Will Disney Rethink the Fixed Week Option?

[BestDadEver]

Opting out each year, by itself, is not a problem for members with traditional points. Keep in mind that a VGF Fixed Week Owner is just like any other DVC member that has DVC points. Its just that his points are going to be used at VGF at the same time every year. Its no different than a BWV owner who spends a week at her resort every October or a VWL owner who spends a week at her resort every December. By letting Fixed Week Owners opt out every year, it increases the chances that traditional points members could book the week that the Fixed Week Owner is giving up for the year. This is a good thing for traditional points owners because it gives them more choices.

Restricting the opt out option to only once every third year would be problematic. It would conflict with the ability to bank and borrow. Plus, I can see some Fixed Week Members losing track of which years they could opt out and which years they could not.

I wasn't saying anything for sure . Not sure at this point that anyone could tell what potential problem could come about if almost all full week purchase tend to opt it fequently . I just don't think they need to have even more flexability by adding floating weeks ect .

But like dean stated most probably won't even opt out much

 

[Breyean]

I wasn't saying anything for sure . Not sure at this point that anyone could tell what potential problem could come about if almost all full week purchase tend to opt it fequently . I just don't think they need to have even more flexability by adding floating weeks ect .

But like dean stated most probably won't even opt out much

Why would this even matter to you?

Having a fixed week means the owner has a reservation for a week each year w/o having to make a phone call to MS or book it online.

Many members book rooms at the 11 month mark and later cancel for various reasons. Change in plans, change in resort. etc. At that point the rooms become available for all other owners at that resort, and at 7 months (or less) non owners can grab up those rooms.

Fixed week works the same. They have a reservation which non owners couldn't get until 7 months anyway. They can cancel that up to 31 days out, just as with a normal reservation now, w/o penalty. Again, when/if they cancel, from 7-11 months out other VGF owners can book those rooms; from 7 months in, they are there for anybody to grab. Just as it is now at all other resorts.

Now, the ones who I can see be affected more than us non owners at VGF are those who DO own at VGF, because even at 11 months they might find their dates hard to get because others (the fixed week owners) have them locked even before the 11 month window opens.

It's almost as though the fixed week owners are another tier of ownership with enhanced booking privileges, but for which they paid a price in having to buy and use more points than what those weeks would normally get from the points charts. And again, it looks like other VGF owners might feel it more than non owners.

 

[BestDadEver]

Why would this even matter to you?

Having a fixed week means the owner has a reservation for a week each year w/o having to make a phone call to MS or book it online.

Many members book rooms at the 11 month mark and later cancel for various reasons. Change in plans, change in resort. etc. At that point the rooms become available for all other owners at that resort, and at 7 months (or less) non owners can grab up those rooms.

Fixed week works the same. They have a reservation which non owners couldn't get until 7 months anyway. They can cancel that up to 31 days out, just as with a normal reservation now, w/o penalty. Again, when/if they cancel, from 7-11 months out other VGF owners can book those rooms; from 7 months in, they are there for anybody to grab. Just as it is now at all other resorts.

Now, the ones who I can see be affected more than us non owners at VGF are those who DO own at VGF, because even at 11 months they might find their dates hard to get because others (the fixed week owners) have them locked even before the 11 month window opens.

It's almost as though the fixed week owners are another tier of ownership with enhanced booking privileges, but for which they paid a price in having to buy and use more points than what those weeks would normally get from the points charts. And again, it looks like other VGF owners might feel it more than non owners.

Well I am worried about it cause of potential problems . That last part you wrote could be a potential problem . Now I have no plans of buying VGF but I would like to add on in the future , and this could be a potential problem that could effect me , and other DVC owners . Plus better then address issues before they arise so then you don't have to change things people are already used to .

 

[HHISand]

It's 31 days before the week starts.

Thank you Dean and Tjkraz. Sometimes the "Guides" are not very good at guiding!

 

[Dean]

It's 31 days before the week starts.

Thank you Dean and Tjkraz. Sometimes the "Guides" are not very good at guiding!

Guides ares salespeople. As you can see it helps to bat these things around so that we can pool our aggregate information and experiences and all come out with a better understanding on the other side.

 

[Soul Brother]

Now, the ones who I can see be affected more than us non owners at VGF are those who DO own at VGF, because even at 11 months they might find their dates hard to get because others (the fixed week owners) have them locked even before the 11 month window opens.

It's almost as though the fixed week owners are another tier of ownership with enhanced booking privileges, but for which they paid a price in having to buy and use more points than what those weeks would normally get from the points charts. And again, it looks like other VGF owners might feel it more than non owners.

