Why kids should work hard in school & stay there

[glitterkittyy]

I must be missing something here because I don't get the debate.

My point is show kids the realities of life and it might work in flipping a switch. I don't get the arguments against it.

Should no-one bother with any of the kids because some won't respond?

I thank you for the link. I will show it to my oldest daughter. She hasn't been paying as much attention to her studies as she should. I have explained several times about the importance of education, and I think this might help in illustrating the drastic difference in what she can expect later in life.

 

[dakcp2001]

I had a teacher in 10th grade who took this type of statistical info and made a chart that has stuck with me to THIS day! I went to a HS with a very high drop out rate, about 50% of students drop out before senior year. The chart6 had this type of info, but he used picture of what you would be driving and where you would be living in each bracket. The point of course was to demonstrate that the HS dropout had a bus pass and lived with their parents, and the one who graduated from hs had their own apt and a used car of their own. Of course there are outliers in this type of statistic, but let me tell you, this was an effective teaching strategy for me when I was in 10th grade it had a huge impact on us. I still remember the sad looking guy with the bus pass. lol. I also remember the college graduate with the new VW Passat and the Dr with the BMW> lol. Steroetypes. lol.

It was a scare tactic that worked.

 

[MrsPete]

Just because it doesn't work for all doesn't mean it's ok to stop trying. What if being lax means the one kid who would have responded misses the message?

If so then WOW, I have no other words than WOW, I'm glad I wasn't one of those kids from a messed up home you told yourselves not to bother with... I didn't know I was supposed to be a lost cause.

No one said stop doing it -- I just said I have a poster on my wall at school with information very similar to what you're describing. What we're saying is that most kids won't believe it applies to them.

Likewise, every semester when I give out report cards, I tally up a little chart with absences /grades. It clearly shows that students who attend school reguarly make better grades. Every time I show it, the students are interested in it, understand it, comment on it . . . but none of the students with poor attendance start coming more often. They're capable of a very big disconnect between logic and their own lives.

 

[eliza61]

I don't fight with my kids, I just hand them the grocery receipt and tell them to do the math themselves. More eye opening is when I sit them down looking over our household budget from time to time when we go over gross earnings, net after tax earnings and how much it costs to keep them in the lifestyle they think is so very ordinary. Even better is when I have them look at a receipt for something they think is easy breezy and we go back to figure out how many hours they'd need to work for that thing if they made minimum wage - taxes. Why use words when math does such a better job?

www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p23-210.pdf

Dh is a high school teacher in a very blue collar area. His school is constantly battling the dropout problem. It is astounding how many parents come to parent teacher conferences and honestly don't give a hoot if their kid drops out of school. Better s/he should get a low paying job now. Many of these parents have their thinking shaped by an era in which it was possible to get a decent paying job in a local factory, but alas, those jobs are few and far between these days. If the kid gets this at home, there's not a whole lot the school can do to overcome it.

The other problem is that kids that age often have very little understanding of delayed gratification. You can show them census data all day long, but they refuse to believe it applies to them.

It's very hard Luv, I volunteer with young girls (16-20) and there are so many other messages they recieve.

1) When young girls are in the 6, 7th and 8th grade they blow the socks off of boys in math and science scores. Unfortunately by the time they hit 10th grade they "dumb" down in order to be popular. All the messages they get says "being skinny and pretty" way more important than being smart. I've literally had parents say to me the only reason for their daughters to go to college was to get a husband. In 2009!

2) Young adults always think they "have a plan" LOL. My sons say this to me all the time. "Don't worry mom, I've got a plan" Of course you've got a plan dear, you don't have a mortgage or a car note etc etc

Pigeon, I've got the opposite problem of your husband. I live in an inner city. My sons see the rappers in videos with half dressed girls and lots of money and think it would be sooo cool to do that.

The problem I'm having with my teenage sons right now is that while they know school is important, they think they don't have to put in the work. My son thinks he can roll out of bed, pick up a geometry book 5 mins before the test and crank out an A. Of course when I then go ballistic and suggest strongly that he study, he looks at me like I just spoke Greek.

