Am I Being Unreasonable

[AZMermaid]

I mean how do parents working minimum wage jobs or barely over afford childcare?

I don't know. I have often wondered this. Most moms in my mom's group use another mom to watch their child and pay about $10-12 an hour and many of them are part time. I always wonder how they can afford that where I, as a teacher, can not. Not that I teach for the pay, but when I have #2 in Feb, Childcare for 2 is almost my whole salary- so I will be at home next year, which happens all the time in teaching. I may try to take on a kid for the $10/hr myself!

 

[Lewisc]

There are PLENTY of daycare situations that have that in the contract. You paid a certain amount of money to have those days available, and it doesn't matter if you don't take advantage of it, or can't take advantage of it b/c of illness. The spot is saved for your child, and you pay for that.

It's certainly reasonable to require the parent to pay if their child doesn't show up due to sickness or any other reason. The slot is saved for the kid.

I don't think it's reasonable to charge the parent if the daycare center is closed for the day. I understand the OP has a valid reason but the parent needs to find (and pay) someone else to care for their kid.

JMO but I think the OP needs to try find a way to get coverage for the days she needs to be closed.

to clarify for everyone...I charged a flat weekly rate. It wasn't daily. I am over the not being paid for sick days. Maybe I was wrong to insist on that but here's what I had written and typed up and she HAS a copy of..,

Please note that because of my extremely discounted rates, I cannot refund for sick time, holidays, nor can I take your child for extra days/hours without advance notice and an additional charge. Please understand that this is not intended to bankrupt the parents, but that I also must be able to support the household expenses among additional fees that are required in order for me to keep my child care license in effect and this is difficult to do due to the restraints that providing such a discount puts on me and my family. I want, however, to ensure that all parents have equal access to care during our economical crisis, and thus have developed this financial plan in order to offer my services to those families who are in need.

she claims this little blurb was left out. It was not. That's what irks me. She lies! She's lied several times to me and yes I feel I was greatly taken advantag of. Her child is very high needs. She thinks he's not. She thinks autism is something that he'll just outgrow. I understand wanting to believe that as a mother but she lies to the child care providers about him. It is NOT easy to change his diapers. He had a very bad accident the first time and took his diaper off and smeared it everywhere. My baby daughter wound up getting in it and I was livid. I told his mother and she laughed at it. I felt the nerve! He once ran outside, just opened the door and left. I told her...she laughed. I am just glad to be done.

I'd interpret that to mean you won't refund if the child doesn't show up due to the child being sick. It's not reasonable to think you can close for a non-scheduled day (sickness in your family) and still charge.

It sounds like the child wasn't worth it. Sounds like you're not appreciated and were underpaid.

That doesn't change the fact that most of us don't agree with your original question. You don't get to close with little or no notice and get paid for that day.

 

[luvthemouse71]

There's a sense of entitlement among some parents who use daycare. If you are unable to pay the reasonable rate for childcare( and anything below minimum wage is unreasonable)you shouldn't have had kids. You shouldn't expect other people to cut you a break. We see here all the time that people jump in and tell others that they shouldn't plan a trip due to finances being bad. To me, same thing with children. You have to realize that kids cost money, lots of it.

 

[mjkacmom]

I'm glad, for your sake, that you are done with her.

BUT, if you are going to get another client, make sure that someone (e.g. a lawyer like someone suggested above) reads your contract. I (as a client) wuld have read "sick time" as a time when my child was sick and "holidays" as a time when I went on holiday - not when you were sick/on holiday. In other words, as times when I choose not to send my child to you, not as times when you choose not to take my child. I know that "choose" is not really the right word when your son is sick, but it is the best I can think of.

That is exactly how I read it, although it really doesn't matter, since she didn't sign it. How are you going to prove she read it? I think you need some help with the contract, making it more specific. Do you watch any other children, or was this a one time deal? You definitely undercharged her, but I don't know why she should pay you if you couldn't watch her child. Are you licensed?

 

[disykat]

I mean how do parents working minimum wage jobs or barely over afford childcare?

It's tough. They do end up somewhere where the sitter is watching multiple children though. Individual child care, like the OP was providing, costs more.

 

[Praying Colonel]

to update everyone....she quit this morning. Brought him and said his last day would be tomorrow. I decided it's today. I am not picking him up from school or doing tomorrow because she refuses to pay me. She said that in my original contract there was never anything about sick pay. BS! I have a copy. I reread it. I never made her sign it. That was my fault. She never mentioned being sorry for the damages her son made or anything. I am done. I appreciate everyone's advice. She refuses to pay me for the 2 weeks notice. I don't believe I can enforce that. Can I?

IMHO you are well rid of her and you can chalk this up as a learning experience. I'm sure you now see the importance of having a written agreement and the next experience will be better.

 

[mjkacmom]

It's tough. They do end up somewhere where the sitter is watching multiple children though. Individual child care, like the OP was providing, costs more.

