Certainty of death. Small chance of success. What are we waiting for? (comments welcome)

[WillRunForPizza]

I will not admit what counts as "cold" to me.

If it's raining, it's possible I think anything below 60 is cold

 

[superchime]

Weekly summary
Nov 11 - 17
No T+D modifications this week because it is freezing!

Mon - off

Tues - 3.5 easy
3.5 in 1:04 avg pace 18:26
Legs made of lead. Trudge, trudge, trudge.

Wed - off

Thurs - 7 tempo (with nutrition strategy practice)
(accidentally put this on my calendar as 7 easy so that was a fun little surprise)
7.02 in 1:43:51 avg pace 14:46

This was the day I had my little meltdown about not wanting to run because it was cold and rainy. I managed to catch a break in the rain and honestly the run was fine. I didn't love the Untapped Waffles, though. They're dry and a lot to chew, plus my worries about potassium (see notes below). I would definitely eat one in the morning before a race, though.

Fri - 2.5 easy
2.5 in 41:55, avg pace 16:44

Sat - 3.5 easy
3.5 in 58:37, avg pace 16:45

Sun - Progression run
I'm getting better at these and enjoyed this one.

Nutrition strategy test this week:
Untapped Waffles (lemon and maple)
20g carb
60mg sodium
Potassium 72mg
3x per hour = 60 carb, 216 potassium,180 sodium,

(goal 40 - 60 g carbs/hr, 100 potassium, 600 sodium)
Adding 4 saltstik chews per hour adds 4g carbs, 120mg potassium, 200 sodium
3 waffles + 4 saltstik/hour = 64 g carbs, 336 potassium (is that too much?), 380 sodium

That’s a lot of potassium, what about 2x waffles + 4 saltstik
44 carb, 320 sodium, 264 potassium

Total miles for the week:
Running: 21
Walking: 8.68

Character stop from Sunday's run.

 

[superchime]

I wanted to get last week's summary out of the way before writing about my PT evaluation today.

Not sure how much I've written about my knee issue, so just a quick summary. My knees have always been touchy and I've done PT for them in the past. We've managed to come to an agreement: I don't do too many squats or other moves where my bent knees bear weight and they let me live my life fairly pain free. That is still the case, but over the past few months I've noticed a weird tension on the inside of my left knee when I'm running. It doesn't hurt but it's a pretty constant tightness while I'm running. I have a great sports medicine doctor who usually has appointments available pretty quickly, so I got in to see her and she sent me on to PT.

PT did her eval today and decided it's most likely my infrapatellar bursa. She videoed me running and noticed my left leg has a pretty pronounced heel strike, especially at slower paces. Looking at the bottoms of my shoes it's obvious that the left heel is seeing a lot of wear. So I've got some stretches and exercises to do and she wants me to increase my easy and marathon paces by 30 - 60 seconds/mile to see if that helps me have more of a mid-foot strike.

I love the vibe here, but in the real world I'm always sort of embarrassed to talk to people about my pace because I'm SO slow I don't feel like a real runner, but she was nothing but supportive and positive. She had heard of Dopey and was excited for me to be training for it.

 

[The Expert]

I'm glad you got some quick answers and potential fixes. And it's so nice to hear your PT is supportive and not judgemental. I know exactly how you feel, wanting to get help but afraid of not being taken seriously.

 

[superchime]

Just a lot of rambling, feel free to skip.

I'm starting to work on my marathon game-day plan. We're staying at Old Key West. Do you think my husband and son would be able to get to Animal Kingdom to see me, then get to the finish line? Assume that I'm running a 15 - 16 min/mile and they will have a car.

I think getting from OKW to anywhere else is going to be tricky, but AK seems doable, and that's the point in the race when seeing a friendly face would probably be most welcome (plus I'd really like for them to hand me a coke and maybe some fresh socks because I hear that is just magical at that point in the race).

Also trying to work out my overall marathon fueling plan. I am big on running fuel, so I know this will seem excessive to some people but Des Linden fuels every 20 min and I am not a better runner than Des Linden. Knowing that it will very likely all fall apart, I plan on putting each hour's fuel in a little baggie so I can just grab one and have everything I need (and fumble around trying to find the right baggie for each hour). I am reading things that say start with 30 - 60g carbs/hr for the first 3 hours, then increase to 60 - 90g after that, or just a flat 60g carbs/hr overall.

