DD wants a purity ring

[MrsPete]

I will have to disagree with this, MrsPete. By nature of it being a ring visible to the outside world, it becomes a public thing. Many people know what they are, and if they don't, they're learning. Why not just keep it private, and know it's within your heart if that's what you want to achieve?

How does someone else know that the ring on your finger is a "purity ring" and not just a pretty ring?

 

[TinkerBelled]

I don't understand the people who are against "waiting". No bad can come of waiting, while much bad can come of having sex too young /with the wrong person. Disease, unwanted pregnancy, emotional entanglements with which the teen isn't ready to deal.

I guess, for me, it depends what you mean by waiting. I am absolutely and entirely all for waiting until you are a mature, responsible person who is in love with your partner. I agree that 14-year-olds aren't mature or responsible enough to deal with the emotional, let alone physical, consequences of a sexual relationship.

But I do think that the marriage-or-else philosophy can have bad effects. (Note: not will, but can). People get married too young to people they're in lust with rather than people they're in love with. People hide things from their parents because they feel ashamed. People don't learn about safer sex properly, because they don't think it's applicable, which is why when they do have sex it's more likely to be unprotected. And some adults who wait--again, certainly not all--find themselves in sexually unsatisfying relationships.

Again, I absolutely agree that sex-too-young is a bad thing. However, I don't think you can say that waiting is right for everyone or has no possible bad side-effects. Personally, I'm really glad that I had sex with my husband before we married: knowing that we were compatible in that area made me even more sure this was the man I wanted to spend the rest of my life with.

 

[MrsPete]

ITA. It is easy to pop on a ring... What matters is what is in the heart. If it truly is heartfelt you don't need to 'display' ' your commitment - you just live it.

Which is easier, especially for a teen, who -- by her very nature and stage in life -- is inclined to be scatter-brained?

1. Seriously think through what "waiting" means and make a promise to yourself at a young age.

2. Seriously think through what "waiting" means and make a promise to yourself at a young age AND have a physical reminder of it every time you look at your own hand. It's a small, "Oh yeah, I've promised myself to make good decisions" item.

Even a teen who is very serious about her choice can benefit from reinforcement.

 

[Colleen27]

I don't want my child making choices based on someone else's values and beliefs-I want her to have her own. Even if they are different than mine.

We made the somewhat difficult decision to send our children to a Catholic school though we aren't a Catholic family, so this is an issue that comes up frequently in our home. I don't care that the peer pressure involved is "positive" (conservative/religious) rather than negative, I want my girls to be strong enough to live their own beliefs even when they're in a group that doesn't share them.

Random thoughts:

11 is plenty old to have a concept of what it means "to wait". Sure, an 11 year old won't grasp the whole picture: That is, she won't understand that she may experience physical desires and pressure from guys, but she's old enough to understand that the world will "encourage" her in a direction that may not be healthy for her in the long run.

I think it's fairly common for girls in middle school -- late middle school -- to decide what they're going to do/not do as teens. I know that I decided around that age that I'd never touch drugs (and I never did), but I'd drink in moderation only once I reached college (and that's exactly what I did). I made other decisions about sex, morality, college, etc. and stuck to them with about 90% accuracy.

I think a girl who decides "to wait" (whether she wears a ring or not) will at least wait longer than a girl who never sets such a goal for herself, and that is a huge positive. I mean, consider the maturity difference between perhaps 15 and 18. An 18 year old is much more likely to use birth control and is more likely to know what she's getting into.

I don't understand the people who are against "waiting". No bad can come of waiting, while much bad can come of having sex too young /with the wrong person. Disease, unwanted pregnancy, emotional entanglements with which the teen isn't ready to deal.

I told my girls (before they had a first boyfriend) that all girls -- or at least almost all girls -- think that their first real boyfriend is "the one"; that is, that most girls believe they're the lucky one-in-a-million who met her soulmate at a very young age, and that she will never, ever look at another boy for the rest of her life. I told them that many girls "say yes" thinking that they're going to marry that fellow anyway. My oldest is in college now, and she's told me that it played out just that way for most of her friends. She thinks I'm brilliant for having told her ahead of time it'd work that way.

I told my girls that they shouldn't have sex while they're still in high school -- under any circumstances. I pointed out to them that high school is a very small world, and if they broke up with the guy after sleeping with him, they'd essentially be "trapped" with him. They'd still see him in math class, in the hallways, etc. My oldest is quicker to talk to me about such things, and she agreed that she never wanted to be in that situation.

I disagree about 11yos having any sense of what it means to abstain from sex well into adulthood. Most don't really have a clear sense of much of anything regarding sex.

