What should be done when people on welfare spend money on vacations?

[barkley]

I wonder if that varies state by state? Where I live, you do have to report gifts and whether or not someone else is helping to pay bills. But for some reason I remember a different poster on the boards whose state didn't make them report trips or gifts. Is my memory failing me?

Anyway, as I said in another post, I do think it's an outrage if someone is doing this. But I also don't believe that as many people are doing it as we're being led to believe on here.

the federal rules for both tanf and food stamps require that a recipient report ANY gifts of cash and certain types of tangible gifts (but allot of items are exempt from consideration-a vacation would be one of these UNLESS-the giftor was providing them real money to pay for any of the items on the trip-if the giftor set up a credit card charge ahead of time with wdw it would'nt have to be reported). they also have to report if anyone else pays for any portion of certain items of need (housing, utilities, food, clothing...), but generaly-unless an entire item of need is paid for there will be no impact on their grant (food stamps uses those items i mentioned in determining the budget-so if an entire item of need is being met it can drasticly reduce the amount of fs received-but if that person pays all but say $1.00 of that bill each month-no impact ). with cash gifts people are permitted uncounted a certain amount every quarter-it used to be $200 per aided person in totality over a 3 month period. it was realy lousy when a parent was honest-and reported that grandma sent $300 to buy a kid a bike and clothes for christmas-and i had to ding them in february (wierd budgeting-i know) for that extra $50. i finaly educated my clients that if grandma wanted to do this-have her send a gift card to target.


btw- for the person that posted about the co-worker with the boyfriend. likely would'nt have made a difference at least tanf wise. an unrelated adult male is not obligated to provide support for his girlfriend or her children that are not his-therefore his income, property or presence in the home may not impact eligibility or receipt of tanf funds what so ever (same if a man has kids and a live in girlfriend). as far as food stamps go-so long as they meet the 'purchase and prepare separatly' criteria-same deal.

 

[punkin]

I'm not assuming anything. I know people who are working the system. They sit around and talk about as if it's normal.

Why don't you report them then? Grousing about it here won't help.

 

[cardaway]

Because of that program, it can't be assumed that a public housing kid had parents who commit fraud, that's all I'm saying with that post.

So in other words, it was yet another attempt to discredit the opinions people are posting by inserting things that have nothing to do with what they posted.

 

[nut4disney]

Does the FAF sponsor family reunions to WDW?

Nope, but a "host" family that sponsors a child for summer definitely can.

Fresh Air only directly funds vacations for children. If the host family wants to do stuff for the parents, the hosts do that of their own free will. (Summer camp, or transportation to a "Friendly Town" to visit a host family, is where their organizational money directly goes.) Lots of kids stay with their host families summer after summer after summer. You can call it caring on the hosts part, you might even call it love. In my own volunteer experience, I've known host families to fund entire educations for the guest children.

Think of it like those child sponsor programs you see on tv all the time, except these children are in the sponsor's own country, and the goal of FAF is specifically to organize vacation.

If so, then that might explain how one of my coworkers (who happens to be married and lives in the projects and no her husband isn't listed on the lease) and her whole extended family(many of them also live in public housing) were able spend 6 nights at WDW this summer.

If so, then that might explain how one of my coworkers (who happens to be married and lives in the projects and no her husband isn't listed on the lease) and her whole extended family(many of them also live in public housing) were able spend 6 nights at WDW this summer.

I used to work with host families in upstate New York. Now, not every host family has Bill Gates' money, but alot of them are extremely well off. Long after kids were too old for Fresh Air their former host families were still taking them for vacation, buying school clothes, school supplies and other things like that. A personal friend of mine (who I've known since I was six years old) wound up adopting a Fresh Air kid she'd had in her Friendly Town. Before he was adopted, he'd already stayed at the Contemporary because he went on an end-of-school trip paid for by the her, the host family, But when he was home he was on Food Stamps with his family of origin.

 

[cardaway]

People like the OP just want to pick and choose what is palatable for THEM to be able to decide who is worthy to spend government money how they see fit.

Let's see you quote somehting of mine that backs that up. Not once have I posted that my opinion is one based on pick and choose. I've posted that if you're getting public assistance, the public gets a say in how that is spent. Period.

