Why isn't a will enough???

[horseshowmom]

My husbands father was not of his right mind towards the end and changed his will. We would go up to see him every year, and he would say that we hadn't been up for 4 years. he was the kind of person who would boast about how large his stock portfolio was and try to insist that my husband look at his statements, it was weird like he was always rubbing money in everyone's face. Then one of the last times we visited, he went crazy because my husband wanted to visit a lifelong friend (this was in my husbands hometown) he had it in his mind that this person didnt complete 200 dollars worth of work in his basement (you would think he would just ask the guy, who was his lifelong friend as well, what was up and try to resolve, but he never did, apparently rather harboring a grudge) So anyway at that point he said things to me like my husband had alot of money coming his way and he better decide where his loyalties lie. Shortly after we returned home he called my husband to say he was changing his will, and my husband was like ok, whatever didnt read much into it, but I pretty much figured out what was coming. It was such a turn off to me to think that people tried to control others with money, no one in my family ever had money to inherit so I had never experienced that before.

Long story short, the majority of the estate was left to my husbands brother (there are just the two of them) My husbands 50% share that his brother told him had been in a prior will got knocked down to 10%. Also every single possession the father listed went to the brother, even things that had been specifically promised to my husband and held no significance to the brother, are you getting me?

Sometimes I wonder if my husband should have looked into contesting the will but we never even discussed it. It was what it was. It has made me feel very bad though that my husbands father would leave the world sending him such a negative message. Again, I have every reason to think he wasnt in his right mind, of course theres much more of the story to tell in that regard.

If my parents had done this to my brother, I would have given him his half of the estate regardless of what the will said. I realize that sometimes there are very good reasons for giving one child more (even much more) than the other(s), but spite and control aren't sufficient.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I guess most of us will not have this problem but why can people just willy nilly break wills.

There use to be a soul singer named James Brown, during the 70's he was known as the "godfather of soul" LOL he was the first to "get down" at concerts.

Anyhoo, he died about 7 years ago. left a few endowments to his family but the bulk of his estate he left to charities. anyone wanna guess where this story is heading? well his wife, ex wife and children all got together and sued saying he wasn't in his "right" mind. will was over turned once and I just heard another judge ruled today that the will can stand. Of course attorney fees are probably eating away at what ever is left.

Then I think of the vultures better known as the Jackson family who are eager to get their hands on the MJ"s kids just to get their claws in his fortune.

Of course I'll never have Mz. Oprahs wealth but....

What's the point? I can totally understand how some wealthy folks say they are spending or giving it all away while they are alive.



Just a rant

So much better coming from a poor family .

The other sad thing is that you had to explain who James Brown was .

 

[tvguy]

You need:

A will. (In my opinion, it should include a clause that says anyone in the will that contests the will, loses that bequest, and instead gets $1)

A revocable trust.

A Durable Medical power of attorney (in case you don't die, but are so sick you can't make your own decisions)

Long Term medical insurance. (in case you don't die, but need long term care)

 

[scubamouse]

If my parents had done this to my brother, I would have given him his half of the estate regardless of what the will said. I realize that sometimes there are very good reasons for giving one child more (even much more) than the other(s), but spite and control aren't sufficient.

Exactly that happened when my MIL died - left everything to DH and SIL and left out BIL. My DH and SIL relinqueshed portions of the estate and the three siblings split things equally. My MIL was a chronic will writer and they had all heard her say that she was cutting the other two out for some silly transgression. They had made a pact to split things equally years before she died. To their great credit, they stuck with that.

 

[minkydog]

My husbands father was not of his right mind towards the end and changed his will. We would go up to see him every year, and he would say that we hadn't been up for 4 years. he was the kind of person who would boast about how large his stock portfolio was and try to insist that my husband look at his statements, it was weird like he was always rubbing money in everyone's face. Then one of the last times we visited, he went crazy because my husband wanted to visit a lifelong friend (this was in my husbands hometown) he had it in his mind that this person didnt complete 200 dollars worth of work in his basement (you would think he would just ask the guy, who was his lifelong friend as well, what was up and try to resolve, but he never did, apparently rather harboring a grudge) So anyway at that point he said things to me like my husband had alot of money coming his way and he better decide where his loyalties lie. Shortly after we returned home he called my husband to say he was changing his will, and my husband was like ok, whatever didnt read much into it, but I pretty much figured out what was coming. It was such a turn off to me to think that people tried to control others with money, no one in my family ever had money to inherit so I had never experienced that before.