Older middle schoolers, yes, but 11 year olds are 5th or 6th graders. The opposite sex is still "yucky" to a lot of kids at that age. An 8th grader might very well understand enough to make a meaningful promise to wait until whatever milestone she feels signifies readiness, but there's a lot of difference between 11 and 13/14 in terms of both physical and emotional development.

My experience hasn't been that girls who promise to wait delay sexual activity. Anecdotal, I know, but I grew up in a fairly religious group of peers and was one of the few who didn't feel strongly about abstinence. Yet I was about middle of the pack as far as sexual activity and am one of few who didn't come to regret my first.

I also disagree that no bad can come of waiting. I encourage my children to wait until they are adults in a relationship with someone they love, but I don't think waiting until marriage (which is usually the meaning attached to purity rings) is a positive message in a society where people marry as late as they do in our culture. I think children who grow up with the expectation of abstinence until marriage and who internalize that expectation tend to marry younger, often at the expense of education, career, and other life goals. And I also think hearing "You shouldn't have sex until you finish high school, finish college (and grad school, if applicable), start a career, move out, and attain enough financial stability to marry" tends to push some teens away from the idea of waiting, because they see that as waiting "forever".

I agree children and teens need to be taught about the disadvantages of engaging in activities before they're ready. I agree that conversations about the social consequences of sexual (and emotional) relationships at a young age are important. But I don't think the underlying message needs to be centered around abstaining until marriage.

 

[disneychrista]

I don't think it's something that's to be shared with other people. I mean, if a girlfriend says, "Cool ring", I would expect a girl to just say, "Thanks, it's new" rather than to expand upon its significance. The ring represents a personal decision.

Most "purity" rings say spell out what it is for. They say "Love Waits" or "Purity" on them. Won't take much for someone to know what it means.

 

[Colleen27]

How does someone else know that the ring on your finger is a "purity ring" and not just a pretty ring?

I've yet to meet the girl who isn't super eager to tell people all about her purity ring (around here purity rings are a girl thing, usually a gift from daddy that signifies the intent of remaining pure for a future husband; I don't personally know any boys who wear them. And that's probably part of the reason they rub me the wrong way, between the message of belonging to one man until given away to another and the focus on girls' purity with far less said about boys' sexuality). I've had several of DS14's female friends show theirs off to me without me even asking or commenting on their jewelry. That's part of the point, I think; it is evangelism for tweens/teens.

 

[LuvinLucifer]

I've yet to meet the girl who isn't super eager to tell people all about her purity ring (around here purity rings are a girl thing, usually a gift from daddy that signifies the intent of remaining pure for a future husband; I don't personally know any boys who wear them.

The Jonas Brothers were one of the first celebs to sport them. I think Tim Tebow did as well.

 

[MrsPete]

I also disagree that no bad can come of waiting. I encourage my children to wait until they are adults in a relationship with someone they love, but I don't think waiting until marriage (which is usually the meaning attached to purity rings) is a positive message in a society where people marry as late as they do in our culture.

See, I'd take the other side of that argument: I think society's acceptance of premarital sex (and living together, which is an extension of this discussion) is one of the things that's led to later marriages. Not that I'd advocate girls graduating from high school in the morning and getting married in the afternoon (one of my fellow high school grads actually did that). No, this isn't the only thing driving later-life marriages, but it is one aspect.

Most "purity" rings say spell out what it is for. They say "Love Waits" or "Purity" on them. Won't take much for someone to know what it means.

Those rings do exist, but most girls choose a fashionable ring that appeals to them -- might be a simple band, might be a birthstone ring. The symbolism is internal and only means something to the girl.

Every so often one of my high school girls'll show me a new ring, and I'll say something nice about it. Only after I've praised what I think is a simple piece of jewelry will she say, "This is my purity ring." I've literally never seen a girl actually wearing one of the "official" rings.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

How does someone else know that the ring on your finger is a "purity ring" and not just a pretty ring?

They are typically worn on the "wedding ring" finger (to be replaced with the wedding ring eventually), and they often have "committment" sayings on them. They can also be bracelets or necklaces.

 

[A_Princess'_Daddy]

Someone upthread mentioned fathers giving these rings to their daughters. I came across this:

As a father whose life revolves around my precious daughter (as well as my beautiful wife and wonderful son), that made me want to throw up! Yuck!!!

