Writing a letter
- Thread starter dthomas
- Start date
I want to write a letter to someone in charge to ask why the points at VWL are the same as preferred view BWV whenever the cash reservation price is Lower than BWV. I have seen it explained on this board (higher construction price) but I would like an "official explanation". I feel the points are a little out of line in compared to the other two resorts at WDW. I know my letter will not make a difference, but I do not think that new members in DVC should have higher points at their home resort whenever the cash price is lower than BWV. Also, I am sure some rooms at VWL face parking lots too. I would just like to see more uniformity.
[This message was edited by dthomas on 02-13-01 at 05:16 PM.]
[This message was edited by dthomas on 02-13-01 at 05:16 PM.]
Muushka
<font color=red>I usually feel like I just stepped
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dthomas
We have recently purchased at VWL. We knew the facts before we bought there, but it was our favorite resort, and so we waited 2 years for it to be built. I agree with what you have written about the point vs cash payment when compared to BWV. One letter may not make a difference, but maybe if several people wrote, who knows! Please let me know if you find out who to write to, and we will write also. (We probably should have let them know how we felt about it when we bought, but they seemed to have the attitide that Disney can do basically what it wants).
We have recently purchased at VWL. We knew the facts before we bought there, but it was our favorite resort, and so we waited 2 years for it to be built. I agree with what you have written about the point vs cash payment when compared to BWV. One letter may not make a difference, but maybe if several people wrote, who knows! Please let me know if you find out who to write to, and we will write also. (We probably should have let them know how we felt about it when we bought, but they seemed to have the attitide that Disney can do basically what it wants).
The reason they had to make the schedule as high as it is is pretty simple. The Vero Beach fiasco. They really should have raised the buy in price to compensate for the higher construction costs. With VB points laying around and nobody buying them, they couldn't very well raise the buy in price. Think of the MB program they would have needed then!!!
Another problem for DVC caused by VB. Now points spent at VWL will return a lower value then points spent at BWV. If the trend continues, and BCV gives even less value, that 11 month window is going to be getting more and more important. I expect they will be selling VB points well after BCV sells out also.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
Another problem for DVC caused by VB. Now points spent at VWL will return a lower value then points spent at BWV. If the trend continues, and BCV gives even less value, that 11 month window is going to be getting more and more important. I expect they will be selling VB points well after BCV sells out also.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
Rich, Vero Beach is not to blame for global warming! I wish you would find something besides your own conjecture to bolster your point about it being a failure. I have read nothing to indicate this and have heard nothing from anyone but you here on these boards.
I don't know what the big surprise is about the point schedule at VWL. When BWV opened they established a new point schedule for DVC. (This was later adjusted to allow for parking lot view rooms at a lower rate.) When VWL opened they continued to use the new point schedule.
I don't know what the big surprise is about the point schedule at VWL. When BWV opened they established a new point schedule for DVC. (This was later adjusted to allow for parking lot view rooms at a lower rate.) When VWL opened they continued to use the new point schedule.
VB is very obviously a very big dissappointment to Disney. The experience there and at HH soured Dsieny on ever building off WDW property DVC resorts again. The resort is only a shadow of its original plans, again, because of poor sales. Remember the deal with the dues??? Do you think that Disney would have put themselves in the very embarrassing position of ending that subsidy if they didn't have to???
What about the MB program? VB has long been the recipient of the most generous MB programs to try to get people to buy there.
There is no doubt at all that VB was a big disappointment. HH was also. HH is in an area with a thriving resort business already, it is a tiny resort, it will sell out.
VB is also a very beautiful resort. Big rooms, plenty of things to do, it is a truly great place. But it isn't selling. DVC sales has been forced by poor sales to use lies and fraud to sell their poorly selling resort.
While I may be very outspoken and candid, I am also right.
For DOC:
My opinion?? I think not, I think that the evidence is overwhelming that Disney is EXTREMELY dissappointed in the sales at VB, so much so that they will never again build an off site DVC resort.
