WWYD?? I don't think I am in the wrong!

[remyandhollandsmommy]

So my ex called a few weeks ago to talk to the girls (his calls are really sporatic) and against my better judgement when he told them at the end of his call he wanted to talk to me I took the phone. I got an earful about how he can't afford to pay any child support and a bunch of name calling then to finish it off a death wish for my unborn child with my DH...poor DH who is normally NEVER involved with ex's BS was furious and hung up the phone. I emailed the ex and told him from now on I will no longer take his calls and if he has anything to say to ME he can email me (this is to protect myself since I will then have proof to take to court if he gets out of line).

I don't know why the ex is so insanely interested in my every move since he has since remarried and has a new child of his own, but he is constantly harrassing my DH and I..mostly of course about child support which is determined by Fl guidelines based on our pay, not an amount I specified. And if I were him I would be interested in talking to our girls about THEIR lives not bringing up adult topics to them you know?

Anyway, of course I had the girls call him from a payphone on Christmas day since our cell was messing up (we just got it back from the company today). He spent his entire phone convo with the girls complaining about child support and me and cut them off if they asked how his Christmas was or tried to steer the convo into "friendly" territory. It's to the point where neither girl wants to deal with him since out of Remy's mouth, "he just wants to talk about you or stupid money mom..he doesn't listen to anything we have to talk about..I'm tired of it." I feel bad for them, but have no way of fixing the situation.

Fast forward to today when we got the phone back working I had them call him to say hi. He did his normal quizzing of what is your mom doing in life and what is she spending my child support on blah blah blah and after the girls had enough of talking he told Remy 11 to put me on the phone. I told her to just say "mom said to email". Then he started yelling at Rem so I took the phone and hung it up. He kept calling back and I had DH answer and tell ex to email or nothing. DH was very calm (despite the death wish towards his child) when he said "sorry man she said email cause she isn't getting on this phone" and then just hung up and turned the cell off. I think we handled it very maturely. What would you have done?

Oh yea, way to start off the new year right?!

 

[Carly_Roach]

DH was very calm (despite the death wish towards his child) when he said "sorry man she said email cause she isn't getting on this phone" and then just hung up and turned the cell off. I think we handled it very maturely. What would you have done?

Oh yea, way to start off the new year right?!

I know it's upsetting, but him saying, "I hope your baby dies" won't make your baby die. Yes, it's an ugly thing to say, however you are aware that he's an ugly man with an ugly heart and you should be prepared to hear ugly things from him.

Now, having said that, I think your DH responded best. He told your ex that any communication between you and the ex will have to be in writing. Obviously the ex can't have a conversation without becoming emotional, therefore all conversations must be in writing until he CAN control his emotions. I'd recommend sending the ex an email telling him that you've chosen this route because of his inability to control himself when he's on the phone. That way you're covered should a judge ask why you cut off communication.

As for your daughters always having to listen to their Dad's money problems, perhaps emails might be best for their communications as well. Again, the kids would have to detail in their first email why they are choosing this method so if a judge asks at a later date why this happened, they can provide evidence that they requested this venue.

If you don't need the cell phone for your regular phone service, I'd recommend leaving it off unless/until you needed to communicate with the ex.

Best of luck to you all.

 

[bobcat]

That's harassment. You can keep a log of each time he calls or when he starts to badger the kids about you. This way you have a record if you ever need to use it. The best way for you to deal with this is to not respond.

 

[Eeyores Butterfly]

It sounds like he needs to not be talking to your children, but I'm sure there is some kind of custody arrangement thing with the courts regarding communication. You might want to talk to a lawyer and find out what your options are on that front since he is escalating to harassing them as well.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

So my ex called a few weeks ago to talk to the girls (his calls are really sporatic) and against my better judgement when he told them at the end of his call he wanted to talk to me I took the phone. I got an earful about how he can't afford to pay any child support and a bunch of name calling then to finish it off a death wish for my unborn child with my DH...poor DH who is normally NEVER involved with ex's BS was furious and hung up the phone. I emailed the ex and told him from now on I will no longer take his calls and if he has anything to say to ME he can email me (this is to protect myself since I will then have proof to take to court if he gets out of line).

