DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[Evita_W]

I’m not arguing against DAS because I think everyone should get to enjoy Disney, but my one point of contention is that DAS is superior “when abused”. While I’m eating lunch for an hour, they are waiting in the 60 minute queue and eating lunch at the same time. Same for dinner. Bathroom breaks. Shopping. If all both parties did was ride, you’d be correct.

Except under the new rules, you COULD be eating lunch while standing in line as long as you are finished before boarding, I mean taking food into line with you is one of the suggestions on the website as an alternative to needing a DAS, but you don't need anything special to do it.

 

[OurBigTrip]

I was responding to a poster who said that DAS users should be limited to the same amount of rides as standby users. They are.

Nope, because DAS users can ride other rides while waiting for their return time.

Disney allows, and even encourages this, so there is no reason DAS users shouldn’t do it, but it is what it is.

 

[PrincessV]

Reasonable accommodation isn't limited by how often one goes someplace. A wheelchair user needs a ramp not just for a one time visit, but every time. A person's developmentally-related needs don't change because one is on vacation vs using an AP.

Thank you for saying this so eloquently and politely. As a local AP, I’ve been quietly stewing over here, sick of local APs being blamed for everything wrong at Disney yet again.

 

[CT Disney]

I’ve seen an awful lot of posts accusing Disney of greed; some even go so far as to accuse Disney of extortion.

I said this upthread but I think it bears repeating. If approximately 8% of guests get a DAS pass and they, on average, have 2 or 3 people with them, that means 16-24% of non-disabled folks are going through the LL for free…while the rest of the non-disabled population has to pay for that privilege.

Disney is in business to make money, increase earnings, and please shareholders. And 16-24% is too big of a number. It had to be reduced from both an operational and an earnings standpoint.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I think it’s good practice to explore how an applicant navigates everyday life and suggest other ways of building resilience to park-like scenarios to make sure DAS is only granted where it is absolutely necessary.

And when an applicant tells them that they've exhausted the suggestions for managing their condition, that should matter in determining whether they get a DAS.

if I'm on a call for Disney and they ask me a question and I say we've done that for DD, it doesn't work or isn't enough and this is why, and they still deny and say well that accommodation you've already said doesn't work is what you need to do (and I've seen that basic report shared a few times in a few places), then that's a problem.

 

[DarthChurro]

With the "100" day approval, do you still have to do the video chat 30 days prior to your stay or can you do it farther out since the booking falls in the 100 day window if approved?

 

[mcall12]

You're conflating "can" - as in the system technically allows this to happen, vs. "can" the limitations of the person with the disability using the system. The majority of DAS users actually cannot do this - physically or mentally. Continuing to categorize DAS as a "ride skip system giving people using it a superior experience in the park" is ableist and damaging. DAS is designed for and used by people with disabilities who literally can't do 3 queue lines back-to-back as you are describing. What you are describing is how someone without a DAS qualifying disability is imagining they would/could use it (and therefore projectioning on what they THINK people on DAS are experiencing in comparison to themselves). Please stop pushing this narrative because it is damaging to those who really do need DAS.

I think the thing is, when you say the “majority of DAS users”, what you mean is the majority of those intended users that were envisioned for this program. I think social media and influencers sharing tips and strategies to help people who have no real “need” for DAS figure out how to get it skews the sample you’re talking about. I also personally know plenty of families using DAS for completely appropriate needs who are able to wait in standby lines depending on the line itself whilst needing to use DAS for others, and therefore can be in two lines at once using the system as it is designed.

I have a disability, it will be lifelong and my symptoms will progress over time. Right now I do not and have never requested a DAS. I can manage my needs just fine with Genie +, even though it does add to the cost of an already expensive trip. I have a family member who has used the DAS. It was completely appropriate for him as the accommodation at the time. Whether that changes as he progresses through development is kind of the point. What he needs now may not be what he needs 5 years from now as he gets older and may be able to manage certain things differently.

There is no one singular brush with which to paint a DAS user. So individual evaluation of need is appropriate, at least in my opinion. But Disney absolutely must make it less attractive to those who do publicize strategies to get it just to avoid paying for Genie +. That is without question happening on social media. And that’s negatively impacting everyone.

 

[Liquidice]

With the "100" day approval, do you still have to do the video chat 30 days prior to your stay or can you do it farther out since the booking falls in the 100 day window if approved?

You can apply up to 30 days in advance of your park stay. Only Annual Passholders get the 120 day DAS approval, everyone else it is for the length of your ticket.

Assuming you're an AP and you wanted to try to get approved for 120 days early, I suppose you could make a park pass reservation and apply. I don't really recommend this as it seems like things are evolving every day and its probably better to wait until 30 days or less before you actually plan to be in the parks.

 

[DarthChurro]

You can apply up to 30 days in advance of your park stay. Only Annual Passholders get the 120 day DAS approval, everyone else it is for the length of your ticket.

