What gets me most is the hypocrites on this board

[ttintagel]

IMO....For most kids,-(and adults), the C and D rides just aren't very appealing...no matter how short the lines. Of course, few have seen 150 minute waits for a ride on a "Level 2" crowd day before...(Soarin' today at 2:00...according to UTs wait times...)...OR all FPs gone by mid morning on same "Level 2 day" for the big ticket rides. I have talked to a few folks who were in the parks over the past few days and they've said the crowds were big...but not "Christmas" big. Who's "getting" these FPs?

I dunno. If the only line for the E-ticket was 120 minutes, no chance of any kind of FP, and people were saying all kind of great things about the D-ticket, and there were CM's and promotional materials right there saying great things about the D-ticket, I have a tough time believing that my family and I are the only weirdos who would say, "Sc*** 120 minutes, let's go ride this other thing and come back to the E-ticket later" like we did back in the '80's.

And we didn't miss out on the E-tickets back then; we actually did come back later and find died-down lines. I have a personal rule of never waiting more than 20-30 minutes for an attraction, and it's never let me down. FP figures into it now, but it worked just as well in the pre-FP days.

 

[KatieCharlotte]

Thanks.



I realize they have perks now.

My question was more directed to the people who think everyone should be treated "equally". I'm asking, if you think everyone should be equal and not receive perks, then what incentive would Disney have to entice people to stay on site?

I like perks that add to the experience of onsite guests rather than take away from the experience of offsite guests.

If I go to Disney with just my girls someday, we will stay onsite for atmosphere, dining, and transportation ease, regardless whether we would also get a FP+ advantage. We now stay offsite in a condo only because it gives us enough space for our entire family without booking two rooms or an expensive suite. We have stayed onsite when our family was smaller.

 

[*disgal*]

And some times that is the best solution.
I have to tell you d, one of the biggest con jobs is that Disney is the only place on the planet where families can have a "magical" time.
I realized that the world no longer was my "go to"place when I noticed we ate offsite more than we did on.
The food is lousy. Add that with other issues and we recognized that for us, it's no longer the same.
And you know what, we are discovering a whole bunch of places where we have just as much fun. We're going on our first cruise in May and I'm more exited about that than I've been for Disney in quite awhile.
Now we go for 3 or 4 day weekend and that's enough.
Disney has changed, for me the changes have not been good so I'm ok with moving on.

Ya know, we started doing this a few years ago after the prices of the tickets just got to be outrageous. We will be going on our 3rd cruise next year.

Now, we still go every spring to Orlando because being northerners we want some sun and warmth. And we stay offsite(oh horrors!!) in 2/3 bedroom places that are beautiful and cheap!! (yes, even compared with a value resort) But now we only go to WDW one or two days of the week and really get to enjoy the resort the rest of the week. It almost feels like, dare I say it? VACATION!! Last year we only went to one disney park and then spent a day over at IOA to see Harry Potter world. (again, horrors!!)

Of course, we've been to WDW about 15 times so I understand those who would like that opportunity also. It's getting harder and harder. And I know not everyone likes to cruise, but let me tell ya....I have never been on such luxurious vacations as my cruises!! Club level at WL didn't even compare.

If this FP system, when it's all worked out, is something my family doesn't like, we'll start taking beach vacations again. WDW is great. We've had some awesome memories. But it doesn't own the market on great vacations.

 

[*disgal*]

And, quite honestly, time will certainly tell whether FP+ is as fantastic as these testers believe it to be. This is a program that seemingly ALL hotel guests will be able to partake in prior to their arrival. I imagine that currently not ALL hotel guests utilize FP-. Whether that be because of naivety or something else, it's simply not happening. Now, you're going to offer this perk to all hotel guests...and I can't help but think this is going to change the game quite a bit. That's tens of thousands (and more likely six figures) of pre-planned FP+'s...and I can guarantee you that the majority of these guests won't be wasting their FP+'s on the American Idol Experience. This makes it near impossible to NOT plan things far in advance, let alone making it more difficult for even a regular hotel guest to get the coveted FP+'s they want.

That! Right there! That is what I am thinking too. Should be interesting to see how it plays out.

We aren't planning on staying onsite until my son graduates in 2018 when hopefully we will stay at BLT. So we will have a few trips until then that are offsite to see how this FP system affects us.

 

[ethanwa]

Here is my take on this thread:

CHANGE IN LIFE HAPPENS. DEAL WITH IT.

