What do you do with people that cut in line to meet up with group?

[Illinistifler]

The only time I used to see the people moving up was at TSM when they used to
do the old way of opening the park. The people getting the FP would try and join up with their parties. Now the last few times I have gone no has done it

 

[JimmyV]

JimmyV, that's a great theory.

Except.... that's not how the vast majority of the current ride queues are designed to work. No question about it. This would be a radical change, probably for newly constructed rides only, or rides like PP where the queue often spills out beyond its bounds.And so solo travelers and parties who need to stay together (like a single mom with her 2 small kids) stand and stand and stand in line like dopes. Well, no, you aren't standing in line like dopes. You would be standing in lines EXACTLY THE WAY YOU ARE NOW. So if you are coping with the current system, you would not be negatively impacted by the new one. And then all these extra people push past them in line, because they've been off doing something else, while a placeholder stands in for them. No pushing past. You would join the line just the way wheelchairs do now. They don't push past. The go through a gate at the end of the line.

Please explain how your theory, in the cold light of day under actual current queue setups, is fair to everyone. It would be perfectly fair to everyone if the system included a "take a number" approach should people wish to do that. Then, a single traveler could take a number and have his/her place saved just like everyone else. As current conditions stand, there are lots and lots of people who CAN'T step out of line and come back later. If they leave the line, they have to rejoin at the end.

I just can't wrap my head around "Sorry, Timmy. You had the bad luck to be born into a household of divorce, so you'll need to wait the entire time right here where I can watch you, while Tammy goes off to ride the carousel and get a snack with her spare parent and comes back later!" is fair. So Timmy, born into a houshold of divorce, forces everyone else to do exactly what he has to do? Take a number, and come back when it is your turn.

Again, nice theory. But it doesn't give equal access to everyone unless lots of these queues are redesigned like Dumbo. And, to be fair, I think Disney is moving in that direction and good for them.

And you DO realize that you're saying a solo traveler will never ever ever skip a single second of a line, don't you? Well, yippee for me. I'm going to start trolling craigslist for randoms to pretend we know each other so they can hold my spot in line from now on.

So where are all these complaints when the guy in front of you at Pecos Bill's orders for his entire family. We simply shouldn't allow that. You have no one to order for you, so the guy in front of you should have to have his entire family in line just because you have to stand in line too.

Apparently, places like Legoland already use such a system, and WDW is using it for character queues. Look. This system won't be implemented any tme soon, but if tweaks were made such that solo travelers could use it, (such as a take-a-number approach), my guess is that you would really enjoy your newfound free time.

 

[JimmyV]

But a placeholder system doesnt exist now, so this agrument is not revelant right now, unless we are talking about ways to improve lines and we are not we are talking about line cutters. Your way is still a disadvantage to the solo /single parent traveler who doesnt have the luxury of leaving a placeholder while they go get a Mickey Bar for the rest of the family.

As to the bolded portion, absolutely. This would invovle a wholesale change, including scrapping FPs.

Not a disadvantage to solo travelers if a take-a-number approach could be added to the mix. Just like at the deli. Most people grocery shop alone and negotiate this system quite well.

 

[gator girl]

Apparently, places like Legoland already use such a system, and WDW is using it for character queues. Look. This system won't be implemented any tme soon, but if tweaks were made such that solo travelers could use it, (such as a take-a-number approach), my guess is that you would really enjoy your newfound free time.

Yes! We agree! It would be WONDERFUL if this system existed right now at all the attractions and everyone could use it!

Sadly, it doesn't.

 

[JimmyV]

Yes! We agree! It would be WONDERFUL if this system existed right now at all the attractions and everyone could use it!

Sadly, it doesn't.

And it never will until innovators start to take a hard look at it, and raise the issue for debate in places like this. Lots more work would have to be done, but there has to be a better approach to all of this than what goes on at PP!

 

[gator girl]

I don't have any points to add. I'm just posting again to bump the zombie thread and irritate mesaboy2.

 

[brucerob62]

Because you were not ready to enter the line, because you create inconvenience for those who will have to move to let you pass, because every body saves a spot only for his own body and you do not have a spot other then at the end of the line.

sorry but the inconvenience to my family is more important than someone i dont know being inconvenienced by 2 people really? sorry...I think my family comes first..and i would hope you would feel the same way about yours

 

[brucerob62]

i think we should all carry tazers and zap anyone who gets in front of us!!..How dare they!