Long story short, the majority of the estate was left to my husbands brother (there are just the two of them) My husbands 50% share that his brother told him had been in a prior will got knocked down to 10%. Also every single possession the father listed went to the brother, even things that had been specifically promised to my husband and held no significance to the brother, are you getting me?

Sometimes I wonder if my husband should have looked into contesting the will but we never even discussed it. It was what it was. It has made me feel very bad though that my husbands father would leave the world sending him such a negative message. Again, I have every reason to think he wasnt in his right mind, of course theres much more of the story to tell in that regard.

Oh, I definitely get it. My DHs grandma ruled the family with threats of cutting them out of her will. She got into a fit or rage.over some.perceived slight my DH had done and threatened to cut him out, one too many times. He politely told.her he didn't want her.money and she could line her casket.with dollar bills, for all he cared.

 

[worm761]

I fully expect to have issues when my father passes. I am 1 of 5 children. Everything is being left to me with the exception of a small amount of money going to one sister. I fully expect an uproar. And I fully expect to tell them all where to go.

He lives in my house with me. I take care of him and will be the only one to do so as he gets older and needs more care. He is VERY functioning now (going to Disney next week and not even taking me!!!) but his health is failing. I have no support from any of my siblings and only the one sister calls him occasionally. The other three don't call, don't text, don't anything. Not even holidays or his birthday. For years I would call or text them to remind them at Father's Day or his birthday and still nothing. I gave up hope a while ago.

 

[Marlea98]

And the horrible stuff doesn't even have to happen after one dies.

FIL married a horrible woman a few years ago and since she's come on the scene it's basically torn the family apart. The wedding was a secret from their own children (both his and hers), she soon 'retired' from working after they married, SIL's things that were in his house were soon sold or given away without her knowledge, his investment properties (which were purchased decades ago and in his name) were sold and new ones purchased in their names, new wills were drawn up using new lawyers that the family doesn't use, Power of Attorney papers naming DH and SIL were cancelled... Oh yes, she's setting herself up nicely for if he dies before she does. And the sad thing is there is not much we can do about it as she is now his wife and he's a grown man entitled to make his own decisions, yet because of her he is now alienated from his long time friends and family. She is too much of a shrew (and we think, sociopath) to allow him to do what he wants. The stories we hear from their neighbours about the screaming and abuse she heaps on him is shameful.

 

[tvguy]

One thing that was shockingly common among the elderly that I saw last year while my mom was in the hospital, then rehab center, then the board and care is the number of these old folks who have no family left to care for them, or to fight over their estates when the die. Very sad.
Lady right now at the board and care my mom is in is in her mid 90s, both her children.. one she had at age 18, the other at the age of 19........in the words of the lady who runs the board and care...."died of old age a couple of years ago."

 

[horseshowmom]

And the horrible stuff doesn't even have to happen after one dies.

FIL married a horrible woman a few years ago and since she's come on the scene it's basically torn the family apart. The wedding was a secret from their own children (both his and hers), she soon 'retired' from working after they married, SIL's things that were in his house were soon sold or given away without her knowledge, his investment properties (which were purchased decades ago and in his name) were sold and new ones purchased in their names, new wills were drawn up using new lawyers that the family doesn't use, Power of Attorney papers naming DH and SIL were cancelled... Oh yes, she's setting herself up nicely for if he dies before she does. And the sad thing is there is not much we can do about it as she is now his wife and he's a grown man entitled to make his own decisions, yet because of her he is now alienated from his long time friends and family. She is too much of a shrew (and we think, sociopath) to allow him to do what he wants. The stories we hear from their neighbours about the screaming and abuse she heaps on him is shameful.

I know of a man who was married a couple of weeks ago. His wife has been dead several years. He was engaged for two years to another woman (which is pretty odd for someone his age - early 60's). He recently broke up with that woman and married another woman that he had been seeing for two weeks. Up until they started dating, she was living with another man.

His children tried to talk him into at least waiting 6 months, but he refused. They're trying the make the best of it, but they are really worried about him. But you're right, he's a grown man and entitled to make his own choices.

 

[hellow]

Exactly that happened when my MIL died - left everything to DH and SIL and left out BIL. My DH and SIL relinqueshed portions of the estate and the three siblings split things equally. My MIL was a chronic will writer and they had all heard There are her say that she was cutting the other two out for some silly transgression. They had made a pact to split things equally years before she died. To their great credit, they stuck with that.

