What is a snowflake?

[wtccheermom]

[/QUOTE=Magpie;40252279]Hey, I like this suggestion! No more hiding behind "cutesy" words. Let's just cut straight to the chase and say what we really mean.

I think I like "spoiled brat" better because there have always been "spoiled brats". Every generation has them. Snowflake (because it's newer) only ever seems to apply to the current generation of children and their parents.

.

Snowflake seems to be one of those terms that is really only said behind one's back....you know, one of those terms that no one really has the courage to say unless the accused is not around. It is said in safe groups and in safe distances...let face it, it is an insult, and if one actually used the term to describe a child directly to a parent, one had better be ready to pull back her hair and kick off her heals because the conversation might get ugly from there......

[/QUOTE]

I guess in some circles physical violence would be OK to defend your little snowflake!!! Snowflake moms are usually pretty out there to begin with so I guess in their delusional world fighting is an appropriate response to someone who insulted your snowflake. I however think it is ridiculous and would never lower myself to such a trashy level even if someone did call my child a snowflake which they are not but I love them anyway!!

 

[laurie31]

Inquiring minds want to know - what's wrong with having a cell phone in your uniform pocket?

IS it against policy? Or are the new grads the only ones who aren't allowed to carry them?

About the butterfly... that's mostly true. Except we raised a lot of butterflies when my kids were small and every now and again one of them would end up with a bit of chrysalis glued to its body. Not every single one emerges perfectly without incident. When that happened, we'd carefully peel the remaining bit off.

Even butterflies need help, sometimes.

The cell phone thing - it's against policy NOW...for everyone.

It's not just having it in your pocket that's the real problem, it's the fact that if it's in there, they are going to *take it out* and text or talk on it. If they had left their phones in there "for emergencies" then no one would have been the wiser. It's all the talking and texting that was the problem. Imagine: Your loved one is in the ICU and the nurse stops adjusting the IVs to answer a text. Or the nurse is chatting on her phone at the bedside of someone in isolation. NOT professional and NOT safe. And in the latter instance, WAY GROSS. Yes, these things and way worse were going on.

And yes, helping is good. Carefully peeling off is helping (or to extend the analogy, parenting). It's not the same as doing it for them completely.

 

[Momvic5]

I guess in some circles physical violence would be OK to defend your little snowflake!!! Snowflake moms are usually pretty out there to begin with so I guess in their delusional world fighting is an appropriate response to someone who insulted your snowflake. I however think it is ridiculous and would never lower myself to such a trashy level even if someone did call my child a snowflake which they are not but I love them anyway!![/QUOTE]

Who said anything about physical violence?! I said the CONVERSATION might get ugly. Geez!

 

[Magpie]

This is awesome!

I think one of the things that bothers me the most about the DIS version of snowflake-itis, is the tendency to think that parents belong squarely in one box or the other. The reality is that there are a lot of parents (like me! ) who are a little bit of one and a little bit of the other.

I'm sure that there are people here who think I'm a snowflake parent because:

1) I didn't let my kid sleep with a pillow during naptime at school until he was four and his teacher had to pull me aside and tell me they called it Sudden INFANT Death Syndrome and not Sudden PRESCHOOLER Death Syndrome for a reason.

I'd read that my baby had to be able to sit up before I could put her in a backpack. Unfortunately she was one of those kids that goes straight from rolling to crawling without ever bothering to actually learn to sit. She was walking before it occurred to me that her neck and back were probably strong enough to put her safely in the backpack!

2) If I work late, serve dinner late, help with homework late, then I usually let my kid sleep past the bus and drive him to school in the a.m.

3) My kid knows that I will pick him up anytime he calls, no questions asked, even if it's 2 a.m. from a sleepover at a house where I totally trust the family.

4) I'm still on the fence about allowing my 11 year old to play football next fall because I'm scared of concussions.

5) I go over every paper he writes with him before he turns it in and we do a final edit together.

My son's therapist actually told me I HAVE to do this with him! Meanwhile my son has actually taken to trying to sneak them past me, so he can turn them in unedited. How messed up is that?

Oh, and I'm secretly grateful that neither of my children has ever had any interest in team sports.

Things I do where I feel like people on the DIS want to call CPS on me because:

1) I've let my 9 year old spend hours on his snowboard in the terrain park with no adult supervision whatsoever.

2) My 12 year old will ride public transportation on his own to and from camp and the swimming pool starting this summer.

3) My 11 year old walks to the bookstore, the computer store, and other neighborhood places after school with a cell phone in his pocket.

4) I let my kid plan our last Disney/Universal vacation almost completely on his own. The only thing I did was provide the credit card numbers, and give him a budget. Yes, he made some interesting choices. But we had fun anyway.

