Alligator Incident Discussion/Fence being built at Grand Floridian?

[GPC0321]

Not true! It's also Disney's responsibility.

To an extent. It isn't their responsibility to remind guests of every conceivable danger that might occur while they are visiting WDW.
The way some people on here talk, they'd be wary of bodies of water almost anywhere in Florida OUTSIDE of Disney property. But for some reason, they thought Disney had some magical way of keeping alligators from entering it's 40+ square miles of property (large portions of it undeveloped) and the extensive network of waterways located there. It's nonsensical to think that way. If you know there are gators in Florida, and you know that WDW is in Florida, then you should be able to figure out there are gators in WDW.
But I will agree with you that Disney, in hindsight, should've been more proactive about informing guests of the gator presence and risks, and enforcing the rule to stay out of the various bodies of water near the "beaches" at the resorts. That is being done now, and that's really all they can do. They cannot bring back those people's child, though I'm sure they wish they could. All they can do now is try to prevent anything like this from happening again.

 

[GrammyJudy]

I know they have installed new fencing and signage at the Grand Floridian. But are they also going to install it at the other resorts on Bay Lake and what about around the lake at Carribean Beach Resort?

 

[brittanidp]

There's a post showing the roped off beach at BCV so I'd assume that all will be

 

[DLgal]

I keep seeing photos of kids wading in that water. And all the captions are the same: "my child did the same thing in the same place!"

However, EVERY picture shows this occurring during the daytime. The fact that this happened at NIGHT is precisely the issue.

During the day, besides the water being inherently gross, there was no chance this would have happened. Gators don't hunt in daylight. The gator would have been seen in the daytime.

It is probably completely safe to wade in that water a couple inches, during the DAY. Once you are 6"+ deep, though...not a good idea due to snakes.

But getting in there at NIGHT? Bad idea. Very, very bad. Do people routinely let their young kids splash around in that lagoon at NIGHT? Is that a common occurrence? I ask honestly because I have never been to those hotel beaches at night.

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

To an extent. It isn't their responsibility to remind guests of every conceivable danger that might occur while they are visiting WDW.
The way some people on here talk, they'd be wary of bodies of water almost anywhere in Florida OUTSIDE of Disney property. But for some reason, they thought Disney had some magical way of keeping alligators from entering it's 40+ square miles of property (large portions of it undeveloped) and the extensive network of waterways located there. It's nonsensical to think that way. If you know there are gators in Florida, and you know that WDW is in Florida, then you should be able to figure out there are gators in WDW.
But I will agree with you that Disney, in hindsight, should've been more proactive about informing guests of the gator presence and risks, and enforcing the rule to stay out of the various bodies of water near the "beaches" at the resorts. That is being done now, and that's really all they can do. They cannot bring back those people's child, though I'm sure they wish they could. All they can do now is try to prevent anything like this from happening again.

Look at the extensive warnings on signs that Disney has had in place for riding many of their rides yet nothing about alligators in the waters in front of their resorts. They made an executive decision not to warn their guests and it unfortunately was the wrong decision.

 

[Lynne M]

I keep seeing photos of kids wading in that water. And all the captions are the same: "my child did the same thing in the same place!"

However, EVERY picture shows this occurring during the daytime. The fact that this happened at NIGHT is precisely the issue.

During the day, besides the water being inherently gross, there was no chance this would have happened. Gators don't hunt in daylight. The gator would have been seen in the daytime.

It is probably completely safe to wade in that water a couple inches, during the DAY. Once you are 6"+ deep, though...not a good idea due to snakes.

But getting in there at NIGHT? Bad idea. Very, very bad. Do people routinely let their young kids splash around in that lagoon at NIGHT? Is that a common occurrence? I ask honestly because I have never been to those hotel beaches at night.

I've seen kids splashing in the water in the daytime, but never at night. I don't think I've seen an adult in the water at night. Unless I'm mis-remembering, the beach area isn't particularly well-lit at night.

But this is an excellent point. Alligators don't really want to be around humans or the commotion they cause. The beaches are pretty busy, and noisy during the day.

A kid by themselves in the water, at night, on a dark stretch of beach? Entirely different situation.

