Wyndam Timeshare

[brownhaired_girl]

SRGIBBS Before you purchase at Star Island and plan to trade into Disney you should know that there are some rules about using a timeshare within 30 miles of Disney and trading in. Also I think Star Island traded through II and not RCI. Not sure if this is still true. Check with tug before making decisions so you aren't dissapointed.

 

[DCTooTall]

And another couple things...


1. Don't feel like you need to get a contract with a large # of points to begin with. You can always add contracts as you go, so you may find that starting with a smaller contract may be the way to go. This could allow you to get familiar with the Wyndham System, how you might use it, and what you actually find you might need to suit your needs.

This also has the advantage of allowing you to grow your ownership as your family grows and your room size and travel needs require additional points, and then divest some of your ownership once your kids start going off on their own allowing you to stay in smaller units...... or should you find that your situation changes for other reasons and you don't want such a large monthly commitment.

2. In general, With Wyndham, your home resort isn't going to be a primary concern. Unless you are wanting to vacation at a very popular resort during a popular time (New Orleans during Mardi Gras, etc), you won't have much need for the home resort perk of being able to exclusively make reservations from 13-10months prior. After 10months, points are points for all intents and purposes... so the MF costs and likelihood of Special Assessments should become the primary motivators.

3. If you do go the multiple contract route, There is nothing saying you have to buy contracts at 1 specific resort. Feel free to mix and match the contracts.

 

[JimMIA]

SRGIBBS Before you purchase at Star Island and plan to trade into Disney you should know that there are some rules about using a timeshare within 30 miles of Disney and trading in. Also I think Star Island traded through II and not RCI. Not sure if this is still true. Check with tug before making decisions so you aren't dissapointed.

You shouldn't buy any timeshare with the objective of trading into anything, but if that's important to you, this is the kind of detail that you will normally only find on TUG. That's the reason people say "Go to TUG."

IF Star Island trades via II (I have no clue) this could be a problem. If they trade via RCI, it is NOT a problem for technical reasons not worth delving into here.

 

[LadyBeBop]

I thought all Wyndham resorts trade into RCI.

 

[DCTooTall]

You shouldn't buy any timeshare with the objective of trading into anything, but if that's important to you, this is the kind of detail that you will normally only find on TUG. That's the reason people say "Go to TUG."

IF Star Island trades via II (I have no clue) this could be a problem. If they trade via RCI, it is NOT a problem for technical reasons not worth delving into here.

I thought all Wyndham resorts trade into RCI.

My understanding is that in general, All Wyndham properties trade into RCI. (Wyndham and RCI are owned by the same company after all....).

There are however exceptions to this rule. Some Older resorts trade into II. This usually only applies to resorts that were initially affiliated with II before being absorbed into the Wyndham system. (Star Island wasn't Initially a Wyndham/Fairfield Resort for example).



However.... I've seen some stuff on TUG and the Wyndham Owners Forums that suggest some possible changes in the works. Traditionally the Way Wyndham worked is that you would get a RCI or II membership based off whatever resort your FIRST contract was affiliated with. There has however been some mumbling that Wyndham may be moving to RCI memberships for all resales, regardless of the company the resort was affiliated to before.

 

[JimMIA]

I thought all Wyndham resorts trade into RCI.

Not all. Here's a list of the Wyndham/II resorts I found on TUG:

Royal Vista, Pompano Beach, FL
Governor's Green, Williamsburg, VA
Star Island, Orlando, FL
Blue Beard's Beach Club, St. Thomas, U. S. Virgin Islands
Riverside Suites, San Antonio, TX

I'm not sure how current that info is, but it's all I could find.

ETA: Also, if I counted correctly on the Wyndham site, there are now 84 Wyndham resorts -- that's not counting Worldmark or any of the affiliated/associated resorts. There might actually be a couple more, because the Wyndham owners website map runs a little behind reality.

 

[Brian Noble]

You shouldn't buy any timeshare with the objective of trading into anything

I am a timeshare owner, I exchange fairly regularly, and I agree 100% with this. There are two big reasons why people become disillusioned with a timeshare ownership. Number one is buying from a developer, and later discovering the resale value. A close second is finding that exchange is much much less convenient than it sounds at first blush---and the "rules" constantly change.