For this I went through 10 hours of labor.

 

[minkydog]

Mystery Machine, why would any kid assume they're not going to college, shouldn't or can't? It sounds like the situation is treated as a forgone conclusion by the schools, but it doesn't have to be. Sure, some kids will just do as they are told but not all kids will. Sounds like the High Schools are doing a poor job making kids aware that student loans exist and that State/City colleges are just as good as the private ones.

I don't think its all the schools fault though. I live in an economically diverse area. Our particular HS and MS are in fairly affluent areas where children are expected to go to college, just like their parents did. They have had years of parent involvment in school, extracurricular sports, music and dance, trips to the library, the state park, and even other countries.

But in the other end of the county you have kids living in homes where nobody has graduated HS in 4 generations. These kids know how to play video games but they can't play kickball because its too dangerous in their apt complex for them to be outside. The only music they've ever known is gangsta rap. They don't know about The Nutcracker, Yellowstone, Picasso, or the solar system. Many of them have never been out of the county. And a sizable number aspire to drop out of school and go work construction or be a maid in a hotel.

I think the buck stops at home. Schools can only do so much. They can't force parents to come to PTA to find out about HS or college. Its very hard for a student to comprehend that there are ways to pay for college when the family is on food stamps and the kids go hungry all weekend because there's no school. Sure, there are loans, but these kids come from families that don't have mortgages, loans, or checking accounts. They live in a totally cash community. Taking out loans is a foreign concept and something their parents actively discourage. Many of these parents don't see the value to staying in school past HS anyway. ANd they certainly don't encourage their kids to seek out college info. THese kids have to be motivated like nobody's business to break out of this kind of cultural poverty. And yes, the schools do have a role in breaking the cycle, but they can't do it alone.

 

[TaraLee4]

Well I could write you a book.

1. You have parents that REFUSE to fill out the FAFSA. This is because generally they are not paying their taxes/doing illegal stuff or they do not want to have there info out their for the government because of their children. (I know it sounds crazy but it is true.)
Also many parents without higher education will take a look at the FAFSA and be unable to figure it out themselves. If the child would try to ask the parents about their taxes or money a lot of them would get the look like, I am NOT sharing my finances with YOU.

I wanted to add that my DH was able to get around his mother not filling out the FAFSA 20yrs ago, but today that just does not fly. His mom was mentally ill and no way was she revealing anything to the GOVERNMENT!

This. I cannot get financial aid because neither of my parents (either of them) will fill out a FAFSA form with me. Partly because I don't live at home and haven't since I turned 18. Partly because they live in fear that the other will find out how much they ACTUALLY earn and the other with have them back in court for child support over my sister.

The requirements to fill out a FAFSA alone are simple: you must be 24, have a dependent (child), be married, or be a member of military. Otherwise, your school must grant a waiver. The 4 schools I applied to do not grant waviers except in dire circumstances.

A single, 19 (now 23) year old with good credit and a full time job (nevermind it being at a restaurant) does NOT consitute a dire circumstance.

No FASFA means there aren't many loans or scholarships i can apply for. Most require having a FASFA on file. I suppose i could take out some personal loans, but why would I take out personal loans on the full sticker price tuition, when if i just wait a few years, maybe i can get some aid. Because i don't want personal loans amounting to what would be enough for a small house.

I have a 2 year degree I paid full price for. Cash. While working 2 jobs full time. My parents hammered going to college to me. Except they got divorced when i was 16 and me going to college wasn't something on the radar anymore.

This topic is one that is particularly near and dear to my heart. I once had a financial aid advisor tell me i'd get aid faster and easier if i got married. Is that what i have to do? i have to mess up somehow to get people to help me with school?? I have to have a shotgun wedding or a child I may love but can't afford so I can get a degree?? I can't just be a hardworking young woman who needs a little help to earn a degree???

For now, I still work at the restaurant. At least my rent is paid, my car runs well and my heat is on.

okay, off my soapbox.

