What Does The Majority Think re: Prices

[DisneyDad2015]

Obviously some on this board are "upset" and "outraged" that Disney has increased ticket prices. Some have vowed not to return to WDW. Many have stated they won't be going back as often.

However, let's be honest with ourselves for a moment. We (here on this board) are a minority...a very small minority. What we say/do has very little impact to Disney. Should that offend you? Not really. Any successful business is going to focus on the majority, not the minority.

So let's talk about this majority. What will they think about this price increase? Do they or will they even know about it? Will it keep them from crowding the parks at historic rates?

I say no. What say you?

 

[tentaguasu]

First, why I’m fine with it.

If this price increase is what tipped you from “Disney is reasonable” to “This is outrageous” then you’re doing a lot better economically than I am. “This is outrageous” came and went for me years ago.

I’m not saying it doesn’t matter. Of course it does. I’m not saying that it won’t price some people (maybe even me) out, because it will.

What I’m saying is this: Disney has (at least for the last couple of decades) never been a financially rational choice. Disney is stupid expensive.

“But Disney should be something every middle class American family can do!”

Let me ask you a question – why only the middle class? Are you going to be the one to tell the poor kids “sorry, I didn’t mean you.”

And for those of you who say Disney used to be a middle class thing, you must have lived in a different middle class than I did. It’s always (in my lifetime) been expensive. My mom promised she’d take me before I turned 10. I got there at 12 (no toddler wonder experience for me) with 1 day in MK and 1 day in Epcot, and didn’t get to go back until I was in my late 30s. (And I was thrilled both times!)

Is it more exclusive now than it was 30 years ago? Sure.

But then again 30 years ago, huge enormous swaths of the American (let alone the world) population couldn’t afford it either.

The line changes, but there is always a line between “can” and “can’t.” I know, because I’m on the wrong side of it all the time. I love NFL football. LOVE IT. I haven’t gone to a live game in more than 20 years because I just can’t bear the ticket prices.

Life is full of velvet ropes. And if you didn’t notice the velvet rope at Disney 30 years ago, it’s because you were on the right side of it, not because it wasn’t there.

Heck, my upcoming trip is the first time I’ll ever stay on property because I could never afford it – and it will be at Pop Century on a huge discount in a standard room. I can’t even fathom staying at Animal Kingdom Lodge, even though I’ve dreamed of it since the day it opened. Some of you go there once a year. For me, it’s a “maybe, just maybe before I die” type thing. Even the “moderate” resorts are way outside my league. “Moderate?!” Our definition of moderate must be very different.

I pack food because I can’t afford to Disney food all the time. I get reservations to experience restaurants, but only buy appetizers because I can’t afford a full meal.

I don’t like it, but I get it. There are some things I’m priced out of, at least for now. (I’m gonna get rich one day, just like every other American, right?!) Such is life.

That just comes with the territory. Always has, always will.

But can’t it be different!? Let’s do a little thought experiment…

So you hate that Disney is pricing people out. So let’s do this. Imagine if it wasn’t like this. How about these options instead.

The “We’re Sorry” pricing plan. Disney comes out tomorrow with the following announcement: “We’re sorry everyone. We’ve priced Disney outside the reach of too many people, so as of tomorrow here’s our new pricing package - $35 for a one day pass to MK, and $25 for the other parks.” Can you imagine the headlines in a few months? “Disney Guests Irate! Wait times for Country Bear Jamboree hit 3 hours!” “Disney announces the suspension of Star Wars land – We just can’t afford it, but we won’t price people out of a Disney vacation, so we’ll make do with what we have.”

The “Bernie Sanders” pricing plan. In reaction to pressure from the public, Disney CEO has moved to free tickets, subsidized by tax dollars. “A Disney vacation is an American birthright, and everyone should have access, regardless of their income.” Since the parks cannot handle the number of people who want to come for free, Disney is now implementing a waiting list. To make sure every American family has a chance to live their Disney dreams, no family can ‘double dip’ by coming more than once a decade. “Make sure you get that one trip while your kid is still under 20!” says Iger.

Just to be clear, I’m not saying either of these is wrong. They are perfectly reasonable options that Disney could implement instead of what they’ve done. But I’m guessing we’d be just as upset – probably more. Most of us are, at heart, free marketers. Of course we want it to be cheap, but we also want the opportunity to earn our way there and go when we can afford to.