In fact, Jim's advice is so important that I will repeat it one more time, with emphasis: you shouldn't buy any timeshare with the objective of trading into anything. Buy resale, and buy to use!

 

[Danibelle]

SRGIBBS Before you purchase at Star Island and plan to trade into Disney you should know that there are some rules about using a timeshare within 30 miles of Disney and trading in. Also I think Star Island traded through II and not RCI. Not sure if this is still true. Check with tug before making decisions so you aren't dissapointed.

Star Island is listed in my Interval Intl. book. And Interval has a rule that you must stay with your home resort or home resort family in many locations including Orlando. For example, I own Marriott's Grande Vista and can only exchange within the other Marriott's in the Kissimmee/Orlando area.

Even with the above, I am a happy vacation club owner. I have booked my home resort and also traded with Interval.

 

[Brian Noble]

The Star Island situation is tricky. New purchasers of Wyndham deeds there may or may not be assigned to II instead of RCI. I don't think that is well known. Existing purchasers, for now, retain their original exchange company assignment. Wyndham *has* started depositing Star Island inventory to RCI, within the last year or two. The same is true for at least Governor's Green, and possibly other Wyndham-II resorts. That suggests something different could be happening.

The DVC Orlando-area block may or may not still be enforced---there have been some recent reports that suggest it has been lifted, but that could also be a glitch introduced by RCI's recent upgrade of the Points side of the system. (If you've been around RCI for any length of time, you will know that such glitches are the norm.) Either way, owners in point-based mini-systems with their own dedicated RCI portals don't have a notion of "home resort" for the purposes of regional blocks. Wyndham is such a system, others include Hilton, Bluegreen, etc.

And, if your head is spinning, you should know I've only scratched the surface of the complexities of how the exchange systems work. And that's why you should never, ever buy with an expectation of any particular exchange.

 

[Janet Hill]

I am a Wyndham owner whose account exchanges through II. My account will forever trade II as my first purchase was an II affiliated resort. I've since added RCI resorts to my ownership and since points are points when I make any exchanges all occur through II. According to Wyndham they are not allowed to change trading company affiliations once they are set (anti-trust so they say). I have inquired about making a developer point purchase to change to RCI and have been declined on three occasions, so they are either telling the truth about this one or they picked up on the fact I was just testing the theory.

Star Island is a peculiar beast as not all of it is Wyndham. If you own Star Island as a Wyndham resort you are not blocked from other Orlando area exchanges; however, if you own the non-Wyndham portion (forget name) you are blocked in Orlando.

All that said many of the II resorts are being transferred to trading RCI when ownership changes (or so was told by a salesman).

 

[srgibbs]

From all my research as a family of 5 we will have to use a 2 bedroom unlike DVC and that will really eat up all our points in a hurry thus not really making even a free timeshare any deal for us with the maintence fees. With kids in school we are not super flexible on travel dates. We go to Disney for 10 days and the beach a few times a year so 154,000 won't begin to be enough. Even looking on ebay for more points with the fees not sure it is the best deal. Looks like way to much hassle and not enough flexiblility. If I'm wrong and someone can show me differently please do. Thanks for all the help.

 

[DCTooTall]

From all my research as a family of 5 we will have to use a 2 bedroom unlike DVC and that will really eat up all our points in a hurry thus not really making even a free timeshare any deal for us with the maintence fees. With kids in school we are not super flexible on travel dates. We go to Disney for 10 days and the beach a few times a year so 154,000 won't begin to be enough. Even looking on ebay for more points with the fees not sure it is the best deal. Looks like way to much hassle and not enough flexiblility. If I'm wrong and someone can show me differently please do. Thanks for all the help.

IMHO, Compared to DVC, It's definately going to give you more flexibility in that you have more resorts within the system (without utilizing RCI or II) in which to use your points, and you also don't usually need to rely on your exclusive period in order to get the dates and rooms you want at your resort. (I've read a lot about how during peak times the "prime" DVC resorts tend to fill up quickly).

