"Black Lives Matter" - it's stupid. Just cut the crap.....

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

Well, thought everyone hated cancer. Maybe, they don't

What has this movement accomplished?

It isn't that people like cancer.

It is that they don't like something about the cause.

Maybe because breast cancer receives the most in donation dollars, when heart disease it the lead disease killer.

 

[DizBelle]

No.... black make up a way higher INCARCERATION rate. Not commit more crimes. THATS JUST ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF THE PROBLEM. Whites commit more crimes than blacks... THEY HAVE TO BY SHEER NUMBERS! There are 9 times as many white people in this country as black. But you are telling me blacks commit more crimes overall??? Whites commit just as many crimes by percentage as blacks as asians as indians as europeans as hispanics, etc. THEY JUST ARENT PUT IN JAIL AS MUCH!!!! but of course that is all being imagined and the system is completely perfect and fair and everybody is treated equally right? Is that you argument? People in 1592 committed just as many crimes as people in 1892 or 2002 regardless of where they are. No race is predisposed to crime. AND STOP MAKING THIS ABOUT BLACK VS WHITE!!!!

So, by the same logic, the proportion of people that crochet HAS to be the same as the proportion of the general population?

I don't think you can take the breackdown of the general population and apply it to any "thing" (interest, crime, taste in food, etc)

 

[DizBelle]

I'm reminded of that scene in Men In Black when Will Smith and the other potential recruits are sent into a room with guns and told to shoot the "bad guys" and the only one Will Smith shoots is the little white blonde girl in pigtails because she's carrying physics books that are far too advanced for someone her age.

The point here is that it is about your presentation to the public. If you present yourself as every gangsta thug I've ever seen in a movie or on TV, regardless of your skin color, without any other information, I'm probably going to be wary of you.

The way you present yourself sends a message for how you want to be treated.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

It isn't that people like cancer.

It is that they don't like something about the cause.

Maybe because breast cancer receives the most in donation dollars, when heart disease it the lead disease killer.

As I posted earlier (below), mistakes made by the medical profession are the 3rd leading cause of death in this country. Maybe people should show support for "medical profession reform" at the next game...

Actually, your husband's profession has a FAR bigger problem than police officers wrt "errors" AND loss of life...

Medical Errors Are No. 3 Cause Of U.S Deaths, Researchers Say
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-...ertificates-undercount-toll-of-medical-errors

I don't know what's actually being done about that, but I agree... no excuse not to improve.

As I said before, I agree, of course, that bandwidth is not a reason for deficient training. I doubt any PD would give that as a reason. That said, major cities ARE facing a major challenge retaining and recruiting officers. The current toxic climate is certainly playing a part, and this is to all our detriment.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

As I posted earlier (below), mistakes made by the medical profession are the 3rd leading cause of death in this country. Maybe people should show support for "medical profession reform" at the next game...

I wish they would just play the game and spend less time telling me how I should feel about a particular cause.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I wish they would just play the game and spend less time telling me how I should feel about a particular cause.

I was just being tongue-in-cheek -- I actually agree with you 110%!!

 

[kamik86]

The organization (or at least this group) that says it's against racism is racist itself? But they are saying that the library is racist? Do they really not get it?

Seems like it. Although I am surprised BLM would want to hold meetings that exclude white people. If that is true that is another example of a sub group that is working against the real vision.

If someone white wants to join BLM that would mean that people in the majority were siding with you and joining you for working towards your vision of greater equality. If the group isn't for that then they really are just trying to segregate themselves and make noise.

I would love to think that BLM is just a group that has poor leadership that isn't helping to guide others in the movement on the best places and ways to protest to get their message across and not that the organization as a whole thinks this is the right way to go about it.

This actually reminds me of when my high school started an LGBT group that was meant to be for all students to address issues of discrimination and hate. I joined and my mother of course could not understand why since I had a boyfriend. I joined because many of my friends were gay (yes mom knew this).

 

[CPanther95]

I'm anti-Pink when it come to the NFL. Find something else that actually needs awareness if you must use that platform. We are all already aware of breast cancer and what we need to do to catch it early.

At this point it is nothing but a revenue generator for the organization itself.

 

[CampbellzSoup]

I haven't seen this organization do anything to actually unify people - it looks to segregate people.

2,100 yes 2,100 people have been shot in the predominately area of Chicago this year: http://hotair.com/archives/2016/07/12/icymi-2100-people-have-been-shot-in-chicago/

Where is the black lives matter demonstrations there?

 

[kellyjeanie]

I'm reminded of that scene in Men In Black when Will Smith and the other potential recruits are sent into a room with guns and told to shoot the "bad guys" and the only one Will Smith shoots is the little white blonde girl in pigtails because she's carrying physics books that are far too advanced for someone her age.

The point here is that it is about your presentation to the public. If you present yourself as every gangsta thug I've ever seen in a movie or on TV, regardless of your skin color, without any other information, I'm probably going to be wary of you.