The OP says he's been going to Disney for 30 years.... did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime? That Disney wasn't going to adjust to new technology and find ways to improve experiences for some people?

When a change happens to a large group (like in this case), you can NEVER make everyone 100% happy with the change. It's impossible. Disney had to make a very hard choice here... leave things the way they are? Or try and make improvements for a majority of guests after listening to YEARS of feedback? If Disney didn't roll out FastPass+, we'd still have all sorts of other complaints about the old system and why Disney isn't using new technology and still using paper tickets and running at Rope Drop to Toy Story Mania and blah blah blah.

For people who aren't 30 year veterans, who don't know how it all works, this system may actually make their planning easier for the overwhelming trip that Disney is. And they want to cater to NEW customers.... after all, they already have your business! I'm not a Disney apologist. I am a realist. Change sucks... you can either whine and complain, or just deal with it and give Disney your feedback. Eventually maybe they'll work out the kinks for you.

FastPass+ isn't perfect. Nothing is. But it's also brand new and has a lot of growth and kinks to go through. Give it a chance.

Ethan

 

[Bullseye]

Here is my take on this thread:

CHANGE IN LIFE HAPPENS. DEAL WITH IT.

The OP says he's been going to Disney for 30 years.... did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime? That Disney wasn't going to adjust to new technology and find ways to improve experiences for some people?

When a change happens to a large group (like in this case), you can NEVER make everyone 100% happy with the change. It's impossible. Disney had to make a very hard choice here... leave things the way they are? Or try and make improvements for a majority of guests after listening to YEARS of feedback? If Disney didn't roll out FastPass+, we'd still have all sorts of other complaints about the old system and why Disney isn't using new technology and still using paper tickets and running at Rope Drop to Toy Story Mania and blah blah blah.

For people who aren't 30 year veterans, who don't know how it all works, this system may actually make their planning easier for the overwhelming trip that Disney is. And they want to cater to NEW customers.... after all, they already have your business! I'm not a Disney apologist. I am a realist. Change sucks... you can either whine and complain, or just deal with it and give Disney your feedback. Eventually maybe they'll work out the kinks for you.

FastPass+ isn't perfect. Nothing is. But it's also brand new and has a lot of growth and kinks to go through. Give it a chance.

Ethan

Good Post! This has kind of been my takeaway from all of these MB/FP+ threads. It's exhausting reading all the complaints. Once it smooths out and is in regular use, it will be fine. No it won't be the same and it might not be what everyone prefers, but it is the way of the future so just deal with it...or don't by going somewhere else.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Here is my take on this thread:

CHANGE IN LIFE HAPPENS. DEAL WITH IT.

The OP says he's been going to Disney for 30 years.... did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime? That Disney wasn't going to adjust to new technology and find ways to improve experiences for some people?

As you pointed out, the OP has been going to WDW for 30 years. Pretty sure that means the OP has seen WDW go through a ton of large changes over the last 3 decades. It's a bit ridiculous to then tell that same person "did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime" - because, obviously, it hasn't.

As I said in another thread...for myself, I have absolutely no issue with change. I have nothing against the concept of pre-booking FP+s, or RFID technology. My concerns are related to the fact that Disney's IT dept has a really crappy track record. Their websites are consistently slow to load and cumbersome to navigate. The Wifi in the parks has been consistently unreliable. The backbone of Disney's IT is the cornerstone for this entire $1 Billion dollar project. I don't have confidence that they can actually make the system function as it is supposed to - and that is based on years of evidence of their IT dept lacking in execution.

 

[skriegerjr]

Don't worry about the people who are ranting about "double dipping" as they've termed it, they don't understand beta testing and their opinion never mattered anyway. Just let them scream at the walls and chew on their leather straps.

Scream at the walls and chew on their leather straps...I LOVE IT! That sounds like certain people on this thread for sure!

 

[crazyventures]

I think the one thing great about WDW is that there is so much to do. If I stay off-site and don't get to go on as many rides? I'll manage my expectations, plan ahead, and deal with it . . . probably by going to get a beer.

That being said, I stayed off-site for New Years last year and still managed to do all the big rides I wanted to do except for Test Track. I still had a good time, even though the parks were filled to the max and there were long waits for everything.

I do expect that the MB/FP+ problems will eventually calm down once the program is fully rolled out. That's not really a consolation for all the (off-site AND on-site) people there now or planning trips within the next few months, though.

