What to do with a Black Sheep?

[Tink-aholic]

I know this may be the wrong forum for this (maybe there should be a forum just for ranting???), but I need some advice.

DH and I bought into DVC in July. We were lucky enough to be able to do it, and it was something we had thought about and discussed for a long time. When we bought, we took advantage of the double Developer points instead of the reduced dollars.

We decided that best way to use our extra points was to book a Grand Gathering and get two 2 BRs at AKV for April Vacation. We invited all of DH's family (for a total of 18 people including two toddlers). We made it clear that we are paying for the rooms only, though we are paying for everything for DH's mom and dad. I send out links to the Undercover Tourist site to get the cheapest tickets and am in negotiations with SouthWest Airlines to get a group rate.

Everyone so far has been very grateful. Well, almost everyone.

As in every family, DH's sister is the family's "black sheep" who has just recently decided to attend with us. We are now getting emails from other family members telling us that they do not want to room with her and she will ruin the vacation. DH and I feel their concerns are valid. We even toyed with the idea of paying for a room at a value resort for her, her husband, and 2 yo daughter.

SIL has no idea that others feel this way about her. We figured she wouldn't be able to afford to go (she can't, but is going anyway) when we invited everyone. We couldn't have invited everyone BUT her, anyway, kwim?

What do we do? What would you do? Any advice is appreciated...even those who flame me for getting into this mess.

 

[tchrrx]

No advice, buy here's a . I'm afraid that I may find myself in a similar situation next year, but on a smaller scale. We've invited the in-laws & then decided to include Sis-in-law, assuming that she won't go b/c of price. Now we're worried that she might. Even though it's a smaller group, it would still have a big impact on our trip.

Maybe you could put them up at a value and just let them know that they didn't have enough rooms available at the DVC b/c she didn't let you know far enough in advance.

Hope things work out for you!

 

[littleteapot]

Could Dh's parents room with them? If her own parents can't stand her, I think maybe you should get the separate room or uninvite her. It sounds like her issues could mess up a wonderful vacation for the rest of the family.

Who would think of flaming you for doing such a nice thing for your family. All of us have "special" family members too

 

[Gillian]

It's nice of you to take everyone. It seems like it would be cruel to not include the sister in the AKV rooms, even if it is because no one likes her. To be over at a value when everyone is at a deluxe resort seems terribly unfair to me. would it be possible to get them a separate studio? Even if you had to rent points? I don't know your financial situation, but if you can do something like that it would make you a hero to everyone.

 

[eliza61]

Personally I would not do any thing. You have given your family a wonderful, special gift. You should not have to be family referee also. WDW is a big place every one does not have to stay join at the hip. Everyone else can split from "Black sheep" for the day. Maybe just meet up for a meal.

After extending such a great invitation don't fee guilty you are not responsible for every one having a good time.
Is she seriously special (thanks little teapot) like verbally abusive, drunk etc or just a pain in the "you know where"?

 

[Tink-aholic]

Thanks to everyone who replied. I agree with everything...but putting things in action is the hard part.

I mentioned the value because SIL said she wanted her own room (she found out she wasn't going to get one of the King rooms and felt she and her family would be too crowded with the rest of us), but she can't afford it.

I admit that it will be a bit cramped, but there will be a bed for each person. We will have two full kitchens, two kitchenettes, and four bathrooms. I have been on cruises in rooms not much larger than a closet and was okay, and this time we are going to have over 2000 sq ft. I figure that we won't be spending that much time in the rooms, anyway.

The problems with SIL is that she should have been born into royalty, in my opinion. Because she doesn't work, she doesn't do housework or take care of her toddler, her disabled mother has to do it all. My MIL just got out of the hospital yesterday from a two-week stay in ICU and all SIL could say was that she was glad to have some time off again from her daughter! She has been married 3 times (her current husband is on his 4th), she just filed bankruptcy and "celebrated" by taking a two-week vacation to North Carolina. She always has phantom ailments and she takes so many prescription drugs that her speech is slurred and she has to sleep all of time.