Tentaguasu’s (that’s me) dream golden ticket scenario: Once a year, Disney has a crazy luxury week. Tickets are $1000 per person, hotel rooms are double price, food is amazing with celebrity chefs, wait times are 5 minutes on everything, limo rides everywhere, 24 hours at every park. A really luxury escape, red carpet to the hilt. Call it “Disney’s Week of Luxury.” And this is what the CEO would announce. “This is a chance for our wealthiest guests to have a true 5-star experience at Disney from top to bottom, true rock star treatment. But we’re not earning a red cent on it. Disney has made kids dream of magical worlds the world over – rich kids, poor kids, and 80 year old kids. We’re a for-profit company, but we understand that we are the stewards of something special that everyone should at least be able to dream of visiting. So we’re taking the earnings from the 50,000 people who come for the Week of Luxury each year, and using that to host a “Dream Week” where we randomly give away full, all-expense paid trips to Disney World for 50,000 families across the entire world that could never afford to come on their own. It’s our way of keeping the Disney dream alive for everyone.”

So that’s never going to happen, but I’m still OK with the price increases.

BUT… here are my demands:

But I’m not giving Disney a full pass. Because just like they are demanding more money from me, I have some demands for them.

Be decent. I can’t stomach fat cat compensation packages while bottom of the line workers get their hours cut and are struggling. Not magical. At all.

Here’s the deal Disney executive team. As soon as Disney workers are giving interviews saying this: “I just love working at Disney. They care about us as workers. They take care of us to the best of the company’s ability and we’re paid above average for anyone else in this industry with benefits that keep me and my family safe and secure. That’s why my smile to visitors every day is genuine and why I have the hope and energy to make their day bright, too!” That day, when I hear that, I promise that you can triple your compensation package, and I won’t say a word. Not a word.

And if the company can’t afford it, then this is what I want to hear: “We’re cutting staff hours because, unfortunately, we’re in a financial pickle. But belt tightening starts with management, so as CEO I’m taking a voluntary 50% compensation cut which will only increase at the same rate as my staffs’ compensation, and I’m enforcing at 25% pay cut for every position at Disney making over $500,000 a year.”

Be fair. I’m a good ole American free market guy. But free markets work when both sides are happy.

Once you accept that we can’t all have everything, then it becomes a question of value for money paid. I remember paying $3.25 for a hotel room in Peru. The next morning both my mom and I agreed that we’d been thoroughly overcharged.

Point being, if you’re gonna soak me for a high ticket price you better deliver. “We mismanaged the expansion of DHS, so just keep on paying an increased price and give us another half a decade to fix it.” That’s not going to cut it. You want to increase my price? I’d be better be f’ing amazed at what I get in return. You get an amazing amount of money from me, I get an amazing experience and we’re both thrilled.

If I’m going to skimp and save and dream of going to Disney, I damned well better have an amazing experience when I get there. A good old American capitalist trade of money for services at its finest.

And just to be clear, I’m not on the “Disney is getting worse every day” bandwagon. Maybe it is, I don’t know. I haven’t noticed it. Maybe for some of you who go very frequently, it’s just like the beautiful person you see every day whose flaws you start to notice out of sheer familiarity. Or maybe it is getting worse. But, I don’t see the decline.

But here’s the thing – I’m on alert now. Don’t disappoint me. Spoil me with the awesome stuff, just like I’m spoiling you with may payments.

Be smart. There are all kinds of things that can go wrong when you increase prices. If you price out too many people, then who grows up on Disney? Who is your market of tomorrow? I can’t understand things like why it takes Disney 10 years or whatever to build Avatar when Universal seems able to do it in a flash. I wonder if they impulsively threw money at China just because China seemed like the next big thing (like we all thought of Japan in the 80s and look what happened there…) only to see the Chinese economy tank. I worry about them continuing to make stellar attractions instead of fair ground junk. I worry about how a cast member is going to give me a wonderful smile and a magical day if they’re worried about their hours this month. Take my money, take your profit, but keep Disney strong. Don’t let it whither and die through mismanagement.

Be smart – keep Disney strong.

Be decent – I want to know you care about me and your staff.

Be fair – soak me to the bone, and then make me smile and say, “I’ll be damned, that was worth it!”

 

[DVCcurious]

Higher prices = fewer people = shorter lines = I get to experience more rides = better value

I wish they'd triple the prices and get 2/3s of the people out of there. 60 minute lines for Pirates and Haunted Mansion in the afternoon is ridiculous!

