Best Strategy for a trip in 2022? Lower Your Expectations

[DisneyFive]

Kudos BridgetBordeaux, this thread was just highlighted in the weekly Dis YouTube show!

Dan

 

[jujubiee4]

Shoutout to OP! Her post was highlighted on Dis Unplugged.

 

[UrsulaTime]

@BridgetBordeaux, you're famous! Speech, speech!

Thanks to those who let us know about it. Good episode!

 

[BridgetBordeaux]

Wow!
What a surprise.
I watched it yesterday while packing for our trip. I am glad they chose to read and discuss it.
I appreciate all the participation here.

PS- presently in line for Monsters Inc Laugh Factory. Posted 20 min for standby.

 

[Grandmad]

I'm a pixie dust huffing, magic farting Disney apologist. They have made a lot of unpopular decisions over the last 5 years, and each time I've shrugged and said "That stinks for those it affects..." but it never affected me. My trips were still FANTASTIC. Pay for parking at resorts? I own DVC so it doesn't apply. Discontinue ME? I drive so it didn't apply. Take away member benefits for DVC resale owners? I bought pre-2016 so it doesn't apply...and on and on..

My last trip, Disney broke me. I never thought there was a line they could cross. I didn't even know there was a line! But they did. I'm pretty devastated about it. I don't recognize the parks or the company anymore.

Perfect

 

[BridgetBordeaux]

I know this is just one small data point.....but I think it was a decent representation.

A family of 4 came here from TX for their first visit and had a 6 day/5 night stay at a moderate.

About 5500 for the package with tix.

Of course with G+ and airport transportation they have spent extra money for the trip.

They say it cost too much and they have had a mediocre time.....and Genie+ has failed them.

They are putting on their game face for the kids right now...but they are not coming back.

The mom, who was here as child, had fond memories of this place.....and even said they could afford to go on any vacation they wanted to....but the cost is high and their satisfaction level is low.

They actually thought that they were at fault, and were comforted to know that it is the Genie+ situation that has changed everything.

Disney made a bad first impression on the parents and they will act accordingly.

 

[bsmcneil]

You have to remember, this is the internet and it's social media. For every loud person on here (and the number of posts is not reflective as some people are particularly into complaining) there are literally thousands of satisfied guests who are not hanging out on boards. Study after study has shown that the negativity and complaints on social media is exponentially higher than people's real life experiences. You don't just need to take comments on here with a grain of salt.... you need to swallow it with the entire dead sea.

So, this is true - and ... It's true that the boards aren't necessarily reflective of greater sentiment but it feels like confirmation bias is at play because you're assuming that the silent visitors who don't frequent boards are enjoying themselves. Surely that's true of some of them - just as surely there are those who do it once, had a bad time, and would never post about that because they've moved on. Or people who hear the stories of coworkers, etc and decide, "OK, I'm just not going to try it." I say that to point out that it seems like a fallacy to suggest the reflected experiences of people on these boards shouldn't matter/hold weight because these are coming from dedicated fans and/or people significantly invested (even if that investment is in complaining about it all the time). They should hold weight - some weight. I used to work in a field where surveys would be regularly commissioned and the idea was sort of that I would take the feedback from those surveys and do ... something with it. And on one hand, my response was about how the surveys weren't created by people who knew what they were doing and the feedback was from the most ardent supporters/detractors and space was needed for those who used the service(s) but didn't complete the surveys. And all of that was true - the feedback from those doing the surveys is important and there needs to be space for the people not speaking up (whether it's because they're perfectly fine, or even happy with how things are, or because they dislike things but aren't invested in communicating that).

 

[bsmcneil]

This one simple fact was the most valuable tip I EVER got from Disboards many many years ago; that's saying a lot since we've gotten some amazingly helpful information!!!

If you go and you bring with you the attitude that you gather from social media that everything is cut backs, taking away, rude CM's and negativity, what you will find is cut backs, things that were taken away, rude CM's and negativity. You will literally LOOK for those things and yes - if you look for them you can find them. (Here I will add another Yoda'ism)

...

