2008 DDP discussion, questions, rants and vents

[lexmelinda]

The complete list of participating restaurants for 2007 was released by Disney on November 15, 2006. You shouldn't expect to see the complete list of participating restaurants for 2008 released by Disney until mid-November 2007. The initial list is presented as a demonstration that patrons will have lots of choices.

Oh, good! Thank you!

 

[kowalchicky]

Being that the complete list is not official yet....what are the chances someone at disney is reading threads like this and maybe they will opt to do a family style app....instead of completly taking it away?

 

[bicker]

Almost no chance. When folks contacted Disney direct about the appetizer change for 2008, when it was first announced, the uniform response was a very direct "Thanks, we'll think about that for 2009."

 

[Pirates4me]

My take is this, I don't mind losing the appetizer and I don't mind losing the 18% tip, after all I agree that servers will actually serve if their income is dependent on good service. The part that I have a hard time swallowing is that they only dropped the price by $1. The way I figure it, I lost about 25-30% value yet the price drops $1. I guess it's the new math.

 

[bicker]

Consider it a price increase. The Dining Plan now costs almost as much as it is worth, instead of being an amazing deal.

 

[goofy4tink]

I've used the DDP several times, most recently in August. I will be using it again in Dec, but not in Jan. We seldom order desserts, but love appetizers. I don't mind being responsible for the tip..in fact, I prefer it. But to leave the automatic 18% tip off, and to delete the appetizer (worth about $5-8) yet only drop the price by $1 is a deal breaker for me.
I can do better using my DDE card for TS and then grazing, so to speak, for lunch. Hopefully, others feel this way and Disney will give us back that appetizer.

 

[disneymoss]

Boy I am sure glad I found this thread. I was not aware that appetizers were no longer included, I was just getting over the fact that gratuity was not included. Although I don't like the new changes it's still worth it in my opinion, most of our table service meals on our last visit came out to more than $150 for 2 adults and 1 child 9.

 

[Tiger926]

Consider it a price increase. The Dining Plan now costs almost as much as it is worth, instead of being an amazing deal.

Excellent analogy - I so totally agree! So many people seem to think that Disney owes us a Dining Plan in which we as guests must save tons o' cash. It's nice to save money of course, but it's not a stipulation that we must do so.

We are doing the Deluxe Plan and know based on our eating habits (we eat 2 -3 TS meals per day), that we will save money, and this is just an added bonus. Even if we didn't save money, and it was breakeven, we would still get the Dining Plan as the convenience of it is of value to us as a young family with two small children.

Tiger

 

[Pumbaa_]

I am with you Di, I don't think it is the value it was.

If your dining style is 3 TS a day, then the DxDP is a much better option. If I was doing a short trip with friends, I would do the DxDP since we tend to do Signatures every night.

 

[musical2]

I might get dinged for this, but I am sort of glad they dropped the appetizer from the plan. We don't usually do appetizers when we go out to dinner anyway because we want to be able to eat all our entree (or at least most of it). Since I figure we will still save about $200 for the week for the six of us, this is still a good deal for us. Plus we don't have to keep our eyes on the food budget as the week progresses. Hey this is vacation!!

When the appetizer is included, I almost feel obliged to get an appetizer I really shouldn't eat because it is included in the cost. Now dessert on the other hand is a reward after dinner. I may eat it or take it to go.

 

[LAS321]

I agree that losing the appetizer was not such a big deal for us. It's too bad you can chose either an appetizer OR a dessert.(Then we could share one of each!! ) But losing the gratuity really bothers me. First because when we go to the Signature restaurants the bill for 2 people could easily be between $100-200 so the gratuity could be anywhere from $20-40....But what really bothers me is that the people that are going to suffer in the long run are the wait staff. Instead of the guaranteed 18% they were getting, people can give whatever they want. And my understanding has been that many Europeans aren't used to paying gratuities, so the wait staff may get nothing from some people. I can see making some changes, but I think the gratuity should have stayed. Maybe they should have the option of several different dining plans, not just two....

 

[disneymoss]

I'm with you LAS321! We are a group of 9 going so we will automatically be charged 18% but think of those families who have 3 or 4 who may only leave a few $$$. When the appetizers were offered that ran up the bill so the waiter/waitress would get their 18% off of that from the Dining Plan, now that the appetizer isn't included the bills won't be all that high therefore cuts down their gratuity even more. I really fell sorry for the waitstaff, I'm gonna do the dining plan regardless, I don't want to worry about how much is this bill gonna be!!

 

[asmit4]

I agree that losing the appetizer was not such a big deal for us. It's too bad you can chose either an appetizer OR a dessert.(Then we could share one of each!! ) But losing the gratuity really bothers me. First because when we go to the Signature restaurants the bill for 2 people could easily be between $100-200 so the gratuity could be anywhere from $20-40....But what really bothers me is that the people that are going to suffer in the long run are the wait staff. Instead of the guaranteed 18% they were getting, people can give whatever they want. And my understanding has been that many Europeans aren't used to paying gratuities, so the wait staff may get nothing from some people. I can see making some changes, but I think the gratuity should have stayed. Maybe they should have the option of several different dining plans, not just two....

Exactly what I said on the tipping thread! The waitstaff is gonna get screwed! I bet they will make maybe 50% what they made in 2007- at least for the signature restaurants.