The thread does make me think of a funny story, however, from when my DD was a newborn. I was out to lunch with a good friend who is as conservative as I am liberal, and we were walking through the mall when we passed a lingerie shop that had, shall we say, very revealing outfits on the mannequins in the windows. Without missing a beat, my friend turned to me and said "you know, in 13 years you are going to wish the Christian Right ruled this nation".

 

[LuvinLucifer]

I'm going to ask my mom to buy me this purity ring

 

[marcyinPA]

:t


I disagree about 11yos having any sense of what it means to abstain from sex well into adulthood. Most don't really have a clear sense of much of anything regarding sex.

Older middle schoolers, yes, but 11 year olds are 5th or 6th graders. The opposite sex is still "yucky" to a lot of kids at that age. An 8th grader might very well understand enough to make a meaningful promise to wait until whatever milestone she feels signifies readiness, but there's a lot of difference between 11 and 13/14 in terms of both physical and emotional development.

This may be true for the area in which you live, but it is not true for where I am. I'm not saying that all 11 year olds are having sex, but I know for a fact that middle schoolers are experimenting with sexual activity- not just intercourse, but other sex acts that are emotionally involving. Having the mentality that 11/12/13 year olds don't know anything about sexual activity is just dangerous in my opinion. They have so much more access to it than we ever had growing up- social media, movies, books, music, etc. Believe me, they may not understand the full emotional implications of having a sexual relationship, but they know what sex is and the mechanics of it.

Because of that, it is not a bad thing when they make a choice not to participate in that type of relationship, at least while they are young. Purity Ring or not (I can't say that I am very knowledgeable in these rings)- just the fact that they make a commitment to wait- is not bad. If my 11 year old came to me and said "I don't want to have sex until I am married"- I would be thrilled to open up that dialogue with them and encourage them to hold true to their beliefs, knowing that it may change as they get older, and then re-visiting the conversation. That doesn't mean that you don't educate them to be safe. You teach them everything they need to know while allowing them to make the choice to abstain if that is what they wish for.

 

[Colleen27]

See, I'd take the other side of that argument: I think society's acceptance of premarital sex (and living together, which is an extension of this discussion) is one of the things that's led to later marriages. Not that I'd advocate girls graduating from high school in the morning and getting married in the afternoon (one of my fellow high school grads actually did that). No, this isn't the only thing driving later-life marriages, but it is one aspect.

I've never really thought of it from that angle, but it makes sense - no pressure to get married for "permission" to have sex and far less pressure to get married because of an unplanned pregnancy would have that effect. I think economics are the biggest factor, though; a 4 year college degree is the baseline for a middle class living the way high school was just a couple generations ago, and that effectively extends "childhood" by the time it takes to earn that degree.

 

[luvmy3]

Which is easier, especially for a teen, who -- by her very nature and stage in life -- is inclined to be scatter-brained?

1. Seriously think through what "waiting" means and make a promise to yourself at a young age.

2. Seriously think through what "waiting" means and make a promise to yourself at a young age AND have a physical reminder of it every time you look at your own hand. It's a small, "Oh yeah, I've promised myself to make good decisions" item.

Even a teen who is very serious about her choice can benefit from reinforcement.

If a teen needs that ring as reinforcement, then she isn't very serious about her choice.

I'm going to ask my mom to buy me this purity ring

I'm going to ask my dad and if he says no, I'm going to ask my dh

 

[Colleen27]

This may be true for the area in which you live, but it is not true for where I am. I'm not saying that all 11 year olds are having sex, but I know for a fact that middle schoolers are experimenting with sexual activity- not just intercourse, but other sex acts that are emotionally involving. Having the mentality that 11/12/13 year olds don't know anything about sexual activity is just dangerous in my opinion. They have so much more access to it than we ever had growing up- social media, movies, books, music, etc. Believe me, they may not understand the full emotional implications of having a sexual relationship, but they know what sex is and the mechanics of it.

That really hasn't been my experience. My son is 14/8th grade and he has some friends who are starting to experiment with "heavy petting" and have "serious" girlfriends. But at 11? He was in 5th grade and he and his friends were all very grossed out by the sex-ed class where they learned exactly what intercourse involves. It was all they could talk about for 2-3 days! My DD is that age now (11/6th grade) and finds the whole thing entirely disgusting; she just can't wrap her mind around the idea that boys use the same part to pee and for sex. We're the "hang out" house in our neighborhood and I hear it all; some because the kids talk to me, the rest because they just don't seem to have any filter or any idea how their voices carry from room to room. But from listening to them for so long I worry a lot more about drinking and pot (both unfortunately common by 8th grade) than about sex (which they are still merely speculating about).

