same here-i get ssd as well as a pension from my former employer. i purchased dvc prior to my strokes and retain it to this day.
What should be done when people on welfare spend money on vacations?
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same here-i get ssd as well as a pension from my former employer. i purchased dvc prior to my strokes and retain it to this day.
Crankyshank
<font color=CC0066>love the happy bunny<br> <fon
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Obviously no one is going to begrudge a child a potential once in a lifetime opportunity. Honestly the situation is apples and oranges imho
nut4disney
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I know all about Brooklyn, I'm a native NYC'er, and have worked/lived/and gone to school there. Family in Bed Stuy and also off Dekalb.
You do know that alot of kids in the neighborhood go on vacation with their Fresh Air Fund sponsor families, right? The FAF is HUGE in your area. Ask your students!! I volunteered with the organization for 10 years. Lots of FAF sponsor families send presents for the kids and their guardians As long as there is no cash exchanged, or the gifts don't exceed a certain amount, there is nothing illegal going on.
And who pays for the flights? You don't really know. As for private school, lots of schools in Brooklyn have finaid programs for poor kids. It doesn't mean the parents are paying tuititon.
And you still don't know who pays for their vacations. Charitiable givers in groups like FAF, their grandmothers, or women in Massachusetts like me.
The majority of my students live in two parent homes. Both parents work. However, when you look at the budget sheet, the mother is a single mom.Her income is low enough for her to qualify for assistance.
I'm sorry, I don't believe you. You said they live in public housing. People in public housing in Brooklyn who lie about the number of adults in the house are evicted. I know because I've worked in housing court. This has been aggressively enforced since Guiliani's law-and-order approach. You should mosey on down to housing court sometime and see for yourself.
i have'nt seen where she's applying for foodstamps-just where she was looking at going into REPORTED work and wondering how many hours she can do that to retain her eligibility (ss is very supportive and encouraging of both ssi and ssd recipients of working-they have an incentive program to encourage it).
in some states ssi recipients can get foodstamps-in some (like california) no way (it depends on how and if the state provides a stipend to supplement the ss benefit). as for ssd recipients-they might be able to qualify if they meet the income and resource criteria for fs-and if someone owned dvc but they owed enough that their equity was valued at less than $2000 (including all their other resources)-they might qualify.
as for debt for vacations-i can't fault the person, plenty of people not on assistance do the same thing. it's their personal choice.
as for the relatives paying-well, um-i generaly only see someone post this when they are 'called' on the fact that they are saying they receive assistance and have the tickers or other posts about all their vacations (my former clients when they got gifts from relatives-generaly got them in the form of food, clothing or gift cards to purchase the same. the only disney connection most of them had was by virtue of the disney outlet where they could buy sweatshirts and tshirts for the kids that had gone unsold in the parks (and were a real value-$2.99 for t's, $4.99 for heavy weight hooded sweats).
ksumn1
DIS Veteran
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I see both sides of the issue. There's the black and white of if you are cheating the system, you should be punished. If you really need assistance, you should be able to get it. But then you have the gray......my Dh's Aunt and Uncle are both on Disability (not sure what type) she has spina bifida along with other health problems she's had since childhood, and he was in a serious car accident in his late 20's that caused some severe memory issues, as well as some damage to the part of the brain that controls your emotions. One minute he's laughing and joking, the next minute he's ready to fight. He has worked a little but because of his emotional issues, he finds it hard to keep a job because he always ends up disrupting the josite with his displays of temper or crying. Both recieve Medicaid and at one point Tanif.
Should they never be allowed to take a vacation to WDW? I think they should be able to. But not have DVC, go twice a year and live it up while I can't afford to go but every 2 years and DH and I both work full time. But then again, if everyone had an aunt or uncle that was in this situation wouldn't they feel the same?
But I also see the other side of the coin. I worked with a girl at a fast food place who had 4 kids, no child support recieved for any of them. The kids were all on Medicaid, she recieved food stamps and Tanif and lived in public housing. Sound real sad, doesn't it? Think again. Her boyfriend who lived with her sold drugs (it wasn't hard to figure out...no job, new car, nice clothes) so she was getting clothes, gifts and groceries from him. She of course told DFACS nothing about him. She drove a brand new Honda Civic, that was in her sister's name. Wore designer clothes, lots of bling, and only worked to "get away form her kids" She made sure that she was only scheduled for a minimum # of hours every week, so it wouldn't affect her eligibility to get her benefits. Took vacations to Miama and Key West "to visit family" at least twice a year. Do I think SHE deserves to take a trip to WDW? H*&& NO!!
I agree with other that it would be hard to find a way to regulate, much less enforce the abuse. I actually called DFACS about the above girl, but every time, she managed to make all evidence of the boyfriend, car, and designer clothes disappear. Later I found out she had a friend who kept all her "good" stuff at her house, so her apartments in the projects would look normal for someone in her situation.
