2008 DDP discussion, questions, rants and vents

[kritter]

That would be a great plan.

The Deluxe Plan does not include gratituity either????

 

[TruBlu]

When I first read about the changes I was very disappointed. I don't really care about the elimination of the appetizer. It is the elimination of the tip that bothers me. The plan was about convenience for us. I liked the fact that it was all pre-paid.

DH and I talked about it last night, and we really think this has given us more vacation options. Now we will not get the plan. In the past our entire trip has really been tied to staying on property because of ADRs each day. Now we can stay off-site in a nicer, cheaper place. We can split our stay with other attractions in Orlando. Our kids have been begging to go to Universal and Sea World! They were very excited to hear that we can now.

So (for us anyway) we will take these lemons that Disney has given us and make lemonade.

 

[pilferk]

My biggest thing to watch? I want to see that snack list expanded or find out that those using the '08 plan are still seeing the same snack offerings - as written? Pretty lame to this family....

The language in the '08 brochure, concerning snacks, is almost identical to the language in the '07 brochure.

So there has been no change in the language, no announcement that snack offerings have been reduced. I guess we'll all have to wait til '08 (and I'll be one of the guinea pigs...we arrive on Jan 5th) to see what the practice actually is. But I'd say...don't get concerned quite yet.

 

[Praying Colonel]

Those poll results suggest to me that the majority of DDP plan folks are mainly interested in saving $$$ and the deluxe plan is priced too high for them right out of the box.
Remember that the tips WILL ADD UP!!!
And if you have a drink or two with your meals (as we always do at the 2TS credit signature restaurants) the $$ goes higher still.

Great points. I was looking at our upcoming meal at Narcoosee's and what we're likely to order. Our tip could end up being 50-55 bucks. Imagine paying that for a 2 credit signature meal and then paying another tip for another TS meal that day. Multiply that times the number of nights in your trip. Even free dining isn't free when you're getting into that kind of money.

I didn't have bad service when were on the DDP--in fact, we found service to be top-notch. So the idea of cutting the tip to eliminate the bad service complaints certainly doesn't apply to us. But even if it did, I'd hope that would be offset by more than a measly $1 decrease in the cost of the plan--especially when they're lopping off a valuable part of the DDP that had been in place since the DDP's inception.

Pay more, get less. Yes, I guess I should be thrilled about that , but even though I was born in the night, I wasn't born last night.

 

[pilferk]

Bottom line is that the DDP no longer has (monetary) value, so there is no longer any reason to get it unless the convenience of a prepaid, inclusive package is of value to you. Most vacation "packages" out there don't save you money if you break them down anyway, they just give you one-stop shopping. I don't blame Disney for making changes, but I hope they are prepared to lose A LOT of participants on the plan. I expect Disney is banking on the lemmings who will continue to get the DDP without really crunching the numbers on the new plan. Personally, I rarely go for packages, as I can customize my own trips better and usually for a much better price. The DDP was an exception as is was a great value. Now its not, so I will go back to paying OOP, maybe with the DDE.

We crunched the numbers.

The DDP still saves us money. About 15% (rather than the 30% plus it WOULD have saved us, previously).

To me, that's enough. As a DVC member, the DDP's not tied to discounts, and I don't get it free, so that's not a factor for me. We also don't prepay (with DVC, you pay for DDP at check in, so.....).

Simply based on numbers, it still has SOME value. Not as much, to be sure, but some. And it's going to be situational, too.

For others, it won't. It's not a no brainer anymore, and, as you point out, actually requires some analysis on a trip by trip basis to determine if it's goingt to "work" for you. Maybe having to do that analysis "lessens" the value for some people (not for me...I'm a data junkie).

 

[Donald&Tinkerbell]

The regular plan doesn't work for us. We don't have kids & part of our vacation is enjoying the restaurants. We eat 2 meals a day, usually both TS & usually dinner is a 2TS place. So the deluxe plan will save us money, and fit our habits well. The $70/day will just about be what lunch would cost, plus the free refillable mugs! It will be like getting the 2ts free. And anytime I can eat just for the price of the tip (20%) I think it's a good deal.

 

[pilferk]

Well I only see possibly signiture resturants opening up some... But will still be booked. I remember long before DDP places like California Grill was still not very easy to book.