 

[Spoiledraf]

Look at the extensive warnings on signs that Disney has had in place for riding many of their rides yet nothing about alligators in the waters in front of their resorts. They made an executive decision not to warn their guests and it unfortunately was the wrong decision.

I believe the term for that is risk management. There are so many opportunities for injury within the park if people ignore warnings. It's up to the lawyers and bean counters and risk management team to decide to what extent people should be given the opportunity to use their own common sense to enjoy the Magic. In an effort to preserve the natural beach effect, Disney "chose" to be soft on signage and enforcement. It seemed like a solid policy until a 2 year old boy crossed paths with an aggressive alligator. Now it's time to reassess their strategy and go a little more accurate with the true risk at the waters edge.
I have to say I have fished, skied, jet skied and did some hang gliding on Bay Lake and Seven Seas lagoon. Never saw a gator and I was looking. And while I was never afraid of an attack, I was aware of the possibility. But like most visitors, I was surprised by this incident. Lulled into the illusion that it just couldn't happen at Disney. I would still do all those things but there will be a little more respect for what could be an unhappy results.

 

[amg35]

Are you kidding me!!! A child just died and it will be Disney executives and attorneys who will be making these decisions. Too bad if people are inconvenienced!

Listen, you want to go that route? Innocent children are killed EVERY DAY by things we can actually get rid of, but people would find it inconvenient.

Jesus, enough, place the outrage in life where it should be.

And that's all I'll say.

 

[Lynne M]

Not sure that works, either. Gators... are pretty good with fences. Curved fences are a best bet, but nature does tend to adapt.

I think everyone's faith that Disney will come up with a magic solution, on the fly, that looks good and is wildly effective when no solution that is either exists today, is misguided. Disney property isn't a place to pilot new systems, and I'm fairly sure there's got to have been multiple university studies about gator barriers already done at multiple southern universities, because gators like to move into retaining pools in golf course communities and senior communities.

(Note: Lynne, not addressing the faith comment at you so much as the number of people who seem to think Disney can legitimately keep every gator out, and do it elegantly. The solution does not exist. And it is unlikely they pilot such a solution in large scale on Disney property, or invent one on such extremely short notice when I've no doubt research has been being done elsewhere for years.)

This is a good point. Keeping every gator out, and preserving the view/atmosphere/theming is probably close to impossible. You'd need to completely ring the lagoon with an unclimbable wall. And Bay Lake. And Crescent Lake by the Boardwalk, YC/BC, S&D. And the waterways that run through Disney Springs, OKW, SSR, POR/POFQ, and the big lagoon at CBR, and the one at CSR. And Hourglass Lake by AoA/Pop. And what about the World Showcase Lagoon?

One thing that really struck me when I started exploring the Orlando area is how many lakes, ponds, lagoons, retaining ponds there are. Water is EVERYWHERE. In housing developments, golf courses, shopping centers, heck, there are probably some right near schools. And I don't recall seeing big fences around them, either.

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

Listen, you want to go that route? Innocent children are killed EVERY DAY by things we can actually get rid of, but people would find it inconvenient.

Jesus, enough, place the outrage in life where it should be.

And that's all I'll say.

I have done just that!

 

[amg35]

I have done just that!

Yep, I see that.

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

Yep.

So, I'll say it. If they do anything more besides a fence and warning signs because of this I would find that very annoying and it would bum me out. I won't say I'll be angry because that's a tad dramatic .

No loungers, no beaches??? People....please, use rational thought. An alligator is not going to crawl up on to the beach, away from the water with all the people there and attack you.

Why, why do we always have to give in to the irrational fears of a few. Ruin everything. (There's the drama)

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

Yep.

So, I'll say it. If they do anything more besides a fence and warning signs because of this I would find that very annoying and it would bum me out. I won't say I'll be angry because that's a tad dramatic .

No loungers, no beaches??? People....please, use rational thought. An alligator is not going to crawl up on to the beach, away from the water with all the people there and attack you.

Why, why do we always have to give in to the irrational fears of a few. Ruin everything. (There's the drama)

So you would be annoyed and bummed out because there might not be beaches or loungers? Ruin everything? Are you kidding me. Can you imagine what the parents of this little boy are feeling?

