What would you do? Grade level question for child

[DawnM]

My son is age wise going in to 4th grade next year.

We have homeschooled him from K-3rd. He has struggled a LOT with reading and writing and still does.

He will be going to school next year.

I personally think we should put him in 3rd next year, but DH is adament that he start out in 4th and be moved only if necessary.

I am working with him a LOT over the summer, but I think for his self esteem it would be much better to just start out in 3rd.

Here is my assessment so far:

1. He can read Magic Treehouse books but it is SLOW!
2. He can write 5 sentence paragraphs, but not an essay or anything.
3. His comprehension skills are very high
4. His math and science are fine.

Anyone with a 3rd grader (esp. of boys) or a 3rd grade teacher who can give feedback?????

Thank you!

I am so not familiar with Elem. schools and what they should do at what level and those What Your Child Needs to Know books aren't very clear on what they should be reading and writing.

Dawn

 

[Hannathy]

I would start him in 3rd. It will be much harder to move him later. He won't be too old for 3rd many, many boys start later now. I would say about half or more kids in my DS class will turn 9 in 3rd grade or even the summer before.

My DS is finishing 2nd grade and he has been reading Magic Treehouse books since the end of first and even the slower readers in 2nd are in those books. They did just write an essay or report for Science that was about 8 paragraphs long on insects.

Just from the thumbnail you have given he sounds closer to 3rd.

If he doesn't know anyone why not start at third and if it is wrong he can bump up to 4th a lot easier than going back down.(and no social stigma in going up a grade)

 

[surfgirl]

If it was me (and it isn't), I wouldn't trust what yahoos on a message board have to say (and that includes me).

I would:
1) talk to the school - maybe even have him tested
2) talk to an independent psychologist

think about the implications. You say he would be in 4th age-wise, but if he is a spring or summer birthday, there are many parents holding kids (especially boys) back. He would be just in line with those. If he is a fall or winter birthday, he will be dramatically older than most.

How is he physically ? Is he tall or short for his age ? Is he coordinated ? Can he hold his own with his peers in sports ?

What is his confidence like ? Will he get frustrated easily or does he like a challenge ? If he gets frustrated in a level too much above him, that could turn him off from school. If he likes to be challenged, then I would be more comfortable pushing him a bit more.

What is his attention span like ? Will he have problems sitting in a classroom setting ? If so, 3rd might be better....

Those are things that would also come into play if it was my child (again, it isn't -- it is a very personal decision you have to make).

 

[Twingle]

I don't know about NC, but here in VA you can take your homeschooled child to your local elementary school for placement testing. They'll tell you where your child is (grade level wise) in english, math, etc.

Also, there are different levels for each grade. For example, your son may very well test as an upcoming fourth grader in all subjects, but maybe in a lower reading group and a higher math group.

Is there a local homeschooling chapter in your area? I've not homeschooled, but I have girlfriends that do, and they've been able to get placement testing through whatever homeschool program they do.

Good luck!

 

[mlraabe]

I would say third. I worked as a Reading Specialist up until this year when I switched to Pre K. Magic Tree House books were used for mostly second graders and some of my struggling third graders. My daughter is finishing third grade and has been writing lengthy writing projects - pages long. I think he would be much more comfortable starting in third. I agree, if you are wrong you could always ask to move up.

 

[december]

I agree with starting him in 3rd. My son will be 10 this summer, but going into the 4th grade. He was small when his time came to start kindergarten, and had a slight speech problem. We decided to hold him back, and it was the best decision ever. He got so many awards at awards day (this morning) that I had to go and get them-he couldn't tote them all! He is in gifted, won 2 art awards, was chess captain, etc. Plus he got the Citizenship award for the 3rd year in a row (yes I'm proud!). Since he started with these kids, there is no stigma of him being older. I have never regretted our decision.

The reading level may really hold your son back. My son has always loved reading Magic Treehouse books, but he can't read them for credit anymore. Dd7 (1st grade) started bringing them home this 9 wks to read.

I know you have to do what is best in your situation, but I think you should trush your instincts here!