 

[Pigeon]

Just because it doesn't work for all doesn't mean it's ok to stop trying. What if being lax means the one kid who would have responded misses the message?

If so then WOW, I have no other words than WOW, I'm glad I wasn't one of those kids from a messed up home you told yourselves not to bother with... I didn't know I was supposed to be a lost cause.

I'm not saying it's OK to stop or to try any other approach that seems like it might have a shot. Teachers and guidance counsellors do this kind of thing non-stop and well they should.

The problem is that in reality the kids who need this the most are the very kids where this message has no effect. It would be lovely if showing them employment and income data would cause a profound shift in their thinking and in their families' thinking, but at the end of the day, for most of them it doesn't.

Dh has had parents come in screaming at him because he talks about kids going to college in the future.

 

[agnes!]

This. I cannot get financial aid because neither of my parents (either of them) will fill out a FAFSA form with me. Partly because I don't live at home and haven't since I turned 18. Partly because they live in fear that the other will find out how much they ACTUALLY earn and the other with have them back in court for child support over my sister.

The requirements to fill out a FAFSA alone are simple: you must be 24, have a dependent (child), be married, or be a member of military. Otherwise, your school must grant a waiver. The 4 schools I applied to do not grant waviers except in dire circumstances.

Do you mind if I ask you where you applied?

A single, 19 (now 23) year old with good credit and a full time job (nevermind it being at a restaurant) does NOT consitute a dire circumstance.

No FASFA means there aren't many loans or scholarships i can apply for. Most require having a FASFA on file. I suppose i could take out some personal loans, but why would I take out personal loans on the full sticker price tuition, when if i just wait a few years, maybe i can get some aid. Because i don't want personal loans amounting to what would be enough for a small house.

I have a 2 year degree I paid full price for. Cash. While working 2 jobs full time. My parents hammered going to college to me. Except they got divorced when i was 16 and me going to college wasn't something on the radar anymore.

This topic is one that is particularly near and dear to my heart. I once had a financial aid advisor tell me i'd get aid faster and easier if i got married. Is that what i have to do? i have to mess up somehow to get people to help me with school?? I have to have a shotgun wedding or a child I may love but can't afford so I can get a degree?? I can't just be a hardworking young woman who needs a little help to earn a degree???

For now, I still work at the restaurant. At least my rent is paid, my car runs well and my heat is on.

okay, off my soapbox.

I haven't gotten into our FAFSA yet (DD is only a HS Junior), but I wonder in your case would either one of them have to learn about the other filling it out?

What in the world will your sister do when the time comes for her to graduate HS? Will your DPs (figure out what that D stands for in this case ....) screw her over just the same way they screwed you over?

I cannot imagine being so awfully selfish to my own flesh and blood. You're not asking them for any money, they just need to fill out some STUPID paperwork!

I guess you have to hold on for one more year... then you can do the almighty FAFSA without their input. And make sure you send them an announcement about your college graduation BUT DON'T INVITE THEM, they don't DESERVE to bask in your reflected accomplishments.

Let me tell you something...I am proud of you, you sound like the kind of young woman that most parents would be glad to claim as their own.

And if you need someone to beat some sense into those two DPs of yours?... let me at 'em.

agnes!

 

[eeyoremum]

So, if your kids decide that they want to work full time instead of going to college, you will kick them out? Yikes.

My father had always planned for me to go to college, and all through HS there was no question that is what I was supposed to do. Well guess what, I had bills and responsibilities and sitting in class 5 days a week wasn't paying for them so I decided to work 2 jobs instead. I know it broke my father's heart andhe was disappointed and angry at me for me decision, but he was still there for me.

Yes exactly. If they choose not to go to higher education be it college, university or an apprentiship they are out. They best they could make with only a highschool education is minimum wage. I am not supporting them financially because they can't make ends meat. They have known this fact all their lives so to them it is not news its reality.

Also, school will cost them nothing because we believe we brought them into this world and it is our duty and resposibility to educate them so they can become resposible, tax paying citizens. It is not my responsibility to make them rich or make them think they are rich because they live at home and don't have to pay market value for things like rent, food, utilities.

