75 employees laid off at Pixar, including the director of Lightyear

[PolymerSkywalker]

Indy 5 will fail because Harrison Ford is too old, Indy 4 was terrible, and Holy Grail was the perfect send off for the character. It's like Return of the Jedi, they didn't strike while the iron was hot and now too much time has flown by.

If people are scared of a younger, morally superior female character then how did Princess Leia appeal to everyone? She was all those things, except physically stronger. You appear to be bringing your own "political" issues into a movie watching experience. Rey was all those things and it didn't hurt the sequel trilogy one bit at the box office.

Top Gun did well because it looked like something you want to go see in a theater, on a big screen, which is true of all Tom Cruise movies. The trailers were spectacular. It looked like it was shot on real locations, with real planes. It looked superior in every way to its predecessor. But it also was a nostalgia fest which is what people wanted. It threaded the needle perfectly.

Indy 5 looks like something that will only appeal to the hardcore audience for Indiana Jones who don't mind seeing old man Indy. I do agree that the market for that isn't one now where a $300 million budget is going to work out well but maybe it will do wonderfully overseas. Indy 4 did better overseas than it did domestically.

People had huge issues with Rey, and the final movie made half what The Force Awakens made. All of those movies were certainly a financial success, but there is no denying it fell off pretty drastically. TLJ is considered by many as one of the most divisive movies in history with the way Rian Johnson deconstructed Luke. There are literally hundreds of news articles from major media sites that call this movie "divisive". I don't think it is political at all, I think there is certainly a trend in Hollywood where older male heroes are deconstructed to make room for a "better" female replacement. I think after what Lucas films did with Luke Skywalker it is pretty understandable for people to fear Indy getting the Luke Skywalker treatment by Disney.

Leia was a perfect female lead character in every way, don't mess with Leia!

Another perfect female lead character is Ellen Ripley in Alien. Always amazes me that people can love those two characters, but still be called a sexist if they don't like the current trend in Hollywood.

 

[Jwaire]

If people are scared of a younger, morally superior female character then how did Princess Leia appeal to everyone? She was all those things, except physically stronger. You appear to be bringing your own "political" issues into a movie watching experience. Rey was all those things and it didn't hurt the sequel trilogy one bit at the box office.

I actually like Rey, but it didn't stop Star Wars fans complaining about her incessantly and the fact her storyline was bonkers in The Rise of Skywalker.

And Princess Leia Organa should be an actual Disney Princess. She's earned it.

Either way, this thread is about the current state of Pixar.

 

[Obi-J Kenobi]

l thought Harrison was too old for Indy 4, let alone 5.

Age and role are an issue for all actors. Clint Eastwood is nearly a perfect example of an actor that changed the roles he took earlier in his career versus later in his career.

Harrison is so much fun as an actor. No lie, I think he should win an Emmy for his work in Shrinking. He is absolutely awesome and funny and the role fits him today. I'm not sure Indy works for him any longer, even though he is the one and the only Indiana Jones and no one will ever (not even a very talented River Phoenix, RIP) stack up to Harrison Ford as the Fedora wearing archeologist.

 

[mdmost]

I actually like Rey, but it didn't stop Star Wars fans complaining about her incessantly and the fact her storyline was bonkers in The Rise of Skywalker.

And Princess Leia Organa should be an actual Disney Princess. She's earned it.

Either way, this thread is about the current state of Pixar.

Well sure because as I was going to quote to the person above, certain people will have a problem with Rey yet the movies all did well. Rise of Skywalker didn't have the repeat viewings that the other two had because it was pretty terrible and that wasn't Daisy Ridley's fault. And yes, I'll go back to this being about Pixar now.

 

[BrianL]

Indy 5 will fail because Harrison Ford is too old, Indy 4 was terrible, and Holy Grail was the perfect send off for the character. It's like Return of the Jedi, they didn't strike while the iron was hot and now too much time has flown by.

Wait, was Indy in Holy Grail?



