CDC Notifies States, Large Cities To Prepare For Vaccine Distribution As Soon As Late October

[disneypharm]

It would be amazing if we could do that. New Jersey is nearly the same size as Israel population-wise (9 million people).....and we are in no way, shape or form anywhere close to where Israel is with respect to inoculating all New Jerseyans. The fact that Israel has so much supply that they *can* vaccinate 24/7....says it all.

That's what happens when each state doesn't have a unified state agency to control the vaccination. They left it to individual clinic, hospital, pharmacy, etc.. to decide. Now we get the news of administrative staff, IT, other nonclinical staff members getting the vaccines before clinicians working in ERs and ICUs. I also agree that they should have 24/7 vaccination. Clinicians work 24/7. Well, hope things get better in 2021.

 

[dvcgirl67]

That's what happens when each state doesn't have a unified state agency to control the vaccination. They left it to individual clinic, hospital, pharmacy, etc.. to decide. Now we get the news of administrative staff, IT, other nonclinical staff members getting the vaccines before clinicians working in ERs and ICUs. I also agree that they should have 24/7 vaccination. Clinicians work 24/7. Well, hope things get better in 2021.

I do think things will get better, but it's slow going to start. Not factoring in the limited supply, this is really supposed to be the easy part. Get the vaccine that we do have to hospitals and vaccinate the people who work there. They're essentially a captive audience. But it's taking awhile. My sister-in-law is supposed to get her vaccine tomorrow. She manages 2 covid units....and we're in NJ, the most densely populated state in the country. I would have thought she would have been vaccinated in the first day or two.

 

[Starwarsfan2]

I got my vaccine on Monday. I actually had the virus over Thanksgiving, and planned to be at the end of the line for the shot due to at least temporary immunity, but was somewhat dismayed with the number of refusals to get it at my hospital, especially among the black employees. I went ahead and got the immunization to maybe instill confidence in my co-workers that this vaccine is not the bogeyman. I honestly think it should be required if you work on the frontlines, unless you have a good reason not to take it. The flu shot is mandatory for us.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Well, each state in the US is like a small country (based on population). So, shouldn't they be vaccinating at the same level in Israel. Each state was allowed to coordinate vaccinations based on their own guideline.

Edit, I posted this in another thread:
"Based on what is reported in my state, less than 3000 vaccines were administered yesterday. At this rate, it will take until next December to vaccinate half of the population of the state. They really need to figure this out soon! I thought we had several months to prepare for this!"

No just because X country is at Y level doesn't mean all countries should be at the same level merely based on that. That's entirely too simplest of thinking. That would be like telling Canada to get with the program leaving out size, remoteness, transportation and more. For instance in Canada Pfizer requested their doses to be administrated at their facilities which meant long-term and places outside of their larger cities were initially left out (with Moderna added they are back in). Not only that but different countries have different types of populations including age distributions, different hierarchy of who gets vaccinated and this applies to the states who have different types of populations in different categories.

I don't personally get bogged down in saying another country can do it better. It's quite interesting learning how other places are doing it and it's something that is good to discuss (another thread I talk in is really good for that) but no sense in bashing our country or that country constantly wishing we were like so and so. I'm really over that type of talk anyhow.

That's not even getting into the discussion of how many doses the U.S. had to order as a whole then distribute from there in comparison to another country.

 

[disneypharm]

Time to move on

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Why not? With all due respect, I disagree. Each country should be able to manage vaccinations the best way they can for their own people. Especially, US which is supposed to be a role model for the rest of the world, considering the wealth and technology. I am not bashing our country. I want us to do better. If you see one country is doing well and another is not, we should be able to demand better distribution and administration. To your example, Canada is not exactly getting it right either. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/29/canada-ontario-paused-vaccinations-during-holidays

Respectfully that's perfectly fine No worries on that front.