Although you might want people to go offsite...Disney does not. The whole idea of the dining plan was to stop people from going off-site. So I seriously doubt freeing up ADRs is the reason for this change. The last thing Disney wants is for someone to go off property and spend money somewhere else. That's a bad business philosophy. Maybe some will end up doing that, but it is not Disney's intention. Remember what Walt said, all his guests are VIPs.

Unless you know the whole story, you can't call it, across the board, bad business.

If you have less volume, but make quite a bit more money on the volume you DO Have, how is that "bad business".

If you have demand that is simply overwhelming supply, and can raise prices/lower value to the consumer to both ease demand, and still hit the capacity of your supply, how is that "bad business"?

We simply don't know enough about what Disney's intent is, what their data says, or what the net result on their bottom line is (or projected to be) to write this off as "bad business". It might be very good business (which isn't to say it's great for their customers). It might turn out to be very bad business. We'll see.

 

[mickey2000]

And anytime I can eat just for the price of the tip (20%) I think it's a good deal.

I don't understand ???
Can you explain more !

 

[pilferk]

The regular plan doesn't work for us. We don't have kids & part of our vacation is enjoying the restaurants. We eat 2 meals a day, usually both TS & usually dinner is a 2TS place. So the deluxe plan will save us money, and fit our habits well. The $70/day will just about be what lunch would cost, plus the free refillable mugs! It will be like getting the 2ts free. And anytime I can eat just for the price of the tip (20%) I think it's a good deal.

One thing to point out: While true that $70 would cover lunch plus all your refillable mugs, keep in mind 2 things when crunching your numbers (I had to, when doing the math):

1) You would only buy your mugs ONCE per trip, not daily. So take the 12 a mug costs, and divide it by your length of stay. That's what your mug is costing you daily.

2) You need to deduct EACH person's mug from their OWN day's expense, not from ONE total days expense.

For example, with it's true that 70 - 24 (2 mugs) - 46 (Le Cellier Lunch) = 0, it's not an accurate depiction, really, on the use of your plan.

Assuming a 6 night stay, you're REALLY looking at 70 - 2 (1 mug/6 nights) - 46 = 22). STILL a good deal considering that $22 covers, potentially, 2 more TS meals!

Just wanted to point that out.....as I've done similar things, and had to rework my numbers, ultimately, to get what I was really looking for.

As an aside, I wonder how many will book "split" ressies at the same resort, one ressie for the first day, the next for the rest of the trip, and add DXDDP for the 1st day only. You'd get 3 TS + 2 snack credits to use within your first 2 "days" on site (arrival and check out), AND a mug you could use for the duration of the REST of your stay (yes, I know, probably technically against "mug" policy but let's not go through THAT debate). You could eke some real value out of doing that, I think, with or without the Basic DDP for the 2nd ressie.

 

[TruBlu]

I don't really care why they changed it. I just know that the plan no longer works for me. Because of this, Disney will get much less of my money. But, I also know that what seems like a lot of money to me is nothing to Disney. It will not hurt them at all for me to stay, eat and play off-site. There will be many others to replace me.

 

[kritter]

I just got an email response from Guest relations and the women provided me with her number to call if I was wanting to discuss it further......

 

[reeeoga]

So why are there different places listed on the DDP and the Deluxe DDP? I will be doing the Deluxe and there are several places that are listed on the regular plan but not the deluxe? makes no sense.

examples: Kona, Tony's, Sci-Fi, Moma Melrose.

 

[MommySiobhan]

I wish they had given the choice of appie or dessert not both and I feel sorry for the servers I am sure they will be big losers! They were guaranteed 18% now they are guaranteed nothing!

Well, they'll be guaranteed 18% from all parties of 6 and over. They automatically added this in.

I asked and this would include my family, as we have a 'reservation for 6'. Does not matter that any will be under 3 and eating from my plate. The baby still counts in the party as he's on the reservation.

I usually tip 20% anyhow but I don't think they should be adding infants to the party size, personally.

 

[Becky2005]

So why are there different places listed on the DDP and the Deluxe DDP? I will be doing the Deluxe and there are several places that are listed on the regular plan but not the deluxe? makes no sense.

examples: Kona, Tony's, Sci-Fi, Moma Melrose.

Hmm...the deluxe brochure I'm looking at has Kona, Tony's, Sci-Fi & Mama Melrose on it.

http://adisneyworld.disney.go.com/m...cific/eng/nontheme/tickets/08deluxedining.pdf

 

[Lewisc]

I totally agree that only registered guests are to use the plan. But I don't know how they can enforce that when only 1 card is asked for regardless of the size of the party.

