for Disney. This year, the Fairy Tale Packages that were released in April were for travel, you guessed, during the fall months. Response to that package was unprecedented. I have it on good authority that Disney revised there sales goals more than 5 times during that promotion because they were selling far more of the packages then they ever anticipated. Put simply, they don't need to fill the resorts with AP rates. Simply because they have done it in the past does not guarantee they will do it in the future, nor does Disney owe us, or anyone else, a discount. To expect it, and actually go so far to quote promissory estoppel is really pushing the line of reality. Disney does not promise the discount, nor is anyone entitled to it. If enough people make enough noise about it, Disney is more likely to stop the AP discounts all together, and find another way to fill those rooms (like more Fairy Tale packages, which will end up making them far more money than they would make on AP rates).

So folks, I'm all for calling Disney out when they mess up, but the fact is, people are upset because they feel entitled to something that was never promised to them. The burden lies on our expectations, not Disney's actions.

Pete

----------------------------------------------

Excellent post!!

Excellent explanation!!!

 

[smfnj]

Originally posted by n2mm
I've had an AP since 1995, when room discounts were almost unheard of.

Maybe you never heard of them back in '95 but I've had room discounts for every one of my 20 or so trips dating back to '91, either MKclub or AP.

steve

 

[DianeV]

Thats all fine and dandy but no one seems to be able to address the fact that there are probably not any other hotels out there who make you go to such measures to get a discount. I am not even talking about AP holders here but rooms in general.

Yes Disney is a business and they want to make money but believe me even if they discounted their rates on a regular basis (like most hotels do) they would make alot of $$$. You dont think that the money people would spend AT the resorts would offset whatever discount Disney gave?

Why can I figure this out but they and many others cant? I believe that the people who will pay $300 a night for a hotel at Disney World are more the exception then the rule. If they continue to stop offering discounts they are going to hurt themselves big time. And their packages are a joke. The only good one was the FTP and not everyone was able to take advantage of that.

I guess I love going to Disney but I dont feel some misguided loyalty to them to constantly defend everything they do. They are not perfect and its pretty noticeable that you are getting less "magic" and paying more these days.

 

[SnackyStacky]

I said it once I'll say it again:

If Disney wouldn't make their rates so ridiculously expensive, nobody would have these problems. They wouldn't NEED to put out discount codes. Problem solved for both Disney, and the consumer!

I'm going to reserve the Polynesian for my honeymoon. At $492/night, they'd BETTER come out with some kind of discount, because if not, I will look into one of the hotels on Hotel Plaza Boulevard. That's just too much. 4 star suites in Manhattan don't go for that much.

 

[smfnj]

Originally posted by DrTomorrow
But please don't use DIS to make assertions that the facts don't support.

Yeah, some people really have nerve posting their opinions here. Why don't we just read the press releases from Disney then we can shut down all the forums and ng's concerning Disney.

steve

 

[smfnj]

Originally posted by disneyjunkie
It's so hard to ignore these threads when they are all over the place.

No, it's very easy to ignore if you are tired of them, don't click on it. I guess it's sort of like a car wreck on the highway, most everybody has to slow down and take a look.

steve

 

[Penny12]

Well, speaking only for myself - I didn't address the fact that Disney makes people go to extreme measures to get discounts because the thread was primarily and specifically about the AP rate and whether people were entitled to it or not. That's a different debate completely...and one which I happen to agree with you about - Disney makes people jump through too many hoops, without a doubt.

Again, I thought this thread was specifically about AP rates - I haven't seen anyone else suggest that Disney has removed all their discount codes, they <i>are</i> still available - just possibly not the big 45-50% AP ones. Historically, as Pete explained, they've offered these big discounts in the past in order to fill empty rooms at slow times of year. If the rooms aren't empty - they've no need to offer the discounts. If enough of their rooms are already occupied, exactly how are Disney hurting themselves big time? Are you suggesting that if a hotel, any hotel, is already full of people willing to pay $X amount for their room, that they should then offer those same people a 50% discount simply because that's what they had to do last week/month/year? What kind of business would be silly enough to do that?!

I don't think I have any misguided loyalties to Disney. Sometimes they mess up and I assure you, I see it and I can and do comment on it. I just don't happen to think this is one of those occasions, but if you prefer to dismiss different opinions to your own as simply that, then so be it

 

[DebbieB]

Wouldn't it make sense for Disney instead of cutting out the discounts completely to lower the discounts? Instead of 50% off, maybe 20%-25% off. Then people would still think they are getting a deal and would be happy. I think the room rates are inflated to start with. I'm going Oct 1 to 6 and really wanted to stay at BWI. But I think $285 plus tax for a standard view there is outrageous. And that's value season! It's not a matter of what I can afford, it's the principle. I paid $169 for the same room last December. I paid about $285 for an OKW 1 bedroom for 2 nights in May, which is about 3 times the size of a BWI room. So I'm staying at CBR with a 20% AAA discount. $118 per night I think is reasonable for that room (waterview).

 

[DianeV]

Yes this was started about AP rates but I personally got offtrack (in a way). We would like to stay in October for a couple nights onsite even though we have a timeshare booked with other family. We already have a place to stay so its not a necessity but it would be fun and if Disney offered some kind of rate incentive you can be sure they would make it back from us because we would spend money in their restaurants etc. at the resort.

