Bus transportation is terrible!

[goofyernmost]

I believe all that you are saying. However, I think they need to increase the number of buses they are running at close. It is ridiculous to have a line out of the queue and send only one regular bus to pick up. And what was strange is that you could see buses sitting there with drivers, I'm guessing waiting for instructions.

Just for informational purposes, there is no such thing as "one regular bus to pick up" even during light times. All buses with very few exceptions have multiple locations and routes. The bus that picks you up at MK and takes you to POP very likely will then proceed to DHS or EPCOT and pick up and deliver to AK Lodge, then maybe back to MK and onto AoA. It is done that way because it is the only way to even closely insure that you have a reasonable chance of your bus getting to you within a reasonable time. There are so many variables when it comes to traffic that once a bus gets caught up in a severe traffic situation, all is lost for whatever place that it is going to next. If they only went to one place, they could get out of schedule at 3 PM and still be running late well into the closing time. It really is very complex and unless you have worked in it, there is no way to understand how it all operates and especially no way of knowing the theories behind it all.

 

[maxiesmom]

Just for informational purposes, there is no such thing as "one regular bus to pick up" even during light times. All buses with very few exceptions have multiple locations and routes. The bus that picks you up at MK and takes you to POP very likely will then proceed to DHS or EPCOT and pick up and deliver to AK Lodge, then maybe back to MK and onto AoA. It is done that way because it is the only way to even closely insure that you have a reasonable chance of your bus getting to you within a reasonable time. There are so many variables when it comes to traffic that once a bus gets caught up in a severe traffic situation, all is lost for whatever place that it is going to next. If they only went to one place, they could get out of schedule at 3 PM and still be running late well into the closing time. It really is very complex and unless you have worked in it, there is no way to understand how it all operates and especially no way of knowing the theories behind it all.

What I meant was regular sized as opposed to the larger buses.

I do get that none of us have to use the buses. All I'm saying is Disney used to do a better job at closing of picking people up quickly. There would be one bus after another after another and now it is one bus, wait for a while, one bus, wait, one bus.

 

[goofy4tink]

maxiesmom....you're absolutely right. They used to have more frequent buses. If I got into a very long, close to park closing, yes, my wait was longish, but there was a fairly steady stream of buses coming along. It wasn't a 25 min wait in between buses, the way it is now. Does that always happen? No. But it happens more often than it should!
And the morning buses? Please. I know many here pooh-pooh those that say they stood there, waiting for a MK bus (for instance) for EE while 3 buses to Epcot came along. I tend to pay way too much attention to the buses when I'm there...really annoys my family!!! I don't exaggerate. But, I have seen that happen. For the life of me, I can't understand why multiple buses come along, one after the other, for a non-EE park, while the number of guests waiting for the EE park gets larger and larger. Why, in heaven's name, do they need that many buses to non-EE parks, at 7am? Drives me nuts.

 

[GreatLakes]

I think Disney will start using the RFID technology in MBs to better route buses in real time if they aren't already. Stops with a lot of people waiting or people who have been waiting a while can be prioritized over stops with less people who have just arrived at the stop.

 

[maxiesmom]

I think Disney will start using the RFID technology in MBs to better route buses in real time if they aren't already. Stops with a lot of people waiting or people who have been waiting a while can be prioritized over stops with less people who have just arrived at the stop.

They already have CMs standing at the bus stops watching. We would see them wave buses over to a certain line. What the deciding factor was on which resort got what bus, I have no idea.

 

[GreatLakes]

They already have CMs standing at the bus stops watching. We would see them wave buses over to a certain line. What the deciding factor was on which resort got what bus, I have no idea.

I noticed some CMs at some of the bus stops during our June trip doing the same thing. It was what made me think they were testing a more automated approach. Then there were reports of screens with bus arrival times and that reinforced my prediction.

 

[cranbiz]

The buses are tracked by GPS. Most of the time, the dispatches are done by the computer system (MIMs). Opening and closing, there will be regularly scheduled buses (computer dispatched) and a pool of buses at certain resorts (like POP/CBR, AllStars, POR) to be dispatched by the coordinator on demand. Once dispatched, the driver enters the location into the onboard computer and that then tracks the bus, allowing the updates on the monitors. All resorts have bus monitors and can call in to a parks dispatch for a bus if a queue needs it in the morning.

 

[sunshinemelody]

I think Disney will start using the RFID technology in MBs to better route buses in real time if they aren't already. Stops with a lot of people waiting or people who have been waiting a while can be prioritized over stops with less people who have just arrived at the stop.

I thought that you were referencing the MBs to figure out how many buses to dispatch for a certain route based on how many people are in the parks from what resort.

The other posters, while I get the whole CM deal, don't seem to resonate the same thought I was thinking, though. Would you mind clarifying, @GreatLakes?

 

[GreatLakes]

I thought that you were referencing the MBs to figure out how many buses to dispatch for a certain route based on how many people are in the parks from what resort.