I guess my reasoning for the point schedule at VWL is 'my opinion'. I would be very interested in hearing other opinions, I haven't/ I think my opinion is right...hmmmm, well, I guess that by definition, I would have to believe that my opinion was right.....
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
What about the MB program? VB has long been the recipient of the most generous MB programs to try to get people to buy there.
There is no doubt at all that VB was a big disappointment. HH was also. HH is in an area with a thriving resort business already, it is a tiny resort, it will sell out.
VB is also a very beautiful resort. Big rooms, plenty of things to do, it is a truly great place. But it isn't selling. DVC sales has been forced by poor sales to use lies and fraud to sell their poorly selling resort.
While I may be very outspoken and candid, I am also right.
For DOC:
My opinion?? I think not, I think that the evidence is overwhelming that Disney is EXTREMELY dissappointed in the sales at VB, so much so that they will never again build an off site DVC resort.
I guess my reasoning for the point schedule at VWL is 'my opinion'. I would be very interested in hearing other opinions, I haven't/ I think my opinion is right...hmmmm, well, I guess that by definition, I would have to believe that my opinion was right.....
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
RobDoc
DIS Legend
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- Aug 14, 1998
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- 34,195
Rich- if you have some facts to back up your suspicions and OPINION then please state them. Otherwise it is merely your opinion.
To state than something is "very obviously" anything is merely your opinion- unless you have a published statement from DVC to it's members saying that. If you want to say "Rich Hyams is disappointed in the sales at VB"- then you are stating a FACT. If you are offering your rhetoric as an official comment from DVC- then I'd like to see your credentials to make such a statement.
If you can offer some statistics from other timeshares about the sales figures for their resorts at HH then your comments about the DVC resort there might also have some merit- but it seems that those comments are only your views on the subject and you include them only to serve your own purpose. Not fact- just your opinion again.
Your "overwhelming evidence" may exist only in your mind- as it doesn't look so overwhelming from my viewpoint. ....and that's MY opinion.
To state than something is "very obviously" anything is merely your opinion- unless you have a published statement from DVC to it's members saying that. If you want to say "Rich Hyams is disappointed in the sales at VB"- then you are stating a FACT. If you are offering your rhetoric as an official comment from DVC- then I'd like to see your credentials to make such a statement.
If you can offer some statistics from other timeshares about the sales figures for their resorts at HH then your comments about the DVC resort there might also have some merit- but it seems that those comments are only your views on the subject and you include them only to serve your own purpose. Not fact- just your opinion again.
Your "overwhelming evidence" may exist only in your mind- as it doesn't look so overwhelming from my viewpoint. ....and that's MY opinion.
Why is the resort not only not going to the "other side of the road" but not even being completed on this side of the road?
What reason could there possibly be other then poor sales?
Ending of that subsidy was a VERY telling move, what other reason could have possibly prompted that?
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
What reason could there possibly be other then poor sales?
Ending of that subsidy was a VERY telling move, what other reason could have possibly prompted that?
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
RobDoc
DIS Legend
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- Aug 14, 1998
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- 34,195
I don't have any information that those plans won't be completed at some time in the future. All I know is that those original plans have been temporarily modified.
While the plans may have been modified from the original proposal- plans do change. They even changed the points at BWV from what was orignally presented and I don't think that would make BWV a failure.
Some examples used are like saying "It is cloudy today and I have a headache- therefore headaches are caused by cloudy days." No real cause and effect there, but "case studies" are often presented as fact without any basis.
Some people are convinced that taking laetrile will cure cancer- or wearing a copper bracelet will prevent all sorts of disease. While there is no substantiated evidence to support those claims- many people are quite vocal with their assertions and they often present their own opinions and observations as fact- thus luring others into believing them and causing those individuals to delay or refuse more appropriate treatment options.
Provide the research to substantiate the claims and those claims are much more effective, as the research may then be evaluated by others in a rational manner.