If HOWEVER you bring magic, happiness, and a childlike attitude of wonder, you will find..... that's right... magic, happiness, and wonder.

These simply aren't accurate, though. What you bring to a situation (your views/perspective, etc) DO matter but that's not ALL that matters! Again, there is a logical fallacy (just-world) that suggests that when good things happen to me, it's because I did something to warrant them. And if bad things happen to others, they did something to warrant them. But that's not a concrete truth of the universe. Sometimes, someone with the sunniest disposition and all of the optimism in the world will have a negative experience due to things outside of their control. And yes, having that disposition can affect how you feel about those negative things but people's dissatisfaction isn't simply/only a measure of turning their frown upside down. But I believe it's easy to give this message when you have the worldview that good things happen to "me" (the speaker) because I deserve them. If folks who had this perspective might hold some space for the concept that experiences can be different from their own, maybe you wouldn't feel the need to rant something and say it all the time, etc. (and if people who are unhappy realize that some of their experience may come from their own perspective, maybe they could find more/different/better silver linings). It's never black/white. But just a couple of posts above these was someone saying, "I've always been a huge Disney fan - and I'm dissatisfied" and to put in your $.02 to say (essentially), "Well it's because you didn't bring enough good vibes to the situation" is really missing the mark.

 

[bsmcneil]

The waking up at 7 and lack of a modify feature are what I find most infuriating about genie +
I can’t think of any other “premium” vacation where the “premium” experience requires such policies. Can you imagine “stay at our ocean front suite at our 5 star resort and wake up at 6:45 am to reserve your beach chair ” At premium resorts if you want a cabana you can choose to pay extra in advance, not telling your guests to wake up on vacation! Or you can likely get a decent spot without paying extra.

Lots of them, actually. I think back to my trip to Hawaii. Want to visit Haleakalā National Park? Sign-up and lottery are the best options (way early in planning the trip) and a really early morning (even if you're using a tour) are necessities. Want a chair at the pool or a spot at the lagoon at Aulani? Wake up early to get them or rent a cabana. While I've not visited, the stories I've heard from people checking out top tourist places in Europe (in 2020, I planned to go either to Europe or Hawaii - guess you can tell which I chose, lol) suggest needing to be up and planning early for popular destinations (the Louvre, etc).

Now, I personally hated the 7am aspect on the trip (even more than I thought I would, and I posted frequently about how I hated the idea before I went) - but it's disingenuous to suggest WDW is the only premium experience where you have to do it to participate. It very much stinks and I would've hoped Disney might see some benefits (especially to families) in not making 7am the starting time - but yeah, plenty of other places, etc have similar situations.

 

[Donaldsfans]

You can see in my signature that I have been to Disney many times.

I even made my second trip on my current Annual Pass and was at Bay Lake Tower and then Animal Kingdom Lodge, Jambo House just a few days ago.

If you are going in 2022 you need to lower your expectations a lot.

I have used Touring Plans and been a rope dropper for many, many years.

I was often able to get 90 percent of my rides/shows done by lunchtime .....and wrapped up each day with a feeling of joy and happiness.

I was able to ride some rides more than once each day and sometimes would hop to a second or third park if I wanted to........I felt free as a bird.

This is not the case anymore.

For the moment, let's put aside the huge cost of resorts, food/beverage, Genie+, and ILL.

Even if G+ were free, it is an inferior product to FP+.

I can even accept the Park Pass requirement for the first park of the day, but park hopping at 2pm it like hitting my kneecaps with a baseball bat.

In the old days, I would often rope drop park number 1 and then hop to park number 2 sometime in the morning.

The present system makes each day feel like we have a national speed limit of 55 again and I am driving around with my parking brake engaged.

If we had little ones in our group, the focus of a typical day would be very different.....even only doing 3 or 4 rides with a child/grandchild, the day's enjoyment is derived from seeing the little ones have a wonderful day.

