Anyone else struggling with the climate of evasiveness?

[tidefan]

Yep completely agree. I love the look and feel of the resort studios at BPK and don’t really mind not having the full kitchenette since we don’t really use them in a studio anyway, although I see why some don’t find them as useful. I love the current longhouses at PVB but really look forward to seeing what they actually do with the tower because it feels like it has so much potential, and it’s not even painted and prettied up yet!

And, I’ll be be honest, I’ve been super speculative of the cabins but sometimes you just have see it from a different perspective. I’ve been following @bama_ed current trip report and he just makes Fort Wilderness look so magical and welcoming and different in the best way from all the other resorts that I think I get it now. FW was never on my radar but now I’m really looking forward to doing a Halloween/holiday season trip over there in the next few years!

When something stops working for you, that’s totally valid to comment on, but making generalizations about everyone who continues to enjoy that same thing is unfair and unnecessary.

Look at me... being the curmudgeon...

Not to beat a dead horse, but BPK was a huge wasted opportunity. I think the reason that a number of us dislike it is because it's all just hotel rooms, but not only that. It's just all the same. They most definitely could have spent the time to make the utility and layout much better (for the record, I much prefer the Deluxe Studios), but they didn't. However, at the least, if they were going to be hotel rooms, they could have at least done what most hotels do and give you the option of 1 King bed instead of 2 Queens. The 2 Queen layout just doesn't work for us. Now, I realize that for some, that is preferred and that's great, but they could have thrown in a few King's for some of us.

I agree on the cabins. I rather like them, however, I do not like the dues or restrictions, so I won't be purchasing, but I do hope to stay there.

PVB tower... I could care less as long as it doesn't make my PVB1 dues go up...

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

Look at me... being the curmudgeon...

Not to beat a dead horse, but BPK was a huge wasted opportunity. I think the reason that a number of us dislike it is because it's all just hotel rooms, but not only that. It's just all the same. They most definitely could have spent the time to make the utility and layout much better (for the record, I much prefer the Deluxe Studios), but they didn't. However, at the least, if they were going to be hotel rooms, they could have at least done what most hotels do and give you the option of 1 King bed instead of 2 Queens. The 2 Queen layout just doesn't work for us. Now, I realize that for some, that is preferred and that's great, but they could have thrown in a few King's for some of us.

I agree on the cabins. I rather like them, however, I do not like the dues or restrictions, so I won't be purchasing, but I do hope to stay there.

PVB tower... I could care less as long as it doesn't make my PVB1 dues go up...

They did a very sloppy job on BPK. The first thing dh noticed when we stayed there was they didn’t even redo the elevators. lol. They were a mess inside. It’s like they took the hotel rooms, put in new carpet, some new furniture and a few new fixtures, and called it a day. A quick reno and flip.

 

[Cfabar1]

They did a very sloppy job on BPK. The first thing dh noticed when we stayed there was they didn’t even redo the elevators. lol. They were a mess inside. It’s like they took the hotel rooms, put in new carpet, some new furniture and a few new fixtures, and called it a day. A quick reno and flip.

Two things:
1. owners dues will cover the renovations of the elevators, don't worry....
2. this is, in my opinion, at best, what we will get in 2042 when the resorts expire. Maybe not even a Reno before sales.

 

[lowlight]

Or they have realistic expectations and like the current product. The way you see it is your opinion not fact and that is your right just as it is others to see it differently. The thing is DVC does what it feels is best for them as a company and the entire membership not just a few. I think the new Polynesian tower is going to be awesome and how anyone can have a negative opinion about something that is not finished and not experienced is beyond me. I also like the new Big Pine Key addition and the cabins at the Fort.
It does seem like it's time for you to sell and I am sure someone will gladly buy.

There’s no accounting for taste, that’s for sure.

 

[Lorana]

Yep completely agree. I love the look and feel of the resort studios at BPK and don’t really mind not having the full kitchenette since we don’t really use them in a studio anyway, although I see why some don’t find them as useful. I love the current longhouses at PVB but really look forward to seeing what they actually do with the tower because it feels like it has so much potential, and it’s not even painted and prettied up yet!