I don't think this is considered individual care (which I've paid for - the sitter comes to me, and watches my children only). The OP has her own children, as well, so I would consider this a home group daycare situation.

 

[5forDis]

Peanutsmommy-I am glad you are no longer dealing with her. My guess is she will come crawling back to you so be prepared to say NO.

I hope the next child(ren)'s parents work more cooperatively with you and appreciate you!

 

[AZMermaid]

There's a sense of entitlement among some parents who use daycare. If you are unable to pay the reasonable rate for childcare( and anything below minimum wage is unreasonable)you shouldn't have had kids. You shouldn't expect other people to cut you a break. We see here all the time that people jump in and tell others that they shouldn't plan a trip due to finances being bad. To me, same thing with children. You have to realize that kids cost money, lots of it.

This is a harsh opinion, but I actually mostly agree with you-especially for 1:1 or small group care. The state ratio for 6 year olds is 1:20. So, if she has 20 kids, then obviously she can not give the attention to that one (not OP situation at all) and a lower rate like $3-4/hr seems ok to me. My daycare has a 1:4 ratio in the toddler room and that is a true 1:4 (often 1:3)- not 2:8, so I pay more than say the Kindercare I looked at that had 3:12. But, I still pay less than I would for 1:2 with a mom wacthing her kid and mine. So, it has to be a balance. If you can not afford to pay for small group, you should not expect/demand things that would be provided. Decent safe care, yes, but face it, there is a difference between watching 2 kids vs watching 6.

It is like going to WDW, you can pay for a room, but there is a vast difference between POP and the Poly. Both are places to sleep- but if you pay more, you get more.

I totally agree that a daycare provider should be making AT LEAST min wage from the combined total of all her kids, after her expenses.

 

[DisneyEater]

Please note that because of my extremely discounted rates, I cannot refund for sick time, holidays, nor can I take your child for extra days/hours without advance notice and an additional charge. Please understand that this is not intended to bankrupt the parents, but that I also must be able to support the household expenses among additional fees that are required in order for me to keep my child care license in effect and this is difficult to do due to the restraints that providing such a discount puts on me and my family. I want, however, to ensure that all parents have equal access to care during our economical crisis, and thus have developed this financial plan in order to offer my services to those families who are in need.

The bolded part of the statement would bother me. You are expecting to be paid for extra hours, but not for hours you don't work. To me you need to pick one or another. I think it is reasonable to be paid for the extra hours but not if you will be closed.

 

[sam_gordon]

It's certainly reasonable to require the parent to pay if their child doesn't show up due to sickness or any other reason. The slot is saved for the kid.

I don't think it's reasonable to charge the parent if the daycare center is closed for the day. I understand the OP has a valid reason but the parent needs to find (and pay) someone else to care for their kid.

In my area (and my kids have been through four different daycares), we pay a set fee per week.
If the child does not attend daycare for reasons of the parent's choosing (sick, "vacation", holiday, etc), you still pay for that day (to "hold the slot").
If the daycare is scheduled to be closed for a day (generally a holiday... Memorial Day, 4th of July, Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc), you still pay the same rate.
If the daycare is closed for an unscheduled reason (snow/ice on the roads, mechanical failure (AC or heat), etc), we generally got credit for the missed day (since we had to pay extra if kids were in all day vs. after school, we could use the credit on those days).

However, this only happened a handful of times (and at a single daycare) over the last 13 years. That's one advantage of an actual daycare instead of a person taking care of kids in a home... if a care giver is sick or otherwise can't perform their job, a daycare can shift things around to cover. Someone operating out of their home can't do that.

 

[mdsoccermom]

You need to let go of the fact that she doesn't want to pay for that day. Besides the fact that your contract is worded very poorly, she did not sign anything. She never actually agreed to this contract you provided. You have no proof of agreement or that she ever read it.

I would consider this a lesson learned. Now, you should get professional assistance in writing a real contract.

 

[wgeo]

Peanutsmommy -

I was an at home child care provider for years, and the issue of feeling taken for granted and not appreciated is a big one. You need to be careful with the wording of your contract, once you start saying your services are "discounted" or at a "special low rate" you will get people who want to see how far they can push that.

But on a much more important note - one that I don't think was mentioned in the last 7 pages of this thread! -- you ABSOLUTELY MUST REQUIRE for all future clients, that you are paid on MONDAY for the upcoming week. Do not ever ever enter into a contract where you get paid for doing the work until after the week ends. It is very likely that more than once you will end up watching a kid and not ever getting paid for it. Also - for your protection NEVER watch a child without a signed contract and signed medical waivers - EVER! Doesn't matter if you are licensed or not, you need those!

FWIW - if I or my kids were sick, I didn't charge for that day, and since my parents paid on Monday, I would give them a credit for the next week if I had an unexpected closing.

 

[BrerMom]

Peanutsmommy-I am glad you are no longer dealing with her. My guess is she will come crawling back to you so be prepared to say NO.