For years, I tried to maximize the number of days I could be at WDW with my AP.

I would stay off site and on site.

These days, it is not so much that the on site folks have a huge advantage compared to the past.......it is that the off site people barely get adequate leftovers by the time they can enter the park and/or buy ILL rides.

I have trips planned for April/May/Sept/Oct on this AP. (I do not like the super hot months)

I am not going to focus on max days at Disney this year.

I went in Dec 2021, Jan 2022 and have a trip with our daughter (a teacher) over the President's Day weekend.

I will have been 3 times on this AP.......I feel I have broken even on the cost.

I will be cancelling the rest of the trips I had on the books for later this year.

That money and time will be spent elsewhere.

Although some of the environment has been impacted by Covid...... a large part of the reduced experience is due to decisions made by management.

Now......I have not said much about the nickel and diming that really adds up now.

At a value resort, a couple on a trip has to pay an extra $47 each day just to park and use Genie+.

When you add the impact of a diminished experience with the very high cost, the value of the experience has been greatly reduced.

Look......I am a Disney fan.

Disney, Coke, a Big Mac, are all part of a truly American experience. I can not imagine life as we know it if they were to all disappear.

Disney has very good customer service.....if the IT situation was not so mediocre, I would say Disney has some of the best customer service of any company.

However, at this time, the overall experience requires a lot of money, a lot a planning, and each day has a lot of chaos caused by the unpredictability of getting a LL or ILL,........and to be under the gun to compete at 7am for a seat on a ride is not relaxing or enjoyable.
And having my face buried in the phone a good part of the day does not add to my enjoyment either.

I composed this because I saw some small headlines about Disney guests not being really thrilled right now.....I thought I may have been the only one that felt this way.......but there is now a bit of rumbling going on........and social media has the ability to provide us to look at the good and the bad comments.

The experience has changed for the worse.

They better improve it substantially and quickly.

I think many of the 2022 visitors may be so unhappy, they may not return or postpone future trips.

In a way, Disney has messed up my Happy Place................and I am a bit sad about that.

I agree. Universal is looking better and better. I do not like seeing TV screens in the queue or staring at my phone to catch a ride or place a mobile order. It's very unmagical. They've lost the human touch by cutting back on the humans.

 

[Donaldsfans]

They do n

Lots of them, actually. I think back to my trip to Hawaii. Want to visit Haleakalā National Park? Sign-up and lottery are the best options (way early in planning the trip) and a really early morning (even if you're using a tour) are necessities. Want a chair at the pool or a spot at the lagoon at Aulani? Wake up early to get them or rent a cabana. While I've not visited, the stories I've heard from people checking out top tourist places in Europe (in 2020, I planned to go either to Europe or Hawaii - guess you can tell which I chose, lol) suggest needing to be up and planning early for popular destinations (the Louvre, etc).

Now, I personally hated the 7am aspect on the trip (even more than I thought I would, and I posted frequently about how I hated the idea before I went) - but it's disingenuous to suggest WDW is the only premium experience where you have to do it to participate. It very much stinks and I would've hoped Disney might see some benefits (especially to families) in not making 7am the starting time - but yeah, plenty of other places, etc have similar situations.

they do not. You can't compare Europe to a theme park. There is no similarity. I was able to sit at an open air Cafe in Paris without pre-ordering on my phone. I did not have to get up at 7 am to go to my favorite museum. No Disney is failing.

 

[woodleygrrl]

Lots of them, actually. I think back to my trip to Hawaii. Want to visit Haleakalā National Park? Sign-up and lottery are the best options (way early in planning the trip) and a really early morning (even if you're using a tour) are necessities. Want a chair at the pool or a spot at the lagoon at Aulani? Wake up early to get them or rent a cabana. While I've not visited, the stories I've heard from people checking out top tourist places in Europe (in 2020, I planned to go either to Europe or Hawaii - guess you can tell which I chose, lol) suggest needing to be up and planning early for popular destinations (the Louvre, etc).