That is SO cool! I wish you'd been my mom!

5) I wouldn't have hesitated to leave my 8 year old alone in a hotel room while I went for a swim 10 feet away. I might have done so even at a Value resort, and even without a baby monitor.

So, what kind of parent am I? What kind of kid do I have?

You make a really good point - the blanket labeling bothers me, too. I mean, it's kind of a mushy retro-Seventies feel good thing, but it actually makes a difference to me when someone says, "She's acting like a snowflake," versus saying, "She IS a snowflake."

 

[Magpie]

The cell phone thing - it's against policy NOW...for everyone.

It's not just having it in your pocket that's the real problem, it's the fact that if it's in there, they are going to *take it out* and text or talk on it. If they had left their phones in there "for emergencies" then no one would have been the wiser. It's all the talking and texting that was the problem. Imagine: Your loved one is in the ICU and the nurse stops adjusting the IVs to answer a text. Or the nurse is chatting on her phone at the bedside of someone in isolation. NOT professional and NOT safe. And in the latter instance, WAY GROSS. Yes, these things and way worse were going on.

And yes, helping is good. Carefully peeling off is helping (or to extend the analogy, parenting). It's not the same as doing it for them completely.

Oh... I can definitely see how that's a problem! Nurses definitely shouldn't be chatting while they're working.

 

[wtccheermom]

I guess in some circles physical violence would be OK to defend your little snowflake!!! Snowflake moms are usually pretty out there to begin with so I guess in their delusional world fighting is an appropriate response to someone who insulted your snowflake. I however think it is ridiculous and would never lower myself to such a trashy level even if someone did call my child a snowflake which they are not but I love them anyway!!

Who said anything about physical violence?! I said the CONVERSATION might get ugly. Geez![/QUOTE]

parent, one had better be ready to pull back her hair and kick off her heals because the conversation might get ugly from there......

Well if that is not a reference to physical violence than I don’t know what is!

 

[ccgirl]

The cell phone thing - it's against policy NOW...for everyone.

It's not just having it in your pocket that's the real problem, it's the fact that if it's in there, they are going to *take it out* and text or talk on it. If they had left their phones in there "for emergencies" then no one would have been the wiser. It's all the talking and texting that was the problem. Imagine: Your loved one is in the ICU and the nurse stops adjusting the IVs to answer a text. Or the nurse is chatting on her phone at the bedside of someone in isolation. NOT professional and NOT safe. And in the latter instance, WAY GROSS. Yes, these things and way worse were going on.

And yes, helping is good. Carefully peeling off is helping (or to extend the analogy, parenting). It's not the same as doing it for them completely.

And isn't it sad they had to actually create a policy for this. I think common sense should have prevailed. These are educated, professional women. You would think that they can figure out talking/texting while they should be caring for their patients is inappropriate. You know what....if one of them got in trouble for this I bet one of them would have a parent that came in and said, "it's not in the policy."

 

[Missy1961]

And isn't it sad they had to actually create a policy for this. I think common sense should have prevailed. These are educated, professional women. You would think that they can figure out talking/texting while they should be caring for their patients is inappropriate. You know what....if one of them got in trouble for this I bet one of them would have a parent that came in and said, "it's not in the policy."

Nurses can be professional men, too.

 

[Momvic5]

Who said anything about physical violence?! I said the CONVERSATION might get ugly. Geez!

Well if that is not a reference to physical violence than I don’t know what is![/QUOTE]

I am sorry you took it so literal. It is merely an expression that my mom used to say to me .....meaning you had better be ready to take responsibility for insulting comments. All I meant was that if you refer to a child as a snowflake directly to his/her parent, you should probably be prepared for a reply that is on the defense.

 

[NotUrsula]

Personally, I don't have a problem with any of the terms.

But....how about just using spoiled brat???? Is that any less "derogatory?"

Hey..I say....if the shoe fits.

The thing is, IME, they are not so much spoiled as sheltered. Very often they are really sweet kids, but the ugly part is that they are also often very helpless and timid. It''s LEARNED helplessness that their parents go to great lengths to justify as wisdom, which is what makes it really heinous in my mind. It's a nasty thing to do to clip your child's wings just because you can.

The parents of these particular children are drunk on power and the idea of power, and they don't want to concede any of it, even the power that they only *imagine* that they have. (Like the power to successfully protect a child from molestation just by keeping him away from strangers.)

 

[ccgirl]

Nurses can be professional men, too.

Very true. I apologize. Thanks for catching that.

 

[wtccheermom]

Well if that is not a reference to physical violence than I don’t know what is!