 

[Postal68]

Right, that's fine, but then why should Disney treat you equally?

Ummm, maybe because the offsite guest is spending the SAME EXACT AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR THEIR PARK ADMISSION as the on site guest???

It is an udder abomination that Disney is screwing a huge percentile of their park guests with this new FP+. If you want to reward people for staying on your property, that's fine. But do it in a way that doesn't penalize guests that are paying the same price for the same ticket.

 

[JRawkSteady]

Here is my take on this thread:

CHANGE IN LIFE HAPPENS. DEAL WITH IT.

The OP says he's been going to Disney for 30 years.... did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime? That Disney wasn't going to adjust to new technology and find ways to improve experiences for some people?

When a change happens to a large group (like in this case), you can NEVER make everyone 100% happy with the change. It's impossible. Disney had to make a very hard choice here... leave things the way they are? Or try and make improvements for a majority of guests after listening to YEARS of feedback? If Disney didn't roll out FastPass+, we'd still have all sorts of other complaints about the old system and why Disney isn't using new technology and still using paper tickets and running at Rope Drop to Toy Story Mania and blah blah blah.

For people who aren't 30 year veterans, who don't know how it all works, this system may actually make their planning easier for the overwhelming trip that Disney is. And they want to cater to NEW customers.... after all, they already have your business! I'm not a Disney apologist. I am a realist. Change sucks... you can either whine and complain, or just deal with it and give Disney your feedback. Eventually maybe they'll work out the kinks for you.

FastPass+ isn't perfect. Nothing is. But it's also brand new and has a lot of growth and kinks to go through. Give it a chance.

Ethan

This is a great post, but I will have to disagree with on thing... the above bolded statement. I do not think it makes planning easier for non-vets visitors for these three reasons:

1) If they have never been to WDW, then they wouldn't know what to book ahead of time. It's not until they have actually arrived that they will find out what they like and want to take advantage of the Fastpass for those attractions. Otherwise, it's all just hearsay and shots in the dark...thereforee making a way more stressful situation.

2) Disney prides themselves on trying to sell parkhopper passes. But with the FP+ only being in one park per day, it makes no sense for a newer guest to want to purchase the parkhopper option. And if they do purchase the parkhopper option, they will soon find out that they aren't using them becaus ethey have to hit all their FP+ locations in the same park!

3) While change is great, there was nothing wrong with the old system. It was easy to explain and was 100% guest friendly. The new system, however, is a nightmare....why? Because it has so many flaws that you really have to work at to get around...When I tried to explain FP+ to my best friend (who is a HUGE WDW fanatic, but hasn't gone in three years), he could not wrap his head around the concept. Not because he is computer illiterate,
but because it is difficult to explain unless you've been physically hands-on with the system. It was never like that with FP-

My 3 cents...

 

[skriegerjr]

Ummm, maybe because the offsite guest is spending the SAME EXACT AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR THEIR PARK ADMISSION as the on site guest???

It is an udder abomination that Disney is screwing a huge percentile of their park guests with this new FP+. If you want to reward people for staying on your property, that's fine. But do it in a way that doesn't penalize guests that are paying the same price for the same ticket.

Offsite guests, however, are not spending the SAME EXACT AMOUNT OF MONEY with Disney as on Onsite Guest is. Disney is capturing a significant amount more money from guests who stay onsite, both in hotel revenue, but then also consider, if guests are flying, like we are, and using DME, then we are "captive" for the entirety of our stay, unless we choose to take a taxi off property. So during our time there, we're more likely than someone staying off-site, to spend more money on food, souveniers, etc.

So your view is that someone who is spending significantly less with Disney than an Onsite Guest should have the same benefits because they spend the same amount on tickets?

 

[diskev]

My concerns are related to the fact that Disney's IT dept has a really crappy track record. Their websites are consistently slow to load and cumbersome to navigate. The Wifi in the parks has been consistently unreliable. The backbone of Disney's IT is the cornerstone for this entire $1 Billion dollar project. I don't have confidence that they can actually make the system function as it is supposed to - and that is based on years of evidence of their IT dept lacking in execution.

As somebody who has worked with (but not for) "Disney IT" I can assure you with 100% confidence that the groups you've noted (Websites, In-Park WIFI) are COMPLETELY separate. Not only that, but the group that creates Web Content is totally separate from the group that handles the backend infrastructure to support those websites.