There are hotels out there in places as nice or nicer then Disney and they dont make it all a big secret or ordeal to try to get some kind of room discount. Why the big secret? Why a secret code? Why cant they just be straight and offer discounts of some kind frequently? After reading Marys website I do start to think that they shut down a resort and call it refurbishing in order to make it seem like they are "full" and cant offer any discounts...

Oh well I can go on and say all the same things over and over again on here but some just dont get it or want to get it. I love going there too but I am not a circus animal that will jump through hoops or do some special trick to get a discount on their rooms. I dont think it should have to be that way, no other hotel I know of operates that way.

 

[palmtreegirl]

Originally posted by WebmasterPete
Let me share with you a conversation I had in October 2001 with a manager at Disney. It was in the aftermath of Sept 11th, and I was asking why Disney was not lowering their rates (as every hotel in Orlando had done by that point), in order to entice more people to travel. The answer he gave me was "rate integrity". Disney felt that if they lowered the rates at the resorts, people would subsequently expect them, and find them too expensive to visit when the rates returned to normal. I told him he was crazy, but I think I'm beginning to see his point. Disney's history is to eliminate discounts that cause them too much trouble. Case in point...Discount codes. Thanks to the proliferation of these codes all over the internet, and the abuse that ensued, Disney has all but stopped issuing them. The only instances where they are sent out now is with a pin number to ensure that only the person who received the code could take advantage of it.

Disney is a business. Yes, they provide magical memories, and wonderful resorts, and great food, etc. But, at the end of the day, they are a business, and a business must remain profitable, or it will soon go bankrupt. That is the law of capitalism. The AP rates are historically issued around this time of the year for fall travel, because Oct/Nov/Dec tend to be slower periods for Disney. This year, the Fairy Tale Packages that were released in April were for travel, you guessed, during the fall months. Response to that package was unprecedented. I have it on good authority that Disney revised there sales goals more than 5 times during that promotion because they were selling far more of the packages then they ever anticipated. Put simply, they don't need to fill the resorts with AP rates. Simply because they have done it in the past does not guarantee they will do it in the future, nor does Disney owe us, or anyone else, a discount. To expect it, and actually go so far to quote promissory estoppel is really pushing the line of reality. Disney does not promise the discount, nor is anyone entitled to it. If enough people make enough noise about it, Disney is more likely to stop the AP discounts all together, and find another way to fill those rooms (like more Fairy Tale packages, which will end up making them far more money than they would make on AP rates).

So folks, I'm all for calling Disney out when they mess up, but the fact is, people are upset because they feel entitled to something that was never promised to them. The burden lies on our expectations, not Disney's actions.

Pete

Who hoo, WTG, bravo, ITA and all that jazz. Thank you for posting this.

 

[PatriciaH]

I do think Disney messed up by offering AP rates on July 30th for a little while and then pulling them. If they were not going to offer AP rates/did not need to offer AP rates this should not have happened. They should have just announced "due to the success of the FTP we will not be releasing AP rates for this time frame." Fine-but don't be playing games like that. Also, why are they sending out code e-mails and postcards if they don't need to fill rooms because of the FTP?

Rack rates are so high at WDW! I am a travel agent and most people do not want to even talk Disney after seeing they can stay at a 5 star all-inclusive resort in the Caribbean/Mexico for the same price as a Disney resort with no meals. The Disney Cruise Line-most customers say forget it-it is double what Royal Caribbean, Celebrity and Carnival are offering. I feel I get my money's worth and more at WDW but most people will not even give it a chance at rack rates. I know- I talk to them every day!

 

[C.Ann]

Every time I read another of these "AP discount threads" I just get more confused than ever!!

It seems that everyone is VERY upset that these codes haven't come out (and may never come out) and they're also VERY upset with Disney for jerking them around and not just making some kind of announcement one way or the other..

Well - rather than get so upset, have your stomach in knots, spend precious time checking, rechecking, and checking these boards again to see if anyone has heard anything - why not SPEAK with your pocketbook and your actions and just get a room elsewhere?? It just seems to me that many folks are torturing themselves unnecessarily and spending the time prior to their trips all in a hissy fit rather than enjoying the planning and being happy and excited..

What am I missing? How can people be SO angry and upset one minute and then want to turn around and give money to that very same source of anger the next? I just don't get it.....

 

[RescueRanger]

Amen!!! C.Ann
Disney is getting less time in our trip next June (only 2 days as opposed to the 5 we will spend a Universal) and we are going to stay at the Dolphin where my wife can get their Teacher Rate $129 p/n for the nights at Disney. At this point, even if Disney decided to come out with AP rates, we will not change our plans and they will not get my extra money.

 

[Tonyspad]

Book a room that you can afford at the time you book it, Do not book a room that you can only afford if a discount comes out.

 

[bsears]

Because perhaps others, like me, will cancel their Disney hotel and stay elsewhere.

And after almost 30 years of staying onsite, I may discover that the Swan/Dolphin or Downtown Disney Hotels offer enough value and service to lead me to change my vacation habits permanently.

And once I am staying offsite, why not go to Universal for a couple of days?