Why are there no Black princesses? (more)

[Mickey'snewestfan]

I just got back from 8 nights 9 days in WDW with my son, my best friend, and her daughter (my goddaughter). We had a wonderful trip and enjoyed so many things. One thing I found really frustrating, however, was the lack of Black characters and cast members for the kids to admire. Although I've heard it said that Disney makes every little girl feel like a princess, I felt like my beautiful goddaughter got a clear message that princesses don't look like she does.

Ideally, I'd like to see Disney put out some movies with Black lead characters, but even without that happening it seems like they missed a lot of opportunities to make children of African descent feel included.

Specifically, why can't they cast a Black woman as one of the princesses at the ball in Cinderellabration? Why can't they have a show in Animal Kingdom or at Animal Kingdom Lodge that features at beautiful Black princess? Why isn't there a "real" pavillion in World Showcase (as opposed to an "outpost") from Kenya, or Jamaica, or Botswana or any other country where the people have dark skin? That way you could feature some beautiful Black dancers or other artists (in the same way that the Japan pagoda had a woman in a beautiful kimono the day we were there?) And why did the show at the American pavillion leave out so many great African Americans (even Martin Luther King didn't warrant an animatronic figure).

 

[the kabuki]

I'm caucasian and have actually wondered the same things. Don't have any answers for you, but I do feel Disney is missing the boat on this one.

 

[UrsulasShadow]

I have to say I've noticed the same thing. I think AKL moved in the right direction, for I've seen many CM's from various African countries, and enjoyed hearing about their home countries, but it's true, you just don't see many cultures represented by the "princesses". Mulan, Jasmine,and Pocahontas were the first non-white princesses I recall seeing (Mulan is a personal favorite of mine). Would love to see a little more "color" in the princesses.

 

[SDRocKGirL]

You know, I used to think the same thing when I was younger (I am now 21). As a kid I grew up with loving Cinderella, Belle, Ariel and Jasmine.

But I think Disney is slowly getting there.. Jasmine was also a minority character, and I was very pleased when they came out with Mulan, then Lilo. I am Pacific Islander but never really thought of Asian or Pacific Islander main characters but they came out recently, not too recent but recent.

I'm pretty sure they will make more movies with more diverse characters in the near future. I would love to see a movie that brought out a beautiful African princess. I love learning about other cultures. But maybe you could write them a letter or something voicing your opinion. I'm pretty sure you're not the only one who feels the same way..

But I hope your goddaughter had a magical time despite all this...

 

[civileng68]

While I can see your point and in no way try to discredit the way you should feel, I will speak based on the way I feel about things.

I just dont know why it matters. I never looked at a white character and felt that had any influence on whether I felt included or not.

I'm just one of those people who don't see color at all. Most of my friends are 50/50 white to black and honestly most of the people from my work who are a high % of African Americans go to Disney regularly. Our company buys passes for most of the employees and allows them to enjoy weekends there.

With SO many African Americans that go there, along with white people, I love talking Disney with them, and you know.. this is the first time that I've ever heard anyone mention that. NOt to say it's wrong, BECAUSE IT'S NOT. Im just saying none of the AFrican American's I've talked to have ever thought of that.

I do find it interesting however how they have not created an African American character. However I'm sure it has nothing to do with racism. I agree with you there that it's funny that it's never been created, I just dont understand why that would cause you to feel more or less welcome.

Honestly I think the African American concerns, which almost all are valid, would have much more standing if Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would not be the sole voice of the African American community. I just dont think anyone takes them seriously and in many cases they make things worse.

Example: I used to live in Concord, NC and years ago a black man was killed by a cop by using pepper spray when resisting arrest. He had a bad reaction. The black community rioted against the white community (as if I had anything to do with it). They literally shut the city down and held a curfew and called in the National Guard. Everything settled down.............and then Jesse Jackson came in, gave one of his speeches and it started all up again. One thing Jesse Jackson has got to realize is that he is no Martin Luther King Jr. who truly was one of the greatest Americans to ever walk the earth.

