Any Reformed FP- Uber Users Who Have Embraced FP+ ?

[Laketravis]

I'm a skeptic as well, but I have no reason to question anyone's experiences here. Short of photo documenting everything you do, there is no way to "prove" ones experience. I don't ask those who love FP+ to prove why they love it- they love it, that's their opinion, and whether I agree with it or my experience matches it is irrelevant. It doesn't change their experience.

The biggest difference is that some of us criticize systems and process, while others criticize the people who criticize those systems and process.

 

[Suvadoo]

The biggest difference is that some of us criticize systems and process, while others criticize the people who criticize those systems and process.

Great post: concisely states how I feel without being too verbose. I also love the Warren Buffet quote, do you think he was talking about FP+?

 

[wisblue]

I was among one of the first beta groups invited to participate in testing FP+ in the fall of 2011 and then again as part of an enhanced test that included additional resources like parades and fireworks in November of 2012.



I feel like that's a baited question. It wasn't in relation to what could have been previously accomplished at all, it was in relation to what was accomplished versus time in the park versus cost versus expectations versus etc. It was clear from the outset that the motivation was to persuade guests to spend more days on site. I found the strategy to be quite effective as we felt forced to do just that.

Thank you for the response.

That was not meant as a baited question at all. You said that you found that you accomplished LESS each day, and that indicates that you were comparing to something. The most natural comparison would be to what you were able to accomplish with a different system in a comparable amount of time using a comparable approach. Apparently that isn't what you meant.

 

[DisneyKidds]

I was among one of the first beta groups invited to participate in testing FP+ in the fall of 2011 and then again as part of an enhanced test that included additional resources like parades and fireworks in November of 2012......I found the strategy to be quite effective as we felt forced to do just that.

Lake, just trying to follow your timing/experiences as well. You participated in FP+ testing in the fall of 2011 and 2012. Any trips using FP+ in 2013? Then, based on your experience of getting less attractions in during your FP+ testing during those trips in 2011/2012 you extended your trip in 2014 to two weeks to accommodate the additional time required to get everything in WDW done utilizing FP+.

Is that an accurate summarization?

 

[erc]

The trouble with this thread is that the critics of FP+ have let us all know their dislike many pages ago some even going as far as to suggest that they may have to rethink their future WDW vacations and whether to spend their money elsewhere. And yet, here we still are.

A long time ago I had a buddy who had a girlfriend who cheated on him. And boy did he criticize her while sharing a lot of beers at my place after that. I said, time to move on, she wasn't worth your time. Over the next month I had to keep hearing about how awful his ex-girlfriend was. Eventually I made excuses so I wouldn't have to hear it anymore. I got it. She was the spawn of the devil. There is probably no changing her. Move on and don't look back.

 

[MrInfinity]

It was clear from the outset that the motivation was to persuade guests to spend more days on site. I found the strategy to be quite effective as we felt forced to do just that.

You felt forced to spend more days on site? Do you feel forced to buy things that are on sale when you walk thru a store? Do you feel forced to drive under the speed limit? Do you feel forced to buy a combo meal when you only want a sandwich because it's a better deal? This is all just normal life / marketing. Well-run companies will find a way to price their services such that you want to buy just a little bit more.

Nobody is forcing you. Disney is offering a product. And not a surprise, they've angled their product to be more beneficial for you the more days you stay at their resort. This doesn't mean you're being forced. It's all the consumer's choice still.

Of course you can certainly get more done by staying longer, but there is no basis to say "more" needs to be done, period. It's a vacation. You go to have fun. If you cannot do enough in a trip that justifies the expense, then you should not go. In no way is Disney forcing you to A) go, or B) stay more than you want to.

You booked every step along the way. At no point did anyone from Disney probly even suggest, let alone force, you to stay more days.

I guess I have just never felt forced to stay more days than I wanted to. We've steadily grown our trips because we are choosing to vacation longer knowing what we want to do -- not out of any obligation.

 

[Angel Ariel]

The trouble with this thread is that the critics of FP+ have let us all know their dislike many pages ago some even going as far as to suggest that they may have to rethink their future WDW vacations and whether to spend their money elsewhere. And yet, here we still are.

A long time ago I had a buddy who had a girlfriend who cheated on him. And boy did he criticize her while sharing a lot of beers at my place after that. I said, time to move on, she wasn't worth your time. Over the next month I had to keep hearing about how awful his ex-girlfriend was. Eventually I made excuses so I wouldn't have to hear it anymore. I got it. She was the spawn of the devil. There is probably no changing her. Move on and don't look back.

I may have criticisms of fp+, but I've never said I'm never going back to wdw, or that we are rethinking wdw vacations.

