BYE BYE MCO Security Lines

[safetymom]

Sorry you feel that way. I don't feel guilty at all for taking advantage of the program and any elite lines at the airport.

 

[DMRick]

I guess we get there so early it's not a problem. The lines start out in the atrium, but we feel they go pretty quick for the amount of people using the airport. I have a computer, which is in my roll on carryon, and I get that out when I'm two people away (too awkward to get it out sooner). We use MCO 5-6 times a year. so it's not worth getting the clear card. Won't be long before that line is long too.

 

[safetymom]

Doris, getting there early is now very crowded.

 

[vellamint]

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole Clear program appears to be a complete sham. All it does is allow people to pay money and cut the line. The pre-clearing and record checking doesn't do a darn thing - Clear folks still have the same checks at the airport as everyone else. The record checking is just there to hide the true nature of the program.

And while I congratulate any DIS readers smart enough to participate in the program (my annoyance is with the program, not them) it ticks me off that (1) I have to wait in line extra while they jump ahead of me, and (2) I'm too darn cheap to join myself.

PS - As for the whole TSA vs stupid passenger debate, I've never seen the TSA equivalent of not understanding that, yes, that almost-actual-size Texas belt buckle really will set off the metal detector and needs to come off.

I'm with you ... one more extra expense to an already expensive vacation.... As a person with a large family I really feel the squeeze. Seems that the more money you have the more freedoms you have. Flame away but just look at the cost of passports too. A bit cost prohibiting I may say. Another nail (albeit tiny one) in the coffin of the middle class.

 

[ducklite]

Amen CarolA! So sorry if it takes me five more minutes as I try to get my 3,9 and 11yo DDs thru security....I guess we should just stay home and not leave the house until they are able to function as independent adults. I know it would make you happier because they wouldn't be interferring with your meals in any resturants either.

I am not suggesting that people with children or those who don't fly often not fly. I do'nt know where you got that idea--but it's completely inaccurate.

I am suggesting that they need to have seperate lines at all airports for frequent fliers like they have a Philly. I think it's unfair to make those of us who can flash through the lines as we are prepared and know the ropes have to arrive an hour early because we inevitably get stuck behind hordes of unseasoned travelers.

That's all I'm saying. Those who take longer should empathize with others in the same boat, and thus be in line together. I don't see what the problem with that concept is.

If I knew that I'd not have to wait longer than 15 minutes, I could pull into the deck at MCO 45 minutes before my flight, be through security and on the monorail in under 20 minutes, getting me to the gate about the time they begin boarding.

Because most of my trips are 24-48 hours in length, adding an extra two hours at airports adds 5-10% to my travel time--a pretty significant number when you look at it that way.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

I am a business traveler that only has 2 carry ons. I always check my luggage. I couldn't be bothered dragging it through the airport, through security, into the bathroom, etc. I have my laptop and camera bag.

I never check my bag, but I can fit everything for th short trips I generally take in my roll-on and camera bag, so there's no reason to.

If I take a longer trip and need a larger bag, then obviously I check. But when I only need to carry a change of clothes, PJ's, and a small toiletry bag, it would be foolish to check.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole Clear program appears to be a complete sham. All it does is allow people to pay money and cut the line. The pre-clearing and record checking doesn't do a darn thing - Clear folks still have the same checks at the airport as everyone else. The record checking is just there to hide the true nature of the program.

I diagree. When you are Joe Passenger, you are not subjected to a thorough backgraound check. You don't need to list every address you've had in teh past five years, or show proof of nationality. Just a photo ID to get through security and you're done.

[/qupte]And while I congratulate any DIS readers smart enough to participate in the program (my annoyance is with the program, not them) it ticks me off that (1) I have to wait in line extra while they jump ahead of me, and (2) I'm too darn cheap to join myself.[/quote]

That's your perrogative and you've go no reason to be ticked off IMHO.

PS - As for the whole TSA vs stupid passenger debate, I've never seen the TSA equivalent of not understanding that, yes, that almost-actual-size Texas belt buckle really will set off the metal detector and needs to come off.

I agree. It's insane how incapable of grasping the basic concept of a metal detector some people are. Like I said, my husband takes his belt off, he's never set the machine off because he does remove it--although he has had TSA people tell him it's ok to wear through. He's not going to bother trying, it's less effort to remove it.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

I'm with you ... one more extra expense to an already expensive vacation.... As a person with a large family I really feel the squeeze. Seems that the more money you have the more freedoms you have. Flame away but just look at the cost of passports too. A bit cost prohibiting I may say. Another nail (albeit tiny one) in the coffin of the middle class.

It's not required, and neither is a passport, so I don't understand your point. I would think you would have thought through added costs as you added each child, so I guess I'm just not understanding your point--if there is one...

To spend the money on the pass is a purely personal decision. No one is making anyone do so, and if you aren't flying frequently, it probably doesn't make sense. As far as money=freedoms, I'll agree, if you're rich you can just have your private jet take you anywhere you want to go--there are no security lines.

Anne

 

[salmoneous]

I diagree. When you are Joe Passenger, you are not subjected to a thorough backgraound check. You don't need to list every address you've had in teh past five years, or show proof of nationality. Just a photo ID to get through security and you're done.