Assuming you're an AP and you wanted to try to get approved for 120 days early, I suppose you could make a park pass reservation and apply. I don't really recommend this as it seems like things are evolving every day and its probably better to wait until 30 days or less before you actually plan to be in the parks.

Thanks , yea that was the confusing part of it and have been trying to read up as much as i can with the new changes. Appreciate the quick response!

 

[BingoJoe]

And when an applicant tells them that they've exhausted the suggestions for managing their condition, that should matter in determining whether they get a DAS.

if I'm on a call for Disney and they ask me a question and I say we've done that for DD, it doesn't work or isn't enough and this is why, and they still deny and say well that accommodation you've already said doesn't work is what you need to do (and I've seen that basic report shared a few times in a few places), then that's a problem.

I suppose the issue is the basic accommodation isn’t as good as DAS used to be. But that’s a difficult one because DAS is really a gold plated upgrade.

I suppose inevitably people are going to have to be dissapointed and Disney are stupid for getting themselves into this mess in the first place.

 

[nalababybear]

I’ve seen an awful lot of posts accusing Disney of greed; some even go so far as to accuse Disney of extortion.

I said this upthread but I think it bears repeating. If approximately 8% of guests get a DAS pass and they, on average, have 2 or 3 people with them, that means 16-24% of non-disabled folks are going through the LL for free…while the rest of the non-disabled population has to pay for that privilege.

Disney is in business to make money, increase earnings, and please shareholders. And 16-24% is too big of a number. It had to be reduced from both an operational and an earnings standpoint.

No evidence of 8% of guests and certainly 24% using LL .

Son has been a parkgoer since age 2 with GAC/DAS - it is only an occasional time when we have a DAS within 2-3 parties of us.

At 24%, we should be seeing this literally every single ride tap in. Not even close.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The majority of DAS users actually cannot do this - physically or mentally.

That isn't a statement we can make nor infer. It would be damaging (to use your words) in itself to assume that of a guest and could be quite insulting to any given individual to presume their physical and mental capacities based on their approval of a program at a point in time from a theme park and their ability to tour that theme park. Obviously people can speak to their own experiences or that of those they personally know as they are discussing their own experiences/personal knowledge.

 

[nalababybear]

And when an applicant tells them that they've exhausted the suggestions for managing their condition, that should matter in determining whether they get a DAS.

if I'm on a call for Disney and they ask me a question and I say we've done that for DD, it doesn't work or isn't enough and this is why, and they still deny and say well that accommodation you've already said doesn't work is what you need to do (and I've seen that basic report shared a few times in a few places), then that's a problem.

And hopefully the system process improvement cycles will kick in and Disney adjusts to it.

PDSA - Plan Do Study Act -- rinse repeat. The hard part for corporations is they forget to keep the cycles going.

 

[gottalovepluto]

It's also creeping dangerously close to practicing medicine without a license. Disney needs to be really careful about having CMs tell people how to handle their medical conditions. They may be "trained," but they're not doctors. And doctors will be the first to tell you that if they're not YOUR doctor, they can't give medical advice.

I don’t think this will bite them in the butt until they start it in CA. We’re rather litigious.

Also they need to be real careful not to run afoul of California’s unlicensed practice code, it’s rather broad. Just diagnosing someone is a violation, even if you don’t hold yourself out to be a medical professional- so the earlier second hand report of a CM telling the person their autism wasn’t severe would be at risk of being reported.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I suppose the issue is the basic accommodation isn’t as good as DAS used to be. But that’s a difficult one because DAS is really a gold plated upgrade.

I suppose inevitably people are going to have to be dissapointed and Disney are stupid for getting themselves into this mess in the first place.

no, the issue in the post of mine that you quoted isn't about not being as good as DAS - the situation I was sharing was when a caller tells Disney that they've *done* that accommodation already and found it *doesn't work* for the disabled person.

There is a HUGE difference between having done something and know it doesn't work and feeling something "isn't as good as DAS."

People with disabilities and/or their caregivers spend every day accommodating their disability. They are the expert on what works for them and what doesn't, full stop.

 

[GoingSince1990]

Am I the only one that has been wondering why if the LL lines are too long because of "DAS abuse" or an increase in DAS users, then how in the hell is denying those people and intentionally telling them to buy Genie+ going to decrease the LL line length?

For Genie+, Disney’s software limits the number of people in each LL time slot to avoid the LL becoming overwhelmed. But there is no such limitation for DAS users; if the standby line for a ride is an hour, and a huge number of DAS users select that ride at the same time and show up an hour later, that would result in many more people in the LL than the Genie+ software would ever allow, causing those huge LL queues where you have to walk back a long way to find the CM holding up the “Lightning Lane starts here” sign. And that in turn slows the standby line to an absolute snail’s pace as the CMs urgently try to clear the LL by slashing the ratio of standby guests allowed through.

 

[Philsfan77]

I suppose the issue is the basic accommodation isn’t as good as DAS used to be. But that’s a difficult one because DAS is really a gold plated upgrade.