And, I’ll be be honest, I’ve been super speculative of the cabins but sometimes you just have see it from a different perspective. I’ve been following @bama_ed current trip report and he just makes Fort Wilderness look so magical and welcoming and different in the best way from all the other resorts that I think I get it now. FW was never on my radar but now I’m really looking forward to doing a Halloween/holiday season trip over there in the next few years!

When something stops working for you, that’s totally valid to comment on, but making generalizations about everyone who continues to enjoy that same thing is unfair and unnecessary.

While I am intrigued at PVB Tower and may buy there, what I think bothers me most is that Poly really needed something to help alleviate crowds, as well as more pools and recreation space. The beach area the tower now sits on was a beautiful walk and place to relax, and like the beach stretch that the VGF building took over, I’m going to miss it. As a Disney bride, I have wedding and family photos along those two stretches of beaches and it’s wild to me to see that the Wedding Chapel - once isolated with two beautiful stretches of beach and palm trees to either side, now has towers cramming right up to it.

What I’ll miss is the impeccable *theming* that was so at the heart of WDW. They really tried to transport you away. Poly did such a great job of trying to make you feel you were off on an island, but a tower is very contemporary and takes away from that “lost in a bygone era.” Yes I’ll confess we bought into PVB for the nostalgia factor and “old time Polynesian feel.” Might I still buy the Tower? Yes, depending on pricing and dues, but I can still be a bit sad at the changes to modernize a resort we loved for the experience it was once all about.

Sort of the same about FW. If you’ve never stayed there, we loved it. We did a couple of resort only stays there when our kids were little and money was tight. We could do Mickeys Backyard BBQ for some great character interactions, and the campfire singalongs and s’mores with Chip & Dale. They always had a lot of great activities throughout the day. We loved it.

For us the cabins very rustic feel was part of the charm. It helped us really feel like we were in a national park campground or other such place and added to it. I have no doubt the cabins will be gorgeous. My guide raved about how nice they were, nicer than he expected. But they are very contemporary, and I confess for us and I suspect a lot of folks who loved the cabins, contemporary is NOT the feel we want. It takes away from the rustic campground feel. Don’t get me wrong — I’m one of those folks who was also sad at how contemporary Copper Creek is. I miss the log bed posts and very rustic style of the old Lodge. I still own CCV and I still like it, but it went from really feeling like I was at the Old Faithful Inn to a nod to the Inn. I can like what it is; and still miss the story experience it once created.

I do recommend trying a stay at Fort Wilderness. It is a lot of fun if family campground with Disney touches is your jam. We definitely plan to check out the new cabins, but yes I will mourn the thematic rustic log cabins of old.

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

While I am intrigued at PVB Tower and may buy there, what I think bothers me most is that Poly really needed something to help alleviate crowds, as well as more pools and recreation space. The beach area the tower now sits on was a beautiful walk and place to relax, and like the beach stretch that the VGF building took over, I’m going to miss it. As a Disney bride, I have wedding and family photos along those two stretches of beaches and it’s wild to me to see that the Wedding Tower - once isolated with two beautiful stretches of beach and palm trees to either side, now has towers cramming right up to it.

What I’ll miss is the impeccable *theming* that was so at the heart of WDW. They really tried to transport you away. Poly did such a great job of trying to make you feel you were off on an island, but a tower is very contemporary and takes away from that “lost in a bygone era.” Yes I’ll confess we bought into PVB for the nostalgia factor and “old time Polynesian feel.” Might I still buy the Tower? Yes, depending on pricing and dues, but I can still be a bit sad at the changes to modernize a resort we loved for the experience it was once all about.

Sort of the same about FW. If you’ve never stayed there, we loved it. We did a couple of resort only stays there when our kids were little and money was tight. We could do Mickeys Backyard BBQ for some great character interactions, and the campfire singalongs and s’mores with Chip & Dale. They always had a lot of great activities throughout the day. We loved it.