There are people in every economic level of society who will try to work the system. I think the majority of people who get assistance need it. But there are always a few who spoil it for everyone else.
At one time, when I was 20, pregnant with my 1st DD I recieved WIC and Medicare. But I also worked full time flipping burgers, as did my now DH. We both drove beat up old cars, he was also in school and we did have some support from our families. Mainly with housing and lots and lots of baby gifts at the shower. And after I had DD, I stayed on WIC for a year before I was booted because of our income level. So it's not quite as easy as people think to qualify for assistance in the 1st place.
Should they never be allowed to take a vacation to WDW? I think they should be able to. But not have DVC, go twice a year and live it up while I can't afford to go but every 2 years and DH and I both work full time. But then again, if everyone had an aunt or uncle that was in this situation wouldn't they feel the same?
But I also see the other side of the coin. I worked with a girl at a fast food place who had 4 kids, no child support recieved for any of them. The kids were all on Medicaid, she recieved food stamps and Tanif and lived in public housing. Sound real sad, doesn't it? Think again. Her boyfriend who lived with her sold drugs (it wasn't hard to figure out...no job, new car, nice clothes) so she was getting clothes, gifts and groceries from him. She of course told DFACS nothing about him. She drove a brand new Honda Civic, that was in her sister's name. Wore designer clothes, lots of bling, and only worked to "get away form her kids" She made sure that she was only scheduled for a minimum # of hours every week, so it wouldn't affect her eligibility to get her benefits. Took vacations to Miama and Key West "to visit family" at least twice a year. Do I think SHE deserves to take a trip to WDW? H*&& NO!!
I agree with other that it would be hard to find a way to regulate, much less enforce the abuse. I actually called DFACS about the above girl, but every time, she managed to make all evidence of the boyfriend, car, and designer clothes disappear. Later I found out she had a friend who kept all her "good" stuff at her house, so her apartments in the projects would look normal for someone in her situation.
There are people in every economic level of society who will try to work the system. I think the majority of people who get assistance need it. But there are always a few who spoil it for everyone else.
At one time, when I was 20, pregnant with my 1st DD I recieved WIC and Medicare. But I also worked full time flipping burgers, as did my now DH. We both drove beat up old cars, he was also in school and we did have some support from our families. Mainly with housing and lots and lots of baby gifts at the shower. And after I had DD, I stayed on WIC for a year before I was booted because of our income level. So it's not quite as easy as people think to qualify for assistance in the 1st place.
Last time I checked we lived in a free country. People can spend their money anyway they want, whether it is earned or given by the government.
Yes it irritates me when people abuse the system, but then I remember it really isn't any of my business. Would you be more happy living in a country where the government tells you how you can spend your money? Count your blessings for all the freedoms you have.
Yes it irritates me when people abuse the system, but then I remember it really isn't any of my business. Would you be more happy living in a country where the government tells you how you can spend your money? Count your blessings for all the freedoms you have.
Crankyshank
<font color=CC0066>love the happy bunny<br> <fon
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I'm not going to call out the poster by providing the link because I'm not sure where that falls with TOS, but there is a post where she said she applied for foodstamps recently.
I'm also not saying one can't have debt and go on vacation. I'd never go on vacation if that was the case. I do have a problem with someone who willingly took on debt for multiplevacations while on assistance and proceeded to apply for further assistance because of the debt they took on for frivolities. You made your bed - lie in it. Don't expect the taxpayers to pay when you can't scale back the vacations a bit to cover your expenses.
I'm also not saying one can't have debt and go on vacation. I'd never go on vacation if that was the case. I do have a problem with someone who willingly took on debt for multiplevacations while on assistance and proceeded to apply for further assistance because of the debt they took on for frivolities. You made your bed - lie in it. Don't expect the taxpayers to pay when you can't scale back the vacations a bit to cover your expenses.
nut4disney
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NYC, just for the record, is a very generous city. Philosophically we're different when it comes to the poor. We don't sentence poor kids or their parents to destitution. Even if the parents are irresponsible as all flark, it's not the fault of the children.
And this crosses party lines. There's passionately pro-life organizations that will provide free long term housing for women. There are tons of Republican families who participate in Fresh Air Fund. Fresh Air Fund's entire mission is specifically to provide a respite for poor kids, whether it's summer camp, or a sponsor family in New Hampshire.
Republicans in NYC prefer privately funded solutions. The Democrats here push for public programs. Between the two groups, poor kids here DO have adequate clothing, the occassional ipod, a vacation in Maine, doctor's visits, and a hot meal in public school during summer vacation. We're a world-class city with alot of wealth. We aren't a third-world country and our citizens shouldn't be living as such. I'm proud of what the city has done for it's citizens. NYC has always had a belief in a collective responsibility for the public good. Republicans and Democrats here differ on "How to help", not "If help should be given".