This is exactly why I bought a fixed week for the first week of December.

We usually stay in a studio. There are only 47 studios at VGF. If they sell the 32% they've allotted (which I'm sure they will given the popularity of December) for this week there will only be 32 studios left for all remaining VGF owners to book at 11 months. This will be an extremely difficult reservation to get and I didn't want to fight it out with reservations to ensure I can get it.

If I decide to rent it, I only will if I get a premium to cover the extra points I paid for to get it.
In my mind, if there's a time you usually like to go you need to buy a fixed week because the resort is so small to begin with. Add in having a bunch of rooms not ever available due to fixed week owners and you have a supply and demand issue for the most popular weeks.

 

[Breyean]

This is exactly why I bought a fixed week for the first week of December.

We usually stay in a studio. There are only 47 studios at VGF. If they sell the 32% they've allotted (which I'm sure they will given the popularity of December) for this week there will only be 32 studios left for all remaining VGF owners to book at 11 months. This will be an extremely difficult reservation to get and I didn't want to fight it out with reservations to ensure I can get it.

If I decide to rent it, I only will if I get a premium to cover the extra points I paid for to get it.
In my mind, if there's a time you usually like to go you need to buy a fixed week because the resort is so small to begin with. Add in having a bunch of rooms not ever available due to fixed week owners and you have a supply and demand issue for the most popular weeks.

Yes, early December is one of the times when it makes sense for a fixed week. You're not looking to hit a specific day, like Christmas, which is a moving target based on calendar changes each year.

That's the time I would have picked had I decided to buy at VGF. It sounds like you have a good plan.

 

[SpaceMountain77]

I also purchased a fixed week, lake view studio in December.

Yesterday, when I spoke to a cast member in the DVC Quality Assurance Department, I inquired about the number of lake view studios. Of the 47 studios, 30 are standard view and 17 are lake view. Although I would not mind a pool view, yearly parking lot views would truly disappoint me. As I have mentioned in other posts, for me, the assurance of having my room type, view and week guaranteed is worth the extra cost. I purchased VGF solely for holiday visits.

Now, to answer a question that has been frequently asked:

1. What happens to the extra points from a fixed week?

This information is provided in both the VGF Component Site Public Offering Statement and contract. Simply put, the points are lost. It is the equivalent of failing to bank and/or use points in holding. Every year, fixed-week owners are automatically booked at the value detailed in the chart and the remainder are lost.

 

[Soul Brother]

I also purchased a fixed week, lake view studio in December.

Yesterday, when I spoke to a cast member in the DVC Quality Assurance Department, I inquired about the number of lake view studios. Of the 47 studios, 30 are standard view and 17 are lake view. Although I would not mind a pool view, yearly parking lot views would truly disappoint me. As I have mentioned in other posts, for me, the assurance of having my room type, view and week guaranteed is worth the extra cost. I purchased VGF solely for holiday visits.

Now, to answer a question that has been frequently asked:

1. What happens to the extra points from a fixed week?

This information is provided in both the VGF Component Site Public Offering Statement and contract. Simply put, the points are lost. It is the equivalent of failing to bank and/or use points in holding. Every year, fixed-week owners are automatically booked at the value detailed in the chart and the remainder are lost.

Congratulations SpaceMountain77.
We purchased a standard view studio for the first week of December.
View has never been a big deal for us as we're not in the room that much and I have BLT for our trips if we desire a view. If view was important for us at VGF we would have done the same as you which absolutely makes sense.

As far as points go, your note above only deals with if you use your points for your fixed week and not if you give up your week and bank or use before your banking deadline, right?
I don't have my paperwork yet but my guide has reassured me multiple times that I have the full 138 points to use. Also, my account lists 138 points on dvcmember.com

 

[SpaceMountain77]

Congratulations SpaceMountain77.
We purchased a standard view studio for the first week of December.
View has never been a big deal for us as we're not in the room that much and I have BLT for our trips if we desire a view. If view was important for us at VGF we would have done the same as you which absolutely makes sense.

As far as points go, your note above only deals with if you use your points for your fixed week and not if you give up your week and bank or use before your banking deadline, right?
I don't have my paperwork yet but my guide has reassured me multiple times that I have the full 138 points to use. Also, my account lists 138 points on dvcmember.com

Hi Soul Brother,

Congratulations and yes, you are correct. If you opt out of the fixed-week, then you have the full 138 points, which could then be used during that use year or banked.

 

[Dean]

Now, to answer a question that has been frequently asked:

1. What happens to the extra points from a fixed week?

This information is provided in both the VGF Component Site Public Offering Statement and contract. Simply put, the points are lost. It is the equivalent of failing to bank and/or use points in holding. Every year, fixed-week owners are automatically booked at the value detailed in the chart and the remainder are lost.