We want our children to do better than we have in life. I think that is every parents wish. For my kids that means an education.

 

[luvmy3]

Yes exactly. If they choose not to go to higher education be it college, university or an apprentiship they are out. They best they could make with only a highschool education is minimum wage. I am not supporting them financially because they can't make ends meat. They have known this fact all their lives so to them it is not news its reality.

Also, school will cost them nothing because we believe we brought them into this world and it is our duty and resposibility to educate them so they can become resposible, tax paying citizens. It is not my responsibility to make them rich or make them think they are rich because they live at home and don't have to pay market value for things like rent, food, utilities.

We want our children to do better than we have in life. I think that is every parents wish. For my kids that means an education.

I wish for my kids to be happy in life, and be the best at what they choose. If that mean going to college and getting their PhD, great. If that means graduating HS and getting a job and working hard at it, move up the ranks and they are successful and they happy, great. Its not my life, its theirs, the best I can do is give them the tools and guidance to be successful in what they choose. I have faith that I wil have raised them right, even if they don't choose college. I would never kick them out because they choose a different path than what I want for them (in terms of higher eduaction). I don't plan on controling my childrens lives in that way, and my home will always be open to them no matter what, and telling them its my way or the highway (literally) is too cruel for my children.
BTW, I graduated from HS, and while working through HS made higher than minimum wage. Not every non college educated person is destined to a life of minumum wage

 

[MrsPete]

I cannot imagine being so awfully selfish to my own flesh and blood. You're not asking them for any money, they just need to fill out some STUPID paperwork!

This story is more common than you'd think.

I lived a variation of it: My parents refused to fill out the paperwork 'til the very, very last minute -- sometimes even filing for an extension on their taxes, putting it off 'til even later -- even though THEY KNEW FULL WELL how much that FAFSA form mean to me, even though THEY KNEW FULL WELL that the state legislature money would run out and (even though I was qualified) I'd not receive that portion of the money. And they did it year after year after year. That money meant the difference in working 1 or 2 jobs. That money meant the difference between having a textbook for every class and scrounging or borrowing where I could. Year after year I begged them to fill out the paperwork for me, and year after year they were just unresponsive. They weren't going to be involved in my college finances anyway, so it just didn't matter to them.

In my case, I understand why they did it: My mother didn't want me to go to college right after high school. She had done that -- at her parents' insistance, with them paying all the bills and her not even working part time -- and she flunked out. She wasn't ready for college. I, however, WAS ready right out of high school . . . but she wanted to see me do badly. She wanted to justify in her mind that she hadn't messed up; rather, she wanted confirmation that no one's ready at age 18. So she sabotaged me financially. She wanted to see me work a couple years, get married, have kids, THEN go back to school.

I understand why the government has so many regulations in place; they don't want to hand out grant money to the families who have the money and just prefer to use government money -- but the students who are caught between need and inflexible parents are really in a bad situation.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I understand why the government has so many regulations in place; they don't want to hand out grant money to the families who have the money and just prefer to use government money -- but the students who are caught between need and inflexible parents are really in a bad situation.

Yep.

My nephew is doing it on his own in NYC. Took him 5 yrs to get his life going after being thrown out for being gay. And believe me, the stepdad would rather cut off his right arm than fill out anything for this kid, let alone give him 1 penny.

Now he was homeschooled and the parent in this situation was holding his HS education hostage as well (he was behind). Then he found out they had no intention of filling out the FAFSA, on top of which he was a prisoner in the house.

I tried to encourage him to stay to finish his HS however he could not take it.

Today he is moving forward and doing well so he is better off than if he had stayed.

He wanted to go to college and could not. He had to get his life going literally. He is working full time and going to college now.