And she always calls us to ask for money. Her reasoning? We both have good jobs.

Financially, we are paying for everything for DH's parents because they don't have much and really deserve a vacation. I am POSITIVE that SIL thinks that MIL will pay for her...meaning that we are essentially paying for her, too. Ugh.

I guess we COULD afford it, but it would be a stretch for us. Besides that, I would be bitter because she is 33 years old and perfectly CAPABLE of making her own money. Is that awful? I just can't understand feeling so entitled.

I liked tchrrx's idea of suggesting that she didn't get "in" on time (we already have the rooms booked) for the plane tickets. Problem is, if I told her she needs $500 by next week for tickets, she would just skip paying her rent and other bills to pay for it. Tchrrx, take my advice and DON'T invite anyone that you don't want to go!

I am still open to any other ideas, too. Maybe we could all get together and send all of our collective Black Sheep to Disney together! What do you say?

 

[Aliceacc]

Here's what I think I would try:

a) stop feeling guilty. You're doing a wonderful thing. None of us can be all things to all people.

b) Tell her that you HAVE already booked and are afraid to change the reservations. But forward her all the info: prices for the values (along with your suggestions), what airlines and flights you have booked and what's a "good price" and so on. Let her know what your plans are, but let her know that you'll certainly respect her choices if they're different than yours. Fill her in on Magical Express, when to make ADR's, and so on. Also, let her know which things need to be done ASAP, and maybe include a suggested timeline.

c) Plan one or two big family dinners and ask her if she's planning to join the crew.

Ultimately, leave all the decision making in her hands, but be sure she has easy access to all the information. What she chooses to do with the info is up to her.

Good luck, and kudos to you for organizing all this!

 

[Creekermom]

My heart goes out to you as it is a "sticky situation"

I like these to suggestions as the best from what has been posted thus far.

from tchrrx --Maybe you could put them up at a value and just let them know that they didn't have enough rooms available at the DVC b/c she didn't let you know far enough in advance

AND
this one from Aliceacc is the best

from Aliceacc--Here's what I think I would try:

a) stop feeling guilty. You're doing a wonderful thing. None of us can be all things to all people.

b) Tell her that you HAVE already booked and are afraid to change the reservations. But forward her all the info: prices for the values (along with your suggestions), what airlines and flights you have booked and what's a "good price" and so on. Let her know what your plans are, but let her know that you'll certainly respect her choices if they're different than yours. Fill her in on Magical Express, when to make ADR's, and so on. Also, let her know which things need to be done ASAP, and maybe include a suggested timeline.

c) Plan one or two big family dinners and ask her if she's planning to join the crew.

Ultimatley, leave all the decision making in her hands, but be sure she has easy access to all the information. What she chooses to do with the info is up to her.

 

[lisaviolet]

I don't know. How long are you going? Sometimes points or money are worth the outcome. They really are. As I get older I truly believe this.

We had a family of 13 a couple of years ago. I was sad that I didn't have enough points for a SSR GV to do it and we ended up with:

*a SSR two bedroom for one family of five plus hangout for three that were in POR
*POR room for those three b/c they were last and we ran out of points
*SSR studio for M and D
*SSR studio for SIS and N
*OKW one bedroom for us two and hang out for meals of 13

It worked out wonderfully. My gut said, "my parents need to have their own place and not deal with my Sis". I thought am I silly to have four people in two studios. In the end... nope.

There were no black sheeps and some of us were in mourning so all were thankful.

But OP the separation worked wonderfully. So only you know. But I would use points to put them in their own studio or $ for Value (if she truly commits to going). Seems insane because it's not right. It's not right. But to me the well being of all of you....priceless in my opinion. That would be my priority.

Have a wonderful time. That's so nice of you......

Lisa

 

[lisaviolet]

Oh OP my gut said to stay a couple of days after everyone left. And that was a great decision as well. Nice to unwind on our own.