While the plans may have been modified from the original proposal- plans do change. They even changed the points at BWV from what was orignally presented and I don't think that would make BWV a failure.
Some examples used are like saying "It is cloudy today and I have a headache- therefore headaches are caused by cloudy days." No real cause and effect there, but "case studies" are often presented as fact without any basis.
Some people are convinced that taking laetrile will cure cancer- or wearing a copper bracelet will prevent all sorts of disease. While there is no substantiated evidence to support those claims- many people are quite vocal with their assertions and they often present their own opinions and observations as fact- thus luring others into believing them and causing those individuals to delay or refuse more appropriate treatment options.
Provide the research to substantiate the claims and those claims are much more effective, as the research may then be evaluated by others in a rational manner.
I have heard nothing from DVC on what their plans are or are not for building out the rest of Vero. From Day One they were upfront that they were unsure how it would all develop. The ending of the subsidy was included in the documents early on as well. If BWV and WLV had not been built chances are very good that Vero would indeed be close to sell-out by now. These two on-site options certainly slowed sales.
It does appear that DVC will not continue in offsite development. However, I have no knowledge of what led to that decision nor do you. You feel that Vero and HHI were "failures". Have you considered that maybe they did take into consideration the balance needed between WDW and non-WDW resorts? Could it be they are looking to protect your ability to stay at WDW by not overselling offsite properties? Or maybe they just decided not to invest the resources to pursue this as a new business for Disney. Blanket "failure" statements are misleading and constantly accusing DVC of false sales practices is also a disservice to people who are coming to these boards for information. Over the years the majority of people have commented much the other way on how honest, helpful and low pressure the salespeople at DVC have been.
It does appear that DVC will not continue in offsite development. However, I have no knowledge of what led to that decision nor do you. You feel that Vero and HHI were "failures". Have you considered that maybe they did take into consideration the balance needed between WDW and non-WDW resorts? Could it be they are looking to protect your ability to stay at WDW by not overselling offsite properties? Or maybe they just decided not to invest the resources to pursue this as a new business for Disney. Blanket "failure" statements are misleading and constantly accusing DVC of false sales practices is also a disservice to people who are coming to these boards for information. Over the years the majority of people have commented much the other way on how honest, helpful and low pressure the salespeople at DVC have been.
I think it is quite fair to infer that the extremely difficult and embarrassing move of ending the subsidy for the dues was a huge confirmation that sales didn't go as planned(failed).
I also think that the ending of the subsidy told us that those plans are permanently scrapped for the "other side of the road", I think that the proposals for a conference center on the now infamous "other side of the road" is another confirmation of the fact that those plans are off the table completely.
You can call this all "my opinon', fine, but I am right.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
I also think that the ending of the subsidy told us that those plans are permanently scrapped for the "other side of the road", I think that the proposals for a conference center on the now infamous "other side of the road" is another confirmation of the fact that those plans are off the table completely.
You can call this all "my opinon', fine, but I am right.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
That Disney purposely stopped building off site DVC resorts, AND actually divested themselves of land that may have been designated for future DVC resorts so that the WDW properties would not be in too high of a demand....I actually hadn't considered that.
I don't think that it is very likely, especially with the zeal they put into using WDW DVC properties to sell VB points.
As far as lies go....I have sat through a presentation for HH where they lied to me. I have had many family members buy into dvc, some pretty recently, I think my sister got some of the last points at OKW. I have had several friends also buy into DVC. I have heard from EVERY single one of them that VB and/or HH were put up as a more economical choice to soley visit WDW DVC resorts.
On top of all that, we have witnessed here many testaments to the lies told by DVC sales staff.
If you remember, I stopped accusing DVC sales of false practices almost two years ago, it seemed we were getting less reports here of poor sales people and many reports of good honest sales folk, I thought that was great.
Then another one of my sisters bought, and we had people coming in here reporting the same lies again, this time they were tilted soley toward the selling of VB. I got back on my horse and as long as I can do so honestly and truthfully, I will continue to point out to people the lies and fraud used by DVC sales staff.
