Alcohol at Be Our Guest

[buffettgirl]

What?! There isn't?! Take that back!

only as they exist in our own minds. And no one, nor alcohol at MK, can take that away.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

How come everyone who disagrees with you is attacking you? On almost every thread where I have read your posts you accuse others of attacking you when they question and disagree with you.

When somone offers a opinion and then others ridicule that opinion its a attack. It is usually the person that is in the minority....and others get a good luaght....sneaky one at that.

You will notice I only response to those, like yourself, in that other thread, that attack first...I am not one to sit back and let mob mentialy win. I am very happy to have polite debate.........but things like are you serious? with the laughly figure is a attack.................or at the very least rude.

You will notice my comments here were general and not directed to anyone until someone got snarky........

There was some things I feel strongly about and/or have a proffessional backgound in and I will offer opinions on them when the situation is being discussed.

As in Carnival, I have never once started a thread about Carnival, yet you saw fit to attack saying that all I do.......you were wrong.

simple

Soory folks that last part was a bit off topic.


AKK

 

[msjprincess]

Holy moly

 

[declansdad]

When somone offers a opinion and then others ridicule that opinion its a attack. It is usually the person that is in the minority....and others get a good luaght....sneaky one at that.

You will notice I only response to those, like yourself, in that other thread, that attack first...I am not one to sit back and let mob mentialy win. I am very happy to have polite debate.........but things like are you serious? with the laughly figure is a attack.................or at the very least rude.

You will notice my comments here were general and not directed to anyone until someone got snarky........

There was some things I feel strongly about and/or have a proffessional backgound in and I will offer opinions on them when the situation is being discussed.

As in Carnival, I have never once started a thread about Carnival, yet you saw fit to attack saying that all I do.......you were wrong.

simple

Soory folks that last part was a bit off topic.


AKK

No one has attacked you here or on any other thread you are refering too. People are disagreeing with you not attacking you, there is a difference.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

This just cracks me up. How could you possibly know what he might have wanted. Had he lived he could have easily changed his mind to allow alcohol into the park. For all we know the day before he died he had changed his mind but never got a chance to say so.

You have to know somthing about the man, I feel it is resonable from what I have studed about the man and the people and family, to say that he would not have changed his mind.

For example lets say your Father was a boater all his life.told lots of people this, had a boast he loved, took his family on it all the time, praised to idea of using the boat as a fun family thing to do, is it resonable to expect on his death bed, with no one around he would suddenly change his mind?

why would it crack you up?.just another opinion..........

AKK

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

No one has attacked you here or on any other thread you are refering too. People are disagreeing with you not attacking you, there is a difference.

Sorry I see it differently, I dont mock other people but I wont stand by and let them mock me.

Again a difference of opinion.

AKK

 

[starousse]

Actually very serious, but enjoy our laugh. I am very thick skinned and just consider immaturity of the poster.

There you go, attacking people again.

Thank you! Quite obnoxious if you ask me. Stop arguing with everyone over such a silly matter and get on with your day already. It's so ridiculous. On that note, I'm quite happy that I will be able to enjoy a nice glass of wine with my meal in the Beast's Castle in December.

 

[BEASLYBOO]

This thread belongs on an episode of Jerry Springer!

 

[The Mayor]

Cue the R.E.M. song

That's great, it starts with an earthquake, birds and snakes,
an aeroplane - Lenny Bruce is not afraid.
Eye of a hurricane, listen to yourself churn,
world serves its own needs, dummy serve your own needs.
Feed it off an aux speak,, grunt, no, strength,
The ladder starts to clatter with fear fight down height.
Wire in a fire, representing seven games, a government for hire and a combat site.
Left of west and coming in a hurry with the furies breathing down your neck.
Team by team reporters baffled, trumped, tethered cropped.
Look at that low playing!
Fine, then.
Uh oh, overflow, population, common food, but it'll do.
Save yourself, serve yourself. World serves its own needs, listen to your heart bleed dummy with the rapture and the revered and the right - right.
You vitriolic, patriotic, slam, fight, bright light, feeling pretty psyched.

It's the end of the world as we know it.
It's the end of the world as we know it.
It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine.