Now, I personally hated the 7am aspect on the trip (even more than I thought I would, and I posted frequently about how I hated the idea before I went) - but it's disingenuous to suggest WDW is the only premium experience where you have to do it to participate. It very much stinks and I would've hoped Disney might see some benefits (especially to families) in not making 7am the starting time - but yeah, plenty of other places, etc have similar situations.

It's also disingenuous to use this logical fallacy to try to prove your point. It is also true that it is a vast minority of vacations that require you to put in the type of planning that WDW makes you do. And Aulani is Disney. Not a good comparison IMHO.

 

[Mollygirl21]

We came back from a 9 day trip in Jan. Once we were home, I said I feel like we need a do-over. I couldn't even put my finger on why exactly but here are some of the things that impacted us negatively:

• It was more crowded than I have ever seen. That probably impacted me the most.
• I didn't get the satisfaction of snagging an impossible to get FP at 5pm for a ride like FoP (we rode 3 times in one day on our last trip without waiting standby even once)
• With Genie+, I didn't feel like I could take a break from finding our next must-do...but with FP, I was confident in my refresh skills and knew I could let it go for a couple hours without impacting our day
• With Genie+, it was difficult to plan in the order you wanted to go. You do end up backtracking a lot if you want to make sure you hit certain headliners because you don't dare leave it for later or you may not get it at all
• Everything felt rushed (I get this is a mindset thing but I have the same mind as I have used on all my other trips). I think it was the crowds.
• As someone else said, I wasn't soaking up the atmosphere like I usually do
• It didn't help that it was the coldest 9 days we have ever experienced in Florida! (not Disney's fault obviously but it did impact my overall satisfaction with the vacation)

Here's the kicker, we are going for 4 days in June for that "do-over" and I have lowered my expectations greatly. We are picking 2-3 must do's at the two parks we will visit and I plan to ignore my phone and look up over top of the crowds as much as possible to see the park itself. I hope to wander into some shows we missed last time in our quest for the next LL and sit on benches and soak in the atmosphere while eating a Mickey ice cream bar (only had one last trip, it was too cold!)

I have lowered my expectations of what we will accomplish this trip but I have very high expectations that I will enjoy our do-over trip more than the one in Jan.

Adding to my high expectations is that we will be celebrating my 50th birthday while we are there which is a dream come true. Being from Canada, we don't go south in the summer so a trip in June has never been in the stars. But it turns out, the stars aligned and we are going! I am as excited as any child to be able to wear a birthday button at WDW

 

[bsmcneil]

It's also disingenuous to use this logical fallacy to try to prove your point. It is also true that it is a vast minority of vacations that require you to put in the type of planning that WDW makes you do. And Aulani is Disney. Not a good comparison IMHO.

Aulani isn't a Disney park. And what was the logical fallacy I used (with which you disagreed)? ETA: I don't disagree (nor did I say) that a majority of places do not involve the level of planning for WDW. It's one reason travel sections of bookstores have considerably more guides to visiting WDW than other places, or even regions. But to suggest "what other premium place requires you to make plans that early" is just not accurate.

 

[Carrie in AZ]

We came back from a 9 day trip in Jan. Once we were home, I said I feel like we need a do-over. I couldn't even put my finger on why exactly but here are some of the things that impacted us negatively:

• It was more crowded than I have ever seen. That probably impacted me the most.
• I didn't get the satisfaction of snagging an impossible to get FP at 5pm for a ride like FoP (we rode 3 times in one day on our last trip without waiting standby even once)
• With Genie+, I didn't feel like I could take a break from finding our next must-do...but with FP, I was confident in my refresh skills and knew I could let it go for a couple hours without impacting our day
• With Genie+, it was difficult to plan in the order you wanted to go. You do end up backtracking a lot if you want to make sure you hit certain headliners because you don't dare leave it for later or you may not get it at all
• Everything felt rushed (I get this is a mindset thing but I have the same mind as I have used on all my other trips). I think it was the crowds.
• As someone else said, I wasn't soaking up the atmosphere like I usually do
• It didn't help that it was the coldest 9 days we have ever experienced in Florida! (not Disney's fault obviously but it did impact my overall satisfaction with the vacation)

