Confused!

[Joe T.]

What am I missing? Are just the points for non-DVC Disney Resorts increasing? It seems to me that old timers have always said that using DVC points for non-DVC resorts is the most inefficient use of points. It has never been a good deal. Are most of the concerned owners from VB or HH, and are only familar with the Deluxe non-DVC resorts? I loved the Poly, but from a quality or space perspective, OKW will compare very favorably.

I was never led to believe that using points for non-DVC Resorts was a good deal. I remember our rep, in 1994, telling us that it was available. But, not an efficient use of points. I guess we never considered it a guaranteed perk.

Is there going to be a "major" restructuring of points for the WDW DVC Resorts? How major can it be. The total annual points for each type unit must stay constant. Raise the OKW studio summer points from 11 to 15 - lower the fall points from 8 to 4? Hardly!

As for a "possible" annual fees increase of 15%. I have enough trust to be comfortable that they would not do that without a compelling business reason, and their history has confirmed that. Compelling reason? How about a major hurricane destroying the resort? Would we be willing to take a hit to get the resort back as soon as possible. I'm sure they have insurance, but I would still expect a hit. Then, it would be my decision to drop my ownership.

I go along with the suggestion that we all relax and wait for the facts.

 

[prplcrzy]

Joe, you've hit the nail right on the head! I asked the question what if the dues go up dramatically when I bought and was told that the board that runs the DVC is like a condo board and can be voted out by the members at any time. I hope this is true because if people are that unhappy they should utilize this. I don't think it is such a big deal and have yet to have someone prove me wrong

 

[dianeschlicht]

Bravo! At last a calm voice of reason!

 

[drusba]

The board is not really like a condo board that can be voted out. To actually make a board change would require a 60% vote of all owners, not something that could likely happen or could even be organized (except at significant organizational costs). Also, if we voted out the DVD appointed board, we could face issues of being eliminated from the DVC system.

Nevertheless, those registering concern about dues because of the Collection point increase should not be concerned. The board members are by law fiduciaries required to act in the best interests of the owners. Also, dues are not something DVD can play with by building in profits.Except for a management fee, dues are required to be based on actual projected costs of operating the resort, and for taxes, insurance, reserves for long term repairs, etc. They cannot base them on costs plus some profit built in. The biggest chunck of your dues are actually for labor costs (for running and maintaining the resort and for MS). You are more likely to see increases due to increases in labor costs than otherwise.

The only profit item of dues is the management fee I mentioned. DVD (or its sister company Disney Vacation Club Management Co.) gets a percentage of dues (not counting property taxes or long term reserves) as a management fee. But the percentage (about 11%) cannot change.

In other words, though the maximum amount that dues can go up a year is 15%, that cannot really happen unless operational costs actually increase 15%.

 

[prplcrzy]

drusba,

I read all of the stuff and never knew that. Is it in the materials? My guide couldn't even tell me that when I asked the question. If that is true I am even happier to know that I am not at someone's whim, and also quite impressed that you knew this. Thanks for sharing that information, I for one appreciate being better informed about the investment I made in my future vacations.

You should post that tidbit, I think it would calm down the masses (somewhat) and keep them from lynching the mouse. I thought I was going to be one of the only members left after reading the posts about the DC.

 

[Lesley]

I found the first reports of the change in the Disney Collection points alarming...mainly because we could have easily found ourselves in the same position as many of the posters who brought it up....we had considered reserving AKL or the Poly for a couple of extra days before our BWV trip. As it was it was not a great deal...same number of points for a room as for a 1br at VWL, but we thought why not for just 2 nights, so we could try out AKL or stay at what has so far been our favorite Disney hotel.

But now that I see some other examples I'm holding my judgement...the concierge option is a nice idea and I've always wanted to try it out. Perhaps we will now try it someday as a splurge. As concierge rooms are generally not discounted (though I've heard a report here or there or someone getting a discount) I think its good to be able to try it without shelling out $400 or more per night in cash. Of course, I have no idea if I'll ever have enough points to do so...I'm dying to see the chart.

Having considered staying at AKL, I must say I'm happy to hear you can now get a guaranteed savannah view, even if it is more points. That's the whole reason we decided against trying AKL on points...no guarantee.

In a way, we may actually have more options...though its yet to be seen whether those options are too expensive to use and still be somewhat sensible.

 

[drusba]

As to the question above as to where the information comes from for how annual dues are determined, it is a combination of: (a) Florida Condominium/Timeshare law (which designates any board and any management company as fiduciaries required to act in best interests of owners, sets out that the costs and estimated future costs --without profit to any managing entity-- for operation, maintenance, taxes, reserves etc. for a resort can be charged to owners and that there is required to be a managing entity to run the resort for which a percentage of dues can be charged to owners); (b) various provisions of the disclosure documents which discuss the powers of the association board and any managing entity designated by the association among which are the power to set dues based on costs of various items (but not the power to build in profits for the managing entity other than the management fee); and (c) certain filings of DVD on file with the Florida Bureau responsible for Timeshares that purchasers actually are not given but can be viewed at the bureau or copies ordered (and it ain't cheap to get copies). Because of my profession (click on profile), there are a lot of things I did before purchasing to check out every minute detail about DVC that many others probably did not do.

 

[normr]

Right now the only thing we know is that there looks like they may some increase in the Disney Collection stays and some may even be lower, it was reported by a member who made a reservation that it was going to be something like 60% higher than previous years, but some of us have asked MS to clarify the situation and they stated some may have gone up and some down, we will know next week when the charts are posted on the DVC member site.

The DVC resorts point charts for 2002 have been out for awhile and are not a problem.