I do know that I am tired of the Ucan after 3 hours, but they are very easy to consume so I'm not sure if I should start or finish with them. I'm also going to use Maruten (probably 160s) and maybe Huma Chia, maybe some Precision chews too. I'll be out there for 7+ hours so plenty of time for a variety of snacks! I might also throw an uncrustable in there, or some teddy grahams in case I start wanting real food. Maybe I should just make my baggies and then during the race I can grab whatever I'm feeling each hour.

Am I overthinking this? Absolutely! Did I just look at the calendar and realize I only have 6 weeks of training left so I'm panicking a little? You betcha!

 

[The Expert]

Do you think my husband and son would be able to get to Animal Kingdom to see me, then get to the finish line? Assume that I'm running a 15 - 16 min/mile and they will have a car.

Depending on your pace and what time you start, the park should be open when we run through. It may be easiest for them to take park transportation from OKW than drive. The road closures are tricky, and traffic backs up once parks are open and day guests are trying to get around, but if they catch an early bus, they should be able to get there before you do. Once you go through there, they could hop back on park transportation to the Boardwalk area or Epcot to catch you later in the course. At a 15mm pace, they should have time to get there -- finish line for sure.

 

[The Expert]

I am big on running fuel, so I know this will seem excessive to some people but Des Linden fuels every 20 min and I am not a better runner than Des Linden.

I am also a frequent fueler, and have been playing around with this in training to see if I REALLY need that every 20 minutes. But if you need it, you need it. Do what your body is telling you to do.

I might also throw an uncrustable in there

FYI these are often available at shops in the parks. We'll be running through AK, DS and Boardwalk area when they are open and you are likely to need that boost, if you don't want to carry them with you. I may also have DH hand one off to me at Contemporary (mile 11ish) -- would be no issue for him to bring more than one!

 

[superchime]

Depending on your pace and what time you start, the park should be open when we run through.

Haha, yeah, there's no scenario where I make it to Animal Kingdom before it opens. Even if they let me start in A.

It may be easiest for them to take park transportation from OKW than drive.

Good point. I will have to think about using Disney transportation vs driving. I was thinking it would be easier to drive because they could take I-4/Irlo Bronson and avoid the race, but it will still be tricky for them to get back to Epcot, and the Disney busses (theoretically) understand race road closures better than we do, so maybe bussing it is best. And that does give them the option to bus to the Boardwalk, or bus to DHS and skyliner to the International Gateway. Hm...

But if you need it, you need it. Do what your body is telling you to do.

I tend to hate it later in half marathons, but I get hypoglycemic pretty easily so I'm shoveling them in anyway.

FYI these are often available at shops in the parks. We'll be running through AK, DS and Boardwalk area when they are open and you are likely to need that boost, if you don't want to carry them with you. I may also have DH hand one off to me at Contemporary (mile 11ish) -- would be no issue for him to bring more than one!

I really appreciate the offer! I'm planning on wearing my hydration vest without the bladder so I should have plenty of room for all the snacks. How I'll feel about eating an uncrustable that's been in my backpack for 6+ hours is another issue. Boardwalk shops are tempting, though. Lots of options there, maybe a cupcake would be good? Haha, I should probably keep moving at that point.

Thanks for the help! There's so much to think about, I'm getting a little overwhelmed wanting to do everything right.

 

[Herding_Cats]

Fueling that much is definitely something that elites do because they’re are redlining their effort the whole time. And taking something every 20min = about 6-7 things. For a 7hr marathon you’re talking about 21. And that’s a lot of non-real-food things. I know personally, im “over” gels after about 3, so I alternate huma with stroopwaffles so its not all just gels or all things I have to chew.

see what your body will tolerate on your long runs for carbs/hr. Factor in the carbs from the Powerade and bananas if you’ll be eating/drinking those when you’re planning for on-course.

 

[azrivest]

I'm starting to work on my marathon game-day plan. We're staying at Old Key West. Do you think my husband and son would be able to get to Animal Kingdom to see me, then get to the finish line? Assume that I'm running a 15 - 16 min/mile and they will have a car.

This might be anecdotal, but it was my experience from last year. We were staying at Coronado so my family saw me pass at mile 19. They then tried to take the bus at CSR to get to Epcot to see me finish. It took them almost an 1h30 and they ended up calling an Uber because no busses, either for the race area or for the regular Epcot entrance, ever came. At that point in the race, the whole area around Coronado and Hollywood Studios was the worst for traffic. I walked the last 5k of the marathon just to give them enough time to arrive.