For us the cabins very rustic feel was part of the charm. It helped us really feel like we were in a national park campground or other such place and added to it. I have no doubt the cabins will be gorgeous. My guide raved about how nice they were, nicer than he expected. But they are very contemporary, and I confess for us and I suspect a lot of folks who loved the cabins, contemporary is NOT the feel we want. It takes away from the rustic campground feel. Don’t get me wrong — I’m one of those folks who was also sad at how contemporary Copper Creek is. I miss the log bed posts and very rustic style of the old Lodge. I still own CCV and I still like it, but it went from really feeling like I was at the Old Faithful Inn to a nod to the Inn. I can like what it is; and still miss the story experience it once created.

I do recommend trying a stay at Fort Wilderness. It is a lot of fun if family campground with Disney touches is your jam. We definitely plan to check out the new cabins, but yes I will mourn the thematic rustic log cabins of old.

I really appreciate your perspective. You’ve made some excellent points and reading everyone’s reasons for why they love Disney is one of favorite things, even if it’s not always in a positive light. You said this and I think it sums up most people’s feelings on change in the company…

I can like what it is; and still miss the story experience it once created.

This is at the heart of it I think. Memories are powerful things and completely romanticize the past. And it’s impossible to get the original magic you felt from those places out of your head. The reality will never live up to our memories and we will always want to get back to that feeling, it’s what keeps us coming back to Disney, time after time.

I guess the question is can Disney find the middle ground of honoring our memories, maintain its whimsy and charm and also usher in a new generation of families who don’t have those nostalgic feelings and probably prefer a more modern hotel aesthetic? It’s certainly cheaper and easier to go the latter route so probably not. But they’ve done decent jobs with BRV and VGF has been an overall success (BPK polarization aside). And then you have the de-theming of BWV and the general dislike of the look of cabins (I still kind of like them! But I agree they should have at least maintained a log cabin design on the outside. They are cabins, the word is right there). The potential silver lining might be that because BWV got such loud criticism, DVD might be rethinking their future plans a bit.

And your take on PVB v. the tower I totally agree with. It’s one of the many reasons it made sense, in my mind, to make it it a separate association. I like both but I see them very differently. But I guess people love CSR and are ok with the tower v. the casitas even though they feel like completely different hotels. I also think they should have spent a lot more time and money on increasing capacity in the amenities and resources around the building and adding to what was there, not take away. I’m still giving them the benefit of the doubt since we don’t know fully what they’re doing and hoping they’re taking note of all the grumbling of members and tweaking what they can, so we’ll see.

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

Not to beat a dead horse, but BPK was a huge wasted opportunity. I think the reason that a number of us dislike it is because it's all just hotel rooms, but not only that. It's just all the same. They most definitely could have spent the time to make the utility and layout much better (for the record, I much prefer the Deluxe Studios), but they didn't. However, at the least, if they were going to be hotel rooms, they could have at least done what most hotels do and give you the option of 1 King bed instead of 2 Queens. The 2 Queen layout just doesn't work for us. Now, I realize that for some, that is preferred and that's great, but they could have thrown in a few King's for some of us

Can’t argue with that. I don’t understand why when they send out all those surveys after every trip, they don’t ask members opinions on these simple things. I can’t imagine making some rooms with King beds would be difficult at all but they probably didn’t even think about it and it would’ve gone a long way if they asked us some basic opinions. I know this could open up a whole different can of worms but maybe be make it a once a year, longer survey we all get to participate in about the day to day things (and maybe a few bigger picture things) so then they have a read of the room. Even if they don’t listen to my opinion I’d at least know they were probably listening to others.