Does that mean that the individual groups work well? Not at all. However, you cannot take something like slow websites and use that as reasoning to assume other parts of the "Disney Electronic Infrastructure" will fail.

 

[skriegerjr]

udder abomination

Is that different than an utter abomination?

 

[DRDISNEYMD]

Here is my take on this thread:

CHANGE IN LIFE HAPPENS. DEAL WITH IT.

The OP says he's been going to Disney for 30 years.... did you really think it was going to stay the same in your entire lifetime? That Disney wasn't going to adjust to new technology and find ways to improve experiences for some people?

When a change happens to a large group (like in this case), you can NEVER make everyone 100% happy with the change. It's impossible. Disney had to make a very hard choice here... leave things the way they are? Or try and make improvements for a majority of guests after listening to YEARS of feedback? If Disney didn't roll out FastPass+, we'd still have all sorts of other complaints about the old system and why Disney isn't using new technology and still using paper tickets and running at Rope Drop to Toy Story Mania and blah blah blah.

For people who aren't 30 year veterans, who don't know how it all works, this system may actually make their planning easier for the overwhelming trip that Disney is. And they want to cater to NEW customers.... after all, they already have your business! I'm not a Disney apologist. I am a realist. Change sucks... you can either whine and complain, or just deal with it and give Disney your feedback. Eventually maybe they'll work out the kinks for you.

FastPass+ isn't perfect. Nothing is. But it's also brand new and has a lot of growth and kinks to go through. Give it a chance.

Ethan

~Hmmm.... this fabulous post needs a visual demonstration. Chop Chop & never give up!

 

[WDSearcher]

This is a great post, but I will have to disagree with on thing... the above bolded statement. I do not think it makes planning easier for non-vets visitors for these three reasons:

1) If they have never been to WDW, then they wouldn't know what to book ahead of time. It's not until they have actually arrived that they will find out what they like and want to take advantage of the Fastpass for those attractions. Otherwise, it's all just hearsay and shots in the dark...thereforee making a way more stressful situation.

This is true if you're assuming that no first-time WDW visitor ever thinks to do any research, that none of them ever picks up a guidebook, that they never ask anyone for hints, that they've never seen a planning video, and that they have never heard of anything in the parks. In pre-internet days I could see this maybe possibly happening. But in this day and age, it's highly unlikely that someone will step into the "booking" phase without knowing ANYTHING. And if they do walk into it with no knowledge at all, then they're not likely to just book rides and shows willy-nilly without at least reading the descriptions or looking at a photo.

Even so ... with the "old" system, the same was true. If someone had never been to WDW before, and they had no idea how popular a ride like TSM was, they could easily show up at DHS at 2pm thinking, "Hey ... let's get a FP for that Toy Story ride", only to discover that they were all gone. So it's exactly the same thing -- they didn't know that the ride they wanted to ride was so darn popular. Even though they're in the park and know what they want a FP for, there are none available. FP- doesn't fix that.

2) Disney prides themselves on trying to sell parkhopper passes. But with the FP+ only being in one park per day, it makes no sense for a newer guest to want to purchase the parkhopper option. And if they do purchase the parkhopper option, they will soon find out that they aren't using them becaus ethey have to hit all their FP+ locations in the same park!

Well, FP+ as it's being tested now is only one park per day. But since we don't know what the final system will be, it's hard to say that this will be an issue. But honestly -- this seems perfect for newer guests. I mean, lots of people here on the DIS consistently recommend that newbies go to one park per day because it will be easier, less overwhelming, and less stressful than trying to get your money's worth out of a hopper pass on a first trip.

On the flip side ... if I'm a new visitor and I can only do FPs at one park, it could also make it easier to park hop, since once my three for the day are used up, I don't have to worry about trying to hop over to another park for a while and then make it back in time for a FP I pulled in the morning that has a return time of 6pm. I can finish in my "FP Park" and then head over to something else without having to watch the clock or try and figure out how long it will take to get from DHS back to Epcot so I can ride Soarin'.

3) While change is great, there was nothing wrong with the old system. It was easy to explain and was 100% guest friendly. The new system, however, is a nightmare....why? Because it has so many flaws that you really have to work at to get around...When I tried to explain FP+ to my best friend (who is a HUGE WDW fanatic, but hasn't gone in three years), he could not wrap his head around the concept. Not because he is computer illiterate, but because it is difficult to explain unless you've been physically hands-on with the system. It was never like that with FP-

But it's NOT a nightmare. Not to everyone. Many people have reported being perfectly happy with the system and having no issues.