 

[lovewdwfun]

The surge pricing for one-day tickets doesn't bother me at all - as a shareholder, I am in favor of it. We are always complaining about the crowds being too much, so it makes sense to raise pricing. The one-day tickets are typically people who don't stay on site or plan in advance. Since there are so many people crowding the parks, I think it makes sense for Disney to focus on people who stay for longer trips and stay on-site, not the folks who stay offsite, spending a day at Sea World, a day at Universal, and a day at Disney.

 

[ShirikiUtundu]

Higher prices = fewer people = shorter lines = I get to experience more rides = better value

I wish they'd triple the prices and get 2/3s of the people out of there. 60 minute lines for Pirates and Haunted Mansion in the afternoon is ridiculous!

I agree to an extent. At this point however Disney would need to do more than just shorten ride lines to for me to have the kind of vacation I like to have for that price. They are getting dangerously close to that line where people are paying luxury pricing for a trailer park experience.

I was laughing so hard reading the boards yesterday at people who decided to "show Disney" by purchasing their tickets, some of them years in advance, to get ahead of today's price increase. Disney is definitely laughing all the way to the bank.

 

[CounselorX]

If it eventually hits multi-day tickets on non-peak times, then I will not like it. Until then, it doesn't affect us, since the only thing we do is 1 to 2 week trips in September, the lowest crowd time of the year.

 

[pork]

I doubt the standard once in a lifetime visitor will notice at all. To be fair they won't notice most of the things that send this board into a uproar.

 

[porschegrl]

And for those of you who say Disney used to be a middle class thing, you must have lived in a different middle class than I did.

+1

 

[amg35]

Most won't notice.

Disney has always been expensive and not a fiscally responsible way to spend your money. Every one isn't entitled to a Disney trip at birth, life isn't fair and not everyone will be able to go every year, every two years or even at all. Disney should not be held to some kind of crazy standard that they need to make it affordable to everyone who wants to go. Do we hold every vacation destination to that standard? Nope.

I will save money for these trips when I feel like I want to go. One day may come where I can't justify spending the money, so I'll just go somewhere else. That's life.

 

[runwad]

The majority won't be phased in the least because they are oblivious to it.

 

[Alesia]

I will never understand people ranting and raving about things they have no control over. In the grand scheme of things, a very expensive vacation destination becoming a little more expensive is just not that big of a deal.

There are thousands of places in the world that I would love to go to, but many of them just aren't in my budget. I don't get angry that I can't afford to go Paris or Morocco, or China - I just find somewhere else that does fit into my budget.

 

[jrt1176]

Death, Taxes and yearly WDW price increases...?

 

[Polydweller]

Death, Taxes and yearly WDW price increases...?

And yearly Universal price increases which happened a couple of weeks ago.

Every time there is a price increase the end of the world threads start and every year people keep going in apparently increasing numbers. So, the question has been answered many times that the majority will keep going.

 

[NH Disneyfan]

Just imagine if the local grocery store or Target published their price increases......you probably pay more on increases there then WDW vacations. One thing everyone can do is buy WDW tickets in bulk now, save yourself from the annual increases. Guaranteed investment if you want to get 5-10% gain on your dollar.

 

[meeko987]

As my wife and I are both educators and our kids are in school, the reality is that we need to go during busy seasons. Although we have developed great strategies for avoiding lines, the crowds at the parks do have some effect on our enjoyment. In lieu of price increases to mitigate the problems of large crowds, I could wish the following:

(1) that other families will simply lose interest and stop going to Disney World (unlikely).
(2) that Disney will significantly increase capacity with new lands or new parks (it's happening a bit here and there, but too slowly to make any difference for us between now and the time my kids have their own families).
(3) that some other huge amusement resort opens up in the country, drawing visitors away from Florida (nothing on the horizon there).

Sadly, it seems that the only way for Disney to reduce the crowds during busy times is to price many families out of going at those times. It happens elsewhere. My family will never go to the Super Bowl. So many families want to go (and the capacity is limited) that the NFL can price 99.9% of families out of going. If we take Disney at its word -- that they are trying to better the experience for people that go during peak season -- then I don't see any other effective way at the moment.....

 

[DebbieB]

I've become immune to it. Like everything else, prices go up and you have to make choices. I just saw someone on Facebook post that they are being extorted because they can't take it away from their children. I didn't go on many vacations as a child, just some car vacations to Washington DC and Niagara Falls. I didn't fly on a plane until I was 19 years old and it was a business trip. My first trip to Disney was in 1994 and I paid for it myself. I seemed to grow up all right.