The way you present yourself sends a message for how you want to be treated.

We need to look beyond the stereotypes shown to us by movies and TV.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

We need to look beyond the stereotypes shown to us by movies and TV.

In our regular daily interactions with people, I completely agree.

On a city street late at night, SHOULD I react the same way to someone who LOOKS LIKE a stereotypical "gangbanger" (isn't saying that we know he is, obviously), as to someone dressed/groomed like a typical businessman?? In that one, quick instance, does it MAKE SENSE for me to react EXACTLY THE SAME WAY? Statistically speaking? Doesn't mean I'd be correct in every instance about each of those individuals!

We're fighting humans' self-preservation and self-protection instincts here. Animals (including humans!) size up potential danger very quickly, based on MYRIAD cues, and react accordingly. In some instances, this makes sense to maintain. In others, they may be prejudices to work against.

 

[sunshinehighway]

In our regular daily interactions with people, I completely agree.

On a city street late at night, SHOULD I react the same way to someone who LOOKS LIKE a stereotypical "gangbanger" (isn't saying that we know he is, obviously), as to someone dressed/groomed like a typical businessman?? In that one, quick instance, does it MAKE SENSE for me to react EXACTLY THE SAME WAY? Statistically speaking? Doesn't mean I'd be correct in every instance about each of those individuals!

We're fighting humans' self-preservation and self-protection instincts here. Animals (including humans!) size up potential danger very quickly, based on MYRIAD cues, and react accordingly. In some instances, this makes sense to maintain. In others, they may be prejudices to work against.

The thing is that black people are often the ones people look at and react to suspiciously. That's a big part what the whole movement is about addressing. There a deep rooted issues in our society which make people often be more concerned what what the black man walking down the street at night is doing than what a white man walking down a street at night is doing.
That translates to the police and how the interact with black people also.
We can try to skip around it and say it's about the way someone dresses or carries themselves but that's not the whole story.
Since we are talking tv and movies. Black people are often portrayed in a negative way. It just enforces the idea to be suspicious of them.
Look at your two examples. A man in a suit..well if men in suits were more often shown as gangsters or seriel killers and not upstanding businessmen, you'd be nervous when you pass a man in a suit walking at night.

 

[kellyjeanie]

In our regular daily interactions with people, I completely agree.

On a city street late at night, SHOULD I react the same way to someone who LOOKS LIKE a stereotypical "gangbanger" (isn't saying that we know he is, obviously), as to someone dressed/groomed like a typical businessman?? In that one, quick instance, does it MAKE SENSE for me to react EXACTLY THE SAME WAY? Statistically speaking? Doesn't mean I'd be correct in every instance about each of those individuals!

We're fighting humans' self-preservation and self-protection instincts here. Animals (including humans!) size up potential danger very quickly, based on MYRIAD cues, and react accordingly. In some instances, this makes sense to maintain. In others, they may be prejudices to work against.

Are you agreeing with the previous poster, that what you're afraid of is a stereotype created by movies and TV? Because that's a big part of the problem, is that we have internalized an exaggerated image created by Hollywood. I include myself in that "we," it's also something I have to work on in myself.

 

[kellyjeanie]

I haven't seen this organization do anything to actually unify people - it looks to segregate people.

2,100 yes 2,100 people have been shot in the predominately area of Chicago this year: http://hotair.com/archives/2016/07/12/icymi-2100-people-have-been-shot-in-chicago/

Where is the black lives matter demonstrations there?

They are concerned about the violence in their own communities. They have held protests and community meetings to try to reduce this violence. Just because they haven't made national news doesn't mean it's not happening.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

The thing is that black people are often the ones people look at and react to suspiciously. That's a big part what the whole movement is about addressing. There a deep rooted issues in our society which make people often be more concerned what what the black man walking down the street at night is doing than what a white man walking down a street at night is doing.
That translates to the police and how the interact with black people also.
We can try to skip around it and say it's about the way someone dresses or carries themselves but that's not the whole story.
Since we are talking tv and movies. Black people are often portrayed in a negative way. It just enforces the idea to be suspicious of them.
Look at your two examples. A man in a suit..well if men in suits were more often shown as gangsters or seriel killers and not upstanding businessmen, you'd be nervous when you pass a man in a suit walking at night.

Are you agreeing with the previous poster, that what you're afraid of is a stereotype created by movies and TV? Because that's a big part of the problem, is that we have internalized an exaggerated image created by Hollywood. I include myself in that "we," it's also something I have to work on in myself.

I appreciate you both engaging in the dialogue - thank you.

I think that beyond stereotypes from TV and elsewhere, crime stats factor into how people react to others in potentially dangerous/tenuous situations. Young black males in casual dress are sadly far more likely to engage in violent crime than middle-aged white men in business suits. Does it not make some sense to be more wary of the former than the latter late at night on a city street?