Is Harrison Ford the one on the right?

 

[mdmost]

Age and role are an issue for all actors. Clint Eastwood is nearly a perfect example of an actor that changed the roles he took earlier in his career versus later in his career.

Harrison is so much fun as an actor. No lie, I think he should win an Emmy for his work in Shrinking. He is absolutely awesome and funny and the role fits him today. I'm not sure Indy works for him any longer, even though he is the one and the only Indiana Jones and no one will ever (not even a very talented River Phoenix, RIP) stack up to Harrison Ford as the Fedora wearing archeologist.

Yes, Shrinking might be the best thing he's done in 20 years. I'll still go see Indy 5 but that's still an 80 year old man up there and you can't get around that fact. But I'll take one last hurrah of that character because I adore those movies, well not you #4.

 

[starlite_]

You literally said the following: "I think it looks hilarious and it's the first Marvel movie in a while I'm excited to see. My friend group also want to go see it." You did this in response to someone else saying they thought it would flop.

So in essence you are saying it looks good to you and your friend group, in response to someone else saying it would be a really bad movie.

Bad movies to the average consumer typically don't do well in the box office, and great movies normally do.

LMAO, so you are saying him is the average consumer and not me? Gotcha, not sure how you can possibly know that at all though. You are hilarious honestly.

 

[Jwaire]

Well sure because as I was going to quote to the person above, certain people will have a problem with Rey yet the movies all did well. Rise of Skywalker didn't have the repeat viewings that the other two had because it was pretty terrible and that wasn't Daisy Ridley's fault. And yes, I'll go back to this being about Pixar now.

Absolutely not Daisy Ridley's fault. All three films of the second trilogy should have been written by the same writer and directed accordingly. In fact, I think they should have shot them simultaneously considering the age of Ford, Fisher and Hamil.

Other trilogy blockbusters had been doing that and they they knew they had a hit. There was no risk.

Kathleen Kennedy should have made sure that happened and Alan Horn should have made sure Kennedy did her job. They had one chance to get this right and they failed.

 

[starlite_]

Am I the only one excited for Indy 5? I can't wait to go watch it with my dad, it's gonna be awesome. Gonna get him a hat so he can indybound at comic con.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

LMAO, so you are saying him is the average consumer and not me? Gotcha, not sure how you can possibly know that at all though. You are hilarious honestly.

So when the Marvels flops financially, will this be proof enough? Or will you just want to move the goalposts at that point?

I said elemental would flop weeks ago, and the 1st weekend certainly suggest this movie will be a financial failure.

Indy 5 will be a financial failure also, care to place a small wager on it? Say $50 to a charity of your choice?

The Marvels will fail financially also, want the same wager on that one?

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

Absolutely not Daisy Ridley's fault. All three films of the second trilogy should have been written by the same writer and directed accordingly. In fact, I think they should have shot them simultaneously considering the age of Ford, Fisher and Hamil.

Other trilogy blockbusters had been doing that and they they knew they had a hit. There was no risk.

Kathleen Kennedy should have made sure that happened and Alan Horn should have made sure Kennedy did her job. They had one chance to get this right and they failed.

100% not Daisy Ridley’s fault at all. Bad writing, poor plan, horrible management, and terrible direction is what people hated. Ridley is very talented, but just couldn’t overcome all the other problems.

 

[BrianL]

So when the Marvels flops financially, will this be proof enough? Or will you just want to move goalposts at that point?

I said elemental would flop weeks ago, and the 1st weekend certainly suggest this movie will be a financial failure.

Indy 5 will be a financial failure also, care to place a small wager on it? Say $50 to a charity of your choice?

The Marvels will fail financially also, want the same wager on that one?

The issue is that you talk like you just KNOW all this stuff. You don't. You can't be certain. Tracking on Elemental wasn't great, but it missed even those predictions. So tracking was wrong, but it just as well could have been wrong the other way too.