 

[chop456]

I see that you are from NC. Here is a link to the standards for each grade level. There are some great resources on this site. Maybe this will help guide you. Good luck

http://www.ncpublicschools.org/curriculum/languagearts/elementary/

 

[meandtheguys2]

This is a perfect time to make that adjustment. My girlfriend did the same with her daughter when they went into the school system. She is diagnosed dyslexic and they originally started hsing because the schools said she would never read nor write.

She went into the 4th grade as a "5th" grader," and is doing well, considering the circumstances. For her it was a great time, and she hasn't had any social struggles in the process.

 

[ndgqccmiller]

I have a fourth grader going into fifth this coming up year. In fourth grade at our school my son had to write reports full pages, read chapter books over 175 pages. They said no Matt Christopher books or Magic Tree House. I don't know your schools, but that is what we had. Also if you go ahead and start him in 3rd he wont be upset about leaving friends he just made. it is a decision for you and your husband, my husband would probably say the same thing. You know your son and only you can do whats best for him.
Good Luck

 

[StitchandPooh'sMom]

Magic Tree House books vary some in complexity, at least according to established reading levels for AR tests (which he will likely be taking in a NC elementary school). For example, After on the Amazon is reading level 2.6 - it is one of the lowest. Blizzard of the Blue Moon (one of the newer ones) is reading level 3.9. A third grader reading at grade level would be expected to read Blizzard of the Blue Moon more slowly than Afternoon on the Amazon. At the end of third grade, though, he should be able to read any MTH book and comprehend it.

DD7's school here in Wilmington administers a computerized reading test at the beginning, middle and end of the year called the STAR reading test. It tries to establish a child's reading comprehension level, along with indicating the percentile at which the child is reading for age. You might check with the elementary school to see if he can take the test now or in the summer (if they offer it). At DD7's school, the kids must read at a certain level (not sure what it is or I would share it) in order to progress to third. I believe that it is a state standard, not a county requirement. If he can't demonstrate proficiency at his grade level, he might not be allowed to go into fourth grade regardless of age.

I do know someone who has had great success with their child at Huntington. I don't know much about the program and can't personally recommend it, but there might be a program through them or Sylvan or someone similar that assesses reading level and can work with him.

Also, DD7's school offers a two week program in the summer for kids who are struggling to maintain grade level. It is the two weeks before school starts to help the kids to catch up and review. You might check with your school to see if anything like that is offered. The summer program is taught by one of the third grade teachers.

Good luck! I personally wouldn't make any decisions without an external evaluation - it's hard to tell how your child is doing relative to peers sometimes - he might be right on track!

 

[DawnM]

Yeah, I think I will set up a time to go in next week have a teacher or counselor at least assess his reading and writing. Those are crucial.

It is more that DH and I disagree. DH was 17 when he graduated from high school and thinks that starting someone late is a horrible idea. I don't quite get that, but, whatever.

Thanks,

Dawn

 

[StitchandPooh'sMom]

Yeah, I think I will set up a time to go in next week have a teacher or counselor at least assess his reading and writing. Those are crucial.

It is more that DH and I disagree. DH was 17 when he graduated from high school and thinks that starting someone late is a horrible idea. I don't quite get that, but, whatever.

Thanks,

Dawn

It is much more common these days. When is your DS's birthday? DD7's birthday is the first week of June, and I think she is the youngest in the class except for one or two kids. It seems that all of the July and August birthdays wait and go later (especially the boys), and our cutoff date is not until October! Several kids in her class were 8 before the school year started, and she is not 8 yet!

 

[DawnM]

His birthday is February and he turned 9. So he is definitely the right age for 4th next year. He is very short and small though and has some behaviours that are more along with younger kids.

But I think even then there are many these days who are a year behind what the schools allow, esp. boys.

In fact, I am hearing that in NC the trend is to encourage parents to have them wait to start K until they are 6 or close to 6.

Dawn

It is much more common these days. When is your DS's birthday? DD7's birthday is the first week of June, and I think she is the youngest in the class except for one or two kids. It seems that all of the July and August birthdays wait and go later (especially the boys), and our cutoff date is not until October! Several kids in her class were 8 before the school year started, and she is not 8 yet!