That's a given, the question really is where does the resort end up total points wise. Do they sell an extra 10% of points on the fixed weeks AND the rest of the points down to the retention amount (2-4%) or do they account for those extra points as part of the total sold. My guess is a little of both. I'm guessing they hold back a slightly larger %, maybe 4% then sell the resort as if the fixed weeks were the same as the points chart. That should make it a wash. Of course they have to show calculations to the state that they haven't oversold the resort but I think they can do that within my thoughts. I'm thinking they have to account for the points from a sales standpoint as if each and every fixed week buyer opted for points every year.

 

[Soul Brother]

That's a given, the question really is where does the resort end up total points wise. Do they sell an extra 10% of points on the fixed weeks AND the rest of the points down to the retention amount (2-4%) or do they account for those extra points as part of the total sold. My guess is a little of both. I'm guessing they hold back a slightly larger %, maybe 4% then sell the resort as if the fixed weeks were the same as the points chart. That should make it a wash. Of course they have to show calculations to the state that they haven't oversold the resort but I think they can do that within my thoughts. I'm thinking they have to account for the points from a sales standpoint as if each and every fixed week buyer opted for points every year.

Would it be possible that extra fixed week points (those where fixed week owners don't opt out) be pooled and used for cash reservations?

 

[SpaceMountain77]

That's a given, the question really is where does the resort end up total points wise. Do they sell an extra 10% of points on the fixed weeks AND the rest of the points down to the retention amount (2-4%) or do they account for those extra points as part of the total sold. My guess is a little of both. I'm guessing they hold back a slightly larger %, maybe 4% then sell the resort as if the fixed weeks were the same as the points chart. That should make it a wash. Of course they have to show calculations to the state that they haven't oversold the resort but I think they can do that within my thoughts. I'm thinking they have to account for the points from a sales standpoint as if each and every fixed week buyer opted for points every year.

Hi Dean,

Based on my read of the offering statement and contract, I believe it is the latter; DVC accounts for those extra points as part of the total sold. The contract suggests that your last statement is correct, factoring in an annual opt out by all.

 

[Dean]

Would it be possible that extra fixed week points (those where fixed week owners don't opt out) be pooled and used for cash reservations?

No, not by DVC or DVD because they are declared into DVC inventory. The exception would be under 60 days out (breakage).

Hi Dean,

Based on my read of the offering statement and contract, I believe it is the latter; DVC accounts for those extra points as part of the total sold. The contract suggests that your last statement is correct, factoring in an annual opt out by all.

That would seem the most likely and most logical and basically means they're selling the same total points as if they didn't have fixed weeks. The only real benefits I see from a system standpoint are 7 day reservations and less phone calls potentially. They'd have made more simply selling them for a higher price but the same points.

 

[SpaceMountain77]

That would seem the most likely and most logical and basically means they're selling the same total points as if they didn't have fixed weeks. The only real benefits I see from a system standpoint are 7 day reservations and less phone calls potentially. They'd have made more simply selling them for a higher price but the same points.

Yes, I agree. I thought the points would be the same, but sold at a higher price.

To me, the fixed-week really seems to favor the purchaser. Nothing is lost by opting out in a given year and the purchaser receives the total points purchased, not the week's value.

 

[Dean]

Yes, I agree. I thought the points would be the same, but sold at a higher price.

To me, the fixed-week really seems to favor the purchaser. Nothing is lost by opting out in a given year and the purchaser receives the total points purchased, not the week's value.

You have to buy those points levels and can't break down to smaller contracts. A negative for some, not as much for others. It also depends on the size of the villa and season.

 

[wdrl]

That's a given, the question really is where does the resort end up total points wise. Do they sell an extra 10% of points on the fixed weeks AND the rest of the points down to the retention amount (2-4%) or do they account for those extra points as part of the total sold. My guess is a little of both. I'm guessing they hold back a slightly larger %, maybe 4% then sell the resort as if the fixed weeks were the same as the points chart. That should make it a wash. Of course they have to show calculations to the state that they haven't oversold the resort but I think they can do that within my thoughts. I'm thinking they have to account for the points from a sales standpoint as if each and every fixed week buyer opted for points every year.

I think its really quite simple how all the points are accounted for at VGF. First, ignore the presence of Fixed Weeks. If it takes 2.5 million points to book the resort for the base year, then that is all what DVD can sell.

If no one buys a Fixed Week, then DVD will sell 2,450,000 points to the general public. This reflects the 2% (50,000 points ) that DVD is required to retain. DVD is entitled to use its 2% any way it wishes, including for cash reservations.