 

[PolymerSkywalker]

The issue is that you talk like you just KNOW all this stuff. You don't. You can't be certain. Tracking on Elemental wasn't great, but it missed even those predictions. So tracking was wrong, but it just as well could have been wrong the other way too.

Sorta like how I knew Top Gun would be a massive hit and it beat all early estimates?

Same with Mario. It beat all estimates early on and I knew it would. How? Original creator involved and read several articles saying he changed several parts of the script to ensure it was true to the characters lore and games. I knew right then it would be a hit and it was.

Toy Story 5 will do very well in the box office, calling it now. How do I know that? They will learn from Lightyear and course correct hard.

 

[Jwaire]

Am I the only one excited for Indy 5? I can't wait to go watch it with my dad, it's gonna be awesome. Gonna get him a hat so he can indybound at comic con.

I'm excited and will actually go see it. Raiders of the Lost Ark is in my Top 5 and I really enjoy Harrison Ford. Plus, I just like treasure hunting movies.

However, I recognize that Harrison Ford's Indy is passed its prime and they have waited too long for this one. It's going to flop.

Sorta like how I knew Top Gun would be a massive hit and it beat all early estimates?

Same with Mario. It beat all estimates early on and I knew it would. How? Original creator involved and read several article saying he changed several parts of the script to ensure it was true to the character lore and games. I knew right then it would be a hot and it was.

Toy Story 5 will do very well in the box office, calling it now. How do I know that? They will learn from Lightyear and course correct hard.

I had a suspicion Top Gun was going to do well also because of how exciting the first one was. It's just a movie you want to see in the theater. As said previously, like Tom Cruise or not, his movies are action packed and theater worthy.

As for Mario, talk about pent up demand. If you follow Nintendo, you know they learned their lesson from the live action film and there was no way a new one was getting released without Shigeru Miyamoto watchful eye. I'm surprised the filmmakers got to take some of the liberties they did. Some of the characters strayed from their personalities, but I enjoyed it immensely and the throwbacks and music were top notch.

We even forked out the $30 to watch it as soon as it came out on early digital (is that what we are calling it?). Illumination can do no wrong right now.

 

[disney-inspired]

Nostalgia and familiarity sells in post Covid theatrical times. Original films don’t.

I'm STILL waiting on a Bugs Life sequel!

Elemental was pretty trope-y too. Let's not pretend it was some amazing original story. It wasn't Coco.

I do wonder if some of Elemental's problem is that it reminds people visually of Inside Out? Hilariously, they're going to do an Inside Out 2 so that may compound the problem.

I love Coco and Encanto, both great original stories with wonderful music. I know not everyone likes musicals but I feel those tend to do better.

Indy 5 will fail because Harrison Ford is too old, Indy 4 was terrible, and Holy Grail was the perfect send off for the character. It's like Return of the Jedi, they didn't strike while the iron was hot and now too much time has flown by.

If people are scared of a younger, morally superior female character then how did Princess Leia appeal to everyone? She was all those things, except physically stronger. You appear to be bringing your own "political" issues into a movie watching experience. Rey was all those things and it didn't hurt the sequel trilogy one bit at the box office.

Top Gun did well because it looked like something you want to go see in a theater, on a big screen, which is true of all Tom Cruise movies. The trailers were spectacular. It looked like it was shot on real locations, with real planes. It looked superior in every way to its predecessor. But it also was a nostalgia fest which is what people wanted. It threaded the needle perfectly.

Indy 5 looks like something that will only appeal to the hardcore audience for Indiana Jones who don't mind seeing old man Indy. I do agree that the market for that isn't one now where a $300 million budget is going to work out well but maybe it will do wonderfully overseas. Indy 4 did better overseas than it did domestically.

I'm a die hard Indy fan so will definitely be seeing Indy 5 in theaters. I think the de-aging tech looked pretty good from the trailer. Indy 4 was lame but I love Harrison Ford so

 

[Jwaire]

The issue is that you talk like you just KNOW all this stuff. You don't. You can't be certain. Tracking on Elemental wasn't great, but it missed even those predictions. So tracking was wrong, but it just as well could have been wrong the other way too.