 

[6TimeMomma]

Only read up to page 3, but just wanted to point out that SSI for children is actually ALLOWED to be used for recreation purposes of child, which, IMO, would include a Disney vacation.

 

[dcgrumpy]

If the poster in question isn't a scammer why the need to lie about when she bought DVC?

 

[lizardqueen]

To answer the question, nothing should be done. Everybody needs a break sometime.

That being said, it really irks me if people are abusing the system. If you are just too lazy to work and think you can just flit by in life on the welfare system, am I happy that my tax dollars are being used to help make your life easier? No.

 

[disneymom3]

Many of the folks getting assistance find way to increase their income without reporting the extra cash flow. That's hot they afford vacations and other non-essentials. One of the most common ways is to bring in a live in boyfriend (or girlfriend) and continuing to live in low income housing, getting WIC or food stamps, and even welfare checks. All while living better than many people who do not qualify because they actually play by the rules and report all their household income.

Oh yeah. That is the part that gets me. We had a really tough time financially a few years back. I decided I had to swallow my pride and apply for assistance mainly because we had a child who needed medical insurance and our COBRA insurance was $1100. So, I did it. I went in and had the interview etc. It was uncomfortable and I felt crappy doing it. In the end we didn't qualify. Primarily because we had a car that was supposedly an asset though we owed more on it than it was worth but also have to do with DHs presence in the home. I told him at the time that I needed him to move out and take the car with him. I have no idea how someone can own DVC and also get food stamps. I couldn't even get health insurance for my uninsurable kid.

 

[MushyMushy]

Let's see you quote somehting of mine that backs that up. Not once have I posted that my opinion is one based on pick and choose. I've posted that if you're getting public assistance, the public gets a say in how that is spent. Period.

First your vent starts out with "anybody" getting "tax based assistance."

Why should anybody getting tax based assistance not have to put their own money towards the things the assitance is for until they are no longer getting that help?

It's like me getting a second job and not reporting the income to save on taxes. But of course that's illegal. The folks doing it anyway are sure to spend that money on things like vacations that are hard to track and can't be taken away.

And considering SSI is "Federal income supplement program funded by general tax revenues" (taken from the SSI website directly), then how are the following quotes not picking and choosing? Or am I reading "anybody getting tax based assistance" wrong?

I edited my post. I didn't catch your puting SSI until after I hit the button.

Obviously SSI type programs are totally different than the others on your list. It was like one of those 'one of these things is not like the other' games.

 

[cardaway]

To answer the question, nothing should be done. Everybody needs a break sometime.

Not trying to be offensive, but in many cases, a break from what?

If they are not working it's obviously not a "vacation".

Of course there are cases where people are really in a bad spot and having a hard time making ends meet, But In those cases I can't see that spending any large sum of money on a vacation is a good idea or acceptable to those not on assitance. People who can't afford to go themselves because they are paying for those on assistance.

 

[cardaway]

And considering SSI is "Federal income supplement program funded by general tax revenues" (taken from the SSI website directly), then how are the following quotes not picking and choosing? Or am I reading "anybody getting tax based assistance" wrong?

Covered. SS is something they have paid into. If they start receiving more than they paid into it, then my first post applies. The public should get to say how their money is spent.

 

[dogluva]

Poor kids in New York are often taken to Disney by "host" families when the kids are a little older. I know host families that developed deep relationships with their sponsored kids. Someone specifically talked about NYC kids in public housing going on Disney vacations. I was pointing out that there is an aggressive effort on the part of FAF to get poor kids out of the city over the summer vacation.

Because of that program, it can't be assumed that a public housing kid had parents who commit fraud, that's all I'm saying with that post.

We had a Fresh Air child with us for five weeks this summer. Her mother was sad to have her gone so long but she was happy that she would be able to just go outside. Obviously her neighborhood is dangerous.

She was so appreciative of all the little things my kids take for granted like leaving their bikes outside in the driveway, going for a bike ride, swimming, etc. It was nice to see her enjoy things that my kids don't bat an eye at. She experienced so many things for the first time (she turned 14 with us). It was such a wonderful experience (this is our third year with her).

This is a great program and I would recommend it to anyone that wants to help a child get out of the city. The stays are usually one week, ten days or two weeks. She stayed with us longer since it was her third year.