I don't know why the ex is so insanely interested in my every move since he has since remarried and has a new child of his own, but he is constantly harrassing my DH and I..mostly of course about child support which is determined by Fl guidelines based on our pay, not an amount I specified. And if I were him I would be interested in talking to our girls about THEIR lives not bringing up adult topics to them you know?

Anyway, of course I had the girls call him from a payphone on Christmas day since our cell was messing up (we just got it back from the company today). He spent his entire phone convo with the girls complaining about child support and me and cut them off if they asked how his Christmas was or tried to steer the convo into "friendly" territory. It's to the point where neither girl wants to deal with him since out of Remy's mouth, "he just wants to talk about you or stupid money mom..he doesn't listen to anything we have to talk about..I'm tired of it." I feel bad for them, but have no way of fixing the situation.

Fast forward to today when we got the phone back working I had them call him to say hi. He did his normal quizzing of what is your mom doing in life and what is she spending my child support on blah blah blah and after the girls had enough of talking he told Remy 11 to put me on the phone. I told her to just say "mom said to email". Then he started yelling at Rem so I took the phone and hung it up. He kept calling back and I had DH answer and tell ex to email or nothing. DH was very calm (despite the death wish towards his child) when he said "sorry man she said email cause she isn't getting on this phone" and then just hung up and turned the cell off. I think we handled it very maturely. What would you have done?

Oh yea, way to start off the new year right?!

So it is WWYD?

Well first I would empower my dd's and teach them how to navigate out of a "rant" conversation. When their dad starts in with the money, I would practice canned answers...like, "Dad if you cannot talk to me about me, then I have nothing more to say to you. I am hanging up now."
(or something to that effect)

As far as the issue between you and the ex, well, that is just something you are going to have to handle.
Try and keep it to emails, however that is just not going to be possible all of the time.

So....when the ex-h calls and talks to your dd's and then wants to talk to you, say you will call him back later. That way your dd's do not have to witness any garbage and in addition it can give you ex time to chill it.

 

[JCJRSmith]

He asked your child "what is your mom spending my child support on"? None of his business - and this is coming to you from a guy who paid child support to an ex-wife for 16 years. It is none of his business.

 

[clovergirl5]

That's harassment. You can keep a log of each time he calls or when he starts to badger the kids about you. This way you have a record if you ever need to use it. The best way for you to deal with this is to not respond.

I agree with that ^^

Sorry op you are having so many issues with such a jerk. Definitely don't need them while you are expecting.

 

[diznygirl]

I'd draw up papers where he can sign off on his parental rights to his children and in exchange he wouldn't have to pay child support.

Getting someone toxic out of my life for good would be my goal.

Okay, I'm sure something like that isn't possible, but sure would be nice.

 

[luvsJack]

The first thing I would do is not call him again. If he wants to talk to his daughters, he would have to call them. They seem to know that he doesn't really want to talk to them anyway. Having them call him is just hurting them more. If he does call them, don't even acknowledge him. Answer, when he ask for his children, hand the phone to them--no conversing between you and him.

You may want to email him before the next phone call and just tell him that he must keep his conversations with his children about them and to leave you out of it. He is upsetting them and you will not tolerate it. And stick to that.

Second, I would stick to my guns about your only communications being email and I would keep a copy of any email he sends you and any you send him.

Lastly, give your DH an extra hug and kiss. He sounds like a really special guy.

 

[aprilgail2]

I'd draw up papers where he can sign off on his parental rights to his children and in exchange he wouldn't have to pay child support.

Getting someone toxic out of my life for good would be my goal.

Okay, I'm sure something like that isn't possible, but sure would be nice.

exactly!

 

[Carly_Roach]

I'd draw up papers where he can sign off on his parental rights to his children and in exchange he wouldn't have to pay child support.

Getting someone toxic out of my life for good would be my goal.

Okay, I'm sure something like that isn't possible, but sure would be nice.

I have to agree with this one. If it's possible, do it. Then you won't have to worry about him upsetting your children again.

 

[VillageMama]

What was it about this jerk that attracted you to him in the first place? I never understand when I read these stories about awful ex-husbands... were they sterling, upstanding men before the wedding? Did they turn into ******** only afterwards? How can I help my daughters choose husbands wisely?