 

[amg35]

So you would be annoyed and bummed out because there might not be beaches or loungers? Ruin everything? Are you kidding me. Can you imagine what the parents of this little boy are feeling?

Yes, I would. Has nothing to do with what their feelings might be, they have every right to their feelings and I would never expect them to be reasonable about this situation. But as a rational, thinking adult, I can see the tragedy for what it was, and have faith in the fact that most people would be able to following simple signage and roped off beaches to know not to go in the water.

So I'm done now because this is starting to take me in a direction I don't want to go , but you guys, I wish we could be this passionate about the loss of all innocent lives that are actually a common occurrence, children and adults, where we can make real changes that matter...

 

[KBinCO]

Wasn't so miniscule this week was it? Tell that to the little boy's parents. I hope they never read these boards!

How is this remotely offensive? It's not minimizing the tragedy whatsoever.

So you would be annoyed and bummed out because there might not be beaches or loungers? Ruin everything? Are you kidding me. Can you imagine what the parents of this little boy are feeling?

What does how the boy's parents feel have to do with what Disney does with the "beaches"?

 

[wdwrule]

I've seen kids splashing in the water in the daytime, but never at night. I don't think I've seen an adult in the water at night. Unless I'm mis-remembering, the beach area isn't particularly well-lit at night.

But this is an excellent point. Alligators don't really want to be around humans or the commotion they cause. The beaches are pretty busy, and noisy during the day.

A kid by themselves in the water, at night, on a dark stretch of beach? Entirely different situation.

I think that's just the thing....kids splashing at water's edge during day since the sign just says "no swimming", then also splashing at water's edge at night with families not knowing, including myself, that alligators hunt at night. So glad they're putting up more specific signs other than the vague "no swimming" signs. I like how it's "readable" too for families visiting from all over the world.

 

[brertoad]

I keep seeing photos of kids wading in that water. And all the captions are the same: "my child did the same thing in the same place!"

However, EVERY picture shows this occurring during the daytime. The fact that this happened at NIGHT is precisely the issue.

During the day, besides the water being inherently gross, there was no chance this would have happened. Gators don't hunt in daylight. The gator would have been seen in the daytime.

It is probably completely safe to wade in that water a couple inches, during the DAY. Once you are 6"+ deep, though...not a good idea due to snakes.

But getting in there at NIGHT? Bad idea. Very, very bad. Do people routinely let their young kids splash around in that lagoon at NIGHT? Is that a common occurrence? I ask honestly because I have never been to those hotel beaches at night.

No. I haven't seen anyone let their kid in the water at night, this is exactly part of the problem. Some people seem to equate daytime splashing and nighttime splashing as equivalent: WRONG... not the same, and certainly not the same to a gator. To me this is nighttime lake splashing behavior is unheard of, total insanity.

All the people who are now paranoid about gator attacks, the answer is pretty simple, keep out of the water, don't splash around the lake at night and act like prey.

This was a horrible tragedy, and no one should be a victim to a gator. It is preventable.

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

http://video.latino.foxnews.com/v/4...ney-be-held-liable-for-the-alligator-attack/#


A judge explaining Disneys liability in the death of this child

 

[DLgal]

So you would be annoyed and bummed out because there might not be beaches or loungers? Ruin everything? Are you kidding me. Can you imagine what the parents of this little boy are feeling?

So the feelings of the boy's family means, literally, millions of WDW visitors every year deserve their vacation experiences to be diminished, now and in the future, for what essentially boils down to a bad judgment THEY made?

Sorry, don't think so. Kids have died at WDW before. Life goes on for everyone else.

 

[Boardwalk Tigger]

So the feelings of the boy's family means, literally, millions of WDW visitors every year deserve their vacation experiences to be diminished, now and in the future, for what essentially boils down to a bad judgment THEY made?

Sorry, don't think so. Kids have died at WDW before. Life goes on for everyone else.

Wow!!! What is wrong with you? You might want to be more compassionate and you clearly don't understand the law. Listen to a judge explain Disneys liability here. Posted above. It is Disney who made the bad judgement!