A 1 bedroom unit does include a pull out couch... so depending on what your needs are, you might be able to fit in a 1bdrm at WBC.

As for being more cost and requiring more effort than you are willing to put forth... that really is a matter of preference. In order to take full advantage of your ownership, it will require some effort on your part. You can also squeeze by on a minimal amount of effort, but you may end up wasting some of your ownership points by doing so.

The nice thing is that, as others have mentioned, you plan on vacationing exclusively in the orlando area, It can often be cheaper to rent thru a third party than to own yourself. This is due partcially to the fact the 3rd party renters tend to have some sort of VIP status with Wyndham, which combined with the time they are able to put into it, allows them to really utilize a lot of the mechanisms available to take advantage of the point discounts on stays at the resort.

 

[JimMIA]

From all my research as a family of 5 we will have to use a 2 bedroom unlike DVC and that will really eat up all our points in a hurry thus not really making even a free timeshare any deal for us with the maintence fees. With kids in school we are not super flexible on travel dates. We go to Disney for 10 days and the beach a few times a year so 154,000 won't begin to be enough. Even looking on ebay for more points with the fees not sure it is the best deal. Looks like way to much hassle and not enough flexiblility. If I'm wrong and someone can show me differently please do. Thanks for all the help.

Like most comparisons, the devil is in the details. Comparing DVC to Wyndham is not apples to apples. It's more like apples to zebras.

For example, you say you go to Disney for 10 days. To do that with DVC in any DVC one bedroom, you're going to need a substantial number of points. During the summer, in an OKW 1 BR (the lowest priced DVC), you're going to need 300 DVC points (282 for 9 nights, 312 for 10) And that's assuming only one Fri-Sat weekend; if you stay two weekends, the cost goes up considerably. My OKW costs per point (acquisition cost buying resale for cash + annual dues) are $7 per point. So that works out to $1,974 to $2,184, depending on whether you stay 9 or 10 nights.

My cost (acquisition + MFs) for my Wyndham points is $4.48 per thousand, and a TWO bedroom at Bonnet Creek during the summer school break is 305K points for 10 nights -- or $1,366. Note that's a TWO bedroom.

You say you can't do much with 154K Wyndham points, and you're right. 154K Wyndham points is roughly comparable to about 50-75 DVC points. You can't do much with either.

My personal opinion (owning both) is that DVC is a great timeshare for stays in DVC resorts at WDW. When you get outside WDW, there are better, less expensive options anywhere else DVC has a resort. When you try to use DVC for non-DVC options, it's just not a good value.

For vacations away from the WDW area, one simple number tells the story. DVC has a total of 11 resorts (7 at WDW); Wyndham currently has 84...and growing. Wyndham has the same number of resorts in Hawaii as DVC has in their entire system.

On the DVC boards, one thing I tell prospective buyers is to first be sure you want a longterm financial committment to any timeshare before you buy. As DCTooTall points out, for WDW, you probably come out ahead just renting...even if you go every year. And that's true whether you rent DVC or Wyndham from an owner, or any other option.

 

[DCTooTall]

And one other very important point to consider.

DVC is a lease. Wyndham is a deeded purchase.


I think the current DVC leases start expiring in about 30years or so (someone can correct me if I'm wrong).... so you will be paying that money for 30yrs and then at the end of it, have nothing.

Wyndham however since it's deeded, you own it outright. It is yours to do with as you please.... including being able use it in your retirement and/or give it to your kids once they start a family.


Personally.. I prefer knowing that I own it outright. Others however like the idea of the "easy out" at the end of the lease period. Either way, because you are looking at a lease vs. a purchase, it is another HUGE thing to consider when comparing them.

(the flip side... CURRENTLY, Disney utilizes it's right of first refusal, which is keeping DVC resale pricing higher. This means that while you may pay more up front to get the points, you also have a better chance of getting some of that $$ back if you decide to sell.)

 

[JimMIA]

And one other very important point to consider.

DVC is a lease. Wyndham is a deeded purchase.


I think the current DVC leases start expiring in about 30years or so (someone can correct me if I'm wrong).... so you will be paying that money for 30yrs and then at the end of it, have nothing.

