AP sales…

[kboo]

In April, we ate at Boma and wasn't sure how to find DVC on our phone, server said that's ok, I put it in as AP. He said DVC needs manager ok, so AP is easier.

At one of the restaurants, I was paying by Magic Band (How quaint!) and started to pull out my AP card, and the server pretty much waved it away since when you scan the MB it indeed says DVC and AP ...

 

[cm8]

At one of the restaurants, I was paying by Magic Band (How quaint!) and started to pull out my AP card, and the server pretty much waved it away since when you scan the MB it indeed says DVC and AP ...

So why all the hassle? It’s not like you can use someone else’s MB to charge unless they have you the PIN?

 

[WilsonFlyer]

So why all the hassle? It’s not like you can use someone else’s MB to charge unless they have you the PIN?

Because if they hassle you about it, they know some people don't like it and just not 'bother.' They get to keep that 10%. Now some people won't like that answer, but it's the only one that's ever made sense to me.

 

[Sandisw]

So why all the hassle? It’s not like you can use someone else’s MB to charge unless they have you the PIN?

Actually not all the restaurants have you enter the pin. We have had it happen a few times.

Personally, don’t see it as a hassle to have to show my pass. I actually love having the digital card as I can just show on my watch.

 

[kboo]

Actually not all the restaurants have you enter the pin. We have had it happen a few times.

Personally, don’t see it as a hassle to have to show my pass. I actually love having the digital card as I can just show on my watch.

My point about the “hassle” was even with charging to a MB (which I had to use to enter the park, with a fingerprint), they asked to see a photo ID. I’m paying with a MB that has all the info on it and is verified by a fingerprint to enter the park, and I was buying something IN a park.. And in the stores, I also have to enter the pin.

 

[Sandisw]

My point about the “hassle” was even with charging to a MB (which I had to use to enter the park, with a fingerprint), they asked to see a photo ID. I’m paying with a MB that has all the info on it and is verified by a fingerprint to enter the park, and I was buying something IN a park.. And in the stores, I also have to enter the pin.

But you can easily give your MB to someone to use..not a stranger but a family member is wouldn’t entitled to the discount.

And, if you enter first thing, they don’t always have you use the fingerprint.

Plus, I have a ton of magic bands so it be pretty easy for me to give one to all my group to use without me.

I guess I still don’t see why it’s a hassle at all. I keep my ID on my phone now and flash that and my DVC Y, especially when that is what the rules say you need to do to get the discounts.

 

[Debbie Jean]

But you can easily give your MB to someone to use..not a stranger but a family member is wouldn’t entitled to the discount.

And, if you enter first thing, they don’t always have you use the fingerprint.

Plus, I have a ton of magic bands so it be pretty easy for me to give one to all my group to use without me.

I guess I still don’t see why it’s a hassle at all. I keep my ID on my phone now and flash that and my DVC Y, especially when that is what the rules say you need to do to get the discounts.

I can’t see the hassle either. I keep my license and AP card along with my phone in a zippered front pocket of my purse. At a restaurant I just take them out and set them on the table ready to give my server. Same if I buy something, at the cash register. Never considered that verifying my information was a hassle. I must be too compliant! LOL

 

[RoseGold]

Your MB showed you were DVC before Covid too. In the late hours, you could see on their scanner that you were staying in X Hotel and that you were DVC. Of course, it was just a MB, and I had a dozen I could have loaned out to whoever.

The problem is they made a million DVC rules, which made a bunch of categories of member, and the IT can't handle all the little categories.

 

[Sandisw]

Your MB showed you were DVC before Covid too. In the late hours, you could see on their scanner that you were staying in X Hotel and that you were DVC. Of course, it was just a MB, and I had a dozen I could have loaned out to whoever.

The problem is they made a million DVC rules, which made a bunch of categories of member, and the IT can't handle all the little categories.

Has nothing to do with IT, though. Showing ID along with proof of eligibility is part of the rules.

Take DVC out of it…it’s the requirement of an AP as well.

 

[WilsonFlyer]

And honestly, there are what, 5-6 'rules?' And they are 'handled' by IT through algorithms already in place all day every day.

 

[ScubaCat]

I think it depends on the CM. Just for DVC discounts I've been asked for card, phone and/or ID.

I can't imagine with what Disney pays, that many CMs would really care. What a joke. I wouldn't want to start a argument over such if I were a CM.

Can you imagine starting an argument with someone who is just following policy and has no say in the matter?

So bizarre.

It's always the manager (or the manager's manager) that determines how strict the policy is at a particular location. I've been given the discount for meals costing over $700 without them even wanting to see the card, and been carded strictly for a bottle of water. You just never know.

