What were these teens thinking?!

[jodifla]

Just got back from work....so I am finally responding to this. I personally don't care who was or wasn't drunk...drinking under age is against the law. Living together is illegal in Michigan...wrong law if they are consenting ADULTS...time to change the law. If a judge would actually have the kahunas to put a couple to trial for that "crime" and they got sentanced to jail, then they do the time. There are outdated laws in all the states, that doesn't mean that they are all going to end up in court...that comparison is way off.

I also was around when the drinking age was legally 18, so a lot of high school kids could be drunk at the prom. It was great hearing them all talk about how they puked in the john...they had a good time too. (I did not do the prom, thought they were stupid). Laws are much stricter now then they were back then. Laws for driving intoxicated were more lenient. Things change. I watched 2 people I loved die from alcohol maybe that's why I have such a strong feeling against letting kids do it because "that is what kids do"

How about having well-thought-out laws instead of knee-jerk political ones that basically make every kid a criminal? (And everybody who lives together, too, for that matter...)

And fyi: In many states, you can legally drink at home with your parents.

 

[Alicnwondrln]

There is ONE word for those parents:

ENABLERS

pinnie

so true

 

[christineann]

Apparently the initial punishment given by the judge was a joke to these spoiled children. If there was anything personal going on, it started when these kids initiated their own "vendetta" against the judge.

A prom is a school event, and at most schools that I know of, that would make the behavior of the students subject to the school handbook.

Before my son's prom, the headmaster sent a letter to each parent spelling out what the punishment would be for drinking at or before this school event (the kids had already been informed in an assembly). When Michael and his date arrived, one girl was standing in the lobby throwing up into a trash can, which was being held by a police officer A friend of Michael's said that it looked like a middle school dance........with all the parents arriving to pick up their kids. If a kid appeared to be drunk, the limo was searched, and some limo companies were fined thousands for allowing alcohol in their vehicles with underage kids. The kids were suspended and required to undergo alcohol counseling. I don't know what more the school could have done to get their point across before the dance. By law, the school could be held liable for any damages or injuries caused by a student who had been kicked out of the dance or denied admission because of drinking. It was a smart move, legally and otherwise.

 

[jodifla]

so true

How are the parents enablers exactly?

 

[disney4us2002]

It seems pretty cut and dried to me. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time, lol. Cliche of course, but true.

Jodifla, I'm curious if you have children? In Md the drinking age changed to 21 in 1982 with a cutoff of July 1st. My birthday is in Nov so I missed the cutoff by 5 months. Half of my freshman class in college could legally drink. Did I partake? Of course. Does that mean I'm a hypocrite if I don't want my son to drink illegally? Perhaps it does to you but to me, not. I look back on some of the decisions I made and think "wow, I was really lucky". Now through experience and maturity, I see how incredibly stupid I was and of course I want my son to be safe, above all else. I think it's pretty natural for parents to want more for their kids. I just can't imagine anyone having children, especially teens, and thinking underage drinking is no biggie. For our teen zero tolerance is the only choice.

 

[jodifla]

Apparently the initial punishment given by the judge was a joke to these spoiled children. If there was anything personal going on, it started when these kids initiated their own "vendetta" against the judge.

A prom is a school event, and at most schools that I know of, that would make the behavior of the students subject to the school handbook.

Before my son's prom, the headmaster sent a letter to each parent spelling out what the punishment would be for drinking at or before this school event (the kids had already been informed in an assembly). When Michael and his date arrived, one girl was standing in the lobby throwing up into a trash can, which was being held by a police officer A friend of Michael's said that it looked like a middle school dance........with all the parents arriving to pick up their kids. If a kid appeared to be drunk, the limo was searched, and some limo companies were fined thousands for allowing alcohol in their vehicles with underage kids. The kids were suspended and required to undergo alcohol counseling. I don't know what more the school could have done to get their point across before the dance. By law, the school could be held liable for any damages or injuries caused by a student who had been kicked out of the dance or denied admission because of drinking. It was a smart move, legally and otherwise.

So, the kids weren't ticketed by the cops??

 

[christineann]

An enabler does not hold another accountable for his or her actions. I know a lot of parents who would rather blame the judge, the system, etc. for consequences their children have to face for their choices. I was an enabler because I didn't give my alcoholic husband an ultimatim until the damage to our family was too much to repair.

Several of the kids were ticketed by the cops, and several whose parents were well connected got the tickets dropped. One of those kids is now on house arrest for a drunken binge and burglary he committed to celebrate his 21st birthday.

 

[jodifla]

It seems pretty cut and dried to me. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time, lol. Cliche of course, but true.

Jodifla, I'm curious if you have children? In Md the drinking age changed to 21 in 1982 with a cutoff of July 1st. My birthday is in Nov so I missed the cutoff by 5 months. Half of my freshman class in college could legally drink. Did I partake? Of course. Does that mean I'm a hypocrite if I don't want my son to drink illegally? Perhaps it does to you but to me, not. I look back on some of the decisions I made and think "wow, I was really lucky". Now through experience and maturity, I see how incredibly stupid I was and of course I want my son to be safe, above all else. I think it's pretty natural for parents to want more for their kids. I just can't imagine anyone having children, especially teens, and thinking underage drinking is no biggie. For our teen zero tolerance is the only choice.

