What's your feeling about getting a medal without finishing Princess?

[robynslp]

Is it this one? http://shrinkingkrista.blogspot.com/2012/03/lonliest-2-miles-of-my-life.html

FYI, she made it to Mile 10 this year before being swept.

I'm a frequent lurker, sometimes joiner. I've been following this thread because it is an interesting discussion. Personally, I wouldn't take a medal if I got swept. In fact, I'm so disappointed in my own marathon performance that my medal is tucked away in a basket.

But that's not why I'm posting on here. I have to say that I am disappointed in some of the comments about Krista. Sure she went very unprepared the first time, but she kept trying and was much more ready to go this year. I am disappointed in W.I.S.H.ers for publicly reacting poorly because I met Krista briefly before the Battleship Half Marathon and suggested that she join W.I.S.H. because it was a supportive group of Disney lovers who love the challenge. I didn't even know she had a blog until I followed one of your posted links and realized she was the person I suggested join here. I hope she didn't follow my suggestion. I am embarrassed that I ever sent her in this direction. Krista, if you are reading this, I am sorry. And great job at Battleship - I know you didn't cross the finish line like you hoped, but that is a WICKED complicated race.

 

[SeptemberGirl]

For the RunDisney races this is not an issue for anyone to agree or disagree on. RunDisney decided to offer the medals. RunDisney decided to place pace caps on their events. The individual gets to chose if they want to sign up for and try to complete a RunDisney Race. The individual chooses whether or not to take the medal.

You as the bystander can know RunDisney does this, you can not like it, and you can ask them to stop. The biggest thing you as the bystander can do is show RunDisney what you think by not buying their product. I really don't like WalMart's cooperate strategies, I do not shop at WalMart. Easy as that.

There can be no discussion, no debate, no moral high ground. Your feelings are just that, personal feelings. Rock and Roll has a great race series, skirt chaser, diva, warrior dash, Spartan, local races. You have options.

I 100% agree with this. Well Said. I would quote this again and again if that wasn't incredibly annoying.

But we aren't talking about degrees and diplomas here, it's a casual race, a novelty race. Something that only truly matters within the Disney sphere and to the person running. The intrinsic value to the medal is only that which the winner places on it. Nobody is going on to the Olympics after earning it, it doesn't give you a gold medal-like status in the world of running, there's no block times determined by placement... It's a fun, challenging race, open to everybody, and enjoyed by many for various reasons. If somebody earned or got their medal shouldn't matter if you feel you earned yours.

To be honest, I know there's a lot of mention about that blog... I'll agree, the first time she did it was a disaster... But this last year? I'm sorry, but if somebody told me she went home with a medal despite not finishing, honestly, I'd be pumped for her. I mean this in the nicest possible way, I really do, I hope nobody takes it as anything other then that... But let's be honest, she's a woman of size... Walking/running all but the last 3 miles of a half marathon is quite an accomplishment. If her blog is truthful and that's reflective of the effort she's put forth... I think she's got everything to be proud of there. Women half her size can have trouble running/walking what she was doing, even behind pace, and she certainly worked for it for the year and showed dramatic improvement over her last year's performance. Honestly, if she got a medal for it, I'd have given her a big high five and said she earned it.

Like I said, the value on the medal is what anybody puts on it... If I think it's the greatest thing ever, who cares how somebody else got it if you're proud of how you got it?

Agreed. Well said. Had to bold those first sentences!

I felt this quote appropriate for this thread:

"It's very hard in the beginning to understand that the whole idea is not to beat the other runners. Eventually you learn that the competition is against the little voice inside you that wants to quit."
--George Sheehan

Try not to get caught up in anything but your own race. Do your best, and be happy in your accomplishments

He was from my area and we do a yearly race named after him; love him, love the quote.

I'm a frequent lurker, sometimes joiner. I've been following this thread because it is an interesting discussion. Personally, I wouldn't take a medal if I got swept. In fact, I'm so disappointed in my own marathon performance that my medal is tucked away in a basket.