That's my point though with bringing up Canada. Every country has their own situation going on, other than on an information level (which I one who loves to gain knowledge) there's not much use, to me that is, in lamenting with respects to country to country..state to state? Sure you want to complain that your state only did 3,000 doses yesterday? Go for it. You've got your fellow citizens of your state you want to be protected, you want to know was there a flub somewhere, was it just 'first day jitters' that will get smoothed over, will it drastically improve as more vaccines are added, etc. Different than saying "well why aren't we like Israel?" Well that's because we aren't, the same as Canada isn't Israel, the same as the Netherlands isn't Israel, the same that Ireland isn't Israel.

We all have different demographics, different geographical issues (Canada for instance has very very remote NW territories much like how Alaska is quite remote and for Alaska you have a lot of places only accessible by plane) including rural, you have transportation issues (India for example Pfizer IIRC discussed how they would be handling their climate in respects to distribution, it's also why we hope other vaccines that don't have 2 doses and cold-storage can be used globally), different vaccines we purchased and helped develop (Canada for instance had an investment with China that ended up failing) and different population needs. The poster who was from Israel also gave a good pros and cons to their national system they have set up.

FWIW I also get tired of all the "the U.S. is supposed to be a leader and such and such". Too many people use that as a means to criticize the U.S. though I'm not saying you're doing that it just seems to be the go to. I guess I just see the faults already and don't proclaim to the rooftops we're the best of the best of the best and these are all the times the supposedly best country is doing terribly poor and majority of the time I'm quite patriotic I suppose I have a different slant on that at times.

KS and MO (the two states I have to worry about) together have about as much population as Israel. Pfzier's agreement with Israel is for about 8million doses (population of the country about 9million so nearly half of their supply from just 1 purchase). Israel has also ordered through Moderna and AZ whenever that one comes about.
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Long-story short I'm more about gaining knowledge at least that's where I spend my mental energy on, I've only got so much

 

[bcla]

We all have different demographics, different geographical issues (Canada for instance has very very remote NW territories much like how Alaska is quite remote and for Alaska you have a lot of places only accessible by plane) including rural, you have transportation issues (India for example Pfizer IIRC discussed how they would be handling their climate in respects to distribution, it's also why we hope other vaccines that don't have 2 doses and cold-storage can be used globally), different vaccines we purchased and helped develop (Canada for instance had an investment with China that ended up failing) and different population needs. The poster who was from Israel also gave a good pros and cons to their national system they have set up.

I read this story about a doctor in Michigan who is driving hundreds of miles in his personal vehicle to deliver vaccine to a rural hospital. They thought that it would be months before they got it, but this special delivery may have been the only means for them to get it quickly.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/12/28/rural-hospitals-covid-vaccines/

 

[Colleen27]

So, a question for the board: I don't think Disney World will employ a vaccine mandate (although Disneyland very well might), but might they reopen some areas that are still closed- VIP tours, shows, character meals- just for people who can demonstrate vaccination?

I don't think so, because I don't think a child-centric business like Disney will even consider such an idea until there is a vaccine approved for use in children. Since that is thought to be a year or so in the future, odds are that viral spread will have been sufficiently restricted by adult vaccinations by the time a children's vaccine becomes available that the business concerns of not excluding a core demographic group will outweigh any public health concerns.

It would be amazing if we could do that. New Jersey is nearly the same size as Israel population-wise (9 million people).....and we are in no way, shape or form anywhere close to where Israel is with respect to inoculating all New Jerseyans. The fact that Israel has so much supply that they *can* vaccinate 24/7....says it all.

Same. But my state isn't doing so great so far even with the supply we do have - almost 300K doses shipped, not quite 60K people actually vaccinated. Hopefully that ramps up quickly once the holidays are over, because it certainly doesn't give one much confidence in the idea of getting all or most of our 10 million residents vaccinated any time in the foreseeable future.

 

[dvcgirl67]

So, a question for the board: I don't think Disney World will employ a vaccine mandate (although Disneyland very well might), but might they reopen some areas that are still closed- VIP tours, shows, character meals- just for people who can demonstrate vaccination?