Gentle reminder to please make an effort to NEVER give front line CM's any hassle or attitude over this. They're often under tremendous pressure for not the greatest wages. I realize it can be frustrating, but there are better channels to vent this and not direct it at a cashier who's just doing his or her job.

 

[RivShore]

From our Stock News thread comes this bit from Bob 2.0, they do have quite a dilemma with AP's.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/disney-bob-chapek-d23-interview-1235216556/


You’re known as a guy who cuts costs and raises prices. You’ve raised the prices pretty stiffly [for some streaming plans] and the parks. And you’ve gotten some blowback from superfans. How much can you keep raising prices and does ill will from them create a problem for the brand?

We love all our fans equally. We love the superfans, obviously. But we also like the fans that don’t have the same expression of their fandom. We want to make sure that our superfans who love to come with annual passes and use [the parks] as their personal playground — we love that. We celebrate that. But at the same time, we’ve got to make sure that there’s room in the park for the family from Denver that comes once every five years. We didn’t have a reservation system and we didn’t control the number of annual passes we distributed and frankly, the annual pass as a value was so great that people were literally coming all the time and the accessibility of the park was unlimited to them and that family from Denver would get to the park and not be let in. That doesn’t seem like a real balanced proposition. I guess it’s possible that the superfans look at that as a disadvantaging of the way they consume the park, but we’ve got to make sure that not only are we heeding the needs of our superfans, but we’re heeding the needs of everyone who travels from across the country one time every five years. We have a real high-class problem: We have much more demand than there is supply. What we will not bend on is giving somebody a less than stellar experience in the parks because we jammed too many people in there. If we’re going to have that foundational rule, you have to start balancing who you let in. … Our ticket prices and constraints we put on how often people can come and when they come is a direct reflection of demand. When is it too much? Demand will tell us when it’s too much.

 

[Sandisw]

From our Stock News thread comes this bit from Bob 2.0, they do have quite a dilemma with AP's.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/disney-bob-chapek-d23-interview-1235216556/


You’re known as a guy who cuts costs and raises prices. You’ve raised the prices pretty stiffly [for some streaming plans] and the parks. And you’ve gotten some blowback from superfans. How much can you keep raising prices and does ill will from them create a problem for the brand?

We love all our fans equally. We love the superfans, obviously. But we also like the fans that don’t have the same expression of their fandom. We want to make sure that our superfans who love to come with annual passes and use [the parks] as their personal playground — we love that. We celebrate that. But at the same time, we’ve got to make sure that there’s room in the park for the family from Denver that comes once every five years. We didn’t have a reservation system and we didn’t control the number of annual passes we distributed and frankly, the annual pass as a value was so great that people were literally coming all the time and the accessibility of the park was unlimited to them and that family from Denver would get to the park and not be let in. That doesn’t seem like a real balanced proposition. I guess it’s possible that the superfans look at that as a disadvantaging of the way they consume the park, but we’ve got to make sure that not only are we heeding the needs of our superfans, but we’re heeding the needs of everyone who travels from across the country one time every five years. We have a real high-class problem: We have much more demand than there is supply. What we will not bend on is giving somebody a less than stellar experience in the parks because we jammed too many people in there. If we’re going to have that foundational rule, you have to start balancing who you let in. … Our ticket prices and constraints we put on how often people can come and when they come is a direct reflection of demand. When is it too much? Demand will tell us when it’s too much.

I know people aren’t happy with these kinds of statements but it does make sense.

Its why I hope they have someone who can find a way to come up with a product that works well for people who come a lot, like DVC, but don’t need a pass that is , for the most part, unlimited,

But, as long as people are going, they are going to hold off on any level of AP being for sale again.

 

[RivShore]

Its why I hope they have someone who can find a way to come up with a product that works well for people who come a lot, like DVC, but don’t need a pass that is , for the most part, unlimited,

I was just thinking the same thing, they really need something inbetween for those few time a year visitors (or long once a year stays).

 

[aka Charles]

I know people aren’t happy with these kinds of statements but it does make sense.

Its why I hope they have someone who can find a way to come up with a product that works well for people who come a lot, like DVC, but don’t need a pass that is , for the most part, unlimited,

But, as long as people are going, they are going to hold off on any level of AP being for sale again.

If we accept his narrative, it makes sense.

But I have a hard time understanding how that family from Denver would have any problem getting into the parks when Disney’s own data shows actual park attendance is down 17%.

It just seems to me that if too much demand was the actual reason, then a 17% drop in attendance would have them going all in on AP sales.

Also, if they had any desire to provide a balanced AP product for DVC members and other guests that visit more than once a year, it would be simple for them to create an AP that is tied to resort stays, like so many have suggested. It would provide excellent flexibility for the guests, and guaranteed multiple level revenue stream for Disney.