But that's not why I'm posting on here. I have to say that I am disappointed in some of the comments about Krista. Sure she went very unprepared the first time, but she kept trying and was much more ready to go this year. I am disappointed in W.I.S.H.ers for publicly reacting poorly because I met Krista briefly before the Battleship Half Marathon and suggested that she join W.I.S.H. because it was a supportive group of Disney lovers who love the challenge. I didn't even know she had a blog until I followed one of your posted links and realized she was the person I suggested join here. I hope she didn't follow my suggestion. I am embarrassed that I ever sent her in this direction. Krista, if you are reading this, I am sorry. And great job at Battleship - I know you didn't cross the finish line like you hoped, but that is a WICKED complicated race.

I feel your disappointment. I am ashamed that a place I thought was welcoming and friendly is supporting this thread.

I'm extremely internally motivated, so for me wearing a medal for a race I didn't finish and pretending I had would make me feel dishonest.

That said, I don't hold anything against those who got a medal but didn't finish as to that specific issue. It does nothing to diminish my accomplishment because I know what I did. Perhaps I'm used to the similar (but certainly not the same) argument that walkers shouldn't be considered finishers because it's a "run." People are entitled to their opinion, and if they don't consider my 3:21 1/2 or 6:47 full "legitimate" because I walked, that's fine with me. I know what I accomplished in my first races ever.

I realize that the arguments are not truly analogous but my point is that there will always be those who don't think someone else's performance in a race isn't worthy of a medal. There are those who think only the winner should get a medal. There are probably some who think even the winner shouldn't get one. That's OK. This is America. Truth be told, if we're honest all of us have that line where we would say "OK, that's too far. It's not a legitimate performance to warrant a medal." For me, I would call it the halfway point of the race. I would think if you make it to halfway you've put in a moderate amount of training and are more likely to be a victim of bad luck (injury, heat, etc.) and not in the crowd blogging about how great it is to be a "start and park" (yes, a NASCAR reference).

But ultimately it's Disney's race and they'll set their policies. Would I take a medal after getting swept? Yes I would. As I said, I'm internally motivated. I'm also motivated by negative emotions. So I would carry that stupid medal with me on every single training session for the next race, letting it mock me and remind me of past failure and pushing me to work ever harder. Once I finished the next race, I'd take the failure medal and chuck it off the tallest bridge I could find. Or maybe find a friend with a gun who would let me shoot it. Or introduce it to a table saw. Whatever. The point is it would die badly.

In the meantime it doesn't hurt me to have non-finishers get a medal, so I'm OK with it, though I do see the point of the crowd complaining about the "participant trophy" state of the country.

I thought this was also nicely said.

I too am internally motivated. Getting the medal is only eh to me - finishing the race is what matters. The medals matter less and less each race. What I really cherish is what I learn about myself while training, on the course, and the love and support I receive from my friends.


I don't care who gets a medal, or who wears it, or where people start, or what their finishing time is. I don't have the inclination to spend my time judging others on their running or races or morals or prep or anything. Goodness. I have a full, happy life and try to focus on that.

I am really grateful for the DIS boards and the WISH ones in particular. The friendships and the kindness I found here inspired me to do my first 5k and my first half. I think we should be a place for encouragement, not for tearing down others. It makes me sad to see this thread and the others I have seen recently, filled too much with personal attacks and petty comments that I feel are not in line with our community.

Getting others started on running and endurance races and encouraging them along is a gift we give ourselves. A friend of mine has been my cheerleader the whole way through and i know she gets as much from it as I do. Not everyone can be or has to be like my dear friend, but we can all follow the cooperative spirit of our online community.

 

[Stitch_lover_Sith]

Moderators please shut this thread down. Everything that that needed to be said has been said. This thread is no longer useful as a discussion.

 

[DISNEYFOS]

I am so confused by the people who feel there is attacking?

Do you not feel that a 1/2 marathon is a real endurance event? That there are dangers involved in attempting that if you don't train yourself for it?

If someone is new to running..I'll encourage them to the cows come home!!! start with a 5K, work up to a 10K when you feel you are ready ..follow training programs to get up to the distance you want to run..then run it comfortably for a while til you get to your ultimate goal...and make sure you run your goal distance comfortably on your own regularly before you enter the race.

Seriously.. I'm not following why that is being mean, not supportive, not the wish way.. I'm really missing something..

 

[mickeysgal]

I too am confused. Opinions are just that opinions.

Running distances you are not prepared for is a risk. Just because you're at Disney doesn't mean something can't happen medically. It clear to me that there are many that "try" this race who simply aren't prepared to keep to the pace requirements that they knew in advance.