Six o'clock - TV hour. Don't get caught in foreign towers.
Slash and burn, return, listen to yourself churn.
Locking in, uniforming, book burning, blood letting.
Every motive escalate. Automotive incinerate.
Light a candle, light a votive. Step down, step down.
Watch your heel crush, crushed. Uh-oh, this means no fear cavalier.
Renegade steer clear! A tournament, a tournament, a tournament of lies.
Offer me solutions, offer me alternatives and I decline.

It's the end of the world as we know it.
It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.
(I feel fine)

It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.

The other night I dreamt of knives, continental drift divide. Mountains sit in a line
Leonard Bernstein. Leonid Brezhnev. Lenny Bruce and Lester Bangs.
Birthday party, cheesecake, jelly bean, boom!
You symbiotic, patriotic, slam book neck, right? Right.

It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.

It's the end of the world as we know it.
It's the end of the world as we know it.
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.

It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.

It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it. (It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it (It's time I had some time alone) and I feel fine.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

Thank you! Quite obnoxious if you ask me. Stop arguing with everyone over such a silly matter and get on with your day already. It's so ridiculous. On that note, I'm quite happy that I will be able to enjoy a nice glass of wine with my meal in the Beast's Castle in December.

Again I feel this will seriously change the MK, and is therefore a serious matter, so I will continue to offer my opinions. Please permit me my rights as I have not told you or anyone you cant have your opinion.

AKK

 

[nyck]

Please learn about the man and then you can speak with some authority....I have read and studed the man for years and can speak with authority..........YES he would be upset with alcohol in Disneyland and MK.

YOU have no authority to speak for someone else, let alone someone you have STUDIED only. I spent a year studying Florence Nightengale for my Nursing thesis but guess what, I don't run around acting like I would know what Florence would think, want, and feel about nursing today. Because I am NOT HER. You are not Walt, you do not know what he would have done, said, did, period. None of us have that kind of power to PREDICT what someone would want 30-40 years later.

 

[smkohn]

No problems with this on my end. Although, I'm not a beer or wine fan. If I could get a Pina Colava in Adventureland however...

I really don't see how alcohol takes away from the magic and pixie dust of MK. To me, the details and themeing of the parks are what create that, not a lack of alcohol. For example, to me, there is something incredibly magical about the fireworks at Epcot, everybody's prime example of the reason alcohol in the parks is a bad thing. There is something magical about riding a train through the Himalaya's and coming very close to the dreaded Yeti (even if he is forever stuck in disco-mode) and then walking over to Africa and taking a safari ride through the savannah. The fact that there is alcohol in AK doesn't seem to hinder any of that magic for me.

And really, no matter how much you may have studied Walt, it is impossible to say he never would have changed his mind on the matter. People change their minds all the time in life. I realize he may have said absolutely no alcohol at first, but perhaps as times changed, his opinion would have too. The only thing for certain here is that NOBODY knows how changing times, opening of other parks, etc. would have changed the man's mind had he been alive. Life experiences have a tendency to shape decisions we make every day.

 

[nyck]

Walt is a busy man for someone who died in 1966. Let's see, if those of you who are so wound up that Walt is crying in the great beyond right now because of wine at the MK, lets think about a few things.

In 1966, women didn't have equal rights. As a matter of fact, want ads were divided into women's jobs and mens jobs. Black people didn't have equal rights, either.

Birth control was declared safe for human use.

Psycho couldn't be aired on TV because it was declared too violent.

So, instead of me going further into a history lesson, times change. You have no idea what Walt wanted. That is the most overused, ridiculous phrase on the DIS. The man is dead, let him rest in peace and stop worrying about what Walt would think.

He's probably up there with a drink and a cigarette in his hand as we speak.

Amen! He is probably having a toast to this decision instead of "rolling in his grave" or " shedding tears" at this. If we went with the "this isn't what Walt would want" theory there woudl still be smoke shops in the parks and I would be sitting at the back of the bus. This is just pathetic.

 

[DisneyChula]

Again I feel this will seriously change the MK, and is therefore a serious matter, so I will continue to offer my opinions. Please permit me my rights as I have not told you or anyone you cant have your opinion.

AKK

I don't have any problem with you having an opinion. I start to have a problem when a person gives their opinion and their opinions are belittled or lessened because they have not studied and learned as much about Walt Disney as you have (in your opinion).

I think that you are very passionate about Walt and the parks maintaining the ideals of Walt. That passion comes across as being uppity and this is not the first time. When someone disagrees with your opinion, they are not attacking you.