Just wishful thinking.

 

[Sandisw]

If we accept his narrative, it makes sense.

But I have a hard time understanding how that family from Denver would have any problem getting into the parks when Disney’s own data shows actual park attendance is down 17%.

It just seems to me that if too much demand was the actual reason, then a 17% drop in attendance would have them going all in on AP sales.

Also, if they had any desire to provide a balanced AP product for DVC members and other guests that visit more than once a year, it would be simple for them to create an AP that is tied to resort stays, like so many have suggested. It would provide excellent flexibility for the guests, and guaranteed multiple level revenue stream for Disney.

Just wishful thinking.

I think they like that the park reservations system is allowing them to control attendance differently than before they had it,

So, it sounds like to me, the goal is to keep crowds at a lower level than before so the guest experience is not compromised in their eyes.

And, I believe that revenue is still up as prices are now higher than before, so they have what they see as system that allows them to do things they couldn’t before and that is to limit AP holders.

The statement at the end says it all. When demand goes down, then they will know they need to change things.

Obviously, they will lose some guests along the way who won’t go back out of principle, but I doubt it would be enough to make a huge difference.

All it would take for many is to offer a very attractively priced AP to Earn back some of those who they lost with this strategy.

 

[aka Charles]

I think they like that the park reservations system is allowing them to control attendance differently than before they had it,

So, it sounds like to me, the goal is to keep crowds at a lower level than before so the guest experience is not compromised in their eyes.

And, I believe that revenue is still up as prices are now higher than before, so they have what they see as system that allows them to do things they couldn’t before and that is to limit AP holders.

The statement at the end says it all. When demand goes down, then they will know they need to change things.

Obviously, they will lose some guests along the way who won’t go back out of principle, but I doubt it would be enough to make a huge difference.

All it would take for many is to offer a very attractively priced AP to Earn back some of those who they lost with this strategy.

Yes, what you say is correct.

In his statement he says "But at the same time, we’ve got to make sure that there’s room in the park for the family from Denver that comes once every five years. We didn’t have a reservation system and we didn’t control the number of annual passes we distributed and frankly, the annual pass as a value was so great that people were literally coming all the time and the accessibility of the park was unlimited to them and that family from Denver would get to the park and not be let in."

He is saying that the reason that the family cannot get into the park is because there is not enough room in the park... in other words the park is at FULL capacity based solely on attendance.
But that is not the case at all, by their own data.

When you say "they like that the park reservations system is allowing them to control attendance differently than before they had it", you are correct, it is about control.
Now, we all love it when the lines are shorter.
For the guest, it means they get on the ride quicker.
For Disney, it means the guests get off the rides quicker, allowing more time for in park shopping and eating.

When you say "the goal is to keep crowds at a lower level than before", you are correct.
So when that family cannot get in, it is because Disney has lowered the level of access, not that demand maxed out the park capacity.

You are correct when you say "that revenue is still up as prices are now higher than before, so they have what they see as system that allows them to do things they couldn’t before..."
What they have done is lower the supply, which artificially increases the demand, thus allowing them to increase the prices.
So even if the family can get in, they have to pay a higher price. They may have to change from once every 5 years to once every 7 or 8 years.

When you say "The statement at the end says it all. When demand goes down, then they will know they need to change things." you are correct.
But in the context of his statement, the "demand" is purposely implied to be about attendance.
The actual "demand" is about the guests who are willing to pay more for less.
When the guests stop paying, "then they will know they need to change things."

So, just a long way of saying that everything he said was correct, except the narrative that the problem is that there is no room in the park.
Under the current system, if anyone cannot get into the park, that is solely because Disney is controlling the access and lowering the supply.

I fully understand it from a business perspective, but not from a customer service perspective.

.

 

[aka Charles]

Sorry Sandi, I went on a bit there.
None of that was directed at you.
Just a bit of a rant on his statement.

 

[MinnieSueB]

Boo! Doesn't sound like APs are coming back any time soon. I still need an AP for my DH - so frustrating. They really need to make an exception for DVC.

 

[ironz]

"We didn’t have a reservation system and we didn’t control the number of annual passes we distributed and frankly, the annual pass as a value was so great that people were literally coming all the time and the accessibility of the park was unlimited to them and that family from Denver would get to the park and not be let in."

Um, so before the stupid reservation system, when did families not get let in, other than the occasional Christmas/NYE? The reservation system is what is causing people to not get let in.

Just my take as an out of state DVC AP holder who only renewed because I didn't want to lose the AP altogether, although we pretty much hate the idea of Genie+ and all the $$$ going into bob's pockets.