The other posters, while I get the whole CM deal, don't seem to resonate the same thought I was thinking, though. Would you mind clarifying, @GreatLakes?

Sure. I think we will see RFID readers installed into the bus stop areas so they can ping the MBs of the guest waiting there. They can tell which stops have how many people in them, how long those people have been there, and can also make an educated guess on why they are waiting for the bus (going back to the resort they are staying at vs trying to make an ADR that is linked to the same MDE account as the MB).

They can integrate that data into the existing bus dispatch software (MIMs per a PP who seems to know) to better route buses based on real time demand.

I think the cast members might have either had an RFID reader on them to collect data or were manually doing some of the routing they are going to eventually automate down the road. The screens being installed with wait times only really makes sense if you have accurate numbers to put on those signs and more advanced routing based on real time metrics would lead to that.

All of this is an educated guess and I could be way off.

 

[sunshinemelody]

Sure. I think we will see RFID readers installed into the bus stop areas so they can ping the MBs of the guest waiting there. They can tell which stops have how many people in them, how long those people have been there, and can also make an educated guess on why they are waiting for the bus (going back to the resort they are staying at vs trying to make an ADR that is linked to the same MDE account as the MB).

They can integrate that data into the existing bus dispatch software (MIMs per a PP who seems to know) to better route buses based on real time demand.

I think the cast members might have either had an RFID reader on them to collect data or were manually doing some of the routing they are going to eventually automate down the road. The screens being installed with wait times only really makes sense if you have accurate numbers to put on those signs and more advanced routing based on real time metrics would lead to that.

All of this is an educated guess and I could be way off.

Thank you.

I understand, but hey, it sounds like an awfully well-thought out educated guess.

Your explanation was pretty much on the same axis as what I was thinking. Only thing is that I didn't think to have the readers at the waiting area, but instead at the park entrance/exit so that those who are going back to resorts and are using the bus system would have a way to have that translated to some sort of computing system, which is what you so graciously explained.

 

[GreatLakes]

Thank you.

I understand, but hey, it sounds like an awfully well-thought out educated guess.

Your explanation was pretty much on the same axis as what I was thinking. Only thing is that I didn't think to have the readers at the waiting area, but instead at the park entrance/exit so that those who are going back to resorts and are using the bus system would have a way to have that translated to some sort of computing system, which is what you so graciously explained.

I think the error rate would be lower if the scanners were inside the bus stops. They also would be at the resort bus stops, not just the park stops. If there are 15 people waiting at AKL to go to MK (based on FP+ and ADRs linked to the MBs via MDE) and only 4 waiting to go to Epcot it makes more sense to make the next bus arriving at AKL provided those 4 people weren't at the bus stop a substantially longer time.

The data gathering is easy, fine tuning the algorithm is the hard part. They can run models and make predictions in a test environment but until they put it into production, probably at a select few resorts and bus stops to begin with, they really won't know exactly how much to weigh each of the decision metrics.

 

[J'Adore Disney]

The use of bus transportation is a hit or miss, can't be flawless every time.

I used bus transportation (to and from resorts/parks) back in May and August of this year and with the exception of a 30-minute wait for bus transportation from Epcot to Hollywood Studios, our experience with bus transportation was near perfect.

However, in April/2014, bus transportation from Downtown Disney back to Wilderness Lodge was a nightmare! Waited 20 minutes for the bus, but when it arrived, passengers were not allowed on due to a mechanical warning. Therefore, we had to wait another 20 minutes for a replacement bus to arrive AND make a second stop at Downtown Disney (West Side). I think we would have been better off taking a taxi back to the hotel!!!

 

[sunshinemelody]

I think the error rate would be lower if the scanners were inside the bus stops. They also would be at the resort bus stops, not just the park stops. If there are 15 people waiting at AKL to go to MK (based on FP+ and ADRs linked to the MBs via MDE) and only 4 waiting to go to Epcot it makes more sense to make the next bus arriving at AKL provided those 4 people weren't at the bus stop a substantially longer time.

The data gathering is easy, fine tuning the algorithm is the hard part. They can run models and make predictions in a test environment but until they put it into production, probably at a select few resorts and bus stops to begin with, they really won't know exactly how much to weigh each of the decision metrics.

OK! That makes sense.

Any idea how quickly things get implemented at WDW, if at all? I heard it's quite some time.

 

[cranbiz]

It took them 5 years to get the Magic in Motion (MIM) system to the point of auto dispatch. Trying to integrate MB statistics in a software system that it wasn't designed to work with will take a looooong time if it's at all possible.

To make your suggestions work, there needs to be a pool of buses that don't have assignments and are available for an on demand dispatch. While its a great idea from a customer service point, from a cost and efficiency standpoint, IMHO, it's never going to happen.

 

[seashoreCM]

I don't think that they can "ping" guests' Magic Bands from a distance. Rather it would make sense if guests could tap their MB's to a sensor at each bus stop.

A rudimentary form of this would be a push button for each park at the bus stop. I suppose that one reason why they never tried this idea (it was long before MBs were invented) was because one guest could push it multiple times.