Can anybody really see most people tipping 40 bucks on a $200 bill for 3 people? I HIGHLY doubt it.

 

[apostolic4life]

Exactly what I said on the tipping thread! The waitstaff is gonna get screwed! I bet they will make maybe 50% what they made in 2007- at least for the signature restaurants.

Can anybody really see most people tipping 40 bucks on a $200 bill for 3 people? I HIGHLY doubt it.

I don't totally agree. I think most people who would not leave a tip (or leave a small inappropriate tip) will not use the DDP in either of its new forms. The DDP is no longer the huge food windfall it has been in the past; many people will not want to pay for it since they won't have that "getting something for free" feeling. They will not see the value in the plan without the appetizer or the tip included. Most people (even many on the DIS) have normally done all CS meals until the DDP came about, and I would bet with the changes for 2008 they will go back to their old ways to save some cash.

As for the wait staff getting screwed, I feel this will require them to actually provide excellent service to receive a tip they had been getting for steadily declining service. I always tip appropriately for the service rendered, but it seems today's servers want great tips just because they show up to punch the time clock. Many times, with the DDP, we were given service that was not worth tipping 18% but they got it anyway. You will always have people who do not follow traditional tipping guidelines, but I would bet the vast majority of us who use TS at WDW will tip appropriately; if you provide great service you will get a great tip, if you give poor service the tip will decrease. If a server gets "screwed" on a steady basis, maybe the server is actually doing it to themselves. Ya' think???

 

[bicker]

Also, Disney reserves the right to change the rules, and if what people are concerned about happens (which I think is very unlikely) they can just require a minimum 18% gratuity on all Dining Plan bills... YES, even after you've purchased it. Folks need to be very careful and READ the rules before they buy the Dining Plan, especially if they're planning to do something dastardly like stiffing the servers.

 

[apostolic4life]

Also, Disney reserves the right to change the rules, and if what people are concerned about happens (which I think is very unlikely) they can just require a minimum 18% gratuity on all Dining Plan bills... YES, even after you've purchased it. Folks need to be very careful and READ the rules before they buy the Dining Plan, especially if they're planning to do something dastardly like stiffing the servers.

I totally agree!

 

[disneymoss]

Well I just want to add that when we went for Thanksgiving last year, this was me and DS's first trip to Disney and DH had been several times as a young child. While in the Theme Parks at Rest. in Disney and at our resort we NEVER ran into any rude CM's or waitstaff, EVER. Yes we were on the dining plan. I can't see anyone keeping their job at Disney being RUDE!!! I'm grateful we didn't have the same experience as some of you DISers had as this might have changed our whole outlook on Disney!!!

 

[apostolic4life]

Well I just want to add that when we went for Thanksgiving last year, this was me and DS's first trip to Disney and DH had been several times as a young child. While in the Theme Parks at Rest. in Disney and at our resort we NEVER ran into any rude CM's or waitstaff, EVER. Yes we were on the dining plan. I can't see anyone keeping their job at Disney being RUDE!!! I'm grateful we didn't have the same experience as some of you DISers had as this might have changed our whole outlook on Disney!!!

I have only ever had one rude server at WDW. Matter of fact, except for the one time, all of our WDW servers have been very kind. Kindness though does not equal good service. Talk to me about my trip, talk to my children, heck, have a pleasant conversation with everyone in the place, but at the end of the meal if my needs have not been met while eating the tip will suffer. Many servers today assume tips are automatic just because a customer has occupied the restaurant seat or because the server may possess a charming demeanor; the whole concept of serving the customer to earn your tip has been slowly erased from the minds of most servers. I hope the new policy will halt the decline of service in the TS restaurants. Like I said, I do not equate poor/average/bad service with rudeness.....nor do I tip well for minimal service from pleasant waiters/waitresses. In all reality, I have had great service from rude servers.......and yes, they got an appropriate tip based on the service rendered!

 

[disneymoss]

I'm sorry I didn't explain myself I was not just relating to the rudeness. All of our waitstaff were very nice and talkative. Almost all of them got a kick out of my son sleeping through the meals. LOL!! Almost every night he fell asleep with in the middle of dinner or right after he ate, every single waiter/waitress that would pass made comments to us. The interaction between them and us were warming, kinda made you a little more comfortable.

 

[A_NY_Outlaw]

I think the dining plan worked ok for us in 2007....although I have to agree that tipping automatically to the servers was both a problem and a blessing. While we didn't need to worry about providing change or having cash on us, I think the guarentee of a decent tip hurt service. I firmly agree that a tip should reflect on the quality of service.

I wouldn't say EVERYONE took advantage of the snacks and every meal...we had snacks and I think 1 or 2 CS left over when we left. I felt the portions at most restaurants were on the small side and I frequently left meals still feeling hungry. I'm not a large person by any means.

I agree with the reasoning that eliminating appetizers gives greater table turnover meaning greater profits. After all, WDW is not dumb by any stetch.
I don't think however, that WDW eliminated this because it was hurting business....I know personally speaking, that the more money I saved on food, I would spend on something else- say shotglasses! My 80 s.g. were a testament to that.

I guess I'm just disappointed to hear someone say that free dining will not be an option for late autumn of 2008. I don't know if planning to go in October of 2008 would have been eligible anyway...I'm not sure how I would find out or how soon WDW would advertise that, if they do at all?