All FP machines to be removed from Animal Kingdom by next week and....

[clsteve]

I agree, I wrote this above as well. I've been working backwards from what Disney is doing to try to figure out how it will all end up (just out of my own curiosity). I thought the patent helped put their current actions in perspective. After reading the patent, I think there are going to be some more surprises coming down the road as well, some not so welcome ones. JMO of course.

And it answers a lot of the questions people have asked and has direct implications for those at DAK starting tomorrow, like:

Why can't we just select one FP+? Because Disney wants control of where you are in the Park and when - FP1, FP2, and FP3 are connected. So, it isn't just a system that displays the next available time for an FP, they and the time choices are interlocked by underlying business rules.

 

[pilferk]

If I understand correctly what you are describing, that is exactly what I was able to do with 10 day park hoppers at the 60 day mark over a two+ week stay.

I made FP+ reservations for day 1, skipped some days, and made our 10th ticket day reservations on day 14.

If I recall correctly, the span of the allowed calendar days was equal to our resort reservation (14 days). It wouldn't let me schedule FP+ beyond that, but it would let me schedule FP's over a span of more than 10 days.

Yup, that's pretty much what I meant.

I'd love to see what would happen without the resort stay being a limiting factor. That way we could see if it was the ticket restriction limiting you to 14 days or just the resort stay. Just interesting to see which you were bumping up against.

There'd be a very narrow opportunity for the above to get tested...a 15+ day resort stay using multi day, non-expiration tickets (meaning not an AP). But maybe some of our overseas visitors might get a chance...

 

[ArwenMarie]

Again, the patent application covers capabilities of the system. Some of the testing going on now helps to see how those capabilities are preforming.

The results of those tests, including how guest experience is affected, will help Disney to determine what features to put in place. And, just because they put a feature into place at one time doesn't mean they can't change it later.

Didn't everyone always anticipate that a distinction between onsite and offsite guests was possible, if not likely? So, why should we be surprised that the patent application includes the possibility of this distinction?

Same thing with different treatment for things like Disney Visa cardholders. Those cardholders have always had access to various discounts and special deals (like the free photo). How surprising is it that Disney would at least consider giving those cardholders a perk relating to more or earlier access to FP+ reservations. That is exactly like fan clubs of a performer getting first crack at a block of concert tickets.

Actually, no, not on here anyway. Many people seem to think that offsite will eventually come on the system and get to prebook at 60 days as well. Well, at least I thought that. I'm not so sure now, based on the recent actions and events (esp the DAK test.) The patent is just another clue in the mystery. (Disclaimer: According to how I have been reading things anyway, obviously just my opinion.)

 

[FlipHipster]

If I understand correctly what you are describing, that is exactly what I was able to do with 10 day park hoppers at the 60 day mark over a two+ week stay.

I made FP+ reservations for day 1, skipped some days, and made our 10th ticket day reservations on day 14.

If I recall correctly, the span of the allowed calendar days was equal to our resort reservation (14 days). It wouldn't let me schedule FP+ beyond that, but it would let me schedule FP's over a span of more than 10 days.

Yeah, I tried it too, just to see what would happen, wouldn't let me select a day past our resort checkout day. I thought about the AP issue and just assumed they will implement rules for that.

 

[amylevan]

Yup, that's pretty much what I meant.

I'd love to see what would happen without the resort stay being a limiting factor. That way we could see if it was the ticket restriction limiting you to 14 days or just the resort stay. Just interesting to see which you were bumping up against.

There'd be a very narrow opportunity for the above to get tested...a 15+ day resort stay using multi day, non-expiration tickets (meaning not an AP). But maybe some of our overseas visitors might get a chance...

We are now less than 60 days out, but I can try on my parents' reservation if you are interested. They have a campground site reserved for 17 nights, but only have 10 day tickets. I already reserved FP+ for them for the 8 days we are with them, but they have 2 more park days that I haven't done any reserving for. I can try to make reservations for the last couple of days if you are interested. (But note that they are now at like 40 days until arrival.)

 

[pilferk]

And it answers a lot of the questions people have asked and has direct implications for those at DAK starting tomorrow, like:

Why can't we just select one FP+? Because Disney wants control of where you are in the Park and when - FP1, FP2, and FP3 are connected. So, it isn't just a system that displays the next available time for an FP, they and the time choices are interlocked by underlying business rules.