 

[Acklander]

BTW, I graduated from HS, and while working through HS made higher than minimum wage. Not every non college educated person is destined to a life of minumum wage

EXACTLY - minimum wage is for entry level. Wasn't there a thread a few weeks ago where someone was upset that they went to college and became a teacher yet their friend, who worked in fast food for 20 years, made more than she did? There is nothing wrong with working your way up the ladder. I did tax returns for over 20 years and saw plenty of people, who never went to college, who made decent incomes. One guy,who had his own landscaping business, made close to $200K a year. He worked in the business thru high school and beyond. Instead of paying $100K for a college education he used that money to buy equipment and start his own business. He hires college kids to do the manual labor. He's doing what he enjoys and is able to support his family just fine. Instead of telling my kids they HAVE to go to college, I tell them that if they follow their hearts the money will follow.
The best advice I ever got from my dad was, that you're going to spend half your life at work, you damn well better be doing something you enjoy.

 

[bettymae1121]

EXACTLY - minimum wage is for entry level. Wasn't there a thread a few weeks ago where someone was upset that they went to college and became a teacher yet their friend, who worked in fast food for 20 years, made more than she did? There is nothing wrong with working your way up the ladder. I did tax returns for over 20 years and saw plenty of people, who never went to college, who made decent incomes. One guy,who had his own landscaping business, made close to $200K a year. He worked in the business thru high school and beyond. Instead of paying $100K for a college education he used that money to buy equipment and start his own business. He hires college kids to do the manual labor. He's doing what he enjoys and is able to support his family just fine. Instead of telling my kids they HAVE to go to college, I tell them that if they follow their hearts the money will follow.
The best advice I ever got from my dad was, that you're going to spend half your life at work, you damn well better be doing something you enjoy.

DH and I are prefect examples of this. DH and I both only have HS diplomas and our combined income is low six figures, we are in our early/mid 30's. Of all my college educated friends, only one makes more than I do, and she has a masters in forensic science, and none of them make as much as my DH does after OT and quarterly bonus.

I would still like to go to college myself, because I love to learn and because I do feel that have a college degree is important for at least on of us (Dh or I) to have to help with long term job security. But you can do well for yourself, even today, with just a HS diploma and hard work.

Next time you call a plumber (at midnight on a holiday...) look at what they are billing you. I swear if I have children, I'm going to make them all become plumbers. Talk about a job with security and that can't be outsourced! No matter what the economy looks like, if you have an over-flowing toilet at 2am, you're calling someone. People will live without heat, will live without power, will live with a hole in the roof. But if the pipe burst and you have 5 inches of water, you're picking up that phone!

 

[The Mystery Machine]

OK....Stop right there. You guys are going off track on the topic. We are not talking about kids that would rather go in a different direction. We are talking about kids that are planning on minimum wage.

Don't misunderstand what we are speaking about.

I wish for my kids to be happy in life, and be the best at what they choose. If that mean going to college and getting their PhD, great. If that means graduating HS and getting a job and working hard at it, move up the ranks and they are successful and they happy, great. Its not my life, its theirs, the best I can do is give them the tools and guidance to be successful in what they choose. I have faith that I wil have raised them right, even if they don't choose college. I would never kick them out because they choose a different path than what I want for them (in terms of higher eduaction). I don't plan on controling my childrens lives in that way, and my home will always be open to them no matter what, and telling them its my way or the highway (literally) is too cruel for my children.
BTW, I graduated from HS, and while working through HS made higher than minimum wage. Not every non college educated person is destined to a life of minumum wage

EXACTLY - minimum wage is for entry level. Wasn't there a thread a few weeks ago where someone was upset that they went to college and became a teacher yet their friend, who worked in fast food for 20 years, made more than she did? There is nothing wrong with working your way up the ladder. I did tax returns for over 20 years and saw plenty of people, who never went to college, who made decent incomes. One guy,who had his own landscaping business, made close to $200K a year. He worked in the business thru high school and beyond. Instead of paying $100K for a college education he used that money to buy equipment and start his own business. He hires college kids to do the manual labor. He's doing what he enjoys and is able to support his family just fine. Instead of telling my kids they HAVE to go to college, I tell them that if they follow their hearts the money will follow.
The best advice I ever got from my dad was, that you're going to spend half your life at work, you damn well better be doing something you enjoy.