I wish you all the best. I hope that your sweet little girls are able to have as little contact with this guy as possible.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

This seems to be an ongoing issue based on your past threads.

Maybe you should seek counseling so the family can handle the calls/emails the correct way.

 

[dislaney]

The first thing I would do is not call him again. If he wants to talk to his daughters, he would have to call them. They seem to know that he doesn't really want to talk to them anyway. Having them call him is just hurting them more. If he does call them, don't even acknowledge him. Answer, when he ask for his children, hand the phone to them--no conversing between you and him.

You may want to email him before the next phone call and just tell him that he must keep his conversations with his children about them and to leave you out of it. He is upsetting them and you will not tolerate it. And stick to that.

Second, I would stick to my guns about your only communications being email and I would keep a copy of any email he sends you and any you send him.

Lastly, give your DH an extra hug and kiss. He sounds like a really special guy.

This is exactly what I would do.

 

[hrh_disney_queen]

Child support is your children's right, not yours. You do not have the right to bargain that away in exchange for full custody as it is not yours, it is theirs. I also doubt that him signing away parental rights would stop him from any of the crap he is pulling on you right now, it will just change the topic of his conversation a little.

If you can record some of these conversations and take him to court, possibly his parental rights will be limited without losing the child support that is again, your children's right. You would have to check the legalities of recording a conversation, usually it is only required that one party know of the recording. Email would be best if you can get him to do it.

I'm so sorry for your troubles with this jerk. Too bad he can't be happy with his new family without harassing yours. Good luck.

 

[3boymthr]

I agree with PP keep all conversations in writing. Send him an e-mail stating that his in ability to maintain his temper in phone calls is what's driving your decision.

If your children wish to follow you in this decision it is their right, but don't force it on them.

It's sad to say but your X may never get over the whole money thing and you may want to prepare your DD's for this.

DH is 45 and until he broke off communication 2 years ago every time we wrote or spoke to FIL the first thing he would ask is "what is that b**** MIL's name doing with my money?" (She got alimony as well as child support.) Seriously, like we knew or cared. Get over it. But he wouldn't. BTW they divorced when DH was 16 and MIL was forced to cut off all phone contact after a while but his vitriol to her continued in his letters, luckily for her he lived (lives?) over 1,000 miles away.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

I think you are doing the right thing by cutting off phone contact.

 

[remyandhollandsmommy]

I know it's upsetting, but him saying, "I hope your baby dies" won't make your baby die. Yes, it's an ugly thing to say, however you are aware that he's an ugly man with an ugly heart and you should be prepared to hear ugly things from him.

Now, having said that, I think your DH responded best. He told your ex that any communication between you and the ex will have to be in writing. Obviously the ex can't have a conversation without becoming emotional, therefore all conversations must be in writing until he CAN control his emotions. I'd recommend sending the ex an email telling him that you've chosen this route because of his inability to control himself when he's on the phone. That way you're covered should a judge ask why you cut off communication.

If you don't need the cell phone for your regular phone service, I'd recommend leaving it off unless/until you needed to communicate with the ex.

Best of luck to you all.

I know that I should expect nasty remarks, by this stage I am used to them. I am just tired of getting into pointless arguements and want to have records from now on for court purposes. I would have to say that roughly 97% off all convos with the ex regard his feelings on paying too much in child support. I would be more sympathetic to this if he didn't make almost 5K a month and have a new house, two new vehicles (both over 30K each) as well as being otherwise financially stable. The truth is he feels like he is giving ME money for nothing instead of in reality paying part of the girls living expenses. The court also says I pay the same amount in support, but of course it is paid to "myself" for their upkeep. Fl state guidelines determine the support amount and we can NOT lower it because it is for the children and Fl state wants to make sure they get what the girls need, not make life easier for the parents. We have been to court over twenty times in the last three years regarding his wanting to lower child support and it is dismissed every time. Acutally we are scheduled to return to court for the same issue sometimes soon (just got the papers served, no court date yet sigh). I would also like to make sure that everyone understands that I get NO money in addition to the child support, I pay OOP for all extras the girls need like school clothes, school fees, activities (for which I go without luxuries to be able to afford to give them..by luxuries I mean cable, clothes for myself, any going out, treats, etc), field trips, etc. Unfortunately we do need the cell since we turned off our regular phone (the cell costs us 28/a mo less which may not seem like alot but to us it is).