Also, easier said then done but let go of the trip. Ours truly worked best because we just went with everyone's thoughts. Tickets..some bought...some didn't...some bought one days which almost killed me (b/c of $ for them) but I said, "not my business, not my business" over and over in my head. TL....three stayed back..no problem.

 

[Gillian]

lisaviolet, your gut seems quite smart!

 

[my2boyzrock]

I swear you could be writing about MY SIL!! She also should have been born into royalty--nothing is ever good enough for her/she is never happy with what she has & she thinks EVERYTHING is about her.

I like all the suggestions you have received--just go and have fun. You have done enough with the planning and graciously offering your family to come along. You don't have to be with her nor does the rest of your family. That's the good thing about DW--it's big enough that you won't have to be around her at all if you don't want to.

Good luck!

 

[2Kds2K9]

I would also keep in mind that she will probably depend on everyone else to watch her DD so she can have a vacation.

As with most family Black Sheep, we have one that expects that when she visits family, she is "off the clock" and everyone else is to tend to her children.

Just another thought into this whole ordeal.

Enjoy!

 

[eliza61]

I am still open to any other ideas, too. Maybe we could all get together and send all of our collective Black Sheep to Disney together! What do you say?

Problem is, Black sheeps never think they are black sheeps. When I call my sister on her idiotic, irresponsible behaviour she looks at me and say "Who me?" like I'm the one who's crazy!!

 

[Disneylush]

We just got out of our "black sheep" deal and here is how we did it...

first, like you, we already had our plans made. Because I had just made these exact requests, and I have the knowledge base, I volunteered to be nice and do the phone calling for them. Our plane tickets were already bought. I looked them up for the late comers and found they had gone up $100.00 a person. ($317.00 a person) Next we had priority rooms at POP and we told them no more were available. So they could stay at POP but we would not be right next door. I made them aware of the park hopper pass (at full price) Lastly I informed them of all the ADR's I had made thus far and then everything read out like a Master Card commercial....
Plane tickets to WDW....... $317.00 x 3 ....... $951.00
10 day hotel room...... $1000.00
10 day park hopper..... $275.00 x3 .....$825.00
Food $50.00 per person x3, per day x10 ..... $1500.00
Spending 4,300 on a Disney vacation and not being next door... not worth it!!!
We also made it VERY clear that they had to pay for everything on their own and we would not do everything together so that all could enjoy their vacation BUT this was not a free babysitting ticket.

Good luck!!

 

[kimsuenew]

Personally I would not do any thing. You have given your family a wonderful, special gift. You should not have to be family referee also. WDW is a big place every one does not have to stay join at the hip. Everyone else can split from "Black sheep" for the day. Maybe just meet up for a meal.

After extending such a great invitation don't fee guilty you are not responsible for every one having a good time.
Is she seriously special (thanks little teapot) like verbally abusive, drunk etc or just a pain in the "you know where"?

I agree! Just go and enjoy! By the way, the suggstion about your hubby's parents staying with her is a good one! Parents have unconditional love... maybe that love will help soothe the rooming with one another situation!

 

[Janet Hill]

Go and don't let her interfere with your good time. If you do anything to ostracize her and keep her from going, it will probably hurt the parents' feelings. They probably realize what a jerk, she can be, but as they age they just want everybody to get along.

I would "bunk" her family with the parents though.

 

[Tink-aholic]

Again, thanks for the great advice. I think you are right about keeping the parents with the SIL (which means in with us too...but we can handle it).

lisaviolet: I am so glad it worked out for you, but I am sorry you had to be in mourning. Great plan with the separation. I probably didn't plan it very well, and I don't know if I could change the reservations now. We are going for a week and are limited to that because of work and school. Funny that everyone BUT SIL is telling me that they are so happy to be going that they would sleep on the floor if they had to, and she is griping about not getting the King room!