 

[almckim]

Honestly, after several hundred cumulative days in the various parks, this has never presented itself as a major issue. Certainly not one that would warrant 20 pages of discussion and "strategies". I don't let it get to me, as I have a different approach to the way I look at "lines".

The absolute most efficient way to organize a line is to have one, and only one person per party wait in said line, and then have a gate to allow the rest of the party to join the one person waiting in line at the very front. Much like WDW does with some limited mobility access lines. One person waits in line, and when that person gets to the front, they open a gate and allow the wheelchair or scooter to move right in. In actuality, it should work this way for all people. If you are going to wait in line at the box office for tickets to a popular concert or a play, do you have all members of your party get in that line, or do you have one person wait in the line and buy tickets for your entire group? Waiting in line for a ride is really no different. If I am the second person in line to buy tickets to see "Lion King" on Broadway, and the person in front of me is going to buy 6 tickets, then I am (virtually) the 7th person in line, irrespective of whether all 6 people crowd the line in front of me or not. Now, if one member of the group waited in line, and at the last moment before that person got to the ticket window, the other 5 members of his group rushed past me to join him, it wouldn't change my place in line whatsoever. I am still 7th in line.

So too at most rides at WDW. I am not going to share a Tea Cup with another family. So if the person in front of me appears to be a solo, but at the last minute, three other family members join him, it doesn't change my place whatsoever. Instead of that apparent solo person riding by himself in a Tea Cup, he now rides with three other people. I still get the next Tea Cup in line. My place in line has not changed, and the outcome of the waiting game has not changed. If I am in line for Jungle Cruise, and it looks like I am going to board Amazon Annie, (which holds around 40 people), and the parents in front of me are joined at the last minute by their two teenagers, I am still going to get on Amazon Annie. And even if the addition of these two people pushes me back to another boat, then that means that I would have been that last to board Amazon Annie, and I would have gotten the worst center seat. By being pushed back to the next boat, I will be the first to board, and I actually benefit.

In the end, if applied in a logical fashion, queue areas could be made much smaller, and park visits could become much more efficient if the way we approached lines transitioned over to the way we wait in line for tickets. One person per party, while the rest use the restroom, or shop, or rest, or whatever. When your group leader gets to the front of the line, you join them. Now, I know that WDW isn't operating under this system, but since that system is most efficient, I do not mind if people do that. Had all the people been in line ahead of me the entire time, I would be no worse off. And if people are not making me worse off, then why should I complain?

In closing, picture this scenario at Peter Pan. All members of your family get in line, and you are the last ones in that line. When the next family gets behind you, one person in your group says to the group behind you, "Sir; as you can see, we are a party of four and we are all ahead of you. Would you mind if my wife and kids sat on that bench to rest. When we approach the boarding area, my family will rejoin me. And to make this equitable, you can make the same request of the next family that gets behind you." The family behind you agrees. Then, another family gets behind the family behind you, and they make the same request, and it is granted, and so on. If every family did this, then by the time your family got to the boarding area, each and every group would have their place held by one person. The line would not extend out into Fantasyland, and no one would be better off, or worse off than if all members of all families had occupied the queue, and the Peter Pan death march could be avoided. If you are approaching the line to get in the back and want to know how many "ships" are in front of you so that you can judge the wait time, simply count. Each person reoresents, on average 1 (or maybe 1.3 to account for large families) ships. No one could possibly accuse anyone else of "cutting" because everyone will have agreed to this new, efficient and cordial way of waiting in line. It would be great.

Edit to add: But of course, if there are children in the group, and only one adult, they would all have to stick together.

In every amusmemt park I have ever been too this would be considered line jumping and grounds for immediatedismissal. There are signs that say no lime jumping or place holding. I understand that the other amusment parks are not Disney, but I agree with the policy.

 

[MikeandReneePlus5]

What? I did not get it, why exactly you feel a need to attack me? I am not talking about rules or anything, I was showing how those examples are not relevant to what we discuss, different lines. If you can explain why it is not so, please go ahead, in civilized way of conversation but do not brush me off with " argue to argue", it is ridiculous and this kinds of comments is what causing civilized thread to be closed.

Wasn't an attack at all! Maybe a bit smug...but certainly not uncivil.