That's harassment. You can keep a log of each time he calls or when he starts to badger the kids about you. This way you have a record if you ever need to use it. The best way for you to deal with this is to not respond.

I do keep a log since I am tired of dealing with name calling and harrassement. This is one of the main reasons I want to have strickly email communication so that a record is kept.

So it is WWYD?

Well first I would empower my dd's and teach them how to navigate out of a "rant" conversation. When their dad starts in with the money, I would practice canned answers...like, "Dad if you cannot talk to me about me, then I have nothing more to say to you. I am hanging up now."
(or something to that effect)

So....when the ex-h calls and talks to your dd's and then wants to talk to you, say you will call him back later. That way your dd's do not have to witness any garbage and in addition it can give you ex time to chill it.

I have tried to teach the girls that if it begins to get uncomfortable with your dad simply explain to him that you don't want to talk about adult things and if he persists then hang up. Even though I have assured them they will NOT get into trouble they are afraid their dad will punish them or yell at them when they see him next. I have had both girls in therapy several years (since the beginning of the divorce) but it doesn't seem to be able to make headway with that fear. Holly isn't as afraid as Remy at this point and has no issue hanging up, but Remy is another story. I will admit that if she starts to cry I have no problem taking the phone and hanging up for her since I will only let it get so far. I honestly don't know what else to do since I am trying to abide by the courts orders.

I have tried the "I will have to call back later" thing but he just keeps yelling at the girls to "tell your mom I said get her butt on this phone"...he has control issues and can't seem to understand that he is no longer in charge of me or my life. I admit I was in therapy for two years as well regarding issues I had with him and my marriage.

I'd draw up papers where he can sign off on his parental rights to his children and in exchange he wouldn't have to pay child support.

Getting someone toxic out of my life for good would be my goal.

Okay, I'm sure something like that isn't possible, but sure would be nice.

A nice thought, but not really feasible lol. I would have no problem giving up child support to get him out of my life but I have to be fair to the girls. I still have that hope that he will get over his money issues with me and see how wonderful they are before its too late.

You may want to email him before the next phone call and just tell him that he must keep his conversations with his children about them and to leave you out of it. He is upsetting them and you will not tolerate it. And stick to that.

Second, I would stick to my guns about your only communications being email and I would keep a copy of any email he sends you and any you send him.

Lastly, give your DH an extra hug and kiss. He sounds like a really special guy.

I took so long to respond back to ya'll becuase I was emailing him letting him know that I think email communication is best between the two of us at this time. I see no point in continually arguing on the phone wasting our cell minutes on the same issues, plus I am tired of being called names.

And I agree my DH is very special...sometimes I am amazed he sticks with me with all the "baggage" I came with. It takes someone wonderful to put up with the constant harrassement we deal with when it isn't really his problem. He does get upset sometimes though becuase in his eyes it is OUR girls as well and he hates seeing them hurt. Plus he goes above and beyond in my eyes...the poor man worked three weeks with only one day off so that he could make extra money to get the girls some gifts we wouldn't have been able to afford for Cmas otherwise..

What was it about this jerk that attracted you to him in the first place? I never understand when I read these stories about awful ex-husbands... were they sterling, upstanding men before the wedding? Did they turn into a@@holes only afterwards? How can I help my daughters choose husbands wisely?

I wish you all the best. I hope that your sweet little girls are able to have as little contact with this guy as possible.

I know it sounds stupid but I grew up in an abusive household with a single mom and a series of stepdads and my moms boyfriends that werent the nicest ppl and didn't think the ex was like this until after we were married and had Remy...by that time I felt stuck and didn't see how I could get out of the situation..I actually left for over a year when Remy was two, but somehow got sucked back in thinking he had changed..which he did for a year or two...then when he was deployed several times he became really bad and had me convinced I was worthless, stupid, and that he would get custody of the girls if I left since I had no job at that time and no resourses...it took a long time (and therapy) to see I was a capable woman and was NOT worthless...now I can't understand how I was so dumb..hindsight I guess.

This seems to be an ongoing issue based on your past threads.