So we'll never try that again. I would encourage your husband to take the car and not do the busses, especially from the AK area to the Epcot area.

 

[The Expert]

IIRC last year there was a big accident just outside Epcot that snarled everything up. That said, I'd don't have bus experience myself during the marathon, so not sure what is "normal" traffic at that time. I would think if buses can't get there, cars can't either, but ymmv.

 

[nancipants]

My husband and son are planning to meet me in AK and then go to Epcot for the finish line.

if you don’t feel like buying Uncrustables, I can bring one to you at Hurricane Hanna’s, or I can also have my husband pack one for you. I stock up at BJs and am planning for him to hand me one.

 

[superchime]

I know personally, im “over” gels after about 3, so I alternate huma with stroopwaffles so its not all just gels or all things I have to chew.

This is true. I like huma, so those are definitely on my list. Stroopwaffles and I aren't on speaking terms after what they did to me during my first half marathon. But, yeah, I will investigate more real food options. I know some people run with dates or even sweet potatoes. Not sure if I could manage that but once you move beyond "running fuel" there are tons of possibilities.

Factor in the carbs from the Powerade and bananas if you’ll be eating/drinking those when you’re planning for on-course.

Bananas! I forgot that for the marathon you get more than just a packet with six jellybeans! I'll have to try one on a long run to see what my stomach thinks.

 

[WillRunForPizza]

If you're looking for real food ideas, you might try yogurt-covered pretzels. They had them at an event I went to last night and I ate like 14 of them. They were sooo good, and the salt could help balance all the sweetness of other fuel.

I haven't actually tried them on a run (and probably wouldn't; I have trouble chewing while running), but obviously they are still haunting me. I need more

 

[superchime]

I would encourage your husband to take the car and not do the busses, especially from the AK area to the Epcot area.

This is good to know, thanks. I'm sorry your family got stuck in that!

 

[superchime]

My husband and son are planning to meet me in AK and then go to Epcot for the finish line.

Yay, maybe our husbands can hang out together! Although mine will probably kill me for suggesting that he hang out with a stranger just because I know his wife.

if you don’t feel like buying Uncrustables, I can bring one to you at Hurricane Hanna’s, or I can also have my husband pack one for you. I stock up at BJs and am planning for him to hand me one.

You are so sweet! Thank you! Since we'll be at OKW I'm planning on a grocery trip and I'll probably buy a box since they're one of my safe pre-race foods, but if I don't I will definitely let you know.

 

[superchime]

If you're looking for real food ideas, you might try yogurt-covered pretzels. They had them at an event I went to last night and I ate like 14 of them. They were sooo good, and the salt could help balance all the sweetness of other fuel.

I haven't actually tried them on a run (and probably wouldn't; I have trouble chewing while running), but obviously they are still haunting me. I need more

Those sound fantastic! I wonder if they melt? I might have to find some to try.

 

[GollyGadget]

I love fueling with dates and highly recommend you try them! I'm not a gel person so the chewing doesn't bother me.

I'm also a frequent fueler, every 15 min, but I'm only taking 15-20g carb so it totals 60-80 per hour. I like having the little fueling milestones to look forward to, it helps me break up the distance into manageable chunks.

As for spectators, I recommend having your family drive. Based on the course map, I wouldn't expect any road closures between okw & ak or ak & epcot. Waiting for buses when I'm on a time sensitive schedule stresses me out. I'd prefer to control my own destiny. The car also makes it easier to adjust if needed.

 

[superchime]

I love fueling with dates and highly recommend you try them! I'm not a gel person so the chewing doesn't bother me.

Do you use whole dates or the chopped ones? Do they get sticky? I know the chopped ones are coated with something to keep them from sticking together. Sorry I have so many date questions!

I'm also a frequent fueler, every 15 min, but I'm only taking 15-20g carb so it totals 60-80 per hour. I like having the little fueling milestones to look forward to, it helps me break up the distance into manageable chunks.

That's about what I'm aiming for too, every 20 min, 40 - 60 per hour. It's definitely a good distraction!

 

[GollyGadget]

Do you use whole dates or the chopped ones? Do they get sticky? I know the chopped ones are coated with something to keep them from sticking together. Sorry I have so many date questions!

I eat pitted dates. They're mostly whole but no giant seed. I rip mine in half to expose the sticky inside so that salt will stick to them. Because of this, they do get a little sticky but I don't think they would if I left them alone. The salt is to cut their natural sweetness.