Why I Hate the DDP

[Katiebell]

No doubt we have opposite opinions of what "very good" is.

Perhaps. I've eaten at some excellent restaurants in Los Angeles, Sacramento, San Francisco, Mendocino, Seattle, and Ireland. Wonderful as those meals were, my husband and I prefer searching out ethnic restaurants, out of the way places, places popular with the locals, always trying something new. I didn't go to WDW for the fine dining, I went to experience the Disney Magic -- to ride the rides, immerse myself in the beautiful scenery, take pictures, see the shows...and we had to eat somewhere We had a few character breakfasts; a high point of the "Disney" experience for me is to eat a meal with princesses, Mickey, or Tigger -- it's just fun. We had dinner at Mama Melrose's to do the Fantasmic package. Wasn't the best or most authentic Italian food I've ever eaten, but it was quite good (the honey hazelnut ricotta cheesecake rocked! ), the waitress was quick and friendly and had a wry sense of humor, and we had fun. We went to Sci Fi Drive-In to have shakes and watch the cheesy movie clips. Again, it was fun. Raglan Road was good, the music alone was worth the price of the meal. Guess that's what I was hoping for -- to have fun -- and I wasn't disappointed at all.

Of course they took top items of menus with the DDP......if they didn't most that participate would order the $$$$ items on the menu which has been proven here time & time again with threads from DDp participants. Not sure what words were hysterical to you....

Actually, much of this thread is hysterical to me...some of it, ridiculously so... I suspect my priorities are probably very different than yours -- if I had a choice between paying OOP $250+ for a dinner at V&A's, or having breakfast with Stitch...bring on the pineapple bread and the maracas, whoo hoo! Hey, everyone wants something different on vacation...

What is your source for that statement? Please link it.

For what statement? That the DDP didn't cause the decline in Disney Dining? I don't have a "source" for that. That is my opinion, based on everything I've read, and my own personal experience in the food industry. Your opinion may be that the DDP is the cause of all the problems with Disney dining. I don't agree, and have explained exactly why, but you are entitled to that opinion. What will really be funny is if -- or when -- Disney does away with the DDP, and the quality of the food doesn't improve...I wonder what folks will blame then.

Perhaps you remember a few years ago Red Lobster had an all you can eat crab promotion. Guess what? They took a bath on it and an executive lost his job. Mistakes happen.

How much experience in the restaurant industry did the marketing guy have?

Didn't they change the way credits were pooled because of abuses using the children's credits for adult meals? That leads me to believe that they DO monitor what is being ordered and change their menu/ plan to reduce losses. Maybe they don't need to take the lobster and filet off ALL of the menu's but isn't that a great way to get people over to Cap'n Jack's and out of Le Cellier? Out of MK and over to DD?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1469601

I don't remember the Red Lobster promo, but don't doubt it. I'm sure heads rolled over the children's credits being used for adult meals -- not sure why no one anticipated that ahead of time. Why would Disney want people out of Le Cellier and in Cap'n Jack's instead? They are making money hand over fist at both restaurants -- they want them both full. And they are.

 

[Dreamfinder2]

It's hard to know how to respond to all this without sounding like an apologist, but I've been to WDW a fair number of times from '71 on, and while the menus have indeed changed, I cannot for the life of me discern any noticable decline in quality. I'd even say that, taken as a whole, the CS quality has improved over the years. There are some old favorites I do miss ... the Gulf Coast Room, Papeete Bay Verandah, Lake Buena Vista Club, those three winners on the Empress Lilly ... but that is tempered by the arrival of California Grill, Citrico's, especially Jiko, which I've been consistently pleased with.

I applaud everyone who is passionate about what they believe or perceive. But WDW has been in a constant state of change since the doors first opened, and what we have now most certainly won't be what we'll experience five years from now. If more people are experiencing the Magic than they did in my "good old days," then heck, I'll celebrate right along with them. I experience no loss of joy after all my visits ... if anything, the thrill continues to grow.

Food does play a big part in all our family vacations. But its not like WDW is being overrun by the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Things will change again. And, candidly, if these changes make The Walt Disney Company a little more money, then it makes ME a little more money, which I'm all too happy to turn around and spend with the Mouse, miniscule though it may be.