Maybe you should seek counseling so the family can handle the calls/emails the correct way.

Yes, it is ongoing...I hate to repeatedly whine, but its nice to talk about/vent to ppl I have grown to "know" the past few years on here. Plus I get second opinions since I am very much emotionally involved and want to make sure I am doing the right thing regarding this problem..I want to see if others with experience I may not possess have alt ideas on what I should/could do and how to deal with this. To tell you the truth I try to follow the court orders while limiting MYSELF from the ex...I just want to do whats best for the girls.

We have all been to councelling, well me and the girls...but ex sees no wrong doing on his part so unless and until he does it will never change how he acts towards us unfortunatley.

Child support is your children's right, not yours. You do not have the right to bargain that away in exchange for full custody as it is not yours, it is theirs. I also doubt that him signing away parental rights would stop him from any of the crap he is pulling on you right now, it will just change the topic of his conversation a little.

If you can record some of these conversations and take him to court, possibly his parental rights will be limited without losing the child support that is again, your children's right. You would have to check the legalities of recording a conversation, usually it is only required that one party know of the recording. Email would be best if you can get him to do it.

I'm so sorry for your troubles with this jerk. Too bad he can't be happy with his new family without harassing yours. Good luck.

I agree with you per my PP up there somewhere. I don't think you can legally record a convo in this state, not sure. I just thought switching to emails would be the best option.


Sorry so long winded, I just want to get this off my chest. Thanks for the advice.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I have tried to teach the girls that if it begins to get uncomfortable with your dad simply explain to him that you don't want to talk about adult things and if he persists then hang up. Even though I have assured them they will NOT get into trouble they are afraid their dad will punish them or yell at them when they see him next. I have had both girls in therapy several years (since the beginning of the divorce) but it doesn't seem to be able to make headway with that fear. Holly isn't as afraid as Remy at this point and has no issue hanging up, but Remy is another story. I will admit that if she starts to cry I have no problem taking the phone and hanging up for her since I will only let it get so far. I honestly don't know what else to do since I am trying to abide by the courts orders.

I have tried the "I will have to call back later" thing but he just keeps yelling at the girls to "tell your mom I said get her butt on this phone"...he has control issues and can't seem to understand that he is no longer in charge of me or my life. I admit I was in therapy for two years as well regarding issues I had with him and my marriage.

You keep at it. Your girls need to be empowered. It is not going to be easy or fixed right away however they need to learn how to speak to their dad and tell him to go pound sand in a matter of speaking.

Yes they are conflicted however one day it will "click".

And part of that is you being their leader. If he "demands" your butt on the phone, then your dd can say you are not allowed to talk to my mother like that and say you will be allowed to speak with us when you are respectful.

It is more about what your girls are saying to him than about what he is saying to them if that makes sense.

I know it is very hard for them however it is the reality they live in so they must learn navigate it. You must role play with them until it becomes a "reflex canned response" that comes out of their mouths.

He is a bully and they need to learn how to deal with bullying/controlling tactics.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

I have tried the "I will have to call back later" thing but he just keeps yelling at the girls to "tell your mom I said get her butt on this phone"...he has control issues and can't seem to understand that he is no longer in charge of me or my life. I admit I was in therapy for two years as well regarding issues I had with him and my marriage.

Why would you make your children do the dirty work for you?
No matter what your the adult so you are making the kids weapons just as much as he seems to be.





Yes, it is ongoing...I hate to repeatedly whine, but its nice to talk about/vent to ppl I have grown to "know" the past few years on here. Plus I get second opinions since I am very much emotionally involved and want to make sure I am doing the right thing regarding this problem..I want to see if others with experience I may not possess have alt ideas on what I should/could do and how to deal with this. To tell you the truth I try to follow the court orders while limiting MYSELF from the ex...I just want to do whats best for the girls.
We have all been to councelling, well me and the girls...but ex sees no wrong doing on his part so unless and until he does it will never change how he acts towards us unfortunatley.

Emotions always cloud your thoughts & that is understandable.......ongoing counseling might be the correct route for you to go.
When I read repeated posts like this I always think there is your side, his side & the side we will never know.
Making sure your doing the right thing for all involved is wonderful but a professional would be best.