 

[Lorana]

And your take on PVB v. the tower I totally agree with. It’s one of the many reasons it made sense, in my mind, to make it it a separate association. I like both but I see them very differently. But I guess people love CSR and are ok with the tower v. the casitas even though they feel like completely different hotels. I also think they should have spent a lot more time and money on increasing capacity in the amenities and resources around the building and adding to what was there, not take away. I’m still giving them the benefit of the doubt since we don’t know fully what they’re doing and hoping they’re taking note of all the grumbling of members and tweaking what they can, so we’ll see.

On the plus side, at least they aren't getting rid of the long houses, and so you'll have the two sides that appeal to both sets of folks (though I could wish that they had longhouses with 1 & 2 BRs!).

I am hopeful that the tower will add more, but the existing architecture plans don't seem to include that. I think it'll be more along the lines of Riviera -- which maybe it is in-keeping with the theme, but seemed to me to lack a bit in the restaurant and recreation space.

Of course, I *was* desperately hoping they'd take the addition of the tower as a chance to add another lazy river into WDW, but alas, that is not to be! Especially as they seemed to borrow the design for Reflections. Reflections at least seemed to have lots of cool spaces built into its design, even if not everyone liked it. (To me, I felt that was sort of achieving that middle ground -- it was nature/wilderness-y enough that I was very excited for it, but also modern enough that it appealed to people who wanted something more contemporary, at least according to initial designs.)

We have yet to see what the interiors will really look like and how they paint the exterior. I hope it wows me more than, say, Riviera does (and I say that as owner).

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

On the plus side, at least they aren't getting rid of the long houses, and so you'll have the two sides that appeal to both sets of folks (though I could wish that they had longhouses with 1 & 2 BRs!).

I am hopeful that the tower will add more, but the existing architecture plans don't seem to include that. I think it'll be more along the lines of Riviera -- which maybe it is in-keeping with the theme, but seemed to me to lack a bit in the restaurant and recreation space.

Of course, I *was* desperately hoping they'd take the addition of the tower as a chance to add another lazy river into WDW, but alas, that is not to be! Especially as they seemed to borrow the design for Reflections. Reflections at least seemed to have lots of cool spaces built into its design, even if not everyone liked it. (To me, I felt that was sort of achieving that middle ground -- it was nature/wilderness-y enough that I was very excited for it, but also modern enough that it appealed to people who wanted something more contemporary, at least according to initial designs.)

We have yet to see what the interiors will really look like and how they paint the exterior. I hope it wows me more than, say, Riviera does (and I say that as owner).

Oh yeah I love the Riviera for a lot of different reasons but I definitely could do with a bit more punchy theming. Maybe with the soft goods refurbishment in a few years they’ll add some things. And as far as restaurants, they could have added more, yes, but I’ll take 2-3 great food options then a 5-6 mediocre ones. I’m sure I’m in the minority but I don’t really like any of the food options at the poly (not you Trader Sam’s, you keep staying great). And a lazy river would have been incredible but I guess they’re confined by the monorail and didn’t have enough room. If they can put a good splash area for kids it should still take some pressure from the main pool.

I feel like one of the reason they aren’t releasing any more detailed schematics or plans about the tower is because know they’re going to get a ton of feedback, to put it nicely. Can’t please everyone so might as well finish it when they can’t do anything about it

 

[RoseGold]

Not to beat a dead horse, but BPK was a huge wasted opportunity.

It was obvious when they didn't even try to fix the pervasive GF complaint for many years, the noise. They didn't even fix the giant door gaps. Quality was not the goal. Hey, it looked nice in the pictures, and wow it does look nice.

 

[we"reofftoneverland]

Two things:
1. owners dues will cover the renovations of the elevators, don't worry....
2. this is, in my opinion, at best, what we will get in 2042 when the resorts expire. Maybe not even a Reno before sales.

Uh— so you’re saying owner’s future dues should cover the wear and tear from the 30+ previous years where Disney fully owned and profited from the BPK section of the hotel? Lol.

 

[tidefan]

Uh— so you’re saying owner’s future dues should cover the wear and tear from the 30+ previous years where Disney fully owned and profited from the BPK section of the hotel? Lol.