 

[Laketravis]

Lake, just trying to follow your timing/experiences as well. You participated in FP+ testing in the fall of 2011 and 2012. Any trips using FP+ in 2013? Then, based on your experience of getting less attractions in during your FP+ testing during those trips in 2011/2012 you extended your trip in 2014 to two weeks to accommodate the additional time required to get everything in WDW done utilizing FP+.

Is that an accurate summarization?

It's my fault that I gave the false impression that 2014 was the first year we decided to extend to two weeks.

Our participation in testing occurred over the course of those two years - 2011 and 2012. When I said we decided to extend our stays to 2 weeks "last year", I was referring to 2013; I haven't quite gotten use to the fact that it is already 2015!

 

[DisneyKidds]

Fuzzy......it's a Pavlovian thing, even Lake is not immune!

 

[Laketravis]

Fuzzy......it's a Pavlovian thing, even Lake is not immune!

Ruff.

Like I said - some of us criticize a system or process, some like to criticize each other.

 

[DisneyKidds]

Lake, thanks for clarifying. So you tested in 2011 and 2012, and based on how much less you got done on those two trips utilizing FP+ you extended your trip in 2013 to two weeks, given the additional time you anticipated needing to do what you wanted at WDW? Did you use FP+ in 2013? Was that 2013 trip all Disney, or were there days/nights at Uni? How about 2014, looks like that was a mix of Disney/Uni? Two weeks? Sorry for so many questions, but understanding the evolution of your FP+ experiences helps we understand where you are coming from.

 

[DisneyKidds]

Ruff. Like I said - some of us criticize a system or process, some like to criticize each other.

That wasn't a criticism, just an observation of the same systems and processes you applauded Disney for earlier. I ain't callin' anyone a dawg!

 

[erc]

I may have criticisms of fp+, but I've never said I'm never going back to wdw, or that we are rethinking wdw vacations.

Post 216, Suvadoo:

I'm seeing a lot of posts that say the same as you're reporting. Less attractions, less time in the parks and more time at the resorts.

I just don't think that's valuable. I can spend a lot less money for a better resort experience elsewhere. For the most part the WDW resorts are OK, but nothing spectacular. I go to WDW to be in the parks and on rides and if FP+ is limiting my access, then April will be my last trip.

 

[Laketravis]

Thank you for the response.

That was not meant as a baited question at all. You said that you found that you accomplished LESS each day, and that indicates that you were comparing to something. The most natural comparison would be to what you were able to accomplish with a different system in a comparable amount of time using a comparable approach. Apparently that isn't what you meant.

I suppose that was me and poor choice of words again; maybe this is a better way to explain it:

We saw that "based on what could be accomplished each day" we would need to spend more days at WDW in order to reduce the overall cost per day and bring the value equation more in line with what we felt we were being provided with.

Very similar to the the cost of air transportation, a fixed cost that diminishes per day when the day count is increased.

So if AP's and airfare are fixed costs regardless of the length of stay, the only variables left are meals and lodging. We have to eat anywhere we go, so let's just stick with lodging.

Long story short, we felt like we needed to reduce the daily cost of a WDW vacation from what was previously, say, $600 a day to more like $350 a day because at $350 per day we felt what we were getting in return was equitable; not $600 a day for 3 FP's.

When Disney said they wanted to persuade guests to spend more of their vacation days on-site and with them, they left it open as to how that might translate differently for different guests. They didn't attempt to define how that would happen or cost justify for every single guest.

I've explained how, in our case, it worked that way and therefore speaks to the success of their strategy. "Forced" to do so? Sure, in the same way I would feel forced to wait to buy the $2.00 item that I want until it's on sale for $1.00.

 

[Laketravis]

Lake, thanks for clarifying. So you tested in 2011 and 2012, and based on how much less you got done on those two trips utilizing FP+ you extended your trip in 2013 to two weeks, given the additional time you anticipated needing to do what you wanted at WDW?

Based on what we experienced during testing and upon the realization that it was going to be rolled out beyond beta, we decided the only way to tilt value back in our direction would be to stay longer.

Did you use FP+ in 2013?

We did.

Was that 2013 trip all Disney, or were there days/nights at Uni?

It was exclusively Disney. We've never been anywhere else in Orlando in over 40 years until a couple of weeks ago when we tried Uni.

How about 2014, looks like that was a mix of Disney/Uni? Two weeks?

The 2014 trip referenced was exclusively WDW. 11/20-12/5, so yes - two weeks. We then returned to Orlando on 12/30 to try Uni, stayed on-site there and did not leave. We considered a day trip over to WDW but could not reserve any of the FP's we wanted.