I think that 2Kds2K9 brought up a valid point though -- I am taking MIL for a VACATION (it is a lot of work to run after a 17-month old all day!) and I am sure that SIL will pawn off her daughter on MIL because she is "on vacation". I wish we could set some stipulations on her, but how to enforce such a thing with an adult? Send her home early?

I also had another thought: we are doing two different suites, though they will probably be next to each other. We want to do the Dining Plan, as does the couple who refuses to room with SIL. Maybe that could be the deciding factor, as I am certain that SIL won't do the meal plan. We are probably doing two dinners as a family, and I think that even the buffet at Hollywood and Vine (very reasonable in my opinion) will be stretching her budget. I think I will do the MasterCard commercial idea like Disneylush and show her how much money this will cost. Probably won't make a difference, though. She spends now and worries later, kwim?

DH has tried to gently talk her into going another time when she can afford it. WDW is hard to do on a budget (not impossible, but she has NO IDEA what a budget IS) and is stressful if you are spending money you don't have. After all, we have the DVC now and can take her another time, right? She absolutely refuses because she doesn't want to be left out. Besides, she says she has had a rotten year and deserves it.

Thanks for all the support and advice.

 

[lisaviolet]

Again, thanks for the great advice. I think you are right about keeping the parents with the SIL (which means in with us too...but we can handle it).

lisaviolet: I am so glad it worked out for you, but I am sorry you had to be in mourning. Great plan with the separation. I probably didn't plan it very well, and I don't know if I could change the reservations now. We are going for a week and are limited to that because of work and school. Funny that everyone BUT SIL is telling me that they are so happy to be going that they would sleep on the floor if they had to, and she is griping about not getting the King room!

Have a wonderful time no matter what you decide Tink-aholic. I was just lucky. It just seemed to fall into place. The sister that was in her own studio. Well, I wanted her to go and didn't have any more points. I heard her complain so much about the Value price and that she was asking to put it on my CC b/c hers was full. So I reworked a pending vacation to free up the points for her. That just made it easier. So don't think I was without drama. Thanks for the sweet thoughts as well. It meant a lot to all of us that trip. I was so thankful we had DVC. So thankful.

Make sure, 100%, that you are vacationing as well. You know it's not your job to make sure everyone is a-okay. That's why I was pushing for a couple of extra days for you. But I hear ya...it's not that easy with life.

Lisa

 

[DisNae]

because I would just say "too bad" to everyone's complaints. Including the ones who don't want to room with SIL. They are getting a free room, for crying out loud! And they "refuse" to room with her? Tough! I'd set up the room assignments, and say this is how it is, take it or leave it! Anyone who absolutely couldn't/wouldn't room with her would then book and pay for their own room if it were that big of an issue, and the problem would solve itself. I thought you said they said they were so glad to be going they'd be happy to sleep on the floor.....but they can't sleep in the same 2 BR suite as your SIL?

I say, stop trying to play referee. You have offered to do an incredibly generous thing for your family, and all they can do is complain about it--and that INCLUDES the other members who are whining about SIL going and having to possibly room with her! I think everyone is forgetting how ungrateful those family members are being as well by making those complaints and "refusing" to room with her. It sounds like some of your family members do not want to have to stand up to SIL themselves if they have to room with her, and tell her no, I won't watch your kid, or no, you can't hog the bathroom, or hey, you're being a pain right now, or whatever. So instead they want you to solve the problem for them and deal with her by making sure they don't have to room with her. That's not fair to you, and they are adults and are certainly capable of telling her to back off when she's going over the line.

I wouldn't put her with your parents. You said you wanted your parents to have a vacation. Well, how much of a vacation will they really have if she is there to pawn off her kid on them, beg money from them, etc?

I would decide which room she would most appropriately fit into based on size alone, and then make the "assignment", let everyone know, and be done with it. If they don't like it, they are free to stay in another room at their own expense.

Bottom line, if you continue to try to accommodate everyone, they will all continue to try to take advantage of you and bombard you with their requests and preferences. Set it up and leave it alone, and let the chips fall where they may. You just can't please everyone.