"Accidental" drug overdose

[tinkntraining]

Gotcha. Thanks for the info!

No problem at all. I think, in the beginning of the investigation, it was widely reported that she had died of an overdose.

 

[luvsJack]

I think that to say a person should know when they take drugs for the first time they are likely to die is not understanding the mind of someone who takes drugs and especially not the mind of an addict.

My nephew died from an accidental overdose. He started taking drugs in high school. Not all the time but "recreationally". He also drank. He did these things so that he would feel on equal ground with his peers and to "be cool". (he had some learning disablities and never felt equal to his friends because of this). He always thought that he was just doing this now and that he would stop later.

Then his father died in an accident. As the oldest son, he felt responsible for his mom and his siblings (his siblings were grown and married by this time but he still felt like he had to help them if they were in trouble and that type of thing). He used to cry to my dh that he couldn't fill his father's shoes. Dh tried to help him understand that he wasn't expected to. We tried many times to get him to get some help.

First he drank more and more. He came to the realization that drinking was destroying his life, so he quit. The problem was he had an addictive personality and needed something to help him cope. So he started taking pills. He took pills for a long, long time before he died. We aren't sure of everything that went on that night but we do know that it was accidental.

He never set out to be an "addict". He thought he was ok and that he could handle it. He was self medicating and in his mind he wasn't taking anything a doctor wouldn't give him. In his mind he was not an addict, he needed these pills because his life was stressful and hard. He would have never taken his own life because his feeling of responsiblity to his mother was too strong and he knew his siblings were incapable of taking care of her.

All addicts have different stories but most do not set out to die and most do not think they will die. Most think that they can handle what they are doing and that they are different from other addicts who have died from accidental overdoses.

 

[ChrisAlli]

And now Cory Haim,,,such a shame but seems to be a lot of accidents in Hollywood lately

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I don't know how they decide it, but I'm not going to make it my place to determine that because someone made a poor choice (no matter how many times that choice may have been made), he wanted to die.

It is likely he'll have an autopsy and they'll determine the amount of drugs and which type in his system.

If it is consistent with his lifestyle, then it would be ruled accidental.

IF they found that he took a whole bottle of sleeping pills (doubtful)--then it points to thinks like suicide.

Marie Osmond's son clearly intended to take his own life as he jumped off of a building and he left a note.

For someone like Cory--unless there is something left behind like talks of death and a note, it is unlikely he purposed to take his own life.

The problem with drugs is that it is unpredictable how your individual body will react toa legal or illegal substance. It is known what a drug CAN do. It is not a guarantee of what it will do.

After decades of drug abuse--he could have done his same old routine and this time it was fatal.

The legality or illegality of a substance or activity is irrelevant.

 

[jlewisinsyr]

Nope, doesn't bother me in the least as I see the difference between accidental and on purpose.

They did not intend to take the drugs (whether illegal or not) and die as a result, however, they accidentally did. Of course, you may not know the persons heart and mind at the time that they took the drugs, therefore what may be called accidental may have actually been on purpose.

But taking a drug (especially an illegal or non-prescribed one) comes with risks and if you decide to take them, you intentionally made a decision to accept the risks of doing them, including overdosing.

I think suicide is even worst (regardless of the method), but I think letting someone get a "free pass" for accidentally overdosing, is a little weak. Now if the death was in part to using a prescribed/over the counter drug that had a dosage error, that truly is an accident (or I guess if it was intentionally misprescibed, I could I see a murder charge).

 

[Heidict]

But taking a drug (especially an illegal or non-prescribed one) comes with risks and if you decide to take them, you intentionally made a decision to accept the risks of doing them, including overdosing.

Every time you get behind the wheel of a car you are intentionally making a decision to accept the risks of doing that, including dying. Doesn't mean that if you die in a car accident that you wanted to die.

 

[jlewisinsyr]

Every time you get behind the wheel of a car you are intentionally making a decision to accept the risks of doing that, including dying. Doesn't mean that if you die in a car accident that you wanted to die.

But I accept the risks associated to it. If I was driving wrecklessly or illegally, I heightened those risks and I made an intentional decision that depending on the heightened risk, may have ultimately sentenced me to a high probability of death.