 

[jrt1176]

Honestly, I'm surprised they increase it every year... But, people keep going...

I don't make a yearly trip. When I was a kid we probably went every other year with a few back to back yearly trips I imagine.

I took my niece when she was 6 and for her 10th birthday for a week each time. We'll probably take some other vacations and throw in a shorter WDW trip somewhere along the way. I figure that she has been there for two weeks and done about everything, so we can go for shorter trips and just hit what we want. Maybe combine WDW with Universal/Sea World or a beach trip?

 

[mummabear]

First, why I’m fine with it.

If this price increase is what tipped you from “Disney is reasonable” to “This is outrageous” then you’re doing a lot better economically than I am. “This is outrageous” came and went for me years ago.

I’m not saying it doesn’t matter. Of course it does. I’m not saying that it won’t price some people (maybe even me) out, because it will.

What I’m saying is this: Disney has (at least for the last couple of decades) never been a financially rational choice. Disney is stupid expensive.

“But Disney should be something every middle class American family can do!”

Let me ask you a question – why only the middle class? Are you going to be the one to tell the poor kids “sorry, I didn’t mean you.”

And for those of you who say Disney used to be a middle class thing, you must have lived in a different middle class than I did. It’s always (in my lifetime) been expensive. My mom promised she’d take me before I turned 10. I got there at 12 (no toddler wonder experience for me) with 1 day in MK and 1 day in Epcot, and didn’t get to go back until I was in my late 30s. (And I was thrilled both times!)

Is it more exclusive now than it was 30 years ago? Sure.

But then again 30 years ago, huge enormous swaths of the American (let alone the world) population couldn’t afford it either.

The line changes, but there is always a line between “can” and “can’t.” I know, because I’m on the wrong side of it all the time. I love NFL football. LOVE IT. I haven’t gone to a live game in more than 20 years because I just can’t bear the ticket prices.

Life is full of velvet ropes. And if you didn’t notice the velvet rope at Disney 30 years ago, it’s because you were on the right side of it, not because it wasn’t there.

Heck, my upcoming trip is the first time I’ll ever stay on property because I could never afford it – and it will be at Pop Century on a huge discount in a standard room. I can’t even fathom staying at Animal Kingdom Lodge, even though I’ve dreamed of it since the day it opened. Some of you go there once a year. For me, it’s a “maybe, just maybe before I die” type thing. Even the “moderate” resorts are way outside my league. “Moderate?!” Our definition of moderate must be very different.

I pack food because I can’t afford to Disney food all the time. I get reservations to experience restaurants, but only buy appetizers because I can’t afford a full meal.

I don’t like it, but I get it. There are some things I’m priced out of, at least for now. (I’m gonna get rich one day, just like every other American, right?!) Such is life.

That just comes with the territory. Always has, always will.

But can’t it be different!? Let’s do a little thought experiment…

So you hate that Disney is pricing people out. So let’s do this. Imagine if it wasn’t like this. How about these options instead.

The “We’re Sorry” pricing plan. Disney comes out tomorrow with the following announcement: “We’re sorry everyone. We’ve priced Disney outside the reach of too many people, so as of tomorrow here’s our new pricing package - $35 for a one day pass to MK, and $25 for the other parks.” Can you imagine the headlines in a few months? “Disney Guests Irate! Wait times for Country Bear Jamboree hit 3 hours!” “Disney announces the suspension of Star Wars land – We just can’t afford it, but we won’t price people out of a Disney vacation, so we’ll make do with what we have.”

The “Bernie Sanders” pricing plan. In reaction to pressure from the public, Disney CEO has moved to free tickets, subsidized by tax dollars. “A Disney vacation is an American birthright, and everyone should have access, regardless of their income.” Since the parks cannot handle the number of people who want to come for free, Disney is now implementing a waiting list. To make sure every American family has a chance to live their Disney dreams, no family can ‘double dip’ by coming more than once a decade. “Make sure you get that one trip while your kid is still under 20!” says Iger.

Just to be clear, I’m not saying either of these is wrong. They are perfectly reasonable options that Disney could implement instead of what they’ve done. But I’m guessing we’d be just as upset – probably more. Most of us are, at heart, free marketers. Of course we want it to be cheap, but we also want the opportunity to earn our way there and go when we can afford to.