Here's the kicker, we are going for 4 days in June for that "do-over" and I have lowered my expectations greatly. We are picking 2-3 must do's at the two parks we will visit and I plan to ignore my phone and look up over top of the crowds as much as possible to see the park itself. I hope to wander into some shows we missed last time in our quest for the next LL and sit on benches and soak in the atmosphere while eating a Mickey ice cream bar (only had one last trip, it was too cold!)

I have lowered my expectations of what we will accomplish this trip but I have very high expectations that I will enjoy our do-over trip more than the one in Jan.

Adding to my high expectations is that we will be celebrating my 50th birthday while we are there which is a dream come true. Being from Canada, we don't go south in the summer so a trip in June has never been in the stars. But it turns out, the stars aligned and we are going! I am as excited as any child to be able to wear a birthday button at WDW

That is awesome!! Happy you get a do-over! Prepare for the heat, though, June is HOT! Like, really really hot.

 

[sequoia 14]

My expectations are already lowered way beyond belief.

I have a trip coming up in March and if I hadn't promised my kids this last minute trip I would cancel it.

This will be our last trip.

The final straw for me was over something silly. I had meant to book base tickets and instead bought park hopper tickets. I realized my mistake too late, but I immediately called to fix it. After a few hours on hold I was told "the tickets are non-refundable, no exceptions." I was offered the ability to use the price difference between the two types of tickets to buy something else like PhotoPass on a credit system, but there was nothing that I wanted or needed. I understand that I could possibility call back and get a different response. I also understand I could email guest services and they might be able to help. However, I only have apathy at this point and will just keep the park hoppers.

After I hung up the phone, I changed our resort reservation from a family suite to a value resort standard room because I refuse the give Disney more money than I need to at this point. I would stay off-site except my kids are up early so the early entry is a huge perk to us.

I am mostly a lurker on this board, but if you knew me you would be shocked that I am giving up Disney. I have gone at least once a year since I was a kid myself. If someone like me is over it, then something is very very broken with the Disney parks right now.

 

[Delirium]

At what point can you stop 'lowering your expectations' and still justify the cost?

My kids are teenagers now (15 & 17). The 17 is graduating high school this year. Many of our favorite memories as a family come from Disney trips throughout their childhood. We have always talked about taking that last trip before the kids go their own ways. And, after that, my wife and I talked about the child-free trips we would take.

But, with the way things are now, I can't see any of that happening. The cost was always a barrier. Staying onsite was always important to us because of the perks. Now, virtually all of those perks are gone. Without staying onsite, without those perks, if I go to Disney, I'm no longer on 'vacation', I'm going to a theme park. Well, let's see, there are a lot of 'no perk' theme parks spread across the county that I can do for a fraction of the cost as Disney.

Why are so many Disney lovers settling for lower expectations? It shouldn't be that way. That's what Chapek and his crowd wants.

 

[T'Lynn]

I think the "settling" is because despite there being lots of amusement parks around the world, there are none who come even close to what Disney has created. Universal is probably closest but I can't imagine anyone regularly planning a 10 day trip to Universal the way people to with Disney. Maybe if they had two more parks?

Disney still offers what Walt imagined - a place that can be enjoyed by children of all ages and generations of families that have fond memories there. They know that now and they are making as much money as they can from it. Will that eventually drive away business? I think time will tell but Disney has such a unique experience that if they do lose customers I think a few slight adjustments would have people ready to return so right now it's a matter of testing thresholds I guess.