 

[Olallamom]

I have the exact same issue. We have homeschooled all along. My DS turned 9 on May 2nd. We also are putting him in school next year, he will go into 3rd. Have you been using 3rd grade math this year and how is he doing? Can he independently write paragraph's? If the answer is yes to both then I would put him in 4th grade. He will do fine, keep working on the reading over the summer.

 

[shelly3girls]

I would consider having him evaluated by an independent source. This will prepare you for what the school may say and may identify any problems. Many schools do a great job in evaluating but some pigeon hole kids with labels.

From what you have said I would say 3rd but that is based on schools in our area. Honestly my DD had those skills by the end of 1st grade (although she was in an accelerated program) but I know that all of her friends have those skills now by the end of public 2nd grade.

If he is small for his age then I would definitely say 3rd. Social issues are very important in a child's development. If I felt my DS was a little behind and small then I would try to give him a little advantage by starting in the lower grade. My DS was born in June. I have no idea what his development will be but I already wonder if I will hold him back like most parents do to summer boys in our area.

 

[DawnM]

He cannot write paragraphs. He can write a very simple paragraph but it has very little description. He can't write what he is really thinking.

We have used Singapore Math and he is 1/2 way through 3rd grade. Math comes easier to him.

Dawn

I have the exact same issue. We have homeschooled all along. My DS turned 9 on May 2nd. We also are putting him in school next year, he will go into 3rd. Have you been using 3rd grade math this year and how is he doing? Can he independently write paragraph's? If the answer is yes to both then I would put him in 4th grade. He will do fine, keep working on the reading over the summer.

 

[momof5boys]

I agree with a PP who said to take him to the school and get him tested. They know what they expect of their students in each grade. Of course you should have the final say but he may test better than you expect. I have 2 DS's that have Aug. Bdays, they started school a couple weeks after they turned 5. The older one is fine(an honor student but one of the youngest and smallest in his class) the younger one has ADHD but tests proficient in reading and advanced in math. My oldest DSS went to live with his mother for 1 1/2 yrs when he was in 4th and 5th grades. He also has ADHD and she didn't stay on top of him. We took him back the summer before 6th grade. Well I had the school test him. In math he was grade level but in reading he was a 3.6 or half way through 3rd grade! Needless to say the school and I agreed that repeating 5th grade would be best. He is also an honor student now but much older than his classmates. A freshman that is old enough to drive! PS don't worry follow Pennsylvanians I haven't let him get his license yet

 

[famofsix]

I agree with getting a school evaluation and diagnostic testing. I have a similiar situation with one of my children who was lost in kindergarten. I have homeschooled one child for 2 years and since we repeated K we felt that it would be good to start next year the grade level below his age. It is considered a retention on his school record but DH and I feel it is the right thing to do along with the school administration. My child also has some Learning issues and ADHD that complicated his learning process so providing an environment where he is challeged but not overwhelmed is important.

There are huge comprehension and reading differences between 3rd and 4th grade. Your child will have to adjust to the school setting so it would be advantageous to find the grade level he can function best at and be challenged.

BTW good going on the homeschooling and I wish you and your family the best as you all go to the new adventure of public education.

 

[DawnM]

Thanks. This will be our test year.

I worked part time up until 2 years ago and then when we moved to NC I quit completely.

I am heading back to work full time in Aug. and am already stressing about this transition!

Dawn

I agree with getting a school evaluation and diagnostic testing. I have a similiar situation with one of my children who was lost in kindergarten. I have homeschooled one child for 2 years and since we repeated K we felt that it would be good to start next year the grade level below his age. It is considered a retention on his school record but DH and I feel it is the right thing to do along with the school administration. My child also has some Learning issues and ADHD that complicated his learning process so providing an environment where he is challeged but not overwhelmed is important.

There are huge comprehension and reading differences between 3rd and 4th grade. Your child will have to adjust to the school setting so it would be advantageous to find the grade level he can function best at and be challenged.

BTW good going on the homeschooling and I wish you and your family the best as you all go to the new adventure of public education.

 

[DawnM]

Ok, I have called the school and will hope to get something set up soon. I think if DH hears it from the school he will be more apt to not get upset about it.

Dawn