You can't GET just one..but you can USE just one.

Agree, there are dependencies and limitations that offshoot from that.

But if you're set on only getting a FP for EE, and NOTHING else in ANY other park that day...you get your FP for EE, and select two things you never intend to use.

Not like Disney's going to track you down and make you use them, or charge you like they do for a missed ADR.

I mentioned in a previous post: We have an "empty" day at Epcot that I will be making FP+ for after we bridge most of our parties tickets from 5 day to 6 day tickets.

My intent? Make an FP+ for TT and 2 other things we'll never use. Because it's our 2nd day in Epcot and, mostly, we're there for World Showcase and Illuminations that night.

FW will be mostly done on our first day..and we already have FP+ to Soarin, Space, and Crush.

Granted, there are ramifications to Disney's system and throughput because of that, but...honestly..that's "their fault", and thus, their problem to deal with.

 

[pilferk]

We are now less than 60 days out, but I can try on my parents' reservation if you are interested. They have a campground site reserved for 17 nights, but only have 10 day tickets. I already reserved FP+ for them for the 8 days we are with them, but they have 2 more park days that I haven't done any reserving for. I can try to make reservations for the last couple of days if you are interested. (But note that they are now at like 40 days until arrival.)

That'd be great!

Really, the best test would be to try to make an FP+ for 15 days after the FIRST set of FP+'s you made for them, if possible. Because, while they might be at the resort/campground, technically their linked 10 day, non expiration tickets would be "expired" (14 days past first use).

If you can't...just because the timings don't work out around their stay and you don't want to mess things up...no worries!

For example, I think ift heir first FP was set for today, Dec 17th ,you'd want to try to make a FP+ for Jan 1? Someone confirm that math? Or would it be the 2nd? I always get confused on how Disney counts "days after". Where's CheshireFigment when you need 'em?

 

[amylevan]

That'd be great!

Really, the best test would be to try to make an FP+ for 15 days after the FIRST set of FP+'s you made for them, if possible. Because, while they might be at the resort/campground, technically their linked 10 day, non expiration tickets would be "expired" (14 days past first use).

If you can't...just because the timings don't work out around their stay and you don't want to mess things up...no worries!

For example, I think ift heir first FP was set for today, Dec 17th ,you'd want to try to make a FP+ for Jan 1? Someone confirm that math? Or would it be the 2nd? I always get confused on how Disney counts "days after". Where's CheshireFigment when you need 'em?

As luck would have it, the website keeps bouncing me out and the only smartphone we own is at work with my DH. I will try again later and let you know.

 

[doconeill]

That'd be great!

Really, the best test would be to try to make an FP+ for 15 days after the FIRST set of FP+'s you made for them, if possible. Because, while they might be at the resort/campground, technically their linked 10 day, non expiration tickets would be "expired" (14 days past first use).

If you can't...just because the timings don't work out around their stay and you don't want to mess things up...no worries!

For example, I think ift heir first FP was set for today, Dec 17th ,you'd want to try to make a FP+ for Jan 1? Someone confirm that math? Or would it be the 2nd? I always get confused on how Disney counts "days after". Where's CheshireFigment when you need 'em?

It's 14 days, inclusive. So if it blocks at 14 days because it is an expiring ticket, Dec. 30th would be the last possible ticket day for one used today. So if it allows FP+ on the 31st, then they've forgotten something.

 

[Laketravis]

You can't GET just one..but you can USE just one.

Not like Disney's going to track you down and make you use them, or charge you like they do for a missed ADR.

Maybe not. But they will know that you didn't use them and when they begin to collect data on what reservations people made but didn't actually use, there are even more possible ways they can use that information to motivate/reward/penalize guest behavior.

 

[pilferk]

It's 14 days, inclusive. So if it blocks at 14 days because it is an expiring ticket, Dec. 30th would be the last possible ticket day for one used today. So if it allows FP+ on the 31st, then they've forgotten something.

Thanks!!