 

[sbell111]

But taking a drug (especially an illegal or non-prescribed one) comes with risks and if you decide to take them, you intentionally made a decision to accept the risks of doing them, including overdosing.

I think suicide is even worst (regardless of the method), but I think letting someone get a "free pass" for accidentally overdosing, is a little weak. Now if the death was in part to using a prescribed/over the counter drug that had a dosage error, that truly is an accident (or I guess if it was intentionally misprescibed, I could I see a murder charge).

How are they getting a 'free pass'? They're dead.

 

[bigmerle1966]

How do you suppose they decide if intent was there or not?

There are a lot of factors that go into determining that. They look at where and how the person was found, what is in the area where the person is found and put that all together with the autopsy results.

Most people who kill themselves leave behind enough clues that indicate that is their intent.

 

[Heidict]

But I accept the risks associated to it. If I was driving wrecklessly or illegally, I heightened those risks and I made an intentional decision that depending on the heightened risk, may have ultimately sentenced me to a high probability of death.

And you could also be driving perfectly safe and legal and WHAM!!! You get smashed into by someone else and die, or your lose control due to weather, or mechanical malfunction or whatever, and BAM you are dead.

Heck, just taking a shower has an small chance of death. Everything comes with risks these days, doesn't mean you WANTED to die but that dying was a result of those actions.

Intentional is when you set out doing something with the mindset of "I want to die".

 

[luvmy3]

But taking a drug (especially an illegal or non-prescribed one) comes with risks and if you decide to take them, you intentionally made a decision to accept the risks of doing them, including overdosing.

I think suicide is even worst (regardless of the method), but I think letting someone get a "free pass" for accidentally overdosing, is a little weak. Now if the death was in part to using a prescribed/over the counter drug that had a dosage error, that truly is an accident (or I guess if it was intentionally misprescibed, I could I see a murder charge).

Its not about the risks, its about the intent. An accidental OD means that the victim did not intend to kill themself. I hardly think being responsible for your own death by way of an accidental OD is a "free pass", they are dead, seems like the worst mistake they could have made

 

[Mermaid02]

bothers me a bit cause how do you know they took the drugs willingly ?idk just alot to think about

What do you mean by this?

 

[jlewisinsyr]

How are they getting a 'free pass'? They're dead.

I probably should have phrased it differently. I think the definition of accidental death while participating in a wreckless activity is a little broad, so I think when a wreckless death is labeled as accidental it denotes a since that they didn't have any effect on the situation.

And you could also be driving perfectly safe and legal and WHAM!!! You get smashed into by someone else and die, or your lose control due to weather, or mechanical malfunction or whatever, and BAM you are dead.

Heck, just taking a shower has an small chance of death. Everything comes with risks these days, doesn't mean you WANTED to die but that dying was a result of those actions.

Intentional is when you set out doing something with the mindset of "I want to die".

Intentionally increasing the risk is taking out some of the accident and putting a piece over to the intentional. He knew (even admitted) that his drug use was an issue, but did nothing to correct the issue.

Its not about the risks, its about the intent. An accidental OD means that the victim did not intend to kill themself. I hardly think being responsible for your own death by way of an accidental OD is a "free pass", they are dead, seems like the worst mistake they could have made

It is the worst mistake one could make, no doubt, don't read into the free pass in that they didn't suffer a consequence, I just think it diminishes the value of a true accidental death, one where I person didn't knowlingly increase their risks by doing something illegal.

 

[Heidict]

Intentionally increasing the risk is taking out some of the accident and putting a piece over to the intentional. He knew (even admitted) that his drug use was an issue, but did nothing to correct the issue.

He did a lot to try to correct the issue. He went to rehab, he had stretches of time when he was clean. Drug addiction is not an easy animal to shack though and occasional relapses are generally a part of the process. That does not mean he was not trying though, it just means that he was normal in his recovery.

None of us were close to him and so we can't begin to know where he was, recovery wise, with his addictions. Was this a momentary relapse, or was he back to hardcore using again? We may very well never know the truth of that, and I'm fine with that. It's really none of our business and I can imagine his family may not want that information being slung around the internet for everyone's entertainment.

I feel horrible for the family. Regardless if you look at this as accidental, intentional or just a stupid move on his part, his family is left to suffer. I'm sure, if he had a crystal ball and saw the outcome he would never had touched those pills, or what ever it was, yesterday.