That white man in a business suit late at night on a city street may be a HORRIBLE person! May even be a dangerous person. But he is far less likely to be on the streets of D.C., for instance. Far MORE likely to be a white collar criminal!! It's a matter of statistics.

If you judge people in these quick, "self-preservation" types of situations based on these external characteristics, you are BOUND to be wrong... A LOT! But if you're gauging risk, based on actual crime stats, is this de facto racist?

As a specific example: We've had multiple thefts at knife point perpetrated by young black males in our predominantly white part of the city. One teen was recently stabbed in such a robbery. Does it make sense for me to be equally wary of the two people I mentioned above if I encounter them on a nearby street late at night tonight? Am I racist if I am more weary of one of them?

 

[CampbellzSoup]

They are concerned about the violence in their own communities. They have held protests and community meetings to try to reduce this violence. Just because they haven't made national news doesn't mean it's not happening.

Where are the protests?

 

[CPanther95]

I'm less suspicious of what a guy in a suit might do because that's awful crime committing attire.

On the flip side I'm much more suspicious of what a guy in a suit is saying.

 

[sunshinehighway]

I appreciate you both engaging in the dialogue - thank you.

I think that beyond stereotypes from TV and elsewhere, crime stats factor into how people react to others in potentially dangerous/tenuous situations. Young black males in casual dress are sadly far more likely to engage in violent crime than middle-aged white men in business suits. Does it not make some sense to be more wary of the former than the latter late at night on a city street?

That white man in a business suit late at night on a city street may be a HORRIBLE person! May even be a dangerous person. But he is far less likely to be on the streets of D.C., for instance. Far MORE likely to be a white collar criminal!! It's a matter of statistics.

If you judge people in these quick, "self-preservation" types of situations based on these external characteristics, you are BOUND to be wrong... A LOT! But if you're gauging risk, based on actual crime stats, is this de facto racist?

Crime stats really don't tell a whole story on their face though. You can find stats and intrepret them to fit whatever you want.
I think the idea of what racism and what is racist is where many people get hung up. Racism, especially when we are talking about institutional racism or systematic racism, doesn't have to be a conscious thing. It seems to be difficult to grasp sometimes because we have this idea of racism as actively not liking someone or discriminating against them based on race. I'm sure many people have older relatives who grew up in a different time that have made cringeworthy statements. That's often what people think of and so they get upset or defensive because they'd never say or think such things.

Trayvon Martin really changed my way of thinking about it. Before that incident, I probably would have felt similar to you. Something about the whole thing just bothered me though. The more conversation were about him being suspicious or up to something , the more I thought about it, the more I realized that yeah, I would be more suspicious about a black teenager walking down the street at night than a white teenager. I'd read comments I thought were so terrible about him and how he was probably up to something and I had to admit that my thinking ( although not as extreme as a lot of it) was along a similar line. I guess something just clicked and I just started looking at things a little differently.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Crime stats really don't tell a whole story on their face though. You can find stats and intrepret them to fit whatever you want.
I think the idea of what racism and what is racist is where many people get hung up. Racism, especially when we are talking about institutional racism or systematic racism, doesn't have to be a conscious thing. It seems to be difficult to grasp sometimes because we have this idea of racism as actively not liking someone or discriminating against them based on race. I'm sure many people have older relatives who grew up in a different time that have made cringeworthy statements. That's often what people think of and so they get upset or defensive because they'd never say or think such things.

Trayvon Martin really changed my way of thinking about it. Before that incident, I probably would have felt similar to you. Something about the whole thing just bothered me though. The more conversation were about him being suspicious or up to something , the more I thought about it, the more I realized that yeah, I would be more suspicious about a black teenager walking down the street at night than a white teenager. I'd read comments I thought were so terrible about him and how he was probably up to something and I had to admit that my thinking ( although not as extreme as a lot of it) was along a similar line. I guess something just clicked and I just started looking at things a little differently.

While there "lies, damned lies, and then statistics" , one cannot mount a legitimate argument against the idea that young black males commit violent crimes and a vastly disproportionate rate. That's not racist. That's factual. I think that getting to the root of WHY THAT IS is more likely where solutions are -- and I don't think that BLM has any interest in that.

I don't think re-litigating any particular case makes a lot of sense at this point, but just want to check my recollection of something re: Trayvon Martin. I vaguely remember hearing that there had been thefts from homes in that predominantly white neighborhood, and that young black males were suspects. Is that right? If so, that is an alternate explanation to racism as to why he would have been referred to as "suspicious" in that context by some people. Though Zimmerman is clearly a piece of work, so I wouldn't necessarily be so charitable to him in my interpretation.

 

[sunshinehighway]

They are concerned about the violence in their own communities. They have held protests and community meetings to try to reduce this violence. Just because they haven't made national news doesn't mean it's not happening.

Yes. Besides I think that always being thrown into a discussion is just a diversion tactic . In a way, it's really a whole different thing itself. Yes it needs to be addressed but separately because otherwise it's just a big jumble of things and there's no focus, everything gets lost in the mix.