I am sorry you took it so literal. It is merely an expression that my mom used to say to me .....meaning you had better be ready to take responsibility for insulting comments. All I meant was that if you refer to a child as a snowflake directly to his/her parent, you should probably be prepared for a reply that is on the defense.[/QUOTE]

No problem maybe I am just a little high strung today!!!

 

[mamacatnv]

The thing is, IME, they are not so much spoiled as sheltered. Very often they are really sweet kids, but the ugly part is that they are also often very helpless and timid. It''s LEARNED helplessness that their parents go to great lengths to justify as wisdom, which is what makes it really heinous in my mind. It's a nasty thing to do to clip your child's wings just because you can.

The parents of these particular children are drunk on power and the idea of power, and they don't want to concede any of it, even the power that they only *imagine* that they have. (Like the power to successfully protect a child from molestation just by keeping him away from strangers.)

Excellent post

 

[Conservative Hippie]

The thing is, IME, they are not so much spoiled as sheltered. Very often they are really sweet kids, but the ugly part is that they are also often very helpless and timid. It''s LEARNED helplessness that their parents go to great lengths to justify as wisdom, which is what makes it really heinous in my mind. It's a nasty thing to do to clip your child's wings just because you can.

The parents of these particular children are drunk on power and the idea of power, and they don't want to concede any of it, even the power that they only *imagine* that they have. (Like the power to successfully protect a child from molestation just by keeping him away from strangers.)

I agree, good post.

My child may act like a spoiled brat at times, but she is NOT a snowflake! Brattiness has consequences in my house.

There is a quote that goes something like "Parenthood is the one profession that, if you do your job right, you are no longer needed."

 

[Ceila]

Spoiled brats and snowflakes are different, IMO.

And to those who think brat is OK but not snowflake, why? You say that you think "name-calling" is wrong, so how is using spoiled brat any different? It just seems quite hypocritical to me.

 

[EclecticWAHM]

Personally, I don't have a problem with any of the terms.

But....how about just using spoiled brat???? Is that any less "derogatory?"

Hey..I say....if the shoe fits.

Agreed.

 

[kaytieeldr]

One of the most annoying and overused words on the DIS.

Along with helicopter - they both give me a They are both words beloved by a group of DISers who have taken it upon themselves to prove that most children are much too fragile, and parents are much too overprotective.

I'll disagree that both terms are widely used elsewhere. I read a million periodicals, journals and articles, and never heard the terms until I saw them being used on here. I did a search, and could not find those terms 'widely' used at all. Did find mention of them in a few parenting or psychology articles, but not that exact wording. Asked my teaching colleagues, and checked many of my Spec. Ed readings, and nothing there either.

Tiger

Hardly most. If "most" children were in any category, even in one small group's opinion, they'd be the majority and being - in this case - snowflakes would be the popular, good status.

It's not. Children are labeled snowflakes because, while no two people are alike, some children are considered so unique and in need of protection, even coddling, by their parents that they're treated as delicate and fragile individual snowflakes that might melt away if someone looks at them wrong.

As for widely used, I don't know any teachers. I've heard the terms used on conservative talk radio often.

 

[indimom]

I think one of the things that bothers me the most about the DIS version of snowflake-itis, is the tendency to think that parents belong squarely in one box or the other. The reality is that there are a lot of parents (like me! ) who are a little bit of one and a little bit of the other.

I'm sure that there are people here who think I'm a snowflake parent because:

1) I didn't let my kid sleep with a pillow during naptime at school until he was four and his teacher had to pull me aside and tell me they called it Sudden INFANT Death Syndrome and not Sudden PRESCHOOLER Death Syndrome for a reason.

2) If I work late, serve dinner late, help with homework late, then I usually let my kid sleep past the bus and drive him to school in the a.m..

3) My kid knows that I will pick him up anytime he calls, no questions asked, even if it's 2 a.m. from a sleepover at a house where I totally trust the family.

4) I'm still on the fence about allowing my 11 year old to play football next fall because I'm scared of concussions.

5) I go over every paper he writes with him before he turns it in and we do a final edit together.

Things I do where I feel like people on the DIS want to call CPS on me because:

1) I've let my 9 year old spend hours on his snowboard in the terrain park with no adult supervision whatsoever.

2) My 12 year old will ride public transportation on his own to and from camp and the swimming pool starting this summer.

3) My 11 year old walks to the bookstore, the computer store, and other neighborhood places after school with a cell phone in his pocket.

4) I let my kid plan our last Disney/Universal vacation almost completely on his own. The only thing I did was provide the credit card numbers, and give him a budget. Yes, he made some interesting choices. But we had fun anyway.

5) I wouldn't have hesitated to leave my 8 year old alone in a hotel room while I went for a swim 10 feet away. I might have done so even at a Value resort, and even without a baby monitor.