It is the worst mistake one could make, no doubt, don't read into the free pass in that they didn't suffer a consequence, I just think it diminishes the value of a true accidental death, one where I person didn't knowlingly increase their risks by doing something illegal.

How else though could they describe it? If there was intentional death (I want to die and will do this to achieve my goal) and accidental death (oops, pharmacist screwed up and I took to many pills and die) then how could you label this death?

 

[TheZue]

Suicide is very different. Yes I agree that people taking drugs have got to know it will probably kill them. But it's much different than a suicide on so many levels. Then when you get into legally perscribed drugs it's a whole other ball of wax. In some ways it would almost be better if they just said "intentional overdose" in case of suicides.

 

[tinkerbelletreasure]

The problem is you are coming at this from a logical view. Logiaclly, it doesn't make sense to take drugs with all the risk ect...but most people who are doing things like that are not thinking logically. And it can be due to a lot of different factors...some have emotional problems, some peopel are thrill seekers and like the risk factor, some have had tragic events happen to them, some people can just have a bad chemical or hormonal imbalance that will start them down the wrong path.
You excluded all the prescription drug accidental overdoses are not being what you were talking about, but you are generalizing all drug users in the same category no matter what the reason/motoivation they had to start. Most people don't start out shooting up heroine. They start with something "less" risky like weed and progress up because it makes them feel good or numbes the emotional pain, quiets the voices, whatever.
If you never had peer pressure issues, self esteem issues, depression, ect you are very blessed. You are obviously a strong person able to deal with what life throws at you. Not every one can.

 

[luvmy3]

It is the worst mistake one could make, no doubt, don't read into the free pass in that they didn't suffer a consequence, I just think it diminishes the value of a true accidental death, one where I person didn't knowlingly increase their risks by doing something illegal.

I get what you are saying however I disagree. To me accidental means just that, it was an accident. Was the shooting heroin into his arm an accident for dh's friend, no but him dying as a result sure was. He wanted to get high not end up dead. Its all about the intent, not what they are doing.

 

[Mermaid02]

The problem is you are coming at this from a logical view. Logiaclly, it doesn't make sense to take drugs with all the risk ect...but most people who are doing things like that are not thinking logically. And it can be due to a lot of different factors...some have emotional problems, some peopel are thrill seekers and like the risk factor, some have had tragic events happen to them, some people can just have a bad chemical or hormonal imbalance that will start them down the wrong path.
You excluded all the prescription drug accidental overdoses are not being what you were talking about, but you are generalizing all drug users in the same category no matter what the reason/motoivation they had to start. Most people don't start out shooting up heroine. They start with something "less" risky like weed and progress up because it makes them feel good or numbes the emotional pain, quiets the voices, whatever.
If you never had peer pressure issues, self esteem issues, depression, ect you are very blessed. You are obviously a strong person able to deal with what life throws at you. Not every one can.

If the drug is prescribed for someone and they take an extra dose because they forgot they already took it- that is NOT the same thing as using heroin etc.

EVERYONE has had peer pressure, MANY have self esteem issues and some have suffer from depression..... But they aren't stupid enough to start doing drugs. And yes, I said STUPID and I meant it.

 

[jlewisinsyr]

How else though could they describe it? If there was intentional death (I want to die and will do this to achieve my goal) and accidental death (oops, pharmacist screwed up and I took to many pills and die) then how could you label this death?

I agree, there are only really two classifications, it's just unfortunate that there isn't another one that would be more defined or a better term that could be used. Possibly self inflicted death.

If you never had peer pressure issues, self esteem issues, depression, ect you are very blessed. You are obviously a strong person able to deal with what life throws at you. Not every one can.

I think it would be naive to think that there are those who have not gone through all of those emotions during their life, but it is a persons self will that determines there actions. I'm trying to say this without coming of harsh, but in someways, you have to take the cards your dealt with and do the best you can with them, you need to get up when your pushed down and you cannot expect the world to stop around you when you give up. Life is harsh, life is unfair, but its life.

 

[jrmasm]

Playing Russian Roulette is stupid. Dying while playing Russian Roulette is stupid. But it's still an accidental death.