Yes, I have a child. And yes, I think saying that it was OK for me to drink at 18 but not for my son is hypocritical.

 

[christineann]

I don't think it's hypocritical at all. When I was 18, it was legal to drink. Now it is not. Big difference!!!

 

[jodifla]

An enabler does not hold another accountable for his or her actions. I know a lot of parents who would rather blame the judge, the system, etc. for consequences their children have to face for their choices. I was an enabler because I didn't give my alcoholic husband an ultimatim until the damage to our family was too much to repair.

Several of the kids were ticketed by the cops, and several whose parents were well connected got the tickets dropped. One of those kids is now on house arrest for a drunken binge and burglary he committed to celebrate his 21st birthday.

There's accountability, and there's overkill that leads kids to think the system is screwed up and not worth following at all.

That's what happened here: Good kids, never in trouble before, getting the death penalty (graduation rites taken away, NHS taken away, sports taken away, court, fees, probation) for having some liquor in a limousine on prom night.

Putting pictures on a web site is stupid, of course. But they're allowed to say whatever they want on a web site, even about a judge.

 

[christineann]

I find it difficult to call what the kids got "the death penalty" . The death penalty is what innocent and (sometimes) the guilty people get when an intoxicated person, who is often young, inexperienced and/or immature, gets behind the wheel of a car or drinks to the point of overdose.

The kids were at a school function and broke a rule that had been all but tattooed onto their foreheads. Had they cheated on an exam or vandalized the school, the same or similar punishment by the school would have been appropriate.

If a young person decides that the whole system is "screwed up and not worth following at all" because they were punished for this, they have more serious problems than underage drinking!

 

[MrsKreamer]

I guess you're talking about me....and I've never sued anyone for anything.

I can see calling the parents,I suppose, in this litigous day and age. I can't see taking their graduation privileges, kicking them out of NHS, jail, etc.

And you don't die from alcohol poisoning with .02 alcohol level. The kids were in the prom eating dinner when they were hauled out by the gestop...I mean school officials.

Only one of them read at that level, all of the others were higher....The only graduation privlege taken away by the school was the NHS ribbon, not being kicked out of the organization. Jail didn't come until after they made a mockery of the legal system...

 

[MrsKreamer]

I haven't read the entire thread as I don't have time- but would like to reply to parts of it, including the original posted article.

Being a 23 year old fresh out of college (with friends still in college), I can totally believe the article and the girls in it. I laughed when I read it actually. I could see people my age (well, a little younger) doing the same thing that these girls did. Well, look- proves that if you put something on the internet it's public domain!

I am not condoning what the girls did- I'm just saying I'm not surprised at all. Not surprised at the drinking before prom or the website. When I had my senior prom, I remember being appauled that there were a few token students who had obviously gotten drunk before prom

But that doesn't mean that we didn't drink after prom. We broke the rules, yes, not to the extent that these girls did, but broke the rules all the same. I think that they were stupid to put up the website and naiive to think no one of authority would find it.

The best post I've read on here was by minkydog:

"Parents, it's the hardest thing you'll ever do, but let your kids take their own falls. It's a life lesson they need to straighten their backbones."

I think the girls made a mistake (well, a few mistakes) and received the proper punishment. They won't do something like this again!! And after re-reading this before posting I realized it may look like I'm condoning the drinking but not the getting caught. I am merely making the point that underage drinking is very common (not right, common) and they obviously didn't learn their lesson the first time, so a second time was called for. It's a good example for those to come and I don't think their punishment was severe. They should have learned the first time the mistake was made!

I guess it comes from my young age, but I'm not shocked at all to read about this.

Being from a town known for it's alcohol consumption, underage drinking is common here too. Heck I was allowed to drink around my mom by 16 or 17. Don't think she wouldn't have thought twice about punishing me for being publically intoxicated on school property. I would have begged them to haul me away that night for fear of my mom.
There is a difference between responsible and irresponsible underage drinking.

 

[MrsKreamer]

There's accountability, and there's overkill that leads kids to think the system is screwed up and not worth following at all.

That's what happened here: Good kids, never in trouble before, getting the death penalty (graduation rites taken away, NHS taken away, sports taken away, court, fees, probation) for having some liquor in a limousine on prom night.

Putting pictures on a web site is stupid, of course. But they're allowed to say whatever they want on a web site, even about a judge.

So I am still wondering what you will do if you get a call from the police saying your son died from alcohol poisioning or a druink driver, or anything else related to alcohol and his involvement. Will you just shrug and say "Well, he was just a kid being a kid..."? I know your response is going to be not my kid or that will never happen, but it could have happened to one of those girls.
What if they had a few sips(as you claim) and then were taken advantage of by their date? Is that still rape? Or is that "boys being boys" or "she should've know better b/c she was drinking"?