 

[RescueRanger]

The princesses at WDW aren't black because the characters in the movies aren't black. I can just see the kids now, "Dad, that isn't Cinderella. She looks nothing like her." Classic Disney movies were made in a different era. That is just a cold hard fact. Right or wrong that is just how it is. When I go to WDW, I want to get away from the "real" world, and that includes political correctness. In FOTLK, the main actors are black and they do a wonderful job. Heck, there is a whole section in AK for Africa. I think "adults" get caught up in the PC stuff too often. Most kids don't see color they just see people. Why can't we let them continue to grow up that way?

 

[AngieBelle]

Actually, there are a few black women who are trained in roles of ladies in the court of Cinderellabration.

Have you seen the Festival of The Lion King? All 4 of the principle singers are black. One young women character in the show is named Kabibi, Swahili for princess according to the script. The Tarzan show has some black lead singers. And Animal Kingdom has an entire "land" representing Africa.

I wish they'd use the Muses from Hercules more often. They are wonderful characters who happen to be black.

I'm sure it's only a matter of time before Disney choses an African story.

 

[Mickey'snewestfan]

I would love to see a movie with a strong Black female lead (or a strong Black male lead, but since DS's favorite characters are largely animals -- Mickey, Tigger etc . . . , I didn't worry as much about the message he was getting). An African princess, a Carribbean themed movie, or a movie set in the U.S. featuring African American lead characters would all be wonderful.

In the meantime, however, it seems like they could be doing more in other ways. I think the thing that bothered me most was watching Cinderellabration and all three of the "no name" princesses were also white. It would have been so easy for them to have cast a beautiful Black dancer in one or more of those roles, maybe even given her a little bit of a "solo" but they didn't (at least not on any of the days I was there). Ironically they did have a Black man dancing a prince part (not nearly as helpful, since everyone knows that Cinderallabration is all about the princesses!) so it wasn't as though they could claim that they were pretending it was medieval Europe so everyone needed to be white.

Similarly, a show with beautiful dancers in World Showcase or Animal Kingdom would be great (Festival of the Lion King was spectacular and definitely one of my favorites but it didn't fill that "beautiful princess" role that so many little girls love).

 

[Stepharia]

Have you seen the version of Cinderella with Brandy playing Cinderella. It's been on the Disney Channel and we've rented it from the video store before. Also, in the new Muppets Wizard of Oz, Dorothy is played by Ashanti. I can understand where you are coming from though as DD is bi-racial, she actually think she looks like Jasmine though without the straight hair. I'm wondering if their will ever come a day that she wonders why there aren't any black princesses. I figure she just thinks that they are going to look like what they did in the movies and I agree with the fact that those movies were done in a different era and maybe things will change.

42 days and counting

 

[BBGirl]

While I can see your point and in no way try to discredit the way you should feel, I will speak based on the way I feel about things.

I just dont know why it matters. I never looked at a white character and felt that had any influence on whether I felt included or not.

I'm just one of those people who don't see color at all. Most of my friends are 50/50 white to black and honestly most of the people from my work who are a high % of African Americans go to Disney regularly. Our company buys passes for most of the employees and allows them to enjoy weekends there.

With SO many African Americans that go there, along with white people, I love talking Disney with them, and you know.. this is the first time that I've ever heard anyone mention that. NOt to say it's wrong, BECAUSE IT'S NOT. Im just saying none of the AFrican American's I've talked to have ever thought of that.

I do find it interesting however how they have not created an African American character. However I'm sure it has nothing to do with racism. I agree with you there that it's funny that it's never been created, I just dont understand why that would cause you to feel more or less welcome.

Honestly I think the African American concerns, which almost all are valid, would have much more standing if Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would not be the sole voice of the African American community. I just dont think anyone takes them seriously and in many cases they make things worse.

Example: I used to live in Concord, NC and years ago a black man was killed by a cop by using pepper spray when resisting arrest. He had a bad reaction. The black community rioted against the white community (as if I had anything to do with it). They literally shut the city down and held a curfew and called in the National Guard. Everything settled down.............and then Jesse Jackson came in, gave one of his speeches and it started all up again. One thing Jesse Jackson has got to realize is that he is no Martin Luther King Jr. who truly was one of the greatest Americans to ever walk the earth.