There's a big jump in maturity from 5th to 6th and another between 7th and 8th in my experience; in 5th grade the kids are 10 & 11 and have little interest in the opposite sex, in 6th they start having "boy/girlfriends" that they don't even see outside of school. The real "couple" stuff like having parents drive them to a movie or meeting at DQ for ice cream starts in 8th grade.

ETA: It probably does have a lot to do with where we live. I joke around about it being Mayberry - small town, not without its problems but very old fashioned in a lot of ways and without as much pressure to pretend to be "grown up" as my peers and I were under when we were that age.

 

[Buckalew11]

Someone upthread mentioned fathers giving these rings to their daughters. I came across this:

That is the type thing that creeps me out!

I will have to disagree with this, MrsPete. By nature of it being a ring visible to the outside world, it becomes a public thing. Many people know what they are, and if they don't, they're learning. Why not just keep it private, and know it's within your heart if that's what you want to achieve?

Well, maybe if the kids look at it this way and the guy sees the ring on her finger and thinks she won't put out and if this is what he's after, he might move on to someone else and not waste time. It might save him a lot of time and money.

I've yet to meet the girl who isn't super eager to tell people all about her purity ring (around here purity rings are a girl thing, usually a gift from daddy that signifies the intent of remaining pure for a future husband; I don't personally know any boys who wear them. And that's probably part of the reason they rub me the wrong way, between the message of belonging to one man until given away to another and the focus on girls' purity with far less said about boys' sexuality). I've had several of DS14's female friends show theirs off to me without me even asking or commenting on their jewelry. That's part of the point, I think; it is evangelism for tweens/teens.

That's so interesting. I live in the Bible Belt and I have never had this experience. I have seen one ring on a girl that I really believe was a purity ring but she never told me that it was and she was at my house a lot and we talked a lot so I'd say that if it was indeed a purity ring (it was just a plain silver band), she never mentioned it.
Of course, there are a lot of teen pregnancies around here lately. My niece said there are at least 14 HS JRs in her school that are pregnant. My SS teacher's dd made a pact with a large of her friends their SR of HS to get pregnant (yeah, there's some bad peer pressure influence). She's now married to the guy, 20yo, pregnant with #2 and he has another baby same age as their #1 that he pays CS for. Ugh.

 

[LuvinLucifer]

I'm going to ask my dad and if he says no, I'm going to ask my dh

Or you could ask him for a "fidelity car".

 

[nathalee81]

Okay I see what you are saying. I want my daughter to use her own values and beliefs to make her decisions, as well. However, I do think that her friends will help her choose her values and beliefs, much like her family, church youth group, and other people that she spends significant time with will. So, when I sad that I don't really see anything wrong with peer pressure when it promotes responsible behavior, I meant that I would be happy that her friends were promoting this as it would make it more likely for her to go along with it at first. Then, she will likely start to think about why she is doing what she is doing and explore it further. I simply mean that I would prefer her to be pressured to do something good at first and then evaluate it rather than do something bad and then evaluate it. When I was a teen, I know that I often acted before thinking about why I was doing something. I chose my actions based on how others around me were behaving (for example, clothes I wore, how I wore my hair, what I ate for lunch) and then started to come into my own. If my daughter is to be this way (as I assume most teens are), I would like for her to have friends who make good, responsible decisions.

And, I guess, where the problem lies is if they are susceptible to peer pressure -how can you ensure it is the "right" kind?

I mean if they don't learn to think for themselves, value their own opinions and ideals-they could just as likely bend to "negative" peer pressure as "positive" peer pressure.

You can hope that your daughter will have friends that make good, responsible decisions, but there isn't a guarantee that will happen.

All this being said, though, being a parent is a hard job. Raising daughters-I think it brings a whole other set of challenges.

I think you are trying to do what you think is best and I can understand and respect that-I hope it works, I sincerely do. It probably won't work for me and my husband, though.

 

[luvmy3]

Or you could ask him for a "fidelity car".

I think you're on to something

 

[FlightlessDuck]

And, I guess, where the problem lies is if they are susceptible to peer pressure -how can you ensure it is the "right" kind?

I think in a lot of cases it's rather obvious.

Peers pressuring you to smoke (because it's "cool"): Bad.
Peers pressuring you NOT to smoke (because it will kill you and is illegal until 18): Good.

Drink vs. not drink.
Bully vs, not bully.
Slack off vs. get good grades...

Although I don't see deciding to make good choices based on your peers are necessarily "pressure". If the child was going to do something dumb and got talked out of it by a friend, is that a bad thing? It would be better for that child to go ahead and do it and learn the hard way (or worse)?