Interesting question. I am really fascinated to see what happens with businesses like Disney and the travel industry in general. As we've all said here before, I definitely think that you'll need to be vaccinated to travel internationally. You will likely need it to travel to islands, etc. I'm not sure how Disney is going to handle it. I can just see them running into a wave of covid-deniers, anti-vaxxers....etc. It'll be interesting to see if those people end being a really small minority, or more like 20-30% of the country. One area of their business where I think they may require vaccines in the short term...is cruising. I don't see how that industry returns without vaccines, or way, way better/accurate testing.

I think that Disney is going to have to choose between people like me, who will be vaccinated and those who refuse it. This may really come into play if Covid becomes a yearly vaccine, which seems likely at this point. And while we've had many strains of the virus already, these two latest more contagious variants make me think of scientists having to do their best to essentially guess which strain of Covid will circulate each year, like they do with the flu.

 

[Jonfw2]

I was thinking of a system where you could voluntarily show proof of vaccine. You'd just go to a line at your resort or in advance of your trip and get a plastic bracelet like at a club to show you're over 21. If you do, no masks, you could approach characters, do character dining, go to shows, etc.

 

[Farro]

I was thinking of a system where you could voluntarily show proof of vaccine. You'd just go to a line at your resort or in advance of your trip and get a plastic bracelet like at a club to show you're over 21. If you do, no masks, you could approach characters, do character dining, go to shows, etc.

While I'm all for whipping this stupid mask off, don't we have to keep masks on , etc., because we don't know if we will still be able to give Covid to others even though we are vaccinated?

which is why it's such a bummer so many people are choosing not to be vaccinated. Kind of ruining it for everyone.

 

[Jonfw2]

While I'm all for whipping this stupid mask off, don't we have to keep masks on , etc., because we don't know if we will still be able to give Covid to others even though we are vaccinated?

which is why it's such a bummer so many people are choosing not to be vaccinated. Kind of ruining it for everyone.

Moderna said their vax DOES prevent being a carrier- to what degree, they haven't stated yet. Pfizer hasn't said either way. Regardless, all the evidence I've seen shows that asymptomatic spread is very unlikely.

 

[skeeter31]

I was thinking of a system where you could voluntarily show proof of vaccine. You'd just go to a line at your resort or in advance of your trip and get a plastic bracelet like at a club to show you're over 21. If you do, no masks, you could approach characters, do character dining, go to shows, etc.

Disney will be among the last places in the country to not require masks. And they will never do something like that where some people would have them on and some off as there are too many idiots that would see people with their masks off and then take theirs off. Just wouldn’t work at all.

Plus, as @Farro said, too much unknown about spread from vaccinated people to make this plan yet. By the end of the 21/early 22, sure we may be able to institute things like this. But not now.

 

[snappy]

Moderna said their vax DOES prevent being a carrier- to what degree, they haven't stated yet. Pfizer hasn't said either way. Regardless, all the evidence I've seen shows that asymptomatic spread is very unlikely.

I do hope all the vaccines are proved to prevent being a carrier. It will help everyone, although to lesser extent, those who refuse the vaccine, since they could still spread it between each other.

 

[Cheburashka]

I'm not sure how Disney is going to handle it. I can just see them running into a wave of covid-deniers, anti-vaxxers....etc. It'll be interesting to see if those people end being a really small minority, or more like 20-30% of the country. One area of their business where I think they may require vaccines in the short term...is cruising. I don't see how that industry returns without vaccines, or way, way better/accurate testing.

1. You don't have to be a Covid-denier to have concerns about taking a brand new vaccine that was rushed through development and testing. That's not putting the vaccine down (I'll probably take it as soon as it's offered), it's just stating a fact. There are risks in taking it, just as there are in not taking it.

2. There is an active debate about this issue on the cruise board. For DCL to wait until all passengers could be vaccinated would put cruising on hold for years, because one of their primary clientele, children, aren't even approved for the vaccine yet due to lack of testing.

 

[Jonfw2]

1. You don't have to be a Covid-denier to have concerns about taking a brand new vaccine that was rushed through development and testing. That's not putting the vaccine down (I'll probably take it as soon as it's offered), it's just stating a fact. There are risks in taking it, just as there are in not taking it.

2. There is an active debate about this issue on the cruise board. For DCL to wait until all passengers could be vaccinated would put cruising on hold for years, because one of their primary clientele, children, aren't even approved for the vaccine yet due to lack of testing.