Are you out of your mind!! You DO NOT SEE COLOR then you disregard alot of who these people are. By these people I mean white, black, asian, hispanic etc. Is it all they are? NO. But just as I am proud to be a white women and it is something that is a part of me. African americans are or should be pround to be black it is part of who they are. When a young african american girl goes to some place like Disney and only sees only pretty WHITE princesses it does send a message. Do I believe Disney means to send this message no. I believe it's important that we as a society realize when we miss the boat. When it comes to giving minority childern role models to look up of their own race we HAVE missed the boat. We only teach african american and hispanic history for a month and how many races does that leave out. To say that the OP should have gotten the message is wrong. sorry Just MHO.

 

[Mickey'snewestfan]

"With SO many African Americans that go there, along with white people, I love talking Disney with them, and you know.. this is the first time that I've ever heard anyone mention that. NOt to say it's wrong, BECAUSE IT'S NOT. Im just saying none of the AFrican American's I've talked to have ever thought of that."

How on earth do you know that? Do you read their minds? In my experience (as a white person in an interracial family) many African Americans refrain from talking to white people about concerns related to race because they know, from experience, how awkward it can be. This doesn't mean that they aren't thinking, noticing and talking amongst themselves and with white friends who they know they can trust.

"I do find it interesting however how they have not created an African American character. However I'm sure it has nothing to do with racism."

That's interesting because my guess is that it has everything to do with racism. The racism that is the most powerful isn't usually about specific people making conscious decisions to not like or exclude people of other races. It's about institutional practices. Disney hasn't made a movie with a Black female lead (or a Hispanic one for that matter) because it fears that such a movie wouldn't sell as much merchandising etc . . . It knows that most "color blind" white people don't buy dark skinned dolls for their daughters.

"Honestly I think the African American concerns, which almost all are valid, would have much more standing if Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would not be the sole voice of the African American community. I just dont think anyone takes them seriously and in many cases they make things worse."

The African American community has many voices who speak on many different issues and in many different ways. To suggest that Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are it's only voices is offensive and absurd.

 

[Kerlynne]

For some reason I'm remembering a resent moive that was out that had a black girl. Could it be Atlantis: The Lost Empire? I actaullywas bored by the movie, so I don't remember all details of the movie. Wasn't there also a younger girl that was latin American? Anyhow, is there were, maybe they would have played up more of those characters, if the movie had done better.

 

[Kerlynne]

"
Disney hasn't made a movie with a Black female lead (or a Hispanic one for that matter) because it fears that such a movie wouldn't sell as much merchandising etc . . . It knows that most "color blind" white people don't buy dark skinned dolls for their daughters.

I highly doubt that, or Disney wouldn't have already took the step to bring in "color" with Jasmine or Mulan.
Couldn't it just be, that many well written stories have not been written, to what Disney wants to stand behind. There have been, what I call "flops" of movies they have released, and it's not because of color, but of scripts, or poorly executed.

 

[Mickey'snewestfan]

The princesses at WDW aren't black because the characters in the movies aren't black. I can just see the kids now, "Dad, that isn't Cinderella. She looks nothing like her." Classic Disney movies were made in a different era. That is just a cold hard fact. Right or wrong that is just how it is. When I go to WDW, I want to get away from the "real" world, and that includes political correctness. In FOTLK, the main actors are black and they do a wonderful job. Heck, there is a whole section in AK for Africa. I think "adults" get caught up in the PC stuff too often. Most kids don't see color they just see people. Why can't we let them continue to grow up that way?