I would have loved the anniversary Mickey medal. However I'm not prepared at this time to finish a full marathon so I stuck with the distance I am trained for...the half. It didn't occur to me to try it and see how it goes and collect a medal either way.

 

[IMGONNABE40!]

I am another who doesn't get all the concern about who gets a medal..... Then again I store all of my medals in a box in my closet and don't consider 13.1 to be that big of a deal for me. I recognize that it is a huge accomplishment for many and symbolizes a big change in lifestyle.

I have finished all of my races-5 marathons and at least that many halfs, but I guess if I weren't able to finish one for some reason I'd take the medal and drop it in the box with my others. I honestly don't know that it would have any more or any less meaning than any of my others. Although.... I understand from another thread I could earn some money for a Disney medal on e-bay! Now, if ever had the training and stamina to complete an ultra, I may have to display that medal somewhere.

I think the reason some are posting about personal attacks on this thread are due to some comments made about Krista who has responded to this thread. Krista, if you are still reading, You Go Girl! You have obviously come a long way and I wish I could be there when you complete your first half to hang that medal around your neck. You are clearly an inspiration to many.

 

[Stitch_lover_Sith]

I am not going to go back and repost every hateful thing that has been said on this thread. I am not even saying that everybody who has posted has had something hateful to say. Now with that being said the moderators need to shut this thread down. It is getting us as a group nowhere. I am not sure the OP knew just what a response they were going to get when they started this thread. Threads like this is why I stopped posting on WISH years ago and I just came back after the Marathon Weekend to talk to some of the cool new people I met.

To those who were part of WISH in 2006 you are going to understand what I am about to say and know who brought this philosophy to the WISH community at that time.

Dead Last Finish is Better than Did not Finish is better than Did no Start.(xterratri)

This is the motto we have on our shirts, this is the motto we live. This thread in no way meets up with this motto. Attacking someone for blogging about their courage to start, to say that if you are undertrained you may as well just stay home. To say that people who do this are Saftey hazards.

People all around the world are getting off the couch to train for RunDisney races. People are getting out of their hotel beds at 3am to hit the start line of a RunDisney event. I celebrate everyone who is there at the start, does not matter if they never made it to the finish. Sometimes the picture with your favorite character is more important. Giving people the courage to start this journey is what this Community is for, not to tear them down because they did not finish.

 

[MrsBeal]

I will be running my first half next year when I do PHM and I will be properly trained and prepared. I would hate to put in all of that hard work and then someone who doesn't even finish gets the same metal. What's the point? That's just like I'm working on my PhD. I have finished all coursework and I am working on my dissertation. If there was someone who did everthing but the dissertation and they decided to still give them the degree, the same degree I earned I would be hotter than fish grease.

It truly did bother me to find out that they were going to hand over a medal to me if I would have been picked up by the sweeper vans.

Before mile 6 (Frontierland bathrooms to be exact) I started feeling sick, dizzy, nauseous, short of breath. As a relative newbie runner I began training for Princess Half in mid-November never missed a run and stuck to my schedule in sub30 temps and did NOT prepare to meet the villainous humidity. I was on track to finish PHM at or right under 3:00.
However, my already slowed down 13-14mm pace fell to a ridiculous walking pace of 18mm + by mile 7. I continued to pull off at each medic tent to get checked out. I ended up at the tail end of runners and watched many people get picked up as I made it up the over pass over World Drive. I hadn't planned to stop for many photos but after realizing that I was completely missing my normal 3 hour finish time along with the medic stops I also stopped for Genie and the mile markers.

When I heard they were still being given a medal I felt so angry but even more determined to finish the 13.1. Here I was almost passing out from heat exhaustion, dehydration, basically crawling to the finish, but damn it I was going to EARN that medal.

Handing a medal over to someone who didn't complete the 13.1 miles in its entirety cheapens it for those of us that DID finish and it really pisses me off. So my question to runDisney is, did the pain sweat and tears I had to endure to EARN my medal doing the entire 13.1 miles was for nothing? Really?

I would NOT have accepted any medal if I had come in on the van.

 

[MrsBeal]

I hadn't read all of the posts before I responded but I see we are thinking alike.

So following this line of thinking if someone doesn't pass all their classes they should still get their High School Diploma or their college degree if they start? Since their receiving their's wouldn't diminish yours?