I think "false", "lies", and "fraud" are very strong words, I wouldn't use them if they weren't deserved, DVC sales staff has earned them thoroughly.
Of course, that is some of the sales staff, I am sure there are a few good ones left, but the choreagraphy of the lies seem so well timed and in such unison that I have to believe that they come from a play book and sales staff meetings, of course, I have no evidence of that, that is my meager opinion.
All of the above is stated by me, merely a man who actually thinks that DVC is the greatest thing in the world. But, in whose humble OPINION, believe DVC sales has some problems.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
[This message was edited by Richyams on 02-14-01 at 11:06 AM.]
I don't think that it is very likely, especially with the zeal they put into using WDW DVC properties to sell VB points.
As far as lies go....I have sat through a presentation for HH where they lied to me. I have had many family members buy into dvc, some pretty recently, I think my sister got some of the last points at OKW. I have had several friends also buy into DVC. I have heard from EVERY single one of them that VB and/or HH were put up as a more economical choice to soley visit WDW DVC resorts.
On top of all that, we have witnessed here many testaments to the lies told by DVC sales staff.
If you remember, I stopped accusing DVC sales of false practices almost two years ago, it seemed we were getting less reports here of poor sales people and many reports of good honest sales folk, I thought that was great.
Then another one of my sisters bought, and we had people coming in here reporting the same lies again, this time they were tilted soley toward the selling of VB. I got back on my horse and as long as I can do so honestly and truthfully, I will continue to point out to people the lies and fraud used by DVC sales staff.
I think "false", "lies", and "fraud" are very strong words, I wouldn't use them if they weren't deserved, DVC sales staff has earned them thoroughly.
Of course, that is some of the sales staff, I am sure there are a few good ones left, but the choreagraphy of the lies seem so well timed and in such unison that I have to believe that they come from a play book and sales staff meetings, of course, I have no evidence of that, that is my meager opinion.
All of the above is stated by me, merely a man who actually thinks that DVC is the greatest thing in the world. But, in whose humble OPINION, believe DVC sales has some problems.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?
[This message was edited by Richyams on 02-14-01 at 11:06 AM.]
RobDoc
DIS Legend
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>You can call this all "my opinon', fine, but I am right. [/quote]
...and that also is just your opinion!
Doc
doc@wdwinfo.com
...and that also is just your opinion!
Doc
doc@wdwinfo.com
kamgen
DIS Veteran
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- Aug 3, 2000
- Messages
- 3,671
Just wanted to say that we bought an add on at VB and we love it there. Well, if they don't sell more than we won't have a booking problem! 
No seriously, I think their marketing of VB is all wrong. Still, it is a wonderful place and apparently a well kept secret!!
Kamgen
Off site '94
AllStar-Movies '99
DxL '00 Honeymoon
DVC Member 4/00
BWV 9/00
VB 9/00
DCL-Wonder 1/01
OKW 1/01
Upcoming:
BWV 12/01
DCL-Magic 12/29/01
No seriously, I think their marketing of VB is all wrong. Still, it is a wonderful place and apparently a well kept secret!!
Kamgen
Off site '94
AllStar-Movies '99
DxL '00 Honeymoon
DVC Member 4/00
BWV 9/00
VB 9/00
DCL-Wonder 1/01
OKW 1/01
Upcoming:
BWV 12/01
DCL-Magic 12/29/01
JudithM
DIS Veteran
- Joined
- Dec 5, 1999
- Messages
- 5,456
DTHOMAS, I received an email from a DVC cast member who suggests you write your letter to Terri Schultz, Director of Administration, Finance & Member Services. I don't have an address in front of me, but I imagine you can find one among your DVC information. I have seen/heard Terri at the OKW annual meetings when she presented the annual budget information. She seems very knowledgeable & seems to care about member's concerns, feelings, thoughts, etc. Please let us know when you get a response.
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