Food gives me pleasure, but in the grand scheme of things that I find truly important, it's just food (and I do remind myself that I eat to live, not live to eat.)

But that's just me, and I wouldn't dare try to impose my peculiar views on anyone else.

 

[kidsister]

Well, Dreamfinder...I couldn't have said it better myself, so a great big
WHAT HE SAID

I've been on the DDP the last 3 of 4 visits. I used to do the World commando (as in speed,not lack of speedos), but with the purchase of DVC and an annual pass, I have time now to 'stroll' and that means I have more time to have a leisurely meal, even fine dining. The DDP allowed me to try restaurants that I hadn't frequented in over a decade.

As to service, I was surprised and pleased that ON the DDP the service was quite good. This surprised me as a 'preordered' tip was never as good as the tips I rec'd for my wonderful service rotfl2: ) . I can't see how the DDP really effects OOP guests. I don't think the menu changes have much at all to do with the DDP. But that's just my opinion. I have two trips coming up this year, before the rumored 'tax and tip' are no longer included on the DDP. I think I'll probably use the DDP on these two trips and then pass.

 

[disneyfanUSA]

I love the dp!!

 

[photo_chick]

I don't think the decline in the food service is limited to Disney. The quality of food in the average resteraunt has in general gone down hill all over the country. They can't raise prices becasue consumers can't afford to pay more at the moment and their costs keep going up. I find it funny that now a national chain is advertising "new smaller portions" like it is a value thing when the food is still priced about the same for the smaller portions. Meats are being supplemented with soy to make them go further and more chepaer canned ingredients are being used from fast food to gourmet places. THere are very few outstanding food places left in the US in general, IMO. Which is why I don't eat out much anymore!

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

I have to wonder, where are you guys eating at WDW.

I honestly cannot remember having a very bad meal there and many are saying the food just keeps getting worse.

Maybe I have not made as many trips as you all (probably 12 - 15 or so in the last 7 - 8 years) but Boatwrights and Cindys castle still fill the void in my belly each time we visit.

Maybe I don't have enough culture to know what "true" good food is, but I grew up in South Louisiana and we cajuns are known for our good cooking. JMHO

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.
Of course cajun food can be great but with that said IMO catchfish only goes so far.

 

[apostolic4life]

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.
Of course cajun food can be great but with that said IMO catchfish only goes so far.

... considering catfish to be the end all and be all of cajun cuisine????

I hope not. Cajun is a complex cusine with a perfect fusion of many cultures (Acadians from Canadian port cities, slaves from the deep south, Caribbean immigrants, etc.) . Done correctly it is one of our countries greatest contributions to the culinary world. I would warn anyone to dismiss this treasure of the southern region!!! The food is wonderful and the history attached to it is important to the history of our great nation.

 

[Tinkerbell24]

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.

If you're eating....sitting in a restauraunt, or eating a meal at all, isn't that dining?? What is the correct definition of "dining"?

 

[marivaid]

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.

And "dining" doesn't necessarily mean being served 6 courses of so-called gourmet food made from ingredients whose names the chef himself can't pronounce.

 

[photo_chick]

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.
Of course cajun food can be great but with that said IMO catchfish only goes so far.

Hmmm... I love Cajun food. I spent several years living near the MS gulf coast and the Louisiana border. But I don't like seafood or catfish (no, not a mud bug eater either!) So if I did not eat catfish does that mean it was not Cajun?

 

[Disney8704]

I dont get it. How can you all sit there and say that the cutting back on poritions and have a limited menus isnt being caused by the DDP? You have to think about it. They HAVE to cut things back in order for Disney to make it profitable. Otherwise, they would charge to much $ for the plan or they would end up loosing money if they charged the same rates that are today. You cant expect them to charge you only $38.99 per day and offer something really expensive on the menu and have the same porition size it was back 10 years ago and you can get it on the DDP. That would hurt them. IMHO, like I said before, they should have left the menus alone and made certain items available for the DDP and everything else could be paid for OOP. As food prices rise, so does their prices on the menus and so will the DDP cost. Its a simple concept. They charge you a small amount of money per day BECAUSE of whats on the menu and how big their poritions are. The more expensive items they get or the bigger poritions they give, the more money its gonna cost u for the DDP and OOP.