DH and I are prefect examples of this. DH and I both only have HS diplomas and our combined income is low six figures, we are in our early/mid 30's. Of all my college educated friends, only one makes more than I do, and she has a masters in forensic science, and none of them make as much as my DH does after OT and quarterly bonus.

I would still like to go to college myself, because I love to learn and because I do feel that have a college degree is important for at least on of us (Dh or I) to have to help with long term job security. But you can do well for yourself, even today, with just a HS diploma and hard work.

Next time you call a plumber (at midnight on a holiday...) look at what they are billing you. I swear if I have children, I'm going to make them all become plumbers. Talk about a job with security and that can't be outsourced! No matter what the economy looks like, if you have an over-flowing toilet at 2am, you're calling someone. People will live without heat, will live without power, will live with a hole in the roof. But if the pipe burst and you have 5 inches of water, you're picking up that phone!

 

[luvmy3]

OK....Stop right there. You guys are going off track on the topic. We are not talking about kids that would rather go in a different direction. We are talking about kids that are planning on minimum wage.

Don't misunderstand what we are speaking about.

My posts are in referrence to those posters who say that they would throw their child out of their home if they don't choose some form of higher ed (a differnt path from what their parents want).

 

[suejai]

Because the reality is, not every kid is college material. Someone's got to work the trades and someone's got to work the menial jobs.
Look at it this way - if every single kid stayed in school until graduation, and then every one of those kids took out a college loan and went to college, what would you end up with? Millions of kids all trying for the same few while collar jobs with student loans hanging over their heads. So those kids would be working the minimum wage jobs while waiting for the opportunity to work in what they were educated in, while there's no one available to fix the plumbing.
Instead of waving census figures in front of kids who have no desire/ability to be successful in college how about we focus on training those kids in jobs, where they can make a living wage. Ask your politicians to make sure that programs such as Job Corps are adequately funded. Ask those in your community that work in the trades to mentor youths in developing skills that they can use to earn a living wage.
And most of all, stop telling kids that unless they complete college they are doomed to a life of minimum wage. Instead help them find their gift and work to the best of their ability.

Exactly

Not everyone is suited to going to college/university. There seems to be a stigma placed on learning a trade. It is very possible to earn a significant amount of money in a skilled trade, and some people enjoy physical labour.

Besides which, if everyone gets a degree it devalues the concept of a higher education.

Having said that, I do believe that everyone should finish high school. But I also think that schools should be structured differently to reflect different life goals. However, I always told my kids to go the highest level they could manage so that they had options when they finished high school, so they could take any direction they chose.

 

[MrsPete]

If that mean going to college and getting their PhD, great. If that means graduating HS and getting a job and working hard at it, move up the ranks and they are successful and they happy, great. Its not my life, its theirs,

I insist that my kids earn a college degree. Yes, you can find examles of people without a degree who've done well financially and are pleased with what they've done . . . but you can find more people with a degree who've done well financially. I want my kids to set themselves up for success. I do believe that money can't buy happiness, but I also am certain that poverty is a sure-fire way to be miserable.

I'm thinking of a friend of mine (who started but didn't finish) college; she has a very good job, BUT she tells her kids (and other people's kids) that if she were just out of school today she'd never get this job without a degree. She's probably smarter than I am, and she has some unique skills that've helped her along the way, but it's harder now than it was when she got her foot in the door. If she were just out of school today, she wouldn't be able to get an interview for her current job. Also, though she has a good job, she is tied to that company; she worked her way up the ranks, but another company wouldn't give her a chance today.

Yes, it's their life, but they haven't had enough experience to recognize how important an education is to their future. I don't want them to someday find themselves 30-something, married with a couple kids, and unable to find worthwhile work. I want them to earn a degree now while they're still young and have fewer responsibilities -- it's easier for them, and they'll have more years to use that degree.

Fortunately, my children are already gung-ho about going to college, so there's no conflict within my house.