Perhaps I wasn't clear with my point - what's the purpose of the background check? Those people who undergo the background check go through the exact same security screening at the airport as the rest of us. All they get to do is cut the line.

And, again, in case my point wasn't clear - my beef is with the system (pay a private company money and get to cut the line) not with anybody who takes advantage of the system.

That's your perrogative and you've go no reason to be ticked off IMHO.

I don't know if we have reason to be ticked off or not, but if you read the DIS forums, you'll see that pay extra money to skip line programs tick a lot of people off.[/quote]

 

[vellamint]

It's not required, and neither is a passport, so I don't understand your point. I would think you would have thought through added costs as you added each child, so I guess I'm just not understanding your point--if there is one...

To spend the money on the pass is a purely personal decision. No one is making anyone do so, and if you aren't flying frequently, it probably doesn't make sense. As far as money=freedoms, I'll agree, if you're rich you can just have your private jet take you anywhere you want to go--there are no security lines.

Anne

My point is that they want more money from people in order to get through the line faster than other people.

 

[ducklite]

I don't know if we have reason to be ticked off or not, but if you read the DIS forums, you'll see that pay extra money to skip line programs tick a lot of people off.

[/QUOTE]

It's a free market economy.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

My point is that they want more money from people in order to get through the line faster than other people.

It's the same as staying on-site at the US hotels and getting FOL privileges there. I just don't see the point. You can choose to spend the extra money for the convenience, or choose not to. That's the way it is. If you had only had one child, cost wouldn't be an issue. You chose to have more children, and I'm sure your life is blessed by them. But with every choice we make in life there are consequences, both positive and negative. I chose to have Mexican for dinner. It was fabulous, but I've got heartburn from it, which I knew would happen. Same concept.

Someone who travels through MCO once every year or two, it just doesn't matter, in the grand scheme you've got to be there an extra hour once a year...

But for someone who has to go through the airport as much as many frequent fliers, it can make up two or three entire days of their live on the space of a year.

Anne

 

[vellamint]

It's the same as staying on-site at the US hotels and getting FOL privileges there. I just don't see the point. You can choose to spend the extra money for the convenience, or choose not to. That's the way it is.

Someone who travels through MCO once every year or two, it just doesn't matter, in the grand scheme you've got to be there an extra hour once a year...

But for someone who has to go through the airport as much as many frequent fliers, it can make up two or three entire days of their live on the space of a year.

Anne

RE: Express Pass ..If you look over the the Universal Boards you will see that quite a few people do not agree with this and quite a few will not be back because of it.

THIS is something that I can agree with....it must be difficult traveling that much and any way to save time would naturally be a plus for you.

What I do not agree with, and please correct me if I am wrong - I read this on another thread, is that the same screeners are used for both lines. If this is true than I am paying (in my ticket fees) for others to have faster service. Now IF this is incorrect and the private company that owns FlyClear is paying for the services of a screener out of the fees they are collecting from the customers then I apologize as this would not impact me nor mine in any way.

 

[salmoneous]

It's a free market economy.

Anne[/QUOTE] When Universal does it, it's a free market economy. When a government controlled airport charges extra to gain quicker access to government employed TSA agents, it's no free market, it's kinda weird. And when a private company charges a fee and the government allows their customers to skip the line and get quicker access to TSA agents, something very weird is going on.

Why should MCO allow people to skip a line because they have paid money to a private company.

 

[safetymom]

So is it ok then to have a line for elite flyers? We bought tickets like everyone else?

I don't get your point. I paid money just like you did for the security screeners and then paid extra, underwent a background check, agreed to be fingerprinted.

What is wrong with that?

 

[ducklite]

RE: Express Pass ..If you look over the the Universal Boards you will see that quite a few people do not agree with this and quite a few will not be back because of it.

THIS is something that I can agree with....it must be difficult traveling that much and any way to save time would naturally be a plus for you.

What I do not agree with, and please correct me if I am wrong - I read this on another thread, is that the same screeners are used for both lines. If this is true than I am paying (in my ticket fees) for others to have faster service. Now IF this is incorrect and the private company that owns FlyClear is paying for the services of a screener out of the fees they are collecting from the customers then I apologize as this would not impact me nor mine in any way.

The choice to not go back to US and the choice to use a different airport (Sanford/TPA) or drive are the consumers. Bottom line, we don't live in a communist country. No one is entitled to take a vacation, let alone visit theme parks. As with anything in life in this free market economy, some will be able to pay for things others can't. I don't have a cleaning lady, many do. I do have a lawn service, many don't. It's just the way it is, and frankly, as I've said many times, if you are unhappy with your financial position, do something about it--I worked a second job for five years to have the money for fairly extravagant vacations.

FlyClear pays an annual fee to MCO for each passenger they preclear. MCO uses that fee to offset the cost for dedicated screeners. So there is no cost to travelers not using the program. During non-peak travel times MCO doesn't deploy a dedicated flyclear security lane, rather simply jumps precleared passengers to the head of the line. In essence, the profit to the airport should actually help them better staff security lanes for all travelers.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

When Universal does it, it's a free market economy. When a government controlled airport charges extra to gain quicker access to government employed TSA agents, it's no free market, it's kinda weird. And when a private company charges a fee and the government allows their customers to skip the line and get quicker access to TSA agents, something very weird is going on.