 

[JimmyV]

Again I feel this will seriously change the MK, and is therefore a serious matter, so I will continue to offer my opinions. Please permit me my rights as I have not told you or anyone you cant have your opinion.

AKK

In all seriousness, without an ounce of "attack" intended, can you posit exactly how many people per day will:

a) Be seated for dinner at BoG;
b) Will be adults;
c) Will choose to consume beer and/or wine; and
d) Will be permitted by the staff (through oversight, neglect, or blatant disregard for stated policy), to abuse the privilege?

I am truly curious how many people the naysayers think will fall into this category. So please. Anyone can chime in. Because for this to be a serious problem that "seriously changes the MK", the number has to be orders of magnitude larger than any I can envision. Lots of generalizations have been spouted off here. But how about some specifics. If you think the Gestalt of the MK is going to change, you must have some vision of what the future will look like. Please share.

 

[Tonka's Skipper]

No problems with this on my end. Although, I'm not a beer or wine fan. If I could get a Pina Colava in Adventureland however...

I really don't see how alcohol takes away from the magic and pixie dust of MK. To me, the details and themeing of the parks are what create that, not a lack of alcohol. For example, to me, there is something incredibly magical about the fireworks at Epcot, everybody's prime example of the reason alcohol in the parks is a bad thing. There is something magical about riding a train through the Himalaya's and coming very close to the dreaded Yeti (even if he is forever stuck in disco-mode) and then walking over to Africa and taking a safari ride through the savannah. The fact that there is alcohol in AK doesn't seem to hinder any of that magic for me.

And really, no matter how much you may have studied Walt, it is impossible to say he never would have changed his mind on the matter. People change their minds all the time in life. I realize he may have said absolutely no alcohol at first, but perhaps as times changed, his opinion would have too. The only thing for certain here is that NOBODY knows how changing times, opening of other parks, etc. would have changed the man's mind had he been alive. Life experiences have a tendency to shape decisions we make every day.

Now that is a good point, but lets turn it around..............there is nothing to say he would have changed his mind.

my feelings are simple............the magic and pixie dust of the MK is partly due to the lack of drinking in the park. My proof is easy,look at the problems in EPCOT now( and yes I bleive it will not be just BOG in the MK), especailly around F and W.

AKK

 

[ArthurFiggis]

Since the thread about the blog post was closed I thought I'd put this here. I never did get to post in there that I felt the blog post title itself was frankly saddening to me since it was the only one I've seen that was more opinion that fact, imho Anywho...


Quote: Originally Posted by Tonka's Skipper
It is not dramatic, its fact...........keeping the MK dry was Walts idea and his wishes, and keeping it dry made it very specail and different.

But your welcome to you opinion and I am welcome to mine without having you attack my comment as dramatic.

AKK


Skipper, not to troll or anything, but can you tell me where the interview or document or whatever it is that you're basing this on can be found? I'm really interested to know. The only things I've been able to find are references to keeping the "rowdies" of the time out of DL. Fine wines and an imported beer would hardly be the drinks of these rowdies.

We do live in a very different society, than what existed in 1955 or 1971. This is our "great big, beautiful tomorrow." Smoking in other than designated areas has been out since at least 2007. There have been innumerable changes to DL and WDW since Walt's death. Should everything have stopped to keep it as Walt envisioned it at the moment of his death? I think that would most certainly go against a couple of his most well-known public statements:

"It's something that will never be finished. Something that I can keep developing...and adding to."

"Disneyland will never be completed. It will continue to grow as long as there is imagination left in the world."

This is development and addition, nothing more. If anything, I would say that it fulfills another of Walt's quotes:

"We believed in our idea - a family park where parents and children could have fun-together."

Mainly, I really hope that this one change will not change your experience of the Magic Kingdom to a negative one. I can tell from the sheer number of posts of yours I've read that you obviously feel very strongly about this. Please don't let one thing turn so much joy so sour for you.

 

[MrRob]

Please learn about the man and then you can speak with some authority....I have read and studed the man for years and can speak with authority..........YES he would be upset with alcohol in Disneyland and MK.

Wow. Just wow.

You've read about Walt and studied his life? Amazing. So have others. I have as well.