 

[jodifla]

So I am still wondering what you will do if you get a call from the police saying your son died from alcohol poisioning or a druink driver, or anything else related to alcohol and his involvement. Will you just shrug and say "Well, he was just a kid being a kid..."? I know your response is going to be not my kid or that will never happen, but it could have happened to one of those girls.
What if they had a few sips(as you claim) and then were taken advantage of by their date? Is that still rape? Or is that "boys being boys" or "she should've know better b/c she was drinking"?

How is this connected? I didn't say kids should drive drunk, and I didn't say they should drink to the point of alcohol poisoning. You drank underage, and those things didn't happen to you, or to me, or to anyone else I know, either, although I know they do happen.

I said the school's reaction was overkill. They should have dealt with the drunk kids, and let the others continue with the prom until they were some sort of behaviour problem, which they never were (not that they were given time to be). I think it drove the girls to even more stupid behavior (the web site)...

I plan to teach DS and responsibile drinking, and that there's a public hysteria out there that will assume guilt first and ask questions later.

 

[christineann]

Yup, the girls were victims of the judicial system, which forced them to indulge in outrageous behavior.

NO WAY it was their fault. It's always someone else's.

 

[declansdad]

. But when I see prom kids getting thrown in jail for things we did on a regular basis, all I can think about is the hypocrisy.

They weren't thrown in jail for drinking at the prom. They were thrown in jail for breaking and disrespecting the terms of the original sentence. That sentence did not stipulate jail time.

 

[MrsKreamer]

How is this connected? I didn't say kids should drive drunk, and I didn't say they should drink to the point of alcohol poisoning. You drank underage, and those things didn't happen to you, or to me, or to anyone else I know, either, although I know they do happen.

I said the school's reaction was overkill. They should have dealt with the drunk kids, and let the others continue with the prom until they were some sort of behaviour problem, which they never were (not that they were given time to be). I think it drove the girls to even more stupid behavior (the web site)...

I plan to teach DS and responsibile drinking, and that there's a public hysteria out there that will assume guilt first and ask questions later.

The connection is that if they were drinking before prom, they propably would have been drinking after prom. One of these girls drinks a little and her date takes advantage, now we have a rape instead of just a little underage drinking. It is not far fetched.

Oh and I never went out in public drinking, nor have I ever showed up on school grounds "staggering" from a few sips. Know why? I had the sense to know I would get caught and have privleges taken away. Since I didn't want to be humiliated in the first place, I chose not to do it.
Wow what a thought! A teen not doing what everyone else was doing!


ETA: They school authorities only assumed guilt b/c the girls were staggering around. They gave them Breath tests....gee it was positive....mass hysteria.

 

[Rock'n Robin]

This hypocrisy thing drives me crazy. So if I drank illegally, or drank and drove,I shouldn't tell my kids not to? So if I had sex with 10 guys in one day, I can't tell my kids not to? If I smoked pot or took acid I can't tell my kids not to?
All of these things are STUPID! MOST people who reach the age of reason (be it 30, 35, 40 or older!) realize that and don't want their kids to make those kinds of mistakes. So they tell them not to do these things and explain the consequences! Sure an explanation about responsible drinking and sex is warranted, but the sure way to make a kid stop listening is to tell them it's OK if they "experiment" because "everybody does it"!
And I wanted to reinforce the point that schools make regulations to keep things in order--if we just slapped on the wrist for every athlete who drank at a party, they'd all be perpetually stoned. And as a previous poster said, "Character" is part of honor society--breaking school and state rules about drinking shows a flaw in the character. It is hard as heck to keep a school from turning into total chaos and these regulations are really necessary at the HS level.
Robin M.

 

[jodifla]

This hypocrisy thing drives me crazy. So if I drank illegally, or drank and drove,I shouldn't tell my kids not to? So if I had sex with 10 guys in one day, I can't tell my kids not to? If I smoked pot or took acid I can't tell my kids not to?
All of these things are STUPID! MOST people who reach the age of reason (be it 30, 35, 40 or older!) realize that and don't want their kids to make those kinds of mistakes. So they tell them not to do these things and explain the consequences! Sure an explanation about responsible drinking and sex is warranted, but the sure way to make a kid stop listening is to tell them it's OK if they "experiment" because "everybody does it"!
And I wanted to reinforce the point that schools make regulations to keep things in order--if we just slapped on the wrist for every athlete who drank at a party, they'd all be perpetually stoned. And as a previous poster said, "Character" is part of honor society--breaking school and state rules about drinking shows a flaw in the character. It is hard as heck to keep a school from turning into total chaos and these regulations are really necessary at the HS level.
Robin M.

From an early age, I thought about what I did. I can honestly say I don't need to tell my son "I did this, but it was stupid, so don't you do it." I did some experimenting, but nothing that got me in any trouble.

From your posts, it sounds as if you work in the school system, and most kids you work with don't think this way.

My school didn't over-react to every little thing, and there wasn't mass chaos that you're describing.