I suppose inevitably people are going to have to be dissapointed and Disney are stupid for getting themselves into this mess in the first place.

This is ultimately the crux of the issue for most people reading through this thread. Nobody likes change...and nobody likes change when its to something less than they are used to.

For guests that have experienced Disney before and are previous DAS holders, these accommodations/suggestions/gaslighting are going to be difficult to accept because they know a better version of DAS exists/existed and they've experienced it.

For new guests, and first timers, they are going to be far more likely to roll with this return to queue option version of DAS, or other accommodations/suggestions because ultimately this is the system, and they don't/haven't experienced something better.

 

[Debbie Jean]

I qualified under the old rules for my trip in early June but have no idea what my September trip will look like. Trying to figure options since I do travel alone with a scooter.

I’m a Winnie the Pooh type ride girl. Don’t access anything more challenging…. no coasters, thrilling rides or ILL for me. But I confess, I’ve ridden it multiple times in a single day. For shame! When I’ve made my pre selections I’ve always gotten a chuckle out of the CM because I’m looking for attractions like Living with the land.

Genie+ has never been about the money… it’s utility and value… I’ve had both DVC and AP for several decades so Disney’s gotten plenty of cash from me. Don’t like the feeling of wasting money though and Genie+ for me has always seemed like going into the bathroom with my wallet and flushing random bills down the toilet.

But if I feel I must buy Genie+ at this point, I would definitely be maximizing my investment and book every single ride offered… Slinky? SF? TOT? Other feature attractions? Never ride them… but you can bet I’d be booking them. Since I won’t actually ride it I can book it again. And again. Since I ride so few attractions, I can at least maximize my ability to book everything available regardless of my ability to ride.

Haven’t tried for any VQ since Rise opened years ago. Never had a need since I’m not able to ride any currently offered. Since I’m throwing extra money at Disney, though, you can bet I’ll be aiming for those slots, too. Won’t ride, of course, but happy to know I have a slot since I paid for it.

If Disney wants to monetize me as a DAS, I will feel entitled to maximize that investment… just like all those healthy able bodied folks in the parks… whether I leave at noon having done 2 attractions or not. I can continue to book time slots.

 

[starlite_]

You're conflating "can" - as in the system technically allows this to happen, vs. "can" the limitations of the person with the disability using the system. The majority of DAS users actually cannot do this - physically or mentally. Continuing to categorize DAS as a "ride skip system giving people using it a superior experience in the park" is ableist and damaging. DAS is designed for and used by people with disabilities who literally can't do 3 queue lines back-to-back as you are describing. What you are describing is how someone without a DAS qualifying disability is imagining they would/could use it (and therefore projectioning on what they THINK people on DAS are experiencing in comparison to themselves). Please stop pushing this narrative because it is damaging to those who really do need DAS.

You sure put a lot of words in my mouth and mischaracterized me for doing simple math.

You hit the problem by yourself thought, a lot of people who DAS isn't designed for are using it. Thus getting a better experience. This is a fact, and not me making it up to be mean to disabled folks like you imply. OBVIOUSLY these people aren't who really do need DAS. Disney is attempting to remove the DAS accommodation from these specific people, who don't need DAS to make the parks possible. Because as you said yourself, DAS should only be used by those who literally can't do 3 queue lines back-to-back.

So, thanks for helping my argument, even if you called me ableist as well.

 

[Keladry84]

I think the thing is, when you say the “majority of DAS users”, what you mean is the majority of those intended users that were envisioned for this program. I think social media and influencers sharing tips and strategies to help people who have no real “need” for DAS figure out how to get it skews the sample you’re talking about. I also personally know plenty of families using DAS for completely appropriate needs who are able to wait in standby lines depending on the line itself whilst needing to use DAS for others, and therefore can be in two lines at once using the system as it is designed.

I have a disability, it will be lifelong and my symptoms will progress over time. Right now I do not and have never requested a DAS. I can manage my needs just fine with Genie +, even though it does add to the cost of an already expensive trip. I have a family member who has used the DAS. It was completely appropriate for him as the accommodation at the time. Whether that changes as he progresses through development is kind of the point. What he needs now may not be what he needs 5 years from now as he gets older and may be able to manage certain things differently.

There is no one singular brush with which to paint a DAS user. So individual evaluation of need is appropriate, at least in my opinion. But Disney absolutely must make it less attractive to those who do publicize strategies to get it just to avoid paying for Genie +. That is without question happening on social media. And that’s negatively impacting everyone.

I don't disagree with you, except on the point that the program needs changed just because there is a subset of people who don't need DAS abusing it (I actually have no opinion on what specifically DAS should look like because that is Disney's prerogative, not mine)

What you are sharing and typing is nuanced - my reply was to a person who was continually pushing a damaging narrative repeatedly on the assumption of what users actual experience - a narrative that when that's all that is heard or pushed both encourages people to abuse DAS, and encourages people to view those who need DAS negatively.