And this crosses party lines. There's passionately pro-life organizations that will provide free long term housing for women. There are tons of Republican families who participate in Fresh Air Fund. Fresh Air Fund's entire mission is specifically to provide a respite for poor kids, whether it's summer camp, or a sponsor family in New Hampshire.
Republicans in NYC prefer privately funded solutions. The Democrats here push for public programs. Between the two groups, poor kids here DO have adequate clothing, the occassional ipod, a vacation in Maine, doctor's visits, and a hot meal in public school during summer vacation. We're a world-class city with alot of wealth. We aren't a third-world country and our citizens shouldn't be living as such. I'm proud of what the city has done for it's citizens. NYC has always had a belief in a collective responsibility for the public good. Republicans and Democrats here differ on "How to help", not "If help should be given".
disneyjunkie
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I don't care if you don't believe me.
I know all about Bed-Stuy.
There are plenty of people getting over on the system. They do it because they can. As a matter of fact they sit back and laugh because people like you are more concerned with what the data shows then what's actually going on.
When I question my friends and coworkers about working the system they all say the same thing. "If you're crazy enough to go down there and tell the truth then you don't deserve to get anything."
If housing evicted everyone that lied about their household make up, the projects would be empty
nut4disney
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That's not true and you know it.
And yes, the data is important for both sides of the issue, because otherwise we're all just talking out of our butts, which is a lousy way to make public policy.
We typically have to limit our spending of our welfare money to either the track, casinos, and/or Crown Royal, Budweiser and lots and lots of cigarettes.
The government doesn't pay us enough to go to WDW.
The government doesn't pay us enough to go to WDW.
If someone has accepted aid from a program that requires them to report any additional income/gifts they receive, then they need to abide by those rules to remain eligible.
It's just one of those choices we all have to make. No different than having to show up for work and put in your hours to get your pay. If you don't do it, you don't get paid. If you don't follow the rules of the welfare system, you should not get paid.
If recipients can legally stretch their assistance (welfare) funds to include vacations, good for them. People who take trips from extra income/gifts and are not reporting that income are committing fraud though.
MushyMushy
Marseeya Here!
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I wonder if that varies state by state? Where I live, you do have to report gifts and whether or not someone else is helping to pay bills. But for some reason I remember a different poster on the boards whose state didn't make them report trips or gifts.
Is my memory failing me?Anyway, as I said in another post, I do think it's an outrage if someone is doing this. But I also don't believe that as many people are doing it as we're being led to believe on here.
nut4disney
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Fresh Air Fund has been providing vacations for poor kids in NYC since 1877. It's not considered income for tax purposes.
http://www.freshair.org/
Again, if it's not against the rules the recipients are required to abide by, then it's fine. This is not about trying to screw kids out of Disney vacations. If you are going to accept assistance, you need to follow the rules.
I was a welfare recipient as a child. We also got food stamps and section 8. My mother was single with two kids (from different fathers) and an elderly mother (my grandmother). We were destitute. We had no money for clothes (grandma dumpster dived). Our furniture was from a charity. We had no food in the house that Grandma hadn't cooked completely from scratch.
However, I went to private school (scholarship). I went to summer camp for 3 weeks every year (charity). My sister went on a cross-country trip for teenagers (charity). During all this my mother finished vocational school (free for low income people).
I guess if you were looking from the outside - summer camps, vacations, private school you would consider us cheating the system too.
However, I went to private school (scholarship). I went to summer camp for 3 weeks every year (charity). My sister went on a cross-country trip for teenagers (charity). During all this my mother finished vocational school (free for low income people).
I guess if you were looking from the outside - summer camps, vacations, private school you would consider us cheating the system too.
cardaway
DIS Legend
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From their site:
Since 1877, The Fresh Air Fund an independent not-for-profit agency has provided free summer vacations to more than 1.7 million children from New York Citys toughest neighborhoods.
Obviosuly not the kind of thing anybody was posting about.
nut4disney
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Poor kids in New York are often taken to Disney by "host" families when the kids are a little older. I know host families that developed deep relationships with their sponsored kids. Someone specifically talked about NYC kids in public housing going on Disney vacations. I was pointing out that there is an aggressive effort on the part of FAF to get poor kids out of the city over the summer vacation.
Because of that program, it can't be assumed that a public housing kid had parents who commit fraud, that's all I'm saying with that post.
kribit
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disneyjunkie
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I'm not assuming anything. I know people who are working the system. They sit around and talk about as if it's normal.
Does the FAF sponsor family reunions to WDW?
If so, then that might explain how one of my coworkers (who happens to be married and lives in the projects and no her husband isn't listed on the lease) and her whole extended family(many of them also live in public housing) were able spend 6 nights at WDW this summer.
Maybe the TA they used to book their grand gathering has a contact at FAF.
Please understand, I don't have a problem with helping those who truly need help. I'm glad that there are programs in place to them.
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