Why should MCO allow people to skip a line because they have paid money to a private company.

Because that company pays a fee to MCO to offset the cost of the additional screeners. Thus there is not cost--in time or dollars--to those not participating in the program.

Anne

 

[goofy4tink]

You know....if you want that priviledge of getting through faster, then pay for it. Otherwise, educate yourselves and your family. My dd has been flying since she was 5 y/o. She knows enough to take her shoes off, have her boarding pass out and ready. Dh and I put all our 'loose stuff' in a zip-lock baggie, as well as all electronics in a huge zip-lock bag. We are like a well-oiled machine going through that security line! Of course, there was the one time I had a roll of quarters in my carry-on and forgot about it. That caused quite the uproar. Or the time I had to bring the cat through security in Boston and forgot to have my boarding pass in hand, and had to tell them it was going through the machine as we spoke!!! I did apologize to all those around me both times.
Sure do wish they would do something about the long lines. And maybe an attitude change would help. I have gotten the nastiest TSA employees at MCO. No wonder people get all frazzled....they're scared to death to do something to bring attentions to themselves and then get yelled at! But, there has to be something they can do to cut down on the wait time there. It is pretty incredible.

And Anne...if you want to pay in order to 'cut' in front of me..go right ahead. I have no problem with that. I think I would pay extra to have someone with half a brain in front of me for a change!!!! Underwire bras indeed!!!! I have yet to have a problem with my bra, my wedding ring/engagement ring, belt...whatever. Why, oh why, can't people just use common sense!!!

 

[salmoneous]

Because that company pays a fee to MCO to offset the cost of the additional screeners. Thus there is not cost--in time or dollars--to those not participating in the program.
Anne

Anne, thanks - I wasn't aware that the company was paying a fee to MCO. That answers some of my issues about it being a private company. However

1) There sure is a cost to me in time - when I have to wait while somebody cuts the line in front of me, that's a cost. This has happened to me when waiting in line for 40 minutes, so it's not just at off-peak times they are doing it.

2) It still seems to me that the whole security issue is just a sham. The background checks and fingerprinting don't do a thing (again, please fill me in if I'm missing something.) It's a pay-to-cut-the-line program.

3) Sometimes, it's best to sacrifice a pure free-market system to provide equity for all. There is no better example of this than, gasp, Disney. The current system of allocating rides is downright communistic. A scare resource (rides) is allocated by making people wait in line. It's like buying bread in the old USSR. The free market system would be to make people pay for each ride - and have people pay more for the more popular rides. Disney had a system like that, but found it better to scrap it and have a everyone-equal system. Look, my point here is not that the free market is bad or anything like that. Just that within the free market, sometimes it is better to do things that don't like purely free-market-esc.

4) Finally, there is absolutely nothing wrong with *people* who take advantage of a system offered to them.

 

[ducklite]

Anne, thanks - I wasn't aware that the company was paying a fee to MCO. That answers some of my issues about it being a private company. However

1) There sure is a cost to me in time - when I have to wait while somebody cuts the line in front of me, that's a cost. This has happened to me when waiting in line for 40 minutes, so it's not just at off-peak times they are doing it.

Actually there's not. Let me explain. This is simplistic, but it's the general situation. Let's say that they have the budget hours allocated for two lanes to be opened at 2:00pm on Wednesday afternoon, which is generally a pretty slow travel time. Due to increased hours because of FlyClear, they now have the budgetary hours to open a third line. The caveat is that the FlyClear patrons who ahve paid for that thrid line will of course be able to have priority use of it--but the airport will be able to use it for other passengers as well as they aren't expecting many FlyClear pax at that point in time. In that respect, FlyClear is benefitting everyone.

2) It still seems to me that the whole security issue is just a sham. The background checks and fingerprinting don't do a thing (again, please fill me in if I'm missing something.) It's a pay-to-cut-the-line program.

Actually, what it's doing is preventing secondary screening, because the person ahs already proven themselves to be a "trusted flier." They still need to walk through the metal detector and have carry-on's x-rayed.

3) Sometimes, it's best to sacrifice a pure free-market system to provide equity for all. There is no better example of this than, gasp, Disney. The current system of allocating rides is downright communistic. A scare resource (rides) is allocated by making people wait in line. It's like buying bread in the old USSR. The free market system would be to make people pay for each ride - and have people pay more for the more popular rides. Disney had a system like that, but found it better to scrap it and have a everyone-equal system. Look, my point here is not that the free market is bad or anything like that. Just that within the free market, sometimes it is better to do things that don't like purely free-market-esc.

Actually Disney is based on a free-market in many respects. Buy an annual pass and get free parking and sneak previews of new attractions before they are open to the public for example. Spend more moeny and get a resort with more amenities. Spend a lot more money and get the personalized services of the club levels.

4) Finally, there is absolutely nothing wrong with *people* who take advantage of a system offered to them.

We agree on this!

Anne