 

[marivaid]

I dont get it. How can you all sit there and say that the cutting back on poritions and have a limited menus isnt being caused by the DDP? You have to think about it. They HAVE to cut things back in order for Disney to make it profitable.

I've yet to see a proof that Disney is losing any $$ with the dining plan.

The restaurants that used to be half empty are now overbooked,the resorts are full and guests are spending the majority if not the totality of their money on property. Disney's profits have gone up 10% in the last year. They don't NEED to cut costs, they do it because they can get away with it.

After all this is the same Disney that charges $30 for a T-Shirt that couldn't be sold for $15 anywhere else,what do you expect ?!

 

[Tinkerbell24]

I've yet to see a proof that Disney is losing any $$ with the dining plan.

The restaurants that used to be half empty are now overbooked,the resorts are full and guests are spending the majority if not the totality of their money on property. Disney's profits have gone up 10% in the last year. They don't NEED to cut costs, they do it because they can get away with it.

After all this is the same Disney that charges $30 for a T-Shirt that couldn't be sold for $15 anywhere else,what do you expect ?!

I agree! Disney makes so much money, rather than losing it. Look at how much people pay for hotels. Clothes and souvenirs are overpriced (I still pay it), but they are making a huge profit. I do not think that the DDP has anything to do with the menu or food changes.

 

[marivaid]

I do not think that the DDP has anything to do with the menu or food changes.

IMO the only thing the DDP has to do with the changes is that it was used as a way to make the pill easier to swallow for a lot of the guests.

Look at how many people post things like "The food wasn't great, but we were on the DDP". You pay months in advance for the plan so it feels like you're not paying once you get to the restaurants but in fact you DID pay.

Although the food we got at WDW wasn't bad it certainely wasn't worth the price we were paying for it. Dinner at Liberty Tree Tavern $28 a pop ?? It's a ripoff but then again let's face it we're getting ripped off on everything else.
ASMO a "value" resort at $170/night ... paid extra for a preferred room and got stuck smack dab in the middle of the pool construction mess. Some value.

So why should the food be any different ? They're going to charge as much as they possibly can, and give us as little as possible, as long as people continue to shut up & pay.

 

[Katiebell]

I dont get it. How can you all sit there and say that the cutting back on poritions and have a limited menus isnt being caused by the DDP? You have to think about it. They HAVE to cut things back in order for Disney to make it profitable. Otherwise, they would charge to much $ for the plan or they would end up loosing money if they charged the same rates that are today. You cant expect them to charge you only $38.99 per day and offer something really expensive on the menu and have the same porition size it was back 10 years ago and you can get it on the DDP. That would hurt them. IMHO, like I said before, they should have left the menus alone and made certain items available for the DDP and everything else could be paid for OOP. As food prices rise, so does their prices on the menus and so will the DDP cost. Its a simple concept. They charge you a small amount of money per day BECAUSE of whats on the menu and how big their poritions are. The more expensive items they get or the bigger poritions they give, the more money its gonna cost u for the DDP and OOP.

Correlation does not imply causation. Disney made a lot of changes to their food service to make more money -- offering the DDP is one of those changes; it doesn't mean that the DDP caused all the other changes. The DDP is a moneymaker for Disney. It ensures that guests pay ahead for their meals (even if they are at a discount). It keeps guests on Disney property, so they don't lose the value of that TS meal every day. It encourages guests to spend more OOP on things like alcoholic beverages (if you only ate CS, you wouldn't be as likely to order cocktails). It is training guests now that in the future, even if the DDP is no longer offered, a true Disney vacation includes a TS meal every single day of your trip, and a real TS meal means appetizer, entree, and dessert for every single member of your party (without the DDP, how many people order that much, every meal, for every day of their trip?) It ensures that guests are paying rack rate for their room because with very few exceptions, the DDP isn't available with room discounts. Between the ME and the DDP, guests don't rent cars, take day trips to Universal or the beach...they stay on Disney property, buying Disney merchandise, shopping in Disney stores, spending all of their vacation dollars at Disney.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Maybe they don't need to take the lobster and filet off ALL of the menu's but isn't that a great way to get people over to Cap'n Jack's and out of Le Cellier? Out of MK and over to DD?