Incidentally, with individual MBs, if guests tap the sensor multiple times, this will actually give additional useful information to a system.

 

[goofyernmost]

I'm not going to go into it in depth because it would take this entire discussion board to do so. I will just say that a bus system, like Disney's, is a very complex and easily misunderstood process. Factors that the everyday person wouldn't even have cause to think about are considered and balanced when it comes to how many buses to dispatch and when. There also is the factor that they get surprised sometimes by the volume that is going to individual resorts, etc. They cannot plan for that because it is not a normal thing. If you are there during that situation, then it causes frustration to you and the others that are there then.

Bus systems run like a clock. They have places to be at specific times and any little unforeseen incident can throw that balance off. Sometimes the buses that are just sitting there and not being called up because they have radio communication with the buses and GPS connections to them and they know that by the time that driver and bus got over to you the one that you are supposed to take would be there or just a minute behind. Every time they do that type of switch, the scheduled runs for each bus driver involved is completely flipped around and that causes even more confusion and also accounts for the few times when I have heard that a bus driver heads the wrong direction or takes a wrong turn. Unless they know it is going to be a huge delay the problems that come with making those changes are really not worth the effort put into it, for them or you. The buses that come at any given time are not just randomly showing up. It is clearly set up in their route. Any unnecessary tampering with that setup has a snowball affect that just makes the system less able to get people places faster.

When you are standing in line, especially at a park. Look around you and notice that there is a bus location for every single destination within WDW and assigned bus routes to cover them. Pull one out and it is a nightmare and nightmares do not often end well. Imagine that what you are seeing is happening at every park and every resort in the place and it is happening at exactly the same time. I know it can be frustrating to have to wait, but, believe me the bus drivers are not one bit happier about the situation then you are. They just want to get you back to your resort, or wherever, and be able to punch out and go to their homes as well. Well, they should call in more drivers for those occasions. OK, but some live miles away and by the time they were able to get there, you will have been able to walk to your resort and be sound asleep. It isn't nearly as simple as people would like to think.

 

[goofy4tink]

This isn't a hard concept to wrap your minds around. Yes, it would be nice if no one had to wait more than 5 mins for a bus. That isn't going to happen. I have stood and watched those overhead bus boards. I have watched as my Epcot bus was 'supposed' to be arriving at 8:45. It was, currently, 8:40. I watched the board time change to 8:48, then to 8:50, then to 8:54. By the time the bus got there, it was 9:02. Yes, I timed it, it's what I tend to do. Stuff happens out there on the road.
You people want the buses running more efficiently, and to be able to know when one is coming. But you also like that bus drivers can offer that they drop you off at a resort instead of the park the bus is going to....heading to MK, but a guest needs to get to the CR or Polynesian, so the driver offers to drop them there after the park stop. That won't be happening anymore.
We've all seen how many flukes the MDE system has. I can't imagine Disney being able to add the buses to that mix successfully.
It is what it is...public transit. You are going to have some short waits, and some longer waits. It's just not that big a deal....if you don't want to wait, or you don't want to leave so much lead time in order to get to another resort, then take a cab. They just aren't all that expensive at WDW.
I don't want rates to keep soaring because there are some that don't want to wait more than 5 mins for a bus. And that cost has to come from somewhere....park pass costs are already through the rood, room rates aren't so wonderful either.

 

[MouseLovingMom]

Please stop being negative about the buses folks! 1st trip is in 20 something days and yall are FREAKING ME OUT! My Disney planner has had NOTHING but nice things to say about the buses along with my daughter's theater director but ya'll are making panic. My dad will be so unbearable if the struggle is as bad as SOME of you are making it out to be. Someone who is not negative please PM the dos and donts of the system so I know how to make it all smooth. We lots of ADRS including 4-5 breakfasts that we do NOT want to mess up.

 

[Boopuff]

I really don't have a big beef with the busses at WDW. But it does baffle me that a place with so much technology can't give bus wait times. I was at AKL and they had monitors with approximate bus arrival times. But those aren't at all resorts. The monitor at Poly wasn't even in the frame (just some wires). Now if a big city can fairly accurately give approximate arrival times I would think it is something Disney could and should do!

 

[HopperFan]

I don't think that they can "ping" guests' Magic Bands from a distance. Rather it would make sense if guests could tap their MB's to a sensor at each bus stop.

A rudimentary form of this would be a push button for each park at the bus stop. I suppose that one reason why they never tried this idea (it was long before MBs were invented) was because one guest could push it multiple times.

Incidentally, with individual MBs, if guests tap the sensor multiple times, this will actually give additional useful information to a system.

Yes they can ping and that is the main reason they want those MB on your arm. There are two readers in the MB, passive needs no battery and does tickets, FP+, room key, charging, DDP .... the other is active and uses a battery - it can be tracked and that is how photos appear on your account from rides where you didn't even ask for them. The MB is being "pinged" as you pass by the camera. In the long run I expect to see Disney using this part of the MB for all kinds of things including the bus system.