This is so good to hear. It is very rare, yet very much the right thing to do.

 

[hellow]

I fully expect to have issues when my father passes. I am 1 of 5 children. Everything is being left to me with the exception of a small amount of money going to one sister. I fully expect an uproar. And I fully expect to tell them all where to go.

He lives in my house with me. I take care of him and will be the only one to do so as he gets older and needs more care. He is VERY functioning now (going to Disney next week and not even taking me!!!) but his health is failing. I have no support from any of my siblings and only the one sister calls him occasionally. The other three don't call, don't text, don't anything. Not even holidays or his birthday. For years I would call or text them to remind them at Father's Day or his birthday and still nothing. I gave up hope a while ago.

Derailing the thread a little bit, but this sounded very much like my half-sister could have written it. However, in our case, my father treated my 4 siblings and me so differently his whole life from how he treats her. None of us really have any desire to continue to try to have a close relationship with him, and have no expectation that he will do more for us when he dies than he did while he was alive. She, too, reminds us to call him for his birthday, etc... even though it wasn't even necessary since I always acknowledge those things with a card or phone call. Not saying this about your case, but for us, it is kinda irritating that she thinks we need to be reminded. Unfortunately, in some cases elderly people have only themselves to blame for not having the support of their family in their "golden" years.

 

[worm761]

Derailing the thread a little bit, but this sounded very much like my half-sister could have written it. However, in our case, my father treated my 4 siblings and me so differently his whole life from how he treats her. None of us really have any desire to continue to try to have a close relationship with him, and have no expectation that he will do more for us when he dies than he did while he was alive. She, too, reminds us to call him for his birthday, etc... even though it wasn't even necessary since I always acknowledge those things with a card or phone call. Not saying this about your case, but for us, it is kinda irritating that she thinks we need to be reminded. Unfortunately, in some cases elderly people have only themselves to blame for not having the support of their family in their "golden" years.

That has to be awful. I am actually the black sheep in my family. My mother passed away not even acknowledging my existence. My siblings are just sort of self absorbed and just don't care about anyone but themselves. I have Facebook relationships with my brothers. You know, where we like each others statuses but don't actually talk. This is how they seem to prefer it. My sisters I am closer to but they are not currently speaking to each other. My family is a mess. I am so glad that my husband handles us all well. I tend to be the one everyone relies on and it gets a little heavy to carry the load sometimes.

 

[eliza61]

Well just watching my BIL and sister dealing with their mother's will....

The mom had debt, did not own the house, so it is not legally binding. A will is an expression of your "wishes".

As a PP stated you need a set up a revocable trust.

but I would think that if they were going to say you weren't of "sound mind" when you made the will, wouldn't they say the same about the trust.

For example, I had all my paperwork redone recently mainly due to my dh's death. new will, trust for the kiddies, financial poa, health poa, living will, the whole enchilada.
Now let's say I kick the bucket and have left a wad of money to the "whatsamatter U" association for the advancement of Rocky and Bullwinkle (young disser may need to google. )
what's to prevent say greedy #1 son from saying. Hey she was distraught at the time, the will and the trust should be thrown out.

 

[gator75]

I'AM another one who will fully feel the wrath of angry siblings when something happens to my parents.I'M one of 4 kids and my parents are leaving everything to me. including the house they built 35 years ago. I'm fully prepared for what is comming to me and i have my suspisions that they know. I don't feel bad about this as not one of my siblings calls or does anything to assist with care giving. I do it all.

My parents where smart when they made out their will though they got a very good attorney and what he did was have my parents take lots of psycholgical tests to prove they where of sound mind and body and fit to enter into a will, Tis was espcially important because my dad had a stroke and has some memory problems. They passed and did their will if my siblings choose to say they aren't mentally fit they would have to prove that the psychatrist that gave them the test was crazy.

I'm not worried about it they are getting what they deserve they treat my parents like garbage because they are aging and like my mom says payback is sweet.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

but I would think that if they were going to say you weren't of "sound mind" when you made the will, wouldn't they say the same about the trust.

For example, I had all my paperwork redone recently mainly due to my dh's death. new will, trust for the kiddies, financial poa, health poa, living will, the whole enchilada.
Now let's say I kick the bucket and have left a wad of money to the "whatsamatter U" association for the advancement of Rocky and Bullwinkle (young disser may need to google. )
what's to prevent say greedy #1 son from saying. Hey she was distraught at the time, the will and the trust should be thrown out.