The card says something like 2A2C. The server isn't allowed to charge more then 2 adult meals and 2 kids meals to the dining account. I guess a family could split and have dinner in two different restaurants, with another family, and get a total of 4 adult and 4 kids meals during one meal period but I doubt many famlies will want to dine that way.

edited to say I saw the OP on this issue, the husband will be playing golf and another family member will be having a meal with those on the plan. This will probably still work, unless Disney decides to issue wrist bands.

 

[Nancyg56]

So what did the servers do before the DDP? The DDP has not been around forever, so maybe they are just a little bit scared/spoiled that they will actually have to work for their tips?

This is not a fair statement. If you watch the servers in Disney TS restaurants you see very hard working professional every day. The problem with not having the gratuity attached to the DDP for the servers is that Disney is a vacation destination with a lot of people who do not travel with the same mindset that they may have at home. A family whose budget got crunched by all of the extras that vacations entail may feel that the meals are already paid for, the server will never see them again, and that Disney has enough of their money so will either stiff the server entirely or leave a minimal tip.

This would not be an issue for servers if it only happens once in a while, it is part of their job to give professional service to all of their customers. If a pattern starts to emerge that DDP guests are not tipping the server may not have the warm and fuzzies when DDP guests are the majority of their station.

I don't know what will happen but I think it is going to be interesting to see who benefits from removing the automatic gratuity. I imagine the big loser will be the server followed closely by the guest with Disney making the big win.

In the end if the DDP plan changes again with the guest agreeing to pay an automatic tip when purchasing the plan I would bet that servers got stiffed a lot. I believe that Disney is a corporation and is not going to take a step backward in this.

 

[hansel1]

I just got off the phone with a CM from disney dining. I asked about the restaurants that were not included with the 2008 regular DDP. Mainly the absence of San Angel Inn and Nine Dragons in world showcase.

Her computer shows that those two restaurants are "pending" and that they are not finalized for the 2008 plan, YET!.

I also asked about double booking on the night I have a San Angel Inn reservations. I was told that I could not do that as my reservations would be audited and one of the two for that night would be cancelled.

 

[psummrs]

I believe that Disney took a calculated risk when they decided to make up the DP for 2008. IMO, they saw 2 blaring customer complaints. 1) The service at the TS restaurants is declining due to overbooking and included gratuity 2) Some people do not like to eat at CS a majority of the time and would like an additional DP to cater to them. Now, one thing that generally is repeated throughout this thread:

The new plan does not adjust the price enough for the amount you now need to cover the tip....If the plan was dropped about $5.00 per person and no tip included ,then it might be a better option.

But have you considered that maybe Disney was intending to raise the price of the DP by approximately 5 dollars. If you take this possibility into account, which is possible due to tourism being on the rise, then Disney did drop the price of the DDP significantly. And don't forget, this was a discount to begin with. This was created as a discount dining plan for guests staying at WDW resorts. All that is simply happening is a decrease in this discount, and it is STILL a discount.

So use the new DDP or DxDDP if you want to, and if it fits your vacation style. I personally like to go to more TS restaurants than not and see the DxDDP as a discount, approx 20% by my estimates, for the way I am planning my vacation to WDW. And it will still be a discount if I do not choose to get an app or desert at every meal. The elimination of included gratuities IMO is no big deal because it still remains a discount for my vacation style.

Overall, I think Disney is having their intended effect of increasing profits, as usual because this is still a business, and reducing the overcrowding of restaurants due to the DDP.

 

[englishrose47]

I too had heard the servers wanted the tip seperately I just dont see why! I normally tip 15% to 20% and so when a server was really good I added to the automatic 18% so I see that a poor server is going to loose as they should but also good servers will get stiffed. Many people unfortunately wont tip at all ! I hope also that Disney re thinks the no appie and goes with the choice of appie or dessert. I checked the places I want to eat and I still think I'll come out a head alittle and I like the convenience of it being prepaid.I probably will order the more expensive itemsthat I like to get my moneys worth as opposed to a ceaper item if paying oop

 

[peel]

Someone in the Codes and Rates forum just said that when she was booking her trip yesterday the CM on the phone told her she'd be able to get an appetizer instead of a dessert if she wanted. Has anyone else been told this? I'm not big into dessert but I love the appetizers....that change was my only disappointment in the DDP.