Yet I wouldn't be brash enough to claim what he WOULD and WOULDN'T want almost 50 years after his death, and only knowing him through books, documentaries and interviews. Even his own family wouldn't be likely to be that brash. They might know him well enough to guess what she would have wanted BACK THEN, but that says nothing of 2012.

He built Disneyland in a very specific fashion to distance his park from the shady reputations of state fairs and carnivals. He was wildly successful and banning alcohol sales from the park definitely played a part in that.

Now it's 2012. Society has evolved in the 50 some odd years since Disneyland opened and that cliche of an amusement park being a dirty, unsafe, unwholesome place is not nearly as prevalent as it was in Walt's days. Today you CAN have a theme park what serves alcohol that still appears clean and wholesome.

So would Walt be OK with it? Nobody knows. I don't know. You don't know. You may THINK you know, but you don't.

In any case, no business is going to continue to prosper if they stubbornly hold on to 50 year old policies put in place by a CEO who has been dead for 40 years. You prosper by taking that founders spirit and philosophy and hold onto THAT. He wanted a wholesome, clean, family park and introducing wine to a sit down dinner in ONE location does not make the Magic Kingdom any less wholesome, clean, or family friendly.

As for your views, you're certainly entitled to them, but I'm entitled to their opposition. I'm not going to try and stop you from voicing your opinion, but I'm also not going to stop myself from debunking it and opposing it. If you take that as an attack, than so be it.

Side note: I hope for the sake of consistency that you're strongly opposed to the rest of Walt Disney World. After all, anybody who has studied him as much as you would know that WDW as it exists today is VERY different from that he had planned it to be, and if your problem is that this goes against Walt's wishes well... so does the rest of WDW.

Furthermore, your thoughts that this will lead to alcohol being all over the park is a fallacy. It's a slippery slope with no evidence to support it. In other words, it's entirely speculative. As is your assumption that a man (any man, not just Walt) wouldn't change their views on an issue over the course of half of a century.

Lastly, you're likely getting singled out because of the pompous nature of your posts. Acting like your word holds more weight because you've "studied" Walt (which I can only assume means you've read a lot of books and seen a lot of documentaries on him.) is what puts you in the sights of other posters.

 

[flicx]

In all seriousness, without an ounce of "attack" intended, can you posit exactly how many people per day will:

a) Be seated for dinner at BoG;
b) Will be adults;
c) Will choose to consume beer and/or wine; and
d) Will be permitted by the staff (through oversight, neglect, or blatant disregard for stated policy), to abuse the privilege?

I am truly curious how many people the naysayers think will fall into this category. So please. Anyone can chime in. Because for this to be a serious problem that "seriously changes the MK", the number has to be orders of magnitude larger than any I can envision. Lots of generalizations have been spouted off here. But how about some specifics. If you think the Gestalt of the MK is going to change, you must have some vision of what the future will look like. Please share.

My only problem with the whole thing is this, and it is my opinion of what I think will happen. I forsee that the BOG will be very successful due to the alcohol.The higher ups will notice this success and they will want more success/money. Thus more establishments will serve, and more and more alcohol will be present at the kingdom. I don't think that is a good thing. Once the first one opens it all starts! Now remember this is just my hypothosis!

 

[JimmyV]

My only problem with the whole thing is this, and it is my opinion of what I think will happen. I forsee that the BOG will be very successful due to the alcohol.The higher ups will notice this success and they will want more success/money. Thus more establishments will serve, and more and more alcohol will be present at the kingdom. I don't think that is a good thing. Once the first one opens it all starts! Now remember this is just my hypothosis!

Thank you. An opinion based on reason, yet one that admits that it is also based on conjecture. Conjecture, however, that is very valid. So lets play this out. If LTT, CRT and CP all begin to allow beer and wine at dinner (and dinner only), and there is no take-away option, my original questions would still stand. How many people at these four (I'm including BoG plus the other three) will meet all the criteria that I laid out? Enough to have the park teeming with drunks? It seems to me as if your fears can only be realized not by an increase in locales that serve beer and wine, but by wholesale changes in the newly minted MK rules. (i.e., dinner only, TS only, no take away, per person drink limits). Is that what you fear? Because I think it is a huge leap to jump from beer and wine at TS diners to booze carts strewn all about the park. That is the only scenario that I can see that would have a material impact, and even then, it seems to have no negative impact whatsoever to AK and DHS.