So, what kind of parent am I? What kind of kid do I have?

Okay, the pillow story made me giggle. I love that one!

But, I think this post says it all. How many of us could fall into either category (helicopter or free range parent) at any single moment of our lives. I know that my family has fit into both from time to time.

My extremes would probably range from tying my 13yo DD's shoes on Tuesday (I could try to justify this, but what's the point? ) to allowing my kids to ride crappy Walmart bikes on a narrow and difficult mountain-biking trail unsupervised without helmets at 8 and 10. (We had the broken nose to prove it. Doh! )

Either one of those instances would put me clearly into the helicopter or the free range parenting camp but I don't fully belong in either one.

At this point, my children are surviving both my babying and my neglect. That's about all I can hope for.

 

[MamaJessie]

But, I think this post says it all. How many of us could fall into either category (helicopter or free range parent) at any single moment of our lives. I know that my family has fit into both from time to time. Either one of those instances would put me clearly into the helicopter or the free range parenting camp but I don't fully belong in either one.

I think I do some things that can sometimes be labeled as babying and most things "free range" (never heard that before and I love it) but the beauty is in the balance. The helicopter parent lacks that balance.

 

[bellebud]

I think I do some things that can sometimes be labeled as babying and most things "free range" (never heard that before and I love it) but the beauty is in the balance. The helicopter parent lacks that balance.

I remember first hearing the term "free range" parenting when a mom in NYC was allowing her young child to ride the subway alone (if I'm mistaken, someone correct me, but I think that was the scenario)... She thought nothing of it, some people were outraged at the young age of her child. I wonder if she even coined the term "free range parenting", or the media maybe did at that time.

I always laugh at the terms because I get an instant mental image of miniature parents w/ helicopter blades whirling over their kids everywhere they go, then I get the image of parents grazing in a field (like a bunch of cows), munching on grass and oblivious to anything their kids are up to, just slowly munching away and mooing.

I, like other pp's, feel dh and I fall into both categories. I sometimes call us "stealthy helicopters" though... like when we were on a cruise, my kids on one of the last days wanted to try the kids club... now, I had already first-hand witnessed a Kids Club employee losing a 3yo kid in the buffet diningroom... I didn't agree w/ the club also having a ship-wide scavenger hunt for the 9yo group (they went out in small groups of kids - all strangers to each other - and no supervision) to find stuff all around the ship. No, my kids were not allowed to do that one. So dh and I allowed our kids to do the club, but we stationed ourselves in comfy lounge chairs outside the club on the deck. Then when ds7's group was going down to the promenade to perform a little show, we secretly followed them from the kids club to the diningroom, watched the show w/ all the other parents, then secretly followed them back up. After seeing the "full attention" of the Kids Club employee losing that 3yo, I just wasn't comfortable. But I've always been that way w/ people watching my kids. I've been on too many field trips when we used to go to school, kids getting lost on the field trip because the teacher or parents assigned to that kid just pays attention to their own kid, etc. I always went on the field trips.

Now, I can be a mooing free ranger too... my ds9 plays x-box live, and swears his head off, so does dd11 (but she doesn't swear as much). They know it's "x-box talk". I could give a rats rear-end about that. They've had a couple of issues happen too from the x-box live thing - some perv told my ds a web address of a gay porno site - ds looked for a second (thank goodness the first page wasn't horrible), but he was horrified and came to me right away. The funny thing was (to me as an adult), the men on the cover page all had beards for some reason and were just standing in a semi-sideways row (so you couldn't see any private parts, but they were all naked), but I guess because of the beards, ds said "it's a bunch of naked HOBO's!!) I LOLed privately at that one.

DD got sent (I didn't know you could send pics on x-box) a pic of a boys private parts (he obviously took the pic himself from the angle). She came right to me. She said "I know what it looks like, I have a brother" (the kids are still very open w/ nudity around our house), so that's not what upset her. She was just very mad at her "friend" to be so rude and inappropriate (her words). She unfriended him and we reported him. But such is life in these modern days of technology. They both learned valuable life lessons those 2 days.

My one friend is horrified I allow the kids on x-box live, and these things happened (and that I allow them to curse on there). Another friend doesn't agree w/ ds9 having a 4-wheeler (he's had one since about 6yo). Other parents don't agree w/ ds having a bb gun when he was little, and now dh taking him to a shooting range w/ air rifles (or whatever they use). All safe, under the supervision of my dh all the time, but some parents are strictly against guns, and that's their right. I'd rather my ds learn from my dh all the proper safety issues and know how to shoot (we're not hunters though), AND how to safely ride a 4-wheeler.

Everyone makes their own decisions, and I think 99% of our kids are going to turn out fine, regardless of what we all disagree on as parents.