Wyndham however since it's deeded, you own it outright. It is yours to do with as you please.... including being able use it in your retirement and/or give it to your kids once they start a family

Personally.. I prefer knowing that I own it outright. Others however like the idea of the "easy out" at the end of the lease period. Either way, because you are looking at a lease vs. a purchase, it is another HUGE thing to consider when comparing them..

That's correct, DVC is a lease. DVC contracts expire between 2042 and 2060, I believe, depending on resort. Some think that's a disadvantage, personally I think it's a kinda-sorta plus if anything. At least there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

Wyndham goes on forever. And the day after you buy it, it is worth NOTHING. Yes, you own it forever, but the resale value is zero or very close to it. Personally, I consider that a plus, because I bought for virtually nothing on the resale market, so WHEN -- not if -- I lose it all, I've lost very little.

(the flip side... CURRENTLY, Disney utilizes it's right of first refusal, which is keeping DVC resale pricing higher. This means that while you may pay more up front to get the points, you also have a better chance of getting some of that $$ back if you decide to sell.)

Actually, DVC held its value for a while, but for more than two years, DVC has been ROFRing almost nothing. As a result, resale prices have dropped to a level most of us would not have imagined a few years ago.

For example, DVC is selling BLT direct currently for $150 per point with discounts depending on the size of the purchase. BLT is selling (and clearing ROFR) for less than $90 resale...with a few sales WAY lower.

With other resorts, you can save 50% or more buying resale. With the drop in resale prices, it's extremely difficult to make a straight-faced argument for buying direct from Disney. The prices have just dropped so far, it's crazy.

If you want to see how bad it is, go to the DVC ROFR Thread and be amazed by what you see.

 

[srgibbs]

I really think the Wyndam timeshare would be a good deal for our family if it would let a family of 5 rent out a 1 bedroom condo. Our children are 10,7 and 10 months so for at least 3 more years a 1 bedroom would be perfect. From what I understand though the max is 4 for a one bedroom and a 2 bedroom uses way to many points. If I have missed something please correct me! I really would love to get one with around 254,000 points which would meet our needs. I like the idea of having a deed and passing it on to the kids or even being able to take turns taking thier families places. I really wanted to try and make it work for our family as we would love to try new places but the main reason I decided against is the 1 bedroom max policy. I would not want to lie or be dishonest when making a reservation but if anyone has other advise on ways to deal with that please let me know.

 

[JimMIA]

I like the idea of having a deed and passing it on to the kids or even being able to take turns taking thier families places.

Actually, DVC is a deeded lease. I'm not sure I have that terminology correct, but you can definitely sell it, leave it to someone when you pass, etc...subject to the expiration of the contract, of course. The only practical difference is DVC ends and Wyndham does not.

The downside of leaving a timeshare to a loved one is they may not want it -- and the ongoing annual fees it will involve. The natural parental assumption is "if I love it, they will love it," but that is often not true.

 

[JimMIA]

I really wanted to try and make it work for our family as we would love to try new places but the main reason I decided against is the 1 bedroom max policy. I would not want to lie or be dishonest when making a reservation but if anyone has other advise on ways to deal with that please let me know.

The only way around it I know of is to just lie, which I certainly would NOT recommend. That might very well blow up in your face.

If you get more points at a resort that has low MF's, you'll probably have enough points to get a 2 bedroom, with little or no difference in cost. MF's are the key. Look for larger contracts at Wyndham Great Smoky Mountains (NOT the lodge with the waterpark) and see how those numbers work for you.

 

[srgibbs]

Thanks that was my thought. i'm keeping my eyes open on ebay. i'm sure the right amount of points with the right maintence fee will come up at some point.

 

[DCTooTall]

I honestly don't see a 1bdrm unit being able to suit your family needs for long anyways at WBC. That max occupancy of 4 is based off 2 people sleeping in the King bed in the bedroom, and 2 on the pull out couch in the living room.

For maybe a year or so, you can get away with maybe using a pack and play to let the youngest sleep in. After that you'll have some issues. (even if it's because the two oldest will start to complain about needing to share a bed.)