 

[FlipHipster]

Actually, no, not on here anyway. Many people seem to think that offsite will eventually come on the system and get to prebook at 60 days as well. Well, at least I thought that. I'm not so sure now, based on the recent actions and events (esp the DAK test.) The patent is just another clue in the mystery. (Disclaimer: According to how I have been reading things anyway, obviously just my opinion.)

Eh, I need to refresh my memory, but I am pretty sure all Staggs and company have promised is "access to FP+" for everyone with an active ticket. "Access" is a loaded word and intentionally vague.

I'm still in the camp that they will offer FP perks for onsite either adv. booking or more tier 2's or maybe even an extra tier 1/day etc. We were there with dbl dipping and no tiers when we booked and it was pretty awesome. If they can figure out a scenario that makes something like this possible, I think it would be a hit. They might not be able to do much with the tier 1's since they are so limited in 3 parks, but 3 extra tier 2's that you can book same day would be pretty sweet. Well for MK anyway..

Limiting to 3 per day and 1 park per day and 1 tier one seems to me it would be the baseline offer. Stay onsite get more of this or that you can book in advance, blah blah blah. Somewhere in there they will have to offer something for AP holders probably.
At least I hope something like that happens. One can dream I guess...

 

[pilferk]

Maybe not. But they will know that you didn't use them and when they begin to collect data on what reservations people made but didn't actually use, there are even more possible ways they can use that information to motivate/reward guest behavior.

Oh, absolutely.

And they would likely see exactly what was going on (scheduling 3 with the intent to use one) because they'd not only see we used the TT FP+, and no others, but they'd see we were still in the park til closing...with maybe a "punch out"...sorry, former Kronos software admin habit...for dinner at one of the nearby Epcot resort restaurants.

All courtesy of the tracking they can do via MB use (looking at our FP+ redemption, our "punch out", our charging of dinner, our "punch in" and then another "punch out" to head back to the resort). Heck, they'll even be able to tell how long it takes to get back to our room, if they are of a mind.

It's a data mining paradise...

 

[su_A_ve]

Limiting to 3 per day and 1 park per day and 1 tier one seems to me it would be the baseline offer. Stay onsite get more of this or that you can book in advance, blah blah blah. Somewhere in there they will have to offer something for AP holders probably.
At least I hope something like that happens. One can dream I guess...

And here comes the 'front of the line pass' - Pay more to have extra tier1, multiple parks, additional tier2, unlimited, etc. Wait - that last one is already there in the form of VIP tour or something, isn't it?

Might as well go back to the original ride ticket booklets...

 

[wisblue]

What other features would you not be surprised to see them put into place?

Dynamic FP+ volume? Meaning, you get less FP's on busy days and more on not so busy days?

Dynamic Park Hopping? Meaning, you are allowed to make FP+ selections at a second particular park because that particular park is less than ideally loaded that day?

I wouldn't use the word "surprised" when describing my reaction to any of the possibilities that make it to actual implementation and multiple iterations of revision, but I am "curious" which ones will prove meaningful and of value to everyone.

For instance, I don't see myself as appreciating that any FP+ reservations suggested by the app also take into account the most efficient way to get from attraction A to B to C within the park, I pretty much know my way around, but understand that a lot of people are literally lost.

Sure is interesting to see what elements survive.

I haven't racked my brain about what the system could do, or what Disney would implement, but I think there is a tradeoff between flexibility (like dynamic volume that you mentioned) and making the system unnecessarily more complicated.

For example, if someone has a trip that begins the week before Thanksgiving and continues into Thanksgiving, it may be hard to explain why they can get more FPs on some days than others. The path of least confusion would be to set a low number that will work even with the busiest crowds. On less crowded days, if fewer FPs are reserved, that would result in more flexibility to make same day changes and/or shorter standby lines.

On our recent trip in early November, we generally didn't need FPs (+ or -) because standby lines were so short by our standards, especially for the first few hours after the park opened, which is when we do most of our touring. Even on an evening at MK, Space, Splash, BTMRR, Pooh, and Buzz were all walk ons.

 

[clsteve]

You can't GET just one..but you can USE just one.

Agree, there are dependencies and limitations that offshoot from that.

But if you're set on only getting a FP for EE, and NOTHING else in ANY other park that day...you get your FP for EE, and select two things you never intend to use.

Not like Disney's going to track you down and make you use them, or charge you like they do for a missed ADR.