There is nothing left to explain...I look at queues as basically all the same. A way to wait for...something. My DMV license, a Dole Whip, meat at a deli counter, a concert, an iPhone, a ride on Peter Pan, a banking transaction, an elevator at a tourist destination etc etc etc.

And in almost all except Peter Pan, no one would ever expect every person in the party to be present 100% of the time in the queue.

It seems you think each of these other queues is somehow unique and that there should be one set of accepted rules for all of them and another set of accepted rules for ride queues. And you are not alone! So many agree with you....

But there is nothing left to explain or argue about. you see it your way I see it mine.

I even do it your way!

What's more civil than that?

 

[Mkrop]

sorry but the inconvenience to my family is more important than someone i dont know being inconvenienced by 2 people really? sorry...I think my family comes first..and i would hope you would feel the same way about yours

I think my family comes first so why shouldnt I be able to cut in line whenever, whereever I feel like it, see the examples above at the bank or the pharmacy.

I think my family is soooooo important that they should forgo all lines and have private meetings with Mickey

Or the person who does decide to make a stink and doesnt let you pass, you know they are only doing this because they think their family comes first and couldnt give two hoots about you catching up with yours, so they will block your way. They are just doing what they think is best


It is sad that you cant see beyond your own family when you are in a public place with many other families.

 

[brucerob62]

I think my family comes first so why shouldnt I be able to cut in line whenever, whereever I feel like it, see the examples above at the bank or the pharmacy.

I think my family is soooooo important that they should forgo all lines and have private meetings with Mickey

Or the person who does decide to make a stink and doesnt let you pass, you know they are only doing this because they think their family comes first and couldnt give two hoots about you catching up with yours, so they will block your way. They are just doing what they think is best


It is sad that you cant see beyond your own family when you are in a public place with many other families.

now you are getting the idea!!

 

[LucyBC80]

Why is so difficult to some people understand the concept of a "family vacation" aren't you supposed to do everything together? Why are you sending half of your family to stand on the line you take the other half to do something else?

My take is that Disney MUST enforce the rules that all members of the party should wait and enter the line together. It's fair all around.

 

[LucyBC80]

sorry but the inconvenience to my family is more important than someone i dont know being inconvenienced by 2 people really? sorry...I think my family comes first..and i would hope you would feel the same way about yours

Talk about entitlement...

 

[Mkrop]

Wasn't an attack at all! Maybe a bit smug...but certainly not uncivil.

There is nothing left to explain...I look at queues as basically all the same. A way to wait for...something. My DMV license, a Dole Whip, meat at a deli counter, a concert, an iPhone, a ride on Peter Pan, a banking transaction, an elevator at a tourist destination etc etc etc.

And in almost all except Peter Pan, no one would ever expect every person in the party to be present 100% of the time in the queue.

It seems you think each of these other queues is somehow unique and that there should be one set of accepted rules for all of them and another set of accepted rules for ride queues. And you are not alone! So many agree with you....

But there is nothing left to explain or argue about. you see it your way I see it mine.

I even do it your way!

What's more civil than that?

But in some of your examples you can not purchase unlimited number of things, like someone should not be able to hold an unlimited number of spots. Like for example, your Iphone or concert tickets. Yes I may only have to stand in line but I may only be able to purchase so many phone or tickets, say 5. Do we then limit how many people someone in line can hold the place for? Sorry family of 6, only 5 of you can ride.

I guess I am confused, yes there are different lines for different things, it doesnt mean that line cutting doenst exist in these scenarios and that rides for lines at least for now have a different protocol for them.

 

[JimmyV]

In every amusmemt park I have ever been too this would be considered line jumping and grounds for immediatedismissal. There are signs that say no lime jumping or place holding. I understand that the other amusment parks are not Disney, but I agree with the policy.

It isn't line jumping if either:
a) the park implements the system; or
b) if everyone agrees to it. If everyone agrees to it, then by definition, there would be no one to complain. And without a complaint, there would be no misconduct to act upon.