Sound mind has nothing to do with it in most cases. A lot of it has to do with financial circumstances at the time with the estate.
Financially you are good now but you may get a long term illness which changes your financial status, you were involved in a car wreck, died and your estate is being sued, or something else unforseen.

A revocable trust is hard to break....also known as "bust the trust".

It is doable but I am not an attorney so really cannot speak to how to do it.

I do know that a will is not worth the paper it is printed on when you have debt, people contesting it, your estate is being sued, or is it just not realistic.

For example, I think it is SO WRONG that my sister's MIL had a lawyer type up a will, KNOWING that it would be impossible to follow through with it upon her death.

Now my BIL has to EVICT his own sister out of his mother's house. Nice huh? Time is up for debtors putting liens on her estate and this is the next step.


.

 

[bettymae1121]

I fully expect to have issues when my father passes. I am 1 of 5 children. Everything is being left to me with the exception of a small amount of money going to one sister. I fully expect an uproar. And I fully expect to tell them all where to go.

He lives in my house with me. I take care of him and will be the only one to do so as he gets older and needs more care. He is VERY functioning now (going to Disney next week and not even taking me!!!) but his health is failing. I have no support from any of my siblings and only the one sister calls him occasionally. The other three don't call, don't text, don't anything. Not even holidays or his birthday. For years I would call or text them to remind them at Father's Day or his birthday and still nothing. I gave up hope a while ago.

Then you need to make sure he has all his legal and estate ducks in a row and quacking in tune! If he just has a plain will and nothing else, they will try and say you forced him into it and have the will voided. If he hasn't already, he needs to meet with an experianced estate lawyer and let the lawyer know he's leaving some children out and leaving it all to you, and that there might be trouble over it when he's gone. Ditto medical POA, you don't want your siblings swooping in and trying to negate any medical decisions you make if your father can't make them himself. The revocable trust and medical POA already mentioned in this thread would go a long way in protecting both of you.

 

[FergieTCat]

I once worked for an attorney who would advise clients to leave everyone something (even it was only $1) to make the Will harder to contest. However, it was about 20 years ago, so laws may have changed.

This same attorney had a elderly rich client who would change her bequests (usually pieces of jewelry) (think Tiffany) every few months, depending on who she was speaking to at the moment.

 

[traviesojmt]

Unless minor children are involved (in this case, I feel that a parent has the responsibility to care for children) then it shouldn't matter if I chose to give everything I own to charity, the waitress at my favorite restaurant or to my favorite pet. Seriously, no one should feel that they have a right to what they haven't earned. I do not think anyone should legally be allowed to contest a will unless they can prove without a doubt that there was definite fraud.

I don't know what state they lived, but I do wonder, in the case of James Brown, why everything wasn't left to his current wife. Of course, she could have been his wife of 2 days for all I know. Legally, wouldn't the courts have to figure out what was community property before they could give anyone else anything. Thank goodness my life is simple. The thought of some random judge giving away my things to vultures is just depressing.

 

[worm761]

Then you need to make sure he has all his legal and estate ducks in a row and quacking in tune! If he just has a plain will and nothing else, they will try and say you forced him into it and have the will voided. If he hasn't already, he needs to meet with an experianced estate lawyer and let the lawyer know he's leaving some children out and leaving it all to you, and that there might be trouble over it when he's gone. Ditto medical POA, you don't want your siblings swooping in and trying to negate any medical decisions you make if your father can't make them himself. The revocable trust and medical POA already mentioned in this thread would go a long way in protecting both of you.

He did his will through the VA. I also have medical POA and am on all of his bank accounts. He doesn't have much. And what he does have is in my house and in my possession. It is when they find out that there is a life insurance policy that it will hit the fan. It is a small policy and meant to cover any expenses my husband and I incur at the end. He knows that all the financial burden will fall to me.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

Unless minor children are involved (in this case, I feel that a parent has the responsibility to care for children) then it shouldn't matter if I chose to give everything I own to charity, the waitress at my favorite restaurant or to my favorite pet. Seriously, no one should feel that they have a right to what they haven't earned. I do not think anyone should legally be allowed to contest a will unless they can prove without a doubt that there was definite fraud.

Well you can't prove fraud or that someone wasn't of sound mind to the satisfaction of the court until you contest those things in court.