The simple end around to number 2 is to allow children a test within 48 hours- it's an absolute fact at this point that kids don't get nearly as sick and aren't transmitting the virus effectively, anyway.

And for the record, this isn't a hypothetical- it is actually happening. Airlines, cruise lines, live events- some WILL have vaccine requirements. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of how it will be carried out.

 

[skeeter31]

The simple end around to number 2 is to allow children a test within 48 hours- it's an absolute fact at this point that kids don't get nearly as sick and aren't transmitting the virus effectively, anyway.

But Disney isn’t requiring negative tests either. Disney isn’t going to move to these extremes (testing and vaccination requirements). And they’re not going to require it of their staff either. Unfortunately masks are here to stay for a year or more possibly at Disney. They’re not going to rush to change.

 

[dvcgirl67]

1. You don't have to be a Covid-denier to have concerns about taking a brand new vaccine that was rushed through development and testing. That's not putting the vaccine down (I'll probably take it as soon as it's offered), it's just stating a fact. There are risks in taking it, just as there are in not taking it.

2. There is an active debate about this issue on the cruise board. For DCL to wait until all passengers could be vaccinated would put cruising on hold for years, because one of their primary clientele, children, aren't even approved for the vaccine yet due to lack of testing.

1. I get it....vaccine hesitant is probably yet another category to add the covid deniers and anti-vaxxers. I understand why people think that the vaccine was rushed. I was a bit concerned about that several months ago until I really started to educate myself and understand that's not the case at all. Because years of research had already gone into SARS1 so many years ago and because the SARS-Co-V2 spike protein that causes infection are almost identical to its predecessor.....scientists had the answer almost immediately. The only reason we didn't have a SARS1 vaccine was because cases disappeared and therefore funding dried up. But the "platform" for a new mRNA vaccine was there. The other reason it "feels" sped up is because we were able to complete human trials so quickly. Well, we happen to have a raging pandemic....so.....plenty of subjects to vaccinate and send out into the world to see how they do.

2. It'll be interesting to see how Disney handles it. I understand your argument that kids are the primary clientele, but they aren't the ones paying for the cruise. Their parents and grandparents are going to have to feel safe in order for cruising to return to anything like it was before. And while we all know now that kids don't typically get very sick from COVID, and thankfully very, very few die....I still know lots and lots of people who are keeping their kids at home for virtual learning when in-person classes are available. I know that DCL has a very loyal clientele, but if even 10-20% of that clientele feels iffy about cruising with non-vaccinated passengers, they're going to have a problem. Cruising presents unique challenges because your cruise can be upended if someone on the cruise gets very sick. You may not be able to disembark to visit ports in other countries if you haven't been vaccinated....etc. Cruising will be the absolute last thing in this world to return to normal.

 

[anniemae]

While I'm all for whipping this stupid mask off, don't we have to keep masks on , etc., because we don't know if we will still be able to give Covid to others even though we are vaccinated?

which is why it's such a bummer so many people are choosing not to be vaccinated. Kind of ruining it for everyone.

I think what will happen is that everyone will need to wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, until the time when everyone who wants to be vaccinated can do so. There will be a time when anyone can walk into CVS and get a vaccine. Then I think the mask usage will drop off. After that point, I think those choosing not to be vaccinated are on their own. I'm not sure about those who want to have the vaccine but can't due to things like allergy to the vaccine.

 

[BrianL]

I think what will happen is that everyone will need to wear masks, regardless of vaccination status, until the time when everyone who wants to be vaccinated can do so. There will be a time when anyone can walk into CVS and get a vaccine. Then I think the mask usage will drop off. After that point, I think those choosing not to be vaccinated are on their own. I'm not sure about those who want to have the vaccine but can't due to things like allergy to the vaccine.

I believe that is exactly what will happen. For those who can't get the vaccine, as long as we have enough people who do get it, then the prevalence of hte virus will diminish dramatically, to the point that catching it will be extremely unlikely. Once we are at that point things will be more back to "normal" but it will be a while.