Remember, (if you are old enough), that the old "wristband system" used for holding places in line when people slept out for concert tickets in the 70's was implemented first by the people themselves and not by the venues. Someone had the great idea to write down numbers on pieces of paper and have everyone who showed up take one, allowing them to go about their business. A short while before the tickets went on sale, people reassembled in line in an orderly fashion according to their number. I am certain that somewhere along the line, this violated the letter of the law of the venue. But everyone was on board and no one complained. Soon, the venues started to pick up on this idea and started issuing hospital style wristbands. The moral of the story is that if a group of Deadheads in the 70's could figure out a way to keep the peace and not have everyone sit around for 36 hours waiting for floor seats, it can't be "cutting", because everyone buys into the system.

 

[princessallegra]

I just want to take a moment to thank the poster back on Page 15 who revived this 6-month-old zombie thread, thought it was about Disneyland, and has not since returned.

<slow-claps>

I just want to thank you, for giving me my ab workout of the day.

 

[goodfood4ursoul]

sorry but the inconvenience to my family is more important than someone i dont know being inconvenienced by 2 people really? sorry...I think my family comes first..and i would hope you would feel the same way about yours

Absolutely!
When my family got into line together, waited patiently in queue like we are supposed to,
we come first,
before people who have not waited in this line but are pushing their way through
to join one person in line whose sole purpose was to hold a spot so they could line jump.

It's not so hard to understand.
We all know how lines work. First in, first out.

Like others, I have no problem with people who were in line needing to go and come back for family issues.
But I would suggest for those families who send forth the line holder
while they do more important things with their time than standing in line like the rest of us
and then just want to "be together" at the front of the line
that if they cannot wait and all get in line together,
then the family member in line closer to the front can come join the
rest of the family at the back of the line so that they can all be "together".
far be it from me to get in the way of family "togetherness"

The problem here is that people have forgotten how to be courteous and polite and always seem to want what other people have.
I'm not too good to wait in line, and neither are you, but you obviously think that you are...

My family only comes first if we have earned it through doing the right thing, which, in this case, is waiting in line.
Why don't people just do the right thing?

 

[goodfood4ursoul]

It isn't line jumping if either:
a) the park implements the system; or
b) if everyone agrees to it. If everyone agrees to it, then by definition, there would be no one to complain. And without a complaint, there would be no misconduct to act upon.

Remember, (if you are old enough), that the old "wristband system" used for holding places in line when people slept out for concert tickets in the 70's was implemented first by the people themselves and not by the venues. Someone had the great idea to write down numbers on pieces of paper and have everyone who showed up take one, allowing them to go about their business. A short while before the tickets went on sale, people reassembled in line in an orderly fashion according to their number. I am certain that somewhere along the line, this violated the letter of the law of the venue. But everyone was on board and no one complained. Soon, the venues started to pick up on this idea and started issuing hospital style wristbands. The moral of the story is that if a group of Deadheads in the 70's could figure out a way to keep the peace and not have everyone sit around for 36 hours waiting for floor seats, it can't be "cutting", because everyone buys into the system.

Only when relating this to WDW it's more complicated than simply doing the right thing and standing in line....
if it was so simple then you would not have to post repeatedly explaining how wonderful and simple it all is, and trying to change so many people's minds...
and clearly, not everyone buys into that system, as it pertains to WDW...

 

[Tinkerbellie16]

I had the mentality that I just didn't care if someone did this - and typically I don't - the random mother who takes their child to the potty, etc. But then it happened....4 grown men pushing through the Soarin line. I told them there was no cutting and they said they were meeting up with their group. I responded that their party would just have to wait for them. 2 of the men left the line after I told them this. The other 2 got kicked out. That was last year.

So what happens this year...at Soarin???? South American tour group line jumpers... 2 girls pushed their way through the line and I said no. They claimed they didn't understand English and I told them they were cutting but they did it anyway. I told a CM who was walking by. At this point, the group of girls that they cut in line to be with and the 2 girls spoke perfect English and claimed no one cut in line. The CM looks at the 2 girls and said, "I told you back there that you could not move forward in the line." Turns out she had already told these girls not to do it and they didn't listen. All the girls were kicked out of line.

Well - am I happy about these situations? NO! I felt horrible for my kids and husband to stand there with the mean lady. Most people said thank you that were in the line but my DH was pretty embarrassed. And then I was annoyed with him for not being supportive. So it caused for some friction between us and that was not fun. I will still tell people not to cut in line because I don't want MY kids cutting in line. If I don't say anything, they might think I am ok with it and that it is ok for them to behave that way.