If DVD sells the maximum percentage of 35% of Fixed Weeks, then it is still limited to selling no more than 2,450,000 points to Fixed Week owners and traditional points owners. The Fixed Week owners pay for and get approximately 10% more points than their weeks actually cost. This means that the Fixed Week Owners will need 857,500 points (35% of 2,450,000 points) to book their weeks. They also get another 85,750 points that represents the 10% premium they pay for the Fixed Weeks. Thus, if all Fixed Weeks are sold, then 943,250 points will be in the hands of the Fixed Week owners.

With a maximum of 943,250 points in the hands of the Fixed Week owners, it leaves DVD with a maximum of 1,506,750 points that will be sold to the traditional points owners.

Now, if all Fixed Week owners retain their Fixed Week, they will only actually use only 857,500 points' worth of accommodations instead of the 943,250 points that they actually own. Thus, there will be 85,750 points' worth of accommodations each year that will be available to the DVC members. Some of these accommodations will be snapped up by non-VGF owners and others will be snapped up by DVD, who will use those points to fund cash reservations.

If every Fixed Week owner opts out of their Week and converts to traditional points, then they can book a maximum of 943,250 points' worth of accommodations. This amount, combined with the 1,506,750 points that belong to the traditional points owners at VGF, account for all 2,450,000 VGF points that are in the hands of the general public. Thus, all accommodations at VGF for the year can be booked and accounted for.

 

[Dean]

I think its really quite simple how all the points are accounted for at VGF. First, ignore the presence of Fixed Weeks. If it takes 2.5 million points to book the resort for the base year, then that is all what DVD can sell.

If no one buys a Fixed Week, then DVD will sell 2,450,000 points to the general public. This reflects the 2% (50,000 points ) that DVD is required to retain. DVD is entitled to use its 2% any way it wishes, including for cash reservations.

If DVD sells the maximum percentage of 35% of Fixed Weeks, then it is still limited to selling no more than 2,450,000 points to Fixed Week owners and traditional points owners. The Fixed Week owners pay for and get approximately 10% more points than their weeks actually cost. This means that the Fixed Week Owners will need 857,500 points (35% of 2,450,000 points) to book their weeks. They also get another 85,750 points that represents the 10% premium they pay for the Fixed Weeks. Thus, if all Fixed Weeks are sold, then 943,250 points will be in the hands of the Fixed Week owners.

With a maximum of 943,250 points in the hands of the Fixed Week owners, it leaves DVD with a maximum of 1,506,750 points that will be sold to the traditional points owners.

Now, if all Fixed Week owners retain their Fixed Week, they will only actually use only 857,500 points' worth of accommodations instead of the 943,250 points that they actually own. Thus, there will be 85,750 points' worth of accommodations each year that will be available to the DVC members. Some of these accommodations will be snapped up by non-VGF owners and others will be snapped up by DVD, who will use those points to fund cash reservations.

If every Fixed Week owner opts out of their Week and converts to traditional points, then they can book a maximum of 943,250 points' worth of accommodations. This amount, combined with the 1,506,750 points that belong to the traditional points owners at VGF, account for all 2,450,000 VGF points that are in the hands of the general public. Thus, all accommodations at VGF for the year can be booked and accounted for.

That would seem the most likely option and thus the fixed week situation will actually help other VGF owners and DVC members that hope to trade in at 7 months out for most weeks. The exceptions will be the weeks that are more heavily penetrated by the fixed weeks.

 

[JWG]

I don't see why they'd revisit fixed weeks if they're selling (and it sounds like they are). They have a set # of points to sell at a resort. Someone wanting a fixed week just helped do so faster by paying a premium on the purchase.

If everyone uses their fixed week, Disney isn't out anything. Matter of fact, they've gained a little as there's a point premium that didn't get "used" so to speak. Everyone using their fixed week would be like me not using 10% of my points. I still paid for them, I still pay dues on them, choosing not to book anything with them isn't a cost to Disney but a savings on my not being there to dirty a room.

 

[CarolMN]

When the "extra" points aren't used by the fixed week owners (because they keep their weeks), wouldn't the "extra" rooms they represent eventually end up somewhere as breakage income? The points belong to the members, not DVD.

Maybe the breakage doesn't end up at VGF (because non-owners book up everything there at 7 months, but it would seem the "extra" would show up as breakage somewhere in the system and thus go towards reducing member dues.

So, maybe the fixed week option actually helps keep dues lower for the members who own somewhere besides VGF - probably mostly SSR, since I assume it has more breakage than the other DVC resorts.

What am I missing?