I loved FOTLK, it was one of my very favorite things at WDW. I loved the music, and the costumes and the acrobatics. I also loved the fact that my son and goddaughter saw themselves reflected in the dancers' faces. I also loved the fact that some of the rollerbladers in the Tarzan show were Black. (I think my son was more impressed with them than any other performer). I also loved watching the interracial cast of the American Vybe, and talking to the Botswanan storyteller at AKL. However, there is a very specific "princess" phenomena associated with Disney. The princesses are presented as beautiful, strong, wonderful and magical in a way that really captures little girls imaginations. I know that for my goddaughter the princesses were a major focus of her Disney experience. I think that Disney needs to find a way to portray Black (and Hispanic, and other groups) women as equally beautiful, strong, wonderful and magical. I agree with you that having a Black woman play Cinderella wouldn't work. But I think that there are other ways to do so.

Finally, as for your last point. Research has shown pretty clearly, that in the United States most children of color do see color differences from an early age. As to why we can't let white children continue to grow up without seeing color, it's only when people become conscious of color that they can notice and work against patterns of racism in this society.

 

[RyMickey]

As for your comment about the American Adventure pavilion, you'll notice that the audio-animatronics storyline stops in the 1930s and the rest of America's "story" is told through pictures of important people in its history including Martin Luther King, Jr.

 

[foolishmortal]

Why is it people like to speak up against no african american figures...but none says hey we need to represent the mexicans, hispanics, just the brown heritage in general. I'm sorry but the african americans are far from the only group that get excluded from many places like this.

If you are going to complain about something like this please include all other groups that are excluded not just your own, otherwise you are just adding to the prejudice.

Now am I sayng you are out of line in asking??? BY NO MEANS AM I SAYING THAT, but like I said your goddaughter is far from the only "minority" excluded so please remember that and help raise her to understand that as well.

Like other posters have already said I agree that disney is making strides in trying to reach out, but at the same time it is all about the bottom line ($$$) at the end of the day.

 

[BillSears]

There is a country in the World Showcase from Africa. Morocco is in Africa. OK I know it's not what you're looking for but it's there. Part of the problem with the World Showcase is that I believe the pavillion has to be sponsered by the country. So if no one is stepping forward to sponser it then there will not be a "black" African pavillion.

Having some Black Princesses in Cinderellabration is a no brainer that should have been done. But changing classic Princesses into something different isn't reasonable.

I guess the underlying problem is when will Disney make a movie starring a Black Princess. Until that's done they're not going to be the main attraction in the shows based on movie characters.

 

[952LisaR]

What about making Aida (the broadway show) into an animated movie. It is a great story with great songs and features a strong female role model.

 

[PKK/MJK]

I think the thing that bothered me most was watching Cinderellabration and all three of the "no name" princesses were also white. It would have been so easy for them to have cast a beautiful Black dancer in one or more of those roles, maybe even given her a little bit of a "solo" but they didn't (at least not on any of the days I was there). Ironically they did have a Black man dancing a prince part (not nearly as helpful, since everyone knows that Cinderallabration is all about the princesses!) so it wasn't as though they could claim that they were pretending it was medieval Europe so everyone needed to be white.


Just as a clarification--there are not any 'no name Princesses' in Cinderellabration nor is the black man dancing the role of a Prince. Those people are members of Cinderella's court--during some of the performances the Grand Duke will actually 'name' these characters--and they're called Dukes and Duchesses, Lords and Ladies, Marquis and Marquessa.. My DD is a 'close personal friend of one of the Princesses' in Cinderellabration so I know what I'm talking about. CM's go through rigorous auditions before they are chosen and trained in roles--Disney tries very hard to be sure the CM's who represent their 'face' characters match what those characters are like in the books and movies. They call it character integrity. My DD has very fair skin so she will NEVER be cast as Jasmine, Mulan or Pocahantas. As has been mentioned, the majority of these stories were written many years ago. In recent years Disney has definitely tried to become more diversified and to represent more cultures. Having a story with a black Princess sounds like a good idea to me--and hopefully it will happen soon.

Cinderellas' court is chosen because of dancing/singing/performing proficiency. Unfortunately, there simply are not many black dancers at Disney right now--so 'casting a beautiful black dancer in one of those roles', while desirable for diversity, is not nearly as easy as you think.

 

[cstraub]

What about making Aida (the broadway show) into an animated movie. It is a great story with great songs and features a strong female role model.

Great idea excpet both main characters end up dying in the end by being burried alive!!!!