And while it has flaws, it's also not in its final form -- something people keep forgetting. And really ... I think FP+ is extremely easy to explain: "You can reserve FPs for rides in advance so that you don't have to pull them in the park day-of. It's like making a dining reservation instead of hoping for a walk-up." Poof. Done. Sure there are all sorts of permutations and options and such, but if you're just trying to explain the system, that's really all it is. I think people get so involved in trying to explain every little thing that they over-do it and get lost in the process. It's like trying to explain tickets. Tickets are incredibly complicated and a total nightmare for lots of people. It's really difficult to explain unless you've been physically hands-on with the system. Yet ... newbies manage.

FP- is confusing too, if you've never been to Disney or if you're used to other parks. How many people have we all heard say, "I'm not doing that FastPass thing because I can't afford it" and then won't believe us when we say it doesn't cost anything? How many of us have been incredulous because we meet people in the parks who are confused about FP and don't even know it exists? How many times has someone posted about people in the stand-by line giving them dirty looks because they were using a FP? Clearly, not everyone understands FP as it is. It's not like the whole theme park world "gets" FP- while FP+ is unintelligible.

 

[wisblue]

It was easy to explain and was 100% guest friendly.

I disagree with this.

I don't think it's that easy to explain that you could get a fastpass at some attractions, but not others, and once you get one you can't get another one until the earlier of (1) 2 hours from the time you got your current pass, or (2) the beginning of the return time of your current pass. Keep in mind, however, that the number of fastpasses is limited so, for popular attractions, especially at busy times of the year, you'd better get one early or you may not get one at all.

I could easily argue that it is easier for someone, in the comfort of their home, to make reservations for the couple of attractions they REALLY want to do at each park than it is to figure out the fastpass system on the fly while you're in the park.

The paper system was easy for the people who learned how it worked and developed their park strategies to take maximum advantage of it. But I don't think it was that easy for the occasional visitor who doesn't do a lot of planning in advance.

It seems to me that a lot of the people who are complaining the most are people who are most familiar with WDW and how it operates and are upset that this will force them to change their approaches. But, I am confident that, once the dust settles, these same people will make the adjustments and will still be able to take advantage of them.

I really think we need to separate the complaints about the CONCEPT of FP+ from the complaints and concerns about problems with the transition to the new system. There are legitimate reasons for people to have differing opinions about the merits of either system, but the fact that a transition from one to the other is going to have a few rough spots is not IMHO one of them.

 

[Cyrano]

Moving to TP Community as this thread does not assist with Trip Planning

 

[Postal68]

Offsite guests, however, are not spending the SAME EXACT AMOUNT OF MONEY with Disney as on Onsite Guest is. Disney is capturing a significant amount more money from guests who stay onsite, both in hotel revenue, but then also consider, if guests are flying, like we are, and using DME, then we are "captive" for the entirety of our stay, unless we choose to take a taxi off property. So during our time there, we're more likely than someone staying off-site, to spend more money on food, souveniers, etc.

So your view is that someone who is spending significantly less with Disney than an Onsite Guest should have the same benefits because they spend the same amount on tickets?

They are not spending less in the Park and for the Park ticket.

Give on site guests benefits of stuff like extra Magic hours, or maybe even discounted Park tickets. They are spending more money than the non resort guests, but they aren't spending anymore in relation to the Parks. In fact you can say that Disney Resort guests are spending LESS in relation to Park visits because they aren't paying for Parking in most cases.

 

[Fantaluminishes]

Not going to read through 27 pages of stuff to say this:
I love everything about FP+ and Magic Bands. Together, they made my September trip one of the best WDW trips I've ever had. I only double-dipped when I was park-hopping. But I could easily do without that. Yes, I was there during a slower season, but when you have EMH and FP+, it's quite easy to make the system work. Don't use FP+ for EMH, and save those attractions for the more crowded times of the day.

I enjoyed having the FP+ option for parades and fireworks. The viewing locations were pretty good, and not having to wait in a long line for Fantasmic, or camp-out on main street for a parade spot is a huge plus.

The Magic Band is best thing Disney has come-up with since the "E" ticket. Who wouldn't want to have their room key, park tickets, charging privilages and fastpasses all linked to a single band that you wear on your wrist?

Only a paranoid, conspiracy theorist. That's who.