I don't know which restaurants took lobster off the menu because that's not something I'd typically order. But upwards of two dozen restaurants - in and out of the parks, on and not on the DDP - have filet on the menu. If every restaurant offered it as a menu item, it's likely that some posters would use that fact to support their argument of the DDP causing all the menus to mimic each other.

Otherwise, they would charge to much $ for the plan or they would end up loosing money if they charged the same rates that are today.

No. They WON'T. I don't understand where people who claim this are getting their information. Could somebody please provide a link in support of this statement?

I don't know how much the food costs Disney. I do know that last week my local butcher shop had filet mignon for $5.99 a pound, retail. Common sense indicates Disney pays far below retail price, but let's just use this figure because I don't have access to Disney's purchasing information. Le Cellier offers a seven ounce filet. They charge $27.99 for one; they're paying $3 for the actual steak. Figure another $1 (generously) for the accompanment. Unless the overhead (utilities/supplies/wages/taxes) is five to seven HUNDRED percent of the restaurant's cost for the food, they are NOT LOSING MONEY by offering the DDP. In addition, in most cases Disney has that money several weeks or months in advance of the Guest's visit, they can invest it.

Also, as maravaid points out, most restaurants are full.
Another simplified example:
A random participating Disney restaurant has 100 seats.
The restaurant is open four hours a day.
Each table turns over once an hour.
Every table is full/used/booked for each reservation time.
That's a minimum of four hundred meals.
Now, granted, it costs more to prep and serve 400 meals than the 200 which would have been sold pre-DDP - but the restaurant then takes in twice as much money and (again, very simplified) ends up with twice as much profit as they would if the restaurant were only half-utilized.

 

[MaryKatesMom]

I don't know how much the food costs Disney. I do know that last week my local butcher shop had filet mignon for $5.99 a pound, retail.

Was it beef?

Seriously, I watch the prices on filet because that is the only steak my DD eats and Sam's club hasn't run below $10.99 in years. And that isn't cleaned and prepped.

I picked up a "special /use or freeze by today" the Tuesday after Memorial day. It had been $13.99 lb and was marked down to $10.99 lb.

 

[Dreamfinder2]

... considering catfish to be the end all and be all of cajun cuisine????

I hope not. Cajun is a complex cusine with a perfect fusion of many cultures (Acadians from Canadian port cities, slaves from the deep south, Caribbean immigrants, etc.) . Done correctly it is one of our countries greatest contributions to the culinary world. I would warn anyone to dismiss this treasure of the southern region!!! The food is wonderful and the history attached to it is important to the history of our great nation.

Yeah, apostolic4life, we could hang out. They've gone to talkin' about my local groceries now.

 

[Tinkerbell24]

IMO the only thing the DDP has to do with the changes is that it was used as a way to make the pill easier to swallow for a lot of the guests.

Look at how many people post things like "The food wasn't great, but we were on the DDP". You pay months in advance for the plan so it feels like you're not paying once you get to the restaurants but in fact you DID pay.

Although the food we got at WDW wasn't bad it certainely wasn't worth the price we were paying for it. Dinner at Liberty Tree Tavern $28 a pop ?? It's a ripoff but then again let's face it we're getting ripped off on everything else.
ASMO a "value" resort at $170/night ... paid extra for a preferred room and got stuck smack dab in the middle of the pool construction mess. Some value.

So why should the food be any different ? They're going to charge as much as they possibly can, and give us as little as possible, as long as people continue to shut up & pay.

I understand what you are saying, but if the food is crappy for someone on the DDP, won't it be crappy for everyone else? To what you said about shutting up and paying, that is true for EVERYTHING. Everything in WDW is overpriced, but people still pay. If they are going to try to give us as little as they can and charge as much as possible, maybe they are doing that regardless of the DDP. Maybe THAT is why people complain about portions.

 

[drakethib]

"FIll a void in my belly" is not dining.
Of course cajun food can be great but with that said IMO catchfish only goes so far.

Two statements:

I guess you think my familywould eat the food if it was bad ????????

If you think cajun food only consist of catfish, I am beginning to understand things alot better now.

Have a good one