I believe that was sarcasm (or that’s how I took it)

 

[CarolynFH]

Uh— so you’re saying owner’s future dues should cover the wear and tear from the 30+ previous years where Disney fully owned and profited from the BPK section of the hotel? Lol.

That’s how timeshare ownership works, isn’t it? VGF owners are now responsible for paying for necessary maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment of their buildings. Roof, HVAC, elevators, ….

 

[mkatsy]

That’s how timeshare ownership works, isn’t it? VGF owners are now responsible for paying for necessary maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment of their buildings. Roof, HVAC, elevators, ….

so, in 2042 when you have decrepit resort buildings coming off contract you just dump them in the trust and the nice DVC members will pay the upkeep ... what could be easier?

 

[Cfabar1]

so, in 2042 when you have decrepit resort buildings coming off contract you just dump them in the trust and the nice DVC members will pay the upkeep ... what could be easier?

exactly....

My comment above was part sarcasm/part resignation to the fact that BPK sold out so clearly what disney did was "good enough", and I say this as someone who bought VGF during the most recent sales this summer!

I'm also one of the people original owners don't care for that much, as I bought to stay in 1 BR and 2 BR units.

 

[CarolynFH]

so, in 2042 when you have decrepit resort buildings coming off contract you just dump them in the trust and the nice DVC members will pay the upkeep ... what could be easier?

Whether placed in a trust or sold as deeded like they were before, the cost to buy into the 2042 timeshare resorts will pay for any renovations that are done before sales start, just like the cost to buy in to Poly Tower will pay for its construction. And the dues will pay for ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how timeshares work.

(And the nightly cost to stay in a hotel or resort for cash covers its construction and ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how the hotel business works.)

 

[mkatsy]

Whether placed in a trust or sold as deeded like they were before, the cost to buy into the 2042 timeshare resorts will pay for any renovations that are done before sales start, just like the cost to buy in to Poly Tower will pay for its construction. And the dues will pay for ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how timeshares work.

(And the nightly cost to stay in a hotel or resort for cash covers its construction and ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how the hotel business works.)

Whether placed in a trust or sold as deeded like they were before, the cost to buy into the 2042 timeshare resorts will pay for any renovations that are done before sales start, just like the cost to buy in to Poly Tower will pay for its construction. And the dues will pay for ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how timeshares work.

(And the nightly cost to stay in a hotel or resort for cash covers its construction and ongoing maintenance, repairs, and refurbishment. That’s how the hotel business works.)

you just have to hope they actually do the important renovations .... we're talking about the people that put a beverage cooler in BPK.

 

[Lorana]

you just have to hope they actually do the important renovations .... we're talking about the people that put a beverage cooler in BPK.

I could possibly be okay with the lack of kitchenette if they had at least put a real mini-fridge and microwave in the room. (And had king bed options). And let’s not forget replacing real dishware in many of the studios with paper plates and bowls and plastic disposable cutlery.

 

[Sammie]

There’s no accounting for taste, that’s for sure.

LOL, that goes both ways

 

[Sammie]

Yep completely agree. I love the look and feel of the resort studios at BPK and don’t really mind not having the full kitchenette since we don’t really use them in a studio anyway, although I see why some don’t find them as useful. I love the current longhouses at PVB but really look forward to seeing what they actually do with the tower because it feels like it has so much potential, and it’s not even painted and prettied up yet!

And, I’ll be be honest, I’ve been super speculative of the cabins but sometimes you just have see it from a different perspective. I’ve been following @bama_ed current trip report and he just makes Fort Wilderness look so magical and welcoming and different in the best way from all the other resorts that I think I get it now. FW was never on my radar but now I’m really looking forward to doing a Halloween/holiday season trip over there in the next few years!

When something stops working for you, that’s totally valid to comment on, but making generalizations about everyone who continues to enjoy that same thing is unfair and unnecessary.

The thing that always boggles my mind is some think because they don't like something it should not exist. Not everything DVC does works for me, but not narcisstic enough to think it should not happen because of that.