Tentaguasu’s (that’s me) dream golden ticket scenario: Once a year, Disney has a crazy luxury week. Tickets are $1000 per person, hotel rooms are double price, food is amazing with celebrity chefs, wait times are 5 minutes on everything, limo rides everywhere, 24 hours at every park. A really luxury escape, red carpet to the hilt. Call it “Disney’s Week of Luxury.” And this is what the CEO would announce. “This is a chance for our wealthiest guests to have a true 5-star experience at Disney from top to bottom, true rock star treatment. But we’re not earning a red cent on it. Disney has made kids dream of magical worlds the world over – rich kids, poor kids, and 80 year old kids. We’re a for-profit company, but we understand that we are the stewards of something special that everyone should at least be able to dream of visiting. So we’re taking the earnings from the 50,000 people who come for the Week of Luxury each year, and using that to host a “Dream Week” where we randomly give away full, all-expense paid trips to Disney World for 50,000 families across the entire world that could never afford to come on their own. It’s our way of keeping the Disney dream alive for everyone.”

So that’s never going to happen, but I’m still OK with the price increases.

BUT… here are my demands:

But I’m not giving Disney a full pass. Because just like they are demanding more money from me, I have some demands for them.

Be decent. I can’t stomach fat cat compensation packages while bottom of the line workers get their hours cut and are struggling. Not magical. At all.

Here’s the deal Disney executive team. As soon as Disney workers are giving interviews saying this: “I just love working at Disney. They care about us as workers. They take care of us to the best of the company’s ability and we’re paid above average for anyone else in this industry with benefits that keep me and my family safe and secure. That’s why my smile to visitors every day is genuine and why I have the hope and energy to make their day bright, too!” That day, when I hear that, I promise that you can triple your compensation package, and I won’t say a word. Not a word.

And if the company can’t afford it, then this is what I want to hear: “We’re cutting staff hours because, unfortunately, we’re in a financial pickle. But belt tightening starts with management, so as CEO I’m taking a voluntary 50% compensation cut which will only increase at the same rate as my staffs’ compensation, and I’m enforcing at 25% pay cut for every position at Disney making over $500,000 a year.”

Be fair. I’m a good ole American free market guy. But free markets work when both sides are happy.

Once you accept that we can’t all have everything, then it becomes a question of value for money paid. I remember paying $3.25 for a hotel room in Peru. The next morning both my mom and I agreed that we’d been thoroughly overcharged.

Point being, if you’re gonna soak me for a high ticket price you better deliver. “We mismanaged the expansion of DHS, so just keep on paying an increased price and give us another half a decade to fix it.” That’s not going to cut it. You want to increase my price? I’d be better be f’ing amazed at what I get in return. You get an amazing amount of money from me, I get an amazing experience and we’re both thrilled.

If I’m going to skimp and save and dream of going to Disney, I damned well better have an amazing experience when I get there. A good old American capitalist trade of money for services at its finest.

And just to be clear, I’m not on the “Disney is getting worse every day” bandwagon. Maybe it is, I don’t know. I haven’t noticed it. Maybe for some of you who go very frequently, it’s just like the beautiful person you see every day whose flaws you start to notice out of sheer familiarity. Or maybe it is getting worse. But, I don’t see the decline.

But here’s the thing – I’m on alert now. Don’t disappoint me. Spoil me with the awesome stuff, just like I’m spoiling you with may payments.

Be smart. There are all kinds of things that can go wrong when you increase prices. If you price out too many people, then who grows up on Disney? Who is your market of tomorrow? I can’t understand things like why it takes Disney 10 years or whatever to build Avatar when Universal seems able to do it in a flash. I wonder if they impulsively threw money at China just because China seemed like the next big thing (like we all thought of Japan in the 80s and look what happened there…) only to see the Chinese economy tank. I worry about them continuing to make stellar attractions instead of fair ground junk. I worry about how a cast member is going to give me a wonderful smile and a magical day if they’re worried about their hours this month. Take my money, take your profit, but keep Disney strong. Don’t let it whither and die through mismanagement.

Be smart – keep Disney strong.

Be decent – I want to know you care about me and your staff.

Be fair – soak me to the bone, and then make me smile and say, “I’ll be damned, that was worth it!”

Best. Post. Ever

 

[kittyab]

This will not change the dates we choose to come. We come down to Orlando when the weather is not to hot and our daughter will not miss so much school.

I can see some will still come in the summer because that is the time they can go.

 

[BayouQueen]

Well, price increases are to be expected, but honestly, airfares are really high right now, and restaurants and hotels are more expensive, so when vacation cost is all put together, I bet a lot of people just won't be able to get it together anymore and will have to do something else. The cost/benefit analysis of a Disney vacation is getting murky.