I disagree- every finishers medal I have is important to me because of what I did to earn it. If others have them and didn't earn them then that makes mine less bright!

I don't think non-finishers should receive a finishers medal. (and you shouldn't get a degree or diploma you don't earn either)

 

[mickeysgal]

I will be running my first half next year when I do PHM and I will be properly trained and prepared. I would hate to put in all of that hard work and then someone who doesn't even finish gets the same metal. What's the point? That's just like I'm working on my PhD. I have finished all coursework and I am working on my dissertation. If there was someone who did everthing but the dissertation and they decided to still give them the degree, the same degree I earned I would be hotter than fish grease.

Ok - this made me laugh...never heard that phrase before.

 

[PRmamiDEdos]

I could care less. I wouldn't take one but why would I care if someone else does. It's their pride, not mine. Some might ask, "would you accept a medal after taking 7 hours to finish a marathon." ...8...9...6 hours? People really need to stop worrying so much about others.

See, here's the thing. Do I wish I had a better time? Yes. But I finished and therefore EARNED my FINISHER's medal.

I work with Medals4Mettle and we do not take unearned medals, meaning ones that you didn't cross the finish line for. I don't know of any other charity that takes medals that weren't earned. The reason for that is that most donated medals have legacy forms attached explaining the race, the training that the donor went through, and encouraging words. A kid doesn't almost finish cancer treatment, or almost meet a medical milestone. I didn't understand that until I presented medals.

So, let me get this straight, an organization that donates race medals to sick children doesn't accept medals that haven't been earned? Hmmm. Sounds to me like medals should be always earned.

As for the dead last finish is better than did not finish which trumps did not start; I love this saying. I believe in it but it has absolutely nothing to do with taking a medal that you didn't earn. No where in that quote does it say you get a medal for trying.

I think what upsets me about people who don't finish and get a medal is that I too was tired, I too had heat exhaustion, my feet hurt, my knees hurt, my head hurt. EVERYTHING was hurting and at mile 19 this year I wanted to give up, but I didn't. I wanted that 20th anniversary medal so bad and I pushed hard to get it and earned it. I don't get why Disney would cheapen our hard work by just giving medals away. I don't dare assume whether or not someone who didn't finish trained or not. Your training doesn't matter to me. What counts is race day and whether you finish the race for a finisher's medal.

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I don't get this. If she knew her limit was 2-3 miles, why not sign up for the 5K instead?* Why sign up for a race that you KNOW you are not ready for and are not physically able to complete? To me it would have been more admirable to hear that someone signed up for a more realistic goal (the 5K), trained for that race and completed it. I'm not trying to offend anyone, but I agree with the PP that said that it's just not safe for some to attempt a half or full marathon, ESPECIALLY as their first-ever race and ESPECIALLY if they are not ready for it. Disney's 5Ks are well-done...I'm not sure why some feel they need to blow right past the 5Ks and go for the half or full marathons if they're not ready for those longer distances.

*DISCLAIMER: I haven't read the blog people are referring to and don't plan on it.

I think you misread... She ran all BUT the last 3 miles. Meaning she ran 10 miles. She was very certain she'd finish, but an injury sidelined her just after MM10.

I'm a frequent lurker, sometimes joiner. I've been following this thread because it is an interesting discussion. Personally, I wouldn't take a medal if I got swept. In fact, I'm so disappointed in my own marathon performance that my medal is tucked away in a basket.

But that's not why I'm posting on here. I have to say that I am disappointed in some of the comments about Krista. Sure she went very unprepared the first time, but she kept trying and was much more ready to go this year. I am disappointed in W.I.S.H.ers for publicly reacting poorly because I met Krista briefly before the Battleship Half Marathon and suggested that she join W.I.S.H. because it was a supportive group of Disney lovers who love the challenge. I didn't even know she had a blog until I followed one of your posted links and realized she was the person I suggested join here. I hope she didn't follow my suggestion. I am embarrassed that I ever sent her in this direction. Krista, if you are reading this, I am sorry. And great job at Battleship - I know you didn't cross the finish line like you hoped, but that is a WICKED complicated race.

Honestly, I admired her for her candor. As somebody who was overweight, who lost 80 pounds to reach my goal (then lost 40 after gaining it while pregnant), and maintained goal for several years now, I know how hard it is to lose weight and I admire that she isn't allowing her size to hold her back. I know that I've heard a lot of "can't" in my life too because of my heart issues, and it's refreshing to see that somebody is so honest about their goals and accountable for falling short. Her blog didn't bother me at all... She seems very strong.