Wasn't there a thread a few weeks ago where someone was upset that they went to college and became a teacher yet their friend, who worked in fast food for 20 years, made more than she did? There is nothing wrong with working your way up the ladder.

Well, I'm a teacher, and I have a same-aged cousin who worked fast food while I went to college (she actually went to college for 1/2 a semester), and she did very well for herself. She worked her way up to above-the-store-level management (not sure of a title), but she really WORKED for that. She worked awful hours in bad working conditions, etc. I don't think she enjoys her job at all; she does it because it was something at which she excels and it pays well. When we were younger, she did make more than I did; however, now she's reached the top -- she can go no farther without a formal education. On the other hand, though I started at a low salary, I am still moving up the salary ladder and could go into administration or another field of education if I chose, and -- here's the biggie for me -- I have a pension. Furthermore, her skills won't take her anywhere except another restaurant, whereas my degree is good for many other professional jobs. Finally -- and this is the biggest point of all concerning my cousin -- she's the exception to the rule. The majority of her similarly-educated co-workers certainly haven't enjoyed anything like the success she's had.

I admire what she's done with herself, but I would not change places with her.

The best advice I ever got from my dad was, that you're going to spend half your life at work, you damn well better be doing something you enjoy.

I don't think anyone should enter a job that he hates (though I've done a few now and then -- thinking back to the summer I worked in a factory), but not everyone can find something he loves, that'll become his reason for getting up in the morning, and that'll also pay.

DH and I are prefect examples of this. DH and I both only have HS diplomas and our combined income is low six figures, we are in our early/mid 30's. Of all my college educated friends, only one makes more than I do, and she has a masters in forensic science, and none of them make as much as my DH does after OT and quarterly bonus.

I'm glad that you've done very well, but you do recognize, of course, that you're an exception to the rule. The majority of high-school diploma only workers don't come close to what you're describing.

 

[Pigeon]

If my kids were commited to taking up a trade, like being a plumber or electrician, which has solid career potential, rather than going to college, I would be fine with that. But that kind of path also requires hard work post-high school, either in a trade school or apprenticeship. These days those types of careers require intelligence, a variety of mechanical, mathematical and computer skills.

What I would not be fine with is having a kid quit their education post-high school and drifting. Our economy is quite different than it was when I was a kid. There were plentiful good paying jobs in the manufacturing sector that didn't require higher education.

Those days are gone. The service jobs that have replaced those manufacturing jobs don't pay well and have lousy benefits.

So, in our family, the default is college, and probably an advanced degree after that.

 

[allison443]

This story is more common than you'd think.

I lived a variation of it: My parents refused to fill out the paperwork 'til the very, very last minute -- sometimes even filing for an extension on their taxes, putting it off 'til even later -- even though THEY KNEW FULL WELL how much that FAFSA form mean to me, even though THEY KNEW FULL WELL that the state legislature money would run out and (even though I was qualified) I'd not receive that portion of the money. And they did it year after year after year. That money meant the difference in working 1 or 2 jobs. That money meant the difference between having a textbook for every class and scrounging or borrowing where I could. Year after year I begged them to fill out the paperwork for me, and year after year they were just unresponsive. They weren't going to be involved in my college finances anyway, so it just didn't matter to them.

In my case, I understand why they did it: My mother didn't want me to go to college right after high school. She had done that -- at her parents' insistance, with them paying all the bills and her not even working part time -- and she flunked out. She wasn't ready for college. I, however, WAS ready right out of high school . . . but she wanted to see me do badly. She wanted to justify in her mind that she hadn't messed up; rather, she wanted confirmation that no one's ready at age 18. So she sabotaged me financially. She wanted to see me work a couple years, get married, have kids, THEN go back to school.

I understand why the government has so many regulations in place; they don't want to hand out grant money to the families who have the money and just prefer to use government money -- but the students who are caught between need and inflexible parents are really in a bad situation.

That is a shame that your parents did not do the responsible thing. Basically they tried to sabotage you. Not good. Glad you were able to overcome that.