I hope the next child(ren)'s parents work more cooperatively with you and appreciate you!

to both of these!

I don't know. I have often wondered this. Most moms in my mom's group use another mom to watch their child and pay about $10-12 an hour and many of them are part time. I always wonder how they can afford that where I, as a teacher, can not. Not that I teach for the pay, but when I have #2 in Feb, Childcare for 2 is almost my whole salary- so I will be at home next year, which happens all the time in teaching. I may try to take on a kid for the $10/hr myself!

When I had two in daycare or one in daycare and one in all-day preschool, my entire salary went to daycare/preschool and gas. So frustrating. Taking a year off isn't really an option in our district as every mom that has gone this route has been assigned multiple buildings or multiple classrooms upon returning. It's just not worth it.

But on a much more important note - one that I don't think was mentioned in the last 7 pages of this thread! -- you ABSOLUTELY MUST REQUIRE for all future clients, that you are paid on MONDAY for the upcoming week. Do not ever ever enter into a contract where you get paid for doing the work until after the week ends. It is very likely that more than once you will end up watching a kid and not ever getting paid for it. Also - for your protection NEVER watch a child without a signed contract and signed medical waivers - EVER! Doesn't matter if you are licensed or not, you need those!

Another idea would be to have them pay for two weeks of service when they sign the original contract. Most home daycare situations I've seen end unhappily as you've described. Most parents don't want an unhappy babysitter spending time with their kid, so they just leave instead of giving two weeks notice. With this set-up, if they give you two weeks notice, they get their "deposit" back (or their last two weeks free). If they don't, you are still covered and don't have to deal with a sudden loss of income.

 

[luvthemouse71]

OP, if this is something you'd like to do professionally, go through state licensure. Some states even have unions for state licensed childcare providers. It can be a long process, but it may be worth it.

 

[Lewisc]

The OP asked if she's being unreasonable. She wants to charge for daycare for a day in which she decided not provide daycare because one of her kids was sick and the OP didn't want to care for the child that day. Obviously the parents had to make other arrangements.

I think the only posters in this thread who didn't think she's being unreasonable (in that regard) didn't read the OP carefully enough and thought the child being cared for was sick and the parents didn't want to utilize the OPs services that day.

Many of us think the OP was undercharging and would be better off without that child. Doesn't change the fact that the OP was being unreasonable.
It almost sounds like she was looking for an excuse to get rid of the kid. Makes some sense but the OP created the mess. Sick days are paid for by the employer. They're indirectly paid for by the customer in the form of slightly higher prices. Your hairdresser cancels an appointment because she's sick. You don't drop by and leave the money at the shop. An employer will typically have other employees work harder, have an employee scheduled to be off work or even hire a temp.

Parents are counting on the OP. In a perfect world she'd have someone cover for her.

 

[pixiewings71]

I work outside the home and I don't get sick days. When my girls were in daycare I did not pay their provider for sick days and I had to call in sick to stay home with them. Or work half a day and have DBF (who is not the kids' bio-father) work half a day. My daycare provider took specific days off that she got paid for, these were days like Christmas Eve, Christmas, New Year's Eve, New Year's Day, Thanksgiving and the day after, your "standard" holidays, she also took her birthday off and requested to be paid for it. I didn't agree with that but since she added that in the last year of working with her I signed the contract anyway. She also gave herself 1 week of vacation.......
If you want to be taken seriously, you need to be licensed (unless your state will allow you to care for 1 family in your home without a license) and you need to have a contract that she signs. And yes, since you use your vehicle and gas I feel you should be paid more than you are......

As to being unreasonable, I honestly do not think you should be paid for a day you take as a sick day. As a parent I would either have to take the day off or pay someone else to care for my child, last minute care is very hard to find (around here) and is normally charged at a double rate. Or that was the case when my girls were in daycare.....

 

[3pletprincesses]

I have a home daycare and if I'm closed other then for my planned vacation or stat holidays, the parents don't pay. It's plain and simple. When my kids are home sick, I will call the parents to advise of the situation but they still have the option to drop off their kids. If their kids are sick with the flu or something like strep, they are not welcome and my contract says so and everyone understands it. Some parents will bring their kids no matter what is going on in my house and no matter how sick my kids are even when they are home. Others will avoid daycare to keep their kids healthy. It's their choice when my kids are sick. Now if I'm sick, daycare is closed without pay.

 

[peanutsmommy10]

well she called cps and the school, or so she says and reported me. For what I don't know? I am infuriated. I have always treated her child with kindness and caring and she knows that. can I get her for filing a false report? What may happen now?

 

[peanutsmommy10]

Oh just wanted to add that no she didn't pay me for the missed day. I didn't care about that. But in my agreement she was given weeks ago, it stated 2 weeks notice with pay. She is not honoring that. I'm not sure if I can/should go after her for it. She didn't sign. Basically I just want to be done with her but I don't need the hassle of cps and all. I've never given her just cause. It just isn't fair or right.