 

[cardaway]

Oh yeah. That is the part that gets me. We had a really tough time financially a few years back. I decided I had to swallow my pride and apply for assistance mainly because we had a child who needed medical insurance and our COBRA insurance was $1100. So, I did it. I went in and had the interview etc. It was uncomfortable and I felt crappy doing it. In the end we didn't qualify. Primarily because we had a car that was supposedly an asset though we owed more on it than it was worth but also have to do with DHs presence in the home. I told him at the time that I needed him to move out and take the car with him. I have no idea how someone can own DVC and also get food stamps. I couldn't even get health insurance for my uninsurable kid.

(bolding mine)

I think you and the person who posted about the lack of shame really hit the nail on the head.

 

[Darcy03231]

While I know there are those that are scamming the system and something needs to be done about them, as others pointed out there are the working poor who receive services. Their tax dollars are also helping to fund the programs they're receiving. If they can manage to take a vacation, good for them! Some of the scrimp and save for years to manage to take a vacation and I don't see anything wrong with it. I also don't see anything wrong with family members paying for or helping to pay for a trip. I did it for my sister's family.

She and her husband are both among our working poor. They both work full time. She has two children from a previous marriage and they have one together. Her ex has disappeared and she hasn't received any child support in years as no one can find him. She and her husband qualify for some federal/state assistance programs and her children receive health insurance through the state. We just got back from two weeks in Orlando. Prior to that the last vacation she took was in 1999. I decided to rent a house and invited her family to stay with me. I had frequent flyer miles and used those for tickets for her whole family (and mine too). We decided on the Orlando 5 park flex pass. The paternal grandparents for her two older children paid for their tickets and for the youngest's. My parents paid for the tickets for her and her husband. We also did Pirates and Princesses and I paid for the tickets for everyone. Since we rented a house we ate almost every meal in, other than those I paid for - she would have had to feed her family at home so groceries were the same. Their only out of pocket expense was for their car rental, parking and gas. To come up with the money for that she literally scrimped and saved for a year. The kids had all their own spending money from birthdays and Christmas (we planned the trip over a year in advance). Neither she nor her husband bought any souvenirs for themselves and the kids were limited to what they had saved. I certainly don't feel like either they or I scammed the system. Everyone needs a break every now and then and if having a family member help out means someone can take a vacation I don't see that a scamming the system.

 

[MushyMushy]

Covered. SS is something they have paid into. If they start receiving more than they paid into it, then my first post applies. The public should get to say how their money is spent.

Maybe I'm thick, but I really don't get where you're coming from on this. Using this logic, anybody who has ever worked and paid taxes, then has to go on welfare for whatever reason has paid into the system. Does that make it okay?

 

[JennyMominRI]

RE the SSDI issue
So you and person x both recieve insurance from your company...You and person X (and others in the company) alll use your health insurance for regular coverage, annual exams etc, an occasional prescription etc etc. This never exceeds what you put in to your insurance premiums...Now person X gets cancer..All of the sudden person X's medical expenses FAR exceed her premiums and hence are paid by the insurance company, which of course gets it's money from everyone that pays into the system...Do you now get to tell person X how their medical insurance can be used and what it should cover? After all, they are now using much more moneywise than they put in, and it's coming out of everyone elses premiums.

 

[cardaway]

Using this logic, anybody who has ever worked and paid taxes, then has to go on welfare for whatever reason has paid into the system. Does that make it okay?

That's not at all what I've psoted. I've been pretty clear IMO and I'm not going to repeat myself anymore.

 

[cardaway]

RE the SSDI issue
So you and person x both recieve insurance from your company...You and person X (and others in the company) alll use your health insurance for regular coverage, annual exams etc, an occasional prescription etc etc. This never exceeds what you put in to your insurance premiums...Now person X gets cancer..All of the sudden person X's medical expenses FAR exceed her premiums and hence are paid by the insurance company, which of course gets it's money from everyone that pays into the system...Do you now get to tell person X how their medical insurance can be used and what it should cover? After all, they are now using much more moneywise than they put in, and it's coming out of everyone elses premiums.

If the money is being used for anything other than medical expenses, then IMO the public should be able to have some say in how it's spent. Again I'll fall back on how it works for those paying for everything out of their own pocket. If you want to claim medical expenses you have to itemize and show where all your money went.

 

[RNMOM]

I can't believe this is still going on.