I mentioned in a previous post: We have an "empty" day at Epcot that I will be making FP+ for after we bridge most of our parties tickets from 5 day to 6 day tickets.

My intent? Make an FP+ for TT and 2 other things we'll never use. Because it's our 2nd day in Epcot and, mostly, we're there for World Showcase and Illuminations that night.

FW will be mostly done on our first day..and we already have FP+ to Soarin, Space, and Crush.

Granted, there are ramifications to Disney's system and throughput because of that, but...honestly..that's "their fault", and thus, their problem to deal with.

I don't disagree, at all. Lots of things look good at 5,000 ft when you build a sys but don't quite work out the same at ground level.

For those first timers and off-site, single day guests at DAK, when they're able to book Dino in the morning, FOTLK after lunch but can only get the Safari late afternoon, it's probably a business rule keeping them in the park longer than what the actual availability might be....

 

[Laketravis]

For those first timers and off-site, single day guests at DAK, when they're able to book Dino in the morning, FOTLK after lunch but can only get the Safari late afternoon, it's probably a business rule keeping them in the park longer than what the actual availability might be....

Exactly.

 

[FlipHipster]

And here comes the 'front of the line pass' - Pay more to have extra tier1, multiple parks, additional tier2, unlimited, etc. Wait - that last one is already there in the form of VIP tour or something, isn't it?

Might as well go back to the original ride ticket booklets...

Yeah I know, but you already pay a huge premium to stay onsite. I can see where they might be headed though. The perks are slowly becoming less of a value for us. We like to stay at deluxe park resorts because of location mostly. We really don't take advantage of the other perks like EMH like we used to. So now we are thinking of moving back offsite and enjoying more that Orlando has to offer and saving a ton of money. The cost savings of staying offsite are hard to ignore. However, now with FP+ park strategies change and if they offered a perk like that for onsite with no noticeable increase in cost then yeah we would probably just keep staying onsite. If they offered a package like US, then it really depends on the cost and how it impacts the SB lines. If they offer the same package to everyone with the same price regardless of where you stay, then suddenly offsite becomes even more attractive since I can buy the ticket upgrade with the money I save moving off property.

 

[FlipHipster]

For those first timers and off-site, single day guests at DAK, when they're able to book Dino in the morning, FOTLK after lunch but can only get the Safari late afternoon, it's probably a business rule keeping them in the park longer than what the actual availability might be....

I felt like our quick picks were doing this, I can't test it anymore though. I would expect them to do it in the future since you are only getting 1 park/day anyway.

I was wondering last night, when they pull the FP- machines out are they also taking the FP return times signs down? So you won't be able to see what return times are without using the app. I just assumed they would take them out since it would probably keep most people from trying to change their times if they can't easily see that better times are available.

 

[pilferk]

I don't disagree, at all. Lots of things look good at 5,000 ft when you build a sys but don't quite work out the same at ground level.

For those first timers and off-site, single day guests at DAK, when they're able to book Dino in the morning, FOTLK after lunch but can only get the Safari late afternoon, it's probably a business rule keeping them in the park longer than what the actual availability might be....

Maybe. It'll be interesting to watch and see if we can ferret out when there is "business rules" being applied, and when it's being driven strictly by availability. I've no doubt, once the roll out is complete, that we'll get a thread going to track that kind of stuff for those of us who are "eggheads" and find it interesting. Right now, without off site and AP being FULLY integrated...it's too hard to tell.

I can tell you that, for my FP+ scheduling experience...I was happy with Disney's default selection of times (and knew I could adjust if I had to...just didn't have to). They actually managed to schedule FP+ just about the same as we would normally hit the attractions, in terms of time....and, in some cases, around ADRs (coincidentally or not). To be clear: I didn't do "quick picks"..I selected the attractions we wanted. Disney just gave me 3 different "packages" of times to pick from. Typically one was morning focuses (the one we typically took..we like to get in early, most days), one was sort of scattered, and one was afternoon focused.

But I hit the system at 5:30 AM-ish exactly 60 days out...largely because I watch the Dis boards and knew how the system was working at the time. We also "beat" the DHS tiering by a day or two..so only really had to deal with Epcot...a park we usually spend 2 days in, anyway.