There are just things in life you know are going to be a failure like Bob Chapek or the Galactic Starcruiser.

It didn't take a genius to see that Turning Red or Soul weren't going to be massive hits. Talk about lack of appeal.

I'm STILL waiting on a Bugs Life sequel!

I love Coco and Encanto, both great original stories with wonderful music. I know not everyone likes musicals but I feel those tend to do better.

Me too! I actually suggested A Bug's Life sequel in a different thread. It's been awhile since we've had an insects movie too.

Coco is easily one of my favorites. The music, the stunning visuals and the story. It's a fantastic movie and deserves more praise than it already gets.

Encanto is getting what it deserves. It's a beautiful movie too. I didn't care for the music as much, but Mirabel is a likable character worth rooting for and again the visuals are pretty stunning.

 

[BrianL]

Sorta like how I knew Top Gun would be a massive hit and it beat all early estimates?

Same with Mario. It beat all estimates early on and I knew it would. How? Original creator involved and read several articles saying he changed several parts of the script to ensure it was true to the characters lore and games. I knew right then it would be a hit and it was.

Toy Story 5 will do very well in the box office, calling it now. How do I know that? They will learn from Lightyear and course correct hard.

You always harp on "the original creator" as some kind of bullet-proof thing. Suppose, the original creator, George Lucas, had been involved in the Star Wars sequels? Would fans have liked them? They sure didn't like the Prequels. That's the thing - it's NOT absolute and you are always speaking in absolutes.

 

[starlite_]

So when the Marvels flops financially, will this be proof enough? Or will you just want to move the goalposts at that point?

I said elemental would flop weeks ago, and the 1st weekend certainly suggest this movie will be a financial failure.

Indy 5 will be a financial failure also, care to place a small wager on it? Say $50 to a charity of your choice?

The Marvels will fail financially also, want the same wager on that one?

Again, I say something and you respond with a completely dif thing. I'm not moving any goalposts. You seem to be intent on predicting doom for all. And then you get defensive when ppl disagree with your opinions.

 

[mdmost]

You always harp on "the original creator" as some kind of bullet-proof thing. Suppose, the original creator, George Lucas, had been involved in the Star Wars sequels? Would fans have liked them? They sure didn't like the Prequels. That's the thing - it's NOT absolute and you are always speaking in absolutes.

Like a Sith.

 

[Elijah Abrams]

Fourth, Walt Disney Studios isn't doing super well both live-action and animation departments. Not only was Strange World a massive flop last year, the truth is that The Little Mermaid may not even break even. I have no idea why TWDC spent $250M on a movie and then spent another $100M to market a movie with no A-list talent cast as the two leads, Ariel or Eric. The budgeted money is obscene to start with and then you try to make a movie where the audience is saying to itself who are these actors. I get that actors need a break to make it big. Perhaps a lower budget movie is the right place to start rather than a $250M budget? It reminds me of 20th Century Fox handing Simon Kinberg the reigns to an X-Men movie and he had never directed a movie before. Simon may turn out to be a talented director. But how about letting him start on a smaller project with a lower budget and cut his teeth there rather than a massive budget blockbuster movie? Even Steven Spielberg, an all time great, started with a small TV movie, Duel.

Then I guess Disney will have to sell off the 20th Century Studios IP/library and the label.

You can blame marketing or Disney+ all you want, but Pixar has been struggling for awhile. Iger will have to respond.

My best guess is Pete Doctor is fired and Brad Bird is brought in to run Pixar (maybe Andrew Stanton?) or Jennifer Lee gets control of all it.

Pixar is about to get a reckoning.

Or they just close Pixar and move half of the staff to Walt Disney Animation Studios, giving the latter an excuse to return to making traditionally-animated features, alongside doing some CGI ones.