I still have a month+ until I go to Disney and experience these changes for myself so I'm not lowering expectations but I do keep adjusting plans and strategies based on what I read from everyone. So thank you all for sharing your experiences - good and bad!

 

[DCLMP]

That is awesome!! Happy you get a do-over! Prepare for the heat, though, June is HOT! Like, really really hot.

and wet

 

[susustudios]

You can see in my signature that I have been to Disney many times.

I even made my second trip on my current Annual Pass and was at Bay Lake Tower and then Animal Kingdom Lodge, Jambo House just a few days ago.

If you are going in 2022 you need to lower your expectations a lot.

I have used Touring Plans and been a rope dropper for many, many years.

I was often able to get 90 percent of my rides/shows done by lunchtime .....and wrapped up each day with a feeling of joy and happiness.

I was able to ride some rides more than once each day and sometimes would hop to a second or third park if I wanted to........I felt free as a bird.

This is not the case anymore.

For the moment, let's put aside the huge cost of resorts, food/beverage, Genie+, and ILL.

Even if G+ were free, it is an inferior product to FP+.

I can even accept the Park Pass requirement for the first park of the day, but park hopping at 2pm it like hitting my kneecaps with a baseball bat.

In the old days, I would often rope drop park number 1 and then hop to park number 2 sometime in the morning.

The present system makes each day feel like we have a national speed limit of 55 again and I am driving around with my parking brake engaged.

If we had little ones in our group, the focus of a typical day would be very different.....even only doing 3 or 4 rides with a child/grandchild, the day's enjoyment is derived from seeing the little ones have a wonderful day.

For years, I tried to maximize the number of days I could be at WDW with my AP.

I would stay off site and on site.

These days, it is not so much that the on site folks have a huge advantage compared to the past.......it is that the off site people barely get adequate leftovers by the time they can enter the park and/or buy ILL rides.

I have trips planned for April/May/Sept/Oct on this AP. (I do not like the super hot months)

I am not going to focus on max days at Disney this year.

I went in Dec 2021, Jan 2022 and have a trip with our daughter (a teacher) over the President's Day weekend.

I will have been 3 times on this AP.......I feel I have broken even on the cost.

I will be cancelling the rest of the trips I had on the books for later this year.

That money and time will be spent elsewhere.

Although some of the environment has been impacted by Covid...... a large part of the reduced experience is due to decisions made by management.

Now......I have not said much about the nickel and diming that really adds up now.

At a value resort, a couple on a trip has to pay an extra $47 each day just to park and use Genie+.

When you add the impact of a diminished experience with the very high cost, the value of the experience has been greatly reduced.

Look......I am a Disney fan.

Disney, Coke, a Big Mac, are all part of a truly American experience. I can not imagine life as we know it if they were to all disappear.

Disney has very good customer service.....if the IT situation was not so mediocre, I would say Disney has some of the best customer service of any company.

However, at this time, the overall experience requires a lot of money, a lot a planning, and each day has a lot of chaos caused by the unpredictability of getting a LL or ILL,........and to be under the gun to compete at 7am for a seat on a ride is not relaxing or enjoyable.
And having my face buried in the phone a good part of the day does not add to my enjoyment either.

I composed this because I saw some small headlines about Disney guests not being really thrilled right now.....I thought I may have been the only one that felt this way.......but there is now a bit of rumbling going on........and social media has the ability to provide us to look at the good and the bad comments.

The experience has changed for the worse.

They better improve it substantially and quickly.

I think many of the 2022 visitors may be so unhappy, they may not return or postpone future trips.

In a way, Disney has messed up my Happy Place................and I am a bit sad about that.

Wow. They really need to start focusing again on visitors returning as they used to. Even Iger, as much as I and others criticized him with some of the cutbacks and price increases etc, still seemed to be able to walk the line and still get people feeling they got enough value to keep coming back. Chapek doesn't seem to care at all, which may hurt them down the line. It's good that I was able to go a lot as a kid and then rediscover it for 10 years as an adult, but maybe I won't go again. There are other options