Sorry for so many questions, but understanding the evolution of your FP+ experiences helps we understand where you are coming from.

No problem, officer.

 

[Suvadoo]

Post 216, Suvadoo:

So what? You're holding Angel Ariel responsible for a comment I made? Does that make any sense?

Also I do stand by my comments. If I don't find value in my vacation time at WDW this April 2015 I will move on. What kind of fool would I be if I continued spending my disposable income at a place I no longer enjoyed?

Based on your comments, I'm getting the overall impression that you are sick of this conversation. especially when you use phrases like "beating a Dead horse". What I don't understand is if you are sick of this thread, why do you keep reading it and posting? why are you still hear if you don't find value?

 

[MrInfinity]

We saw that "based on what could be accomplished each day" we would need to spend more days at WDW in order to reduce the overall cost per day and bring the value equation more in line with what we were comfortable with.

Why should you be reducing the overall cost per day? Inflation goes up, not down. And luxury goods like vacations inflate more in growth periods than staple goods. So the cost of a vacation day would be increasing not decreasing.

Very similar to the the cost of air transportation, a fixed cost that diminishes per day when the day count is increased.

This is certainly the case at WDW. Ticket prices go from $100 the first day to around $10 on the 7th day.

So if AP's and airfare are fixed costs regardless of the length of stay, the only variables left are meals and lodging. We have to eat anywhere we go, so let's just stick with lodging.

If you have an AP then the economies of scale are even greater. In that case, the cost of the 1st day is some $600'ish, and the cost of any number of other days in the year is $0.

Lodging is fixed, pay per night.

We felt like we needed to reduce the daily cost of a WDW vacation from what was previously, say, $600 a day to more like $350 a day because at $350 per day we felt what we were getting in return was equitable;

If previously the cost was $600, 5 years ago, then one could expect $800 or $900 today. Not $350. Really my vacations work out to about $1000 per day, so this is in line with my expectations.

not $600 a day for 3 FP's.

This is nothing but a false sense of entitlement. You never "bought" Fast Passes, nor do you buy them, now. You pay to go to the park. Under FP+, one can get on as much as they did with FP-. Just because you choose not to is on you, not any sense of value. Many people (myself included) have no trouble getting on tons of stuff with minimal waiting.

We have even gotten to the crux of why you are not able to have similar success, and have concluded because it is that you choose to use none of the tools. You want to: go on busy days, skip rope drop, show up late, spend the busiest hours at the park, not utilize single-rider lines, and leave early. So by the same plan using FP-, you would have gotten on far less. Really. On busy days, I had no trouble pulling SDFPs to many awesome rides. So if you want to discuss how to get similar results, ppl out here can help you.

If you'd rather just conclude that because you are unable to do as much, FP+ is to blame, that is not a solid argument if others demonstrate that by many different plans they are able to enjoy just as much as before. They're using the same system successfully.

When Disney said they wanted to persuade guests to spend more of their vacation days on-site and with them, they left it open as to how that might translate differently for different guests.

You're referring to when WDW opened, right? Cuz this has been the goal all along. New technology has provided new ways in which the Disney Co can accomplish the same goals that have always been there.

I've explained how, in our case, it worked that way and therefore speaks to the success of their strategy. "Forced" to do so? Sure, in the same way I would feel forced to buy the $2.00 item that I want when it's on sale for $1.00.

So you agree you weren't forced to stay more then? You used forced to indicate you felt compelled to buy something you didn't necessarily need/want because it was strategically priced to induce such feelings...

 

[DisneyKidds]

No problem, sir, we appreciate your cooperation. On your 2011, 2012, and 2013 trips, when FP+ was not fully rolled out and FP- machines were available, did you use legacy FP in conjunction with your FP+ reservations?

 

[erc]

So what? You're holding Angel Ariel responsible for a comment I made? Does that make any sense?

No it doesn't. Which is why I never did it.

My quote that she assumed meant her:

some even going as far as to suggest that they may have to rethink their future WDW vacations and whether to spend their money elsewhere.

I would not even bother reading this thread anymore except I keep seeing it pop up to the top. Who doesn't love a good dead horse beating party?

 

[SmithSmith]

So it's okay to propose and discuss possible improvements, as long as it's just one?



Yet you'll bother to post a dissenting opinion as to alcohol in the parks and the negative effect it had on YOUR vacation on the same message board because that's constructive and helps someone plan a Disney Vacation?



Perhaps now you can understand the similarities between you observing or experiencing something you interpret as a negative and expressing an opinion about it on a message board, and someone else observing or experiencing something they interpret as a negative and expressing an opinion about it on the same message board.

Lake, I was just giving you my reasons why I have not offered up any possible solutions, nothing more.