My husband and I were actually discussing this today, and he was equally baffled by the discussion. He asked a question that I found fascinating... "So if somebody got the same medal you did even though they didn't finish and that makes yours less special, is somebody's second medal on the same event make your one medal worth less and somebody's third medal more valuable then all of those? The person who has one finishers medal shouldn't brag because somebody else has done what you did 3 times? Or is the guy who's got the three medals now have three medals that are demeaned because people who only completed once have got a medal? Or if somebody finishes the race an hour before you, is their medal an hour more special?"

 

[Sabeking]

This is a tough one. If I didn't finish I personally would not want the medal. This is why I am conflicted on the subject.

A few years back I read an article in the New York Times that interviewed two ladies who were running the New York marathon. They both said that anyone who could not run the race in 3:30 should not even be out there or at any race for that matter. I took issue with that because I come in at about 4:30. My thought was " who are they racing against?" Because at the end of the day there are only truly about ten folks really racing to win They clearly weren't there to beat anyone; hence it was a personal journey , as it was for me. So who were they to decide if I was worthy to run.

That being said, it is a personal journey for everyone even those who don't finish. I think in Disney fashion they are going to always give a medal regardless of circumstances. At that point it falls back to the runner as to whether they really believe they are worthy of wearing it.

 

[Bookwood]

I'm sorry if someone thinks I'm hateful. If it's called a finishers medal IMHO it should be for finishers only. I started running several years ago at over 220 lbs got down to 180ish before my first half and hung there until this last year. In between I've done 1 full and 15 half marathons training all year long and at least 16 weeks specially for each race, and have finished all of them yes, I've been lucky injury wise.

Sorry but I don't think stating opinions that aren't the same as others is hateful. Political correctness shouldn't keep people from being allowed to have and state respectfully differing opinions.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I don't think that anybody is saying that the opinion that only finishers should get a medal is what's hateful... Just some of the chatter around that, where people make statements of others training, commitment, weight, and mock their personal journey or abilities, or the determining of who should or shouldn't race, or belittling one's pride in their accomplishment, even if they didn't finish, all in the process of expressing their opinion... But even then, I'm not seeing where anybody is saying that's hateful, only that it's against the core mission statement of the forum.

Which honestly, I think is a fair assessment.

I came here and shared my experience and am now active on the Wine and Dine forum, but I have to say that if I'd had some of the comments made about that blogger, or some others here, directed at me... I'd be more then a little upset. If I'd shared my impressions earlier and all that somebody gleaned off of it was "you have a heart condition, you shouldn't be racing anyway," I'd be a little put off. I mean, we're talking about Disney runs, not the Olympics or the Boston Marathon. The intent here or for Disney was never to rub people's faces in their failures with their runs, but to set people up for success and a good time.

In the end, if I finish the whole thing and somebody does a half-hearted walk for a mile and get's swept, that has no impact on me. Even if they get a medal or not. Why bother being upset about it, or worse, demeaning people about it?

 

[EMHDad]

Again, I say I am torn on this. It is not about the finisher's medal even for me. It is about the effort and commitment. For example, it seems the blogger krista has become somewhat of a poster child for this issue. I was the one who originally brought her up, although in a vague, nondescript way. (I could only remember the elements of the story, not the name, link, etc. That was later added). For example, with her story, I see 2 different narratives that bring 2 different opinions. When I discovered she ran (I believe the PHM, and made it to 10, only to miss the last 3 miles because of an injury, I was impressed. It stinks that she didnt finish, but you could see the work that was put in. Her first Dis HM in which she made it less than 2 miles before being swept was more frustrating. That showed a clear lack of preparation for the HM. That is what bothers me as I put in the work I need to to give it my best shot, seeing people go into a HM or Marathon with little or no ability whatsoever to finish because they did not train.

I am not going to take away their medal. Its not even my place. However, when I hear how crowded the Marathon is and the frustrations of that combined with people who have no reasonable business being out there, I am bothered.

That said, her PHM was an inspirational story (finish or not) and her journey towards that should be applauded.

 

[Gryhndmom]

I'm sorry if someone thinks I'm hateful. If it's called a finishers medal IMHO it should be for finishers only. I started running several years ago at over 220 lbs got down to 180ish before my first half and hung there until this last year. In between I've done 1 full and 15 half marathons training all year long and at least 16 weeks specially for each race, and have finished all of them yes, I've been lucky injury wise.

Sorry but I don't think stating opinions that aren't the same as others is hateful. Political correctness shouldn't keep people from being allowed to have and state respectfully differing opinions.

I agree with you in respect to the finisher medal...I believe if Disney wants to give everyone a medal then there should be one for those that physically cross the finish line and ... those that DNF whether the DNF is because of injury, illness, etc. get a separate medal from the official medal that is posted before the race. I know of one girl from the PHM thread who couldn't finish PHM because of illness that DID NOT get her C2C medal because she didn't cross the finish line so in that respect rundisney does make it clear...to get C2C you must cross the finish line...that I did read under C2C info.

Other than the C2C medal...I reread the rundisney info and can't find anything in writing stating only those that cross the finish line get a medal and/or anyone starting the race but not finishing would also get a medal. Anyone else find anything in writing on this issue ?

I think that most of us here on this thread are respectful of differing opinions...that being said...there are some that lowered themselves to calling out someone's weight etc instead of having a respectful difference of opinions. That is wrong...

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Again, I say I am torn on this. It is not about the finisher's medal even for me. It is about the effort and commitment. For example, it seems the blogger krista has become somewhat of a poster child for this issue. I was the one who originally brought her up, although in a vague, nondescript way. (I could only remember the elements of the story, not the name, link, etc. That was later added). For example, with her story, I see 2 different narratives that bring 2 different opinions. When I discovered she ran (I believe the PHM, and made it to 10, only to miss the last 3 miles because of an injury, I was impressed. It stinks that she didnt finish, but you could see the work that was put in. Her first Dis HM in which she made it less than 2 miles before being swept was more frustrating. That showed a clear lack of preparation for the HM. That is what bothers me as I put in the work I need to to give it my best shot, seeing people go into a HM or Marathon with little or no ability whatsoever to finish because they did not train.

I am not going to take away their medal. Its not even my place. However, when I hear how crowded the Marathon is and the frustrations of that combined with people who have no reasonable business being out there, I am bothered.

That said, her PHM was an inspirational story (finish or not) and her journey towards that should be applauded.

Again, I don't want to focus on her size... So please, please, please, please, PLEASE, nobody think I'm insulting her on this. I truly am not... In the full spirit of disclosure, I weighed about 200 pounds, lost the weight to 130, gained to 170 after I was pregnant, lost again to 130... I know what it's like to weigh more then your frame can accommodate, how difficult exercise is at that point, and all that being a weight like that can mean for you physically, mentally, and emotionally. Please, I don't mean the references to her weight negatively, I truly don't.

I just want to say that even reading her first round at the PHM where she was swept at MM 2... Even though the race itself was a disaster, she certainly learned a ton from it and made some incredible changes to her lifestyle as a result. The fact that a woman of size was able to come back and make such a strong showing in the marathon, held back only by an injury... I'm well 100 pounds under her weight and she made it farther then I know I can now in that marathon. There's something to celebrate in her saying she screwed up, trained to fix it, and had a second showing that was night and day different. So that first round wasn't quite a disaster as if she had learned nothing.

(FYI, not singling you out, just following on your thoughts of how she was inspirational).

 

[freepixie]

This thread just makes me sad, who are we to judge another person's athletic performance? Who are we to judge Run Disney's stance on medals? Why should we care who is and who is not receiving medals?

Someone on here a couple pages back wrote very eloquently about it being "my race" and that is really what it comes down to- each individual getting out there and doing their best.

I will not judge a person receiving a medal, I have no idea what all occurred on their journey to getting to the race, and I will not judge Disney's decision in giving people medals.

And at the end of the day, if you don't like the way Disney handles things, nobody is forcing you to participate in their races!! You don't like it, find other races to run!

 

[fashionista311]

I think it might help if Disney pushed out the time limit from 3:30 to 4 hours (especially in Fla, when it's their own roads they are closing anyways). I'm sure most of those who were swept would be able to finish if given enough time, and it might help a bit with the dishonesty with